Official Panasonic S60 Series Discussion Thread - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 07:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Widmark View Post

Because the Best Buy near me doesn't have any S60s and because according to it's manual, it doesn't even exist. There is no mention anywhere in it's help that even suggests it exists and can be changed. Every other detail is laid out in the eHelp. 24p Direct in, 3:2 pulldown etc. No mention of IFC at all.

It also gives the Pixel Orbiter options as "On/Auto". There is no "Off", which seems strange, and I don't know what the difference would be between "On" and "Auto". There's also no setting given to disable the TV speakers. Will Best Buy let a person play with settings for a TV up on the wall?
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post #92 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 07:36 PM
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Well, the Best Buy near me wasn't aware that there were new Panasonic Plasma TVs, so asking them to dig up a remote control seems like it might be a stretch.
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post #93 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 07:38 PM
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i can't fathom that you couldn't turn off motion smoothing...that can't be right.

s60 is better black that st50, likely because of the lack of screen filter...I'm guessing.
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post #94 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 07:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Widmark View Post

Because the Best Buy near me doesn't have any S60s and because according to it's manual, it doesn't even exist. There is no mention anywhere in it's help that even suggests it exists and can be changed. Every other detail is laid out in the eHelp. 24p Direct in, 3:2 pulldown etc. No mention of IFC at all.

Common sense would dictate it being there, as it's removal/lack of user control would be extremely unusual.
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post #95 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 07:45 PM
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Has anyone else read the manual and eHelp documents? Maybe I'm missing something.
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post #96 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Widmark View Post

Well, the Best Buy near me wasn't aware that there were new Panasonic Plasma TVs, so asking them to dig up a remote control seems like it might be a stretch.

As you said in the post I replied to, which I quoted in full. The thing is, mine does have a 50" S60 on the wall; I saw it a few days ago.
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post #97 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by sawfish View Post

As you said in the post I replied to, which I quoted in full. The thing is, mine does have a 50" S60 on the wall; I saw it a few days ago.

I wasn't being redundant. It's one thing that they didn't have them. It's another thing all together to not be aware that they even exist or may be coming.
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post #98 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Widmark View Post

Has anyone else read the manual and eHelp documents? Maybe I'm missing something.

Alright. Where is this e-help manual? rolleyes.gif
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post #99 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 08:19 PM
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First post on this thread!

http://service.us.panasonic.com/OPERMANPDF/E-HELP_S60.PDF

and regular manual, which is less informative:

http://service.us.panasonic.com/OPERMANPDF/TCP42S60.PDF
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post #100 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 08:21 PM
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Advanced picture settings discussed on page 30 and page 127.
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post #101 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 08:30 PM
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Alright, I have to admit that's somewhat peculiar. I suppose it's possible they removed the feature entirely, but I don't see why they would do that when they are perfectly content to leave the utterly useless 48hz feature as well. It's an awful, awful feature though, so you shouldn't lose sleep if it's not included. The way I see it, there's no conceivable way that any motion smoother is running by default, that you can't adjust, it's either fully functional or it's not there entirely.
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post #102 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 08:54 PM
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I'd be perfectly happy for it to not exist. When I've noticed it, on parent-in-laws Samsung, it drives me crazy. It says 24p direct only works with HD sources. How does a tv like this deal with a standard DVD or non HD tv broadcast?
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post #103 of 7174 Old 03-12-2013, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish View Post


Will Best Buy let a person play with settings for a TV up on the wall?

If you are interested in buying one , you can take your time and play with the settings and features, why wouldn't you? I always do before I pick one. Best buy employees are usually clueless anyways, not all of them but most of them. I ask one one time, if they were ever going to get the Sharp Elite and they didn't even know it existed.rolleyes.gif

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post #104 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Lestat Phoenix View Post

The S60 has a very small difference in black level for the better than the ST from last year...

Were you able to measure this?

