Official Samsung PNxxF8500 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 109 - AVS Forum
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post #3241 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 03:37 AM
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Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

There is a hockey game on NBCSHD my fellow floridaman, That would be the perfect way to be sure the pop's are gone. If you know of a good calibrator on the southwest coast of Florida, please don't be shy : )

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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

That's key Floridaman! We now have a couple of professionally calibrated Cal Day modes that eliminate popping. I'm glad Robert and I weren't crazy

Let's get three. Where are you located, jackobots?

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post #3242 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 04:38 AM
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Let's get three. Where are you located, jackobots?

I'm about 45 minutes south of Sarasota and 45 minutes north of Fort Myers, in a town called Port Charlotte. I'll soon be moving closer to Sarasota but, for now, I'm here. The only source for a calibrator in my town is Best Buy and it's not a Magnolia. Port Charlotte is definitely not a high tech town, so I'm concerned they may not be very good. We do have a lot of great fishing guides here though : )

Thanks for any help you can provide!
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post #3243 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 04:38 AM
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Hi. I'm about to get my ps64f8500 in May and I'wondering something : for the program suggestions system, will it work if I use a stb and not the integrated tuner?
By the way will the vocal command like "channel 4" will work also thanks to the external IR module?
Hope I'm clear ;-)
Thanks for your answers.
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post #3244 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 05:21 AM
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Originally Posted by JimShaw View Post

JR, I thank you a great post that helps with the problem that I will have placing a 64F8500 in a cabinet.

It looks like it will work but as you said, I will have to keep an eye on the temperature. I would set it up for if a fan shut down, a small red light would go on. That light would be in a spot where it would be visible.

Thanks

A binary indicator is one way to go. Did a little searching and found the Extech 401012 Indoor/Outdoor Temperature Alarm that you should consider.

Have updated my post as shown below:

"Putting any electronic device in a cabinet make me very nervous. If the fans speeds are set for silent operation you would have no indication of fan failure(s) or loss of power to one or more fans. A quick search for "temperature alarm" returns many choices. The Extech 401012 Indoor/Outdoor Temperature Alarm http://www.extech.com/testequipment/product.asp?catid=67&prodid=392 has colors that would go well with A/V equipment and is only about $20 on Amazon. The 10' temperature sensor could be placed inside the cabinet. You could then read your room and cabinet temperature from the display and have an audible alarm and Red/Green indicator for your set point."
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post #3245 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 05:41 AM
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Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

Well, I tried all the modes...it is not a severe issue. I think it can be solved with some tweaking of the white balance. It sounds like Elvamir's calibrator (Jeff Meier) did not have to do much more than adjust the white balance to get it calibrated perfectly. It's so close to perfect now, with my own tweaks, which do not include any adjustments to white balance, I can't imagine it needing any radical changes.

That is false. This is a very tricky set to get good color from. Just hitting white balance will not get you very close on flesh tones. I spent about 2.5 hours finessing this unit to get a quality image. White balance is only a part of it.
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post #3246 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 06:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Uh oh Air, this was how it began with the Elite for you. wink.gif

sssssshhhh...I'm hoping it's just my incredible bad luck, and truly just an isolated event. I could handle this abl pop all day long compared to uniformity issues.

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post #3247 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 06:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Atlantaguy View Post

Cooler guys makes great A/V cabinet cooling solutions.

http://www.coolerguys.com/

I have the Coolerguys PRO-Metal Dual 120mm Deluxe Cabinet Cooling Kit with built-in LED Controller CABCOOL 1202-Deluxe-M and it works like a charm.

Thanks. I have updated http://www.avsforum.com/t/1463454/official-samsung-pnxxf8500-series-discussion-thread-no-street-price-talk/3200_100#post_23226905 with a link to your recommendation.
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post #3248 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 07:32 AM
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Does anyone know the picture quality of the PN51F5500 compared to the PN51F8500 as I'm considering a less expensive model for the den as it's not my main viewing area

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post #3249 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 08:04 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

Edge lit technology is maxed out........
Funny, I was PM'd just last year that it is plasma tech that had reached its zenith. wink.gif
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post #3250 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 08:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

Funny, I was PM'd just last year that it is plasma tech that had reached its zenith. wink.gif
It is getting close also........
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post #3251 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by umr View Post

That is false. This is a very tricky set to get good color from. Just hitting white balance will not get you very close on flesh tones. I spent about 2.5 hours finessing this unit to get a quality image. White balance is only a part of it.

Thanks...flesh tones is one area where there is definitely room for improvement. From what I've read, most calibrators are saying this is a tough set to calibrate, so hopefully I can find a really good one!
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post #3252 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 09:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRWalker View Post

A binary indicator is one way to go. Did a little searching and found the Extech 401012 Indoor/Outdoor Temperature Alarm that you should consider.

Have updated my post as shown below:

"Putting any electronic device in a cabinet make me very nervous. If the fans speeds are set for silent operation you would have no indication of fan failure(s) or loss of power to one or more fans. A quick search for "temperature alarm" returns many choices. The Extech 401012 Indoor/Outdoor Temperature Alarm http://www.extech.com/testequipment/product.asp?catid=67&prodid=392 has colors that would go well with A/V equipment and is only about $20 on Amazon. The 10' temperature sensor could be placed inside the cabinet. You could then read your room and cabinet temperature from the display and have an audible alarm and Red/Green indicator for your set point."

Very nice. That would work perfectly.

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post #3253 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 09:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

Funny, I was PM'd just last year that it is plasma tech that had reached its zenith. wink.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

It is getting close also........


Didn't the head of the Patent office in the late 1800's say that the Patent office was no longer needed and should be closed because everything has been invented?



m

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post #3254 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

Thanks...flesh tones is one area where there is definitely room for improvement. From what I've read, most calibrators are saying this is a tough set to calibrate, so hopefully I can find a really good one!

i take it you have decided to keep it? i'm crossing fingers on my swap. this set certainly comes alive when the sun goes down.smile.gif

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post #3255 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 09:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

It is getting close also........

People forget this. There really isn't much to improve upon, especially since this set now has added brightness and improved clarity, in addition to contrast that is near reference. We've got sets this year that are pretty much equal to a 9G Kuro and we might be done with big improvements in picture quality.

There was a wall at Magnolia with the GT50, E8000 plasma and LED, and the new F8500. The biggest difference watching a feed between all of them was the brightness, with the F8500 having less abl than the other two plasmas, and being close in brightness to the LED.

The biggest difference people are noticing with the F8500 is brightness and the LED look to the picture, a crispness that is part of the new pixel structure. This is part of the reason why I'm more interested in this set than the Panasonics. Unless Panny changes the look of the image, something that really can't be measured with equipment, I'm not too interested in upgrading from a Pioneer. With Sammy, it's almost like I'm changing to an LED or an OLED because of the unique look to the image that it produces.

The most striking part of the ZT60 v. Kuro demo at the Panasonic event the other week was the difference in shades of gradation. It wasn't black level. That tells me that black level is almost maxed out, since anything above 0fL is going to have some slight glow to it, so it's almost irrelevant.

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post #3256 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by gmarceau View Post

People forget this. There really isn't much to improve upon, especially since this set now has added brightness and improved clarity, in addition to contrast that is near reference. We've got sets this year that are pretty much equal to a 9G Kuro and we might be done with big improvements in picture quality.

There was a wall at Magnolia with the GT50, E8000 plasma and LED, and the new F8500. The biggest difference watching a feed between all of them was the brightness, with the F8500 having less abl than the other two plasmas, and being close in brightness to the LED.

The biggest difference people are noticing with the F8500 is brightness and the LED look to the picture, a crispness that is part of the new pixel structure. This is part of the reason why I'm more interested in this set than the Panasonics. Unless Panny changes the look of the image, something that really can't be measured with equipment, I'm not too interested in upgrading from a Pioneer. With Sammy, it's almost like I'm changing to an LED or an OLED because of the unique look to the image that it produces.

The most striking part of the ZT60 v. Kuro demo at the Panasonic event the other week was the difference in shades of gradation. It wasn't black level. That tells me that black level is almost maxed out, since anything above 0fL is going to have some slight glow to it, so it's almost irrelevant.

" LED look to the picture"-yes it does indeed.

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post #3257 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post

i take it you have decided to keep it? i'm crossing fingers on my swap. this set certainly comes alive when the sun goes down.smile.gif

Yep, I'm keeping it! I must say, after looking at so many other plasma's, this is the only one I'd pay big bucks for. The difference in picture quality between the ST60, the VT60, and even the LG 60" I saw at Sam's for $700, is minimal. It's hard to justify paying so much more for virtually the same picture. The F8500 is an obvious improvement, but you are not going to see much difference among other plasma's.

So, if I was going to give advice to those looking for a plasma, either go for the F8500 or look for a bargain. There are some great deals out there on very nice, big plasma's...and the detail, brightness and the whites are virtually the same on the lot of them...IMO : )
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post #3258 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by jackobots View Post



So, if I was going to give advice to those looking for a plasma, either go for the F8500 or look for a bargain. There are some great deals out there on very nice, big plasma's...and the detail, brightness and the whites are virtually the same on the lot of them...IMO : )

WOW! couldnt disagree more. There are big differences between bargain plasmas and the higher end models.
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post #3259 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 10:32 AM
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WOW! couldnt disagree more. There are big differences between bargain plasmas and the higher end models.

I agree with your statement, but I would replace the word "big" with "little" : )
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post #3260 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 10:34 AM
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Hello All. Newbie here. So Best Buy messed up and gave me a crappy PN60E8000. Long story short I did my research and just had the PN60F8500 delivered. I was looking forward to all the dark blacks and crazy brightness. To be HONEST out of the box and on the wall it looks only slightly better than my e8000. Couple questions who is a Good guy in the Los Angeles area to get a proffesional calibration?? Second, I dont want to take any money out of these guys pockets,where can I find some callibration settings to play with until I can get a Pro out. Thanks for the help, any other help for a newbie with a sweet TV that I cant get to look good would be great.
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post #3261 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by jackobots View Post

Yep, I'm keeping it! I must say, after looking at so many other plasma's, this is the only one I'd pay big bucks for. The difference in picture quality between the ST60, the VT60, and even the LG 60" I saw at Sam's for $700, is minimal. It's hard to justify paying so much more for virtually the same picture. The F8500 is an obvious improvement, but you are not going to see much difference among other plasma's.

So, if I was going to give advice to those looking for a plasma, either go for the F8500 or look for a bargain. There are some great deals out there on very nice, big plasma's...and the detail, brightness and the whites are virtually the same on the lot of them...IMO : )
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WOW! couldnt disagree more. There are big differences between bargain plasmas and the higher end models.


Not so sure he was saiying "bargain plasma" in that sense, but find a good bargain on a plasma. The ST60 right now is a great bargain for the performance\picture you are getting, which is what I think jack was referring to....
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post #3262 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by ucsbrandall View Post

Hello All. Newbie here. So Best Buy messed up and gave me a crappy PN60E8000. Long story short I did my research and just had the PN60F8500 delivered. I was looking forward to all the dark blacks and crazy brightness. To be HONEST out of the box and on the wall it looks only slightly better than my e8000. Couple questions who is a Good guy in the Los Angeles area to get a proffesional calibration?? Second, I dont want to take any money out of these guys pockets,where can I find some callibration settings to play with until I can get a Pro out. Thanks for the help, any other help for a newbie with a sweet TV that I cant get to look good would be great.

There is a Display Calibration section of the forums where you will find calibrators and thier locations as well as reviews for them....

As far as settings go there is a Settings Thread