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post #105 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 09:14 AM
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So is the 42S60 the best 42" screen currently available?
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post #106 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 01:18 PM
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^yeah if you need a 42 it looks like the s60 is the obvious choice. I don't even know if lg & samsung make a 42" lately, & prior to this year, since panasonic's 42u's were discontinued, most all 42's are 720p. It'd take a pretty pricey lcd to beat even the low end plasmas I think, & the premium lcd's with individual zones of backlighting that can dim independently, they don't go that small afaik.

edit- well excluding the commercial plasma panels, which still come in 42", but they are more expensive than a 50" st. And idk if the commercial 42's even have a tuner or speakers etc.
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post #107 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 03:14 PM
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Hoping to get the transcript soon but I just chatted with someone at Panasonic who claimed simply, that the s60 does not feature IFC.
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post #108 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSpectre88 View Post

Alright, I have to admit that's somewhat peculiar. I suppose it's possible they removed the feature entirely, but I don't see why they would do that when they are perfectly content to leave the utterly useless 48hz feature as well. It's an awful, awful feature though, so you shouldn't lose sleep if it's not included. The way I see it, there's no conceivable way that any motion smoother is running by default, that you can't adjust, it's either fully functional or it's not there entirely.

Why is the 48Hz feature useless? Still trying to understand what all these do.

Likewise, how useful is 3:2 pulldown?
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post #109 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Widmark View Post

Why is the 48Hz feature useless?

From my understanding (haven't seen it myself) it produces a high amount of flickering which makes it unusable. Therefore most just watch 24p content at the panel's 60hz using 3:2 pulldown which is usually performed on the device playing the content (with a blu-ray disc, the blu-ray player)


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post #110 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Widmark View Post

Why is the 48Hz feature useless? Still trying to understand what all these do.

Likewise, how useful is 3:2 pulldown?

It's useless because that refresh rate is too low, if it was 72hz or 96hz it would produce a film without 3:2 pull down and with no flickering. As for 3:2 pull down setting, it's not really important, but if you're outputting a film at 60hz then some kind of 3:2 or 2:3 pull down is occurring. With blu-rays for example, it may show 3:2 pull down is off, but if you have 24p direct set to 60hz it's still using some form of pull down. No matter what you do, it's going to use pull down if it's required.
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post #111 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 04:04 PM
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I think I need to read more to fully understand what these features mean and do, but in layman's terms, if I'm watching a standard def movie DVR'd or watching an old DVD, is it going to have problems?

My other general question regarding plasma TVs and IR...I have no interest in cutting off or stretching the TV image. If i'm watching an old movie or TV show that's in 4:3 in standard mode so there's no stretching and no cutting off edges, I understand that it will leave black images on the side bar. If the movie is 2 hours or so, is this going to be a problem for whatever I watch next? Does it last a long time generally?
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post #112 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 04:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Widmark View Post

I think I need to read more to fully understand what these features mean and do, but in layman's terms, if I'm watching a standard def movie DVR'd or watching an old DVD, is it going to have problems?

My other general question regarding plasma TVs and IR...I have no interest in cutting off or stretching the TV image. If i'm watching an old movie or TV show that's in 4:3 in standard mode so there's no stretching and no cutting off edges, I understand that it will leave black images on the side bar. If the movie is 2 hours or so, is this going to be a problem for whatever I watch next? Does it last a long time generally?

You won't have any problems with either of those things. smile.gif
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post #113 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 04:21 PM
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That's good enough for me. I've been waiting since early January to get a TV. The distance from TV to couch in my living room isn't large so most TVs look too big. a 42" Plasma, without 3d or other features I don't need, the 42s60 really seems to have hit a sweet spot.
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post #114 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 07:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leon! View Post

^yeah if you need a 42 it looks like the s60 is the obvious choice. I don't even know if lg & samsung make a 42" lately, & prior to this year, since panasonic's 42u's were discontinued, most all 42's are 720p. It'd take a pretty pricey lcd to beat even the low end plasmas I think, & the premium lcd's with individual zones of backlighting that can dim independently, they don't go that small afaik.

edit- well excluding the commercial plasma panels, which still come in 42", but they are more expensive than a 50" st. And idk if the commercial 42's even have a tuner or speakers etc.

Well, that's just my situation: I don't need a TV tuner or speakers. I have an excellent audio system. I have cable TV. You can't run an outside antenna in our community anyway, they are banned.

All I need is a High Quality 42" display device, with HDMI and Component video in, able to do 1080p.
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post #115 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 07:34 PM
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Well, that's just my situation: I don't need a TV tuner or speakers. I have an excellent audio system. I have cable TV. You can't run an outside antenna in our community anyway, they are banned.

All I need is a High Quality 42" display device, with HDMI and Component video in, able to do 1080p.

An indoor antenna may be all you need; the WineGard FlatWave is a leaf antenna and for me pretty magical unamplified compared to amplified Terk and Philips antennas. As for your community banning outdoor antennas, if you're talking about the USA, the ban should be trumped by federal law as long as you own the area where the antenna would go and have exclusive use of that area:

http://www.fcc.gov/guides/over-air-reception-devices-rule
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post #116 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 09:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Widmark View Post

I really really want to buy a 42s60, right now, I just cannot get a straight answer about motion smoothing! I've been told "it can be turned off" but I've read the entire eHelp document, which far as I understand is the manual for all the features, including the advanced picture adjustments, and there is no mention. Can somebody please allay my fears here?

....... the Best Buy near me doesn't have any S60s and because according to it's manual, it doesn't even exist. There is no mention anywhere in it's help that even suggests it exists and can be changed. Every other detail is laid out in the eHelp. 24p Direct in, 3:2 pulldown etc. No mention of IFC at all.

Is IFC the same as "Motion Smoother"? Because the U50 (the model that the S60 is replacing) doesn't have the Motion Smoother, so i wouldn't expect the S60 to have it.

But since the UT50 and higher models do have the Motion Smoother, i wonder if it's only possible to have this on the 3D models what with their Fast Switching Phosphor panels? Could this be why the non-3D models do not have it?

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post #117 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 09:58 PM
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Is IFC the same as "Motion Smoother"? Because the U50 (the model that the S60 is replacing) doesn't have the Motion Smoother, so i wouldn't expect the S60 to have it.

But since the UT50 and higher models do have the Motion Smoother, i wonder if it's only possible to have this on the 3D models what with their Fast Switching Phosphor panels? Could this be why the non-3D models do not have it?

Glad to hear the prior version didn't have it...makes it seem like less of an anomaly! Whatever the reason, I'm glad, because the feature drives me crazy.
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post #118 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 10:49 PM
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if evaluating the 48Hz option...give it time! It will seem objectionable at first...but after a while, it will just look like a movie theater.

This is the same flicker that you would have seen in any movie theater that used film...they all had flicker due to the frame rate.

but, interestingly enough...I don't tend to feel that the 2:2 cadence is amazingly better that the 3:2 cadence...I think we have all grown used to 3:2 pulldown as many tv shows are also captured with 24fps film which has to be displayed on a tv at 3:2 ratio.
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post #119 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 11:27 PM
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Quote:
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if evaluating the 48Hz option...give it time! It will seem objectionable at first...but after a while, it will just look like a movie theater.

This is the same flicker that you would have seen in any movie theater that used film...they all had flicker due to the frame rate.

but, interestingly enough...I don't tend to feel that the 2:2 cadence is amazingly better that the 3:2 cadence...I think we have all grown used to 3:2 pulldown as many tv shows are also captured with 24fps film which has to be displayed on a tv at 3:2 ratio.

No way, it's different in the theater for whatever reason. Either they use something that reduces flicker or it's just different with a giant screen. You're right though, at 60hz movies play almost flawlessly, and have no annoying flicker, making it the obvious choice.
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post #120 of 7174 Old 03-13-2013, 11:29 PM
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modern theaters are using dlp...not film. Film will flicker...there's no 2 ways about it.

And yes..I tend to agree that 60Hz is fine anyhow...
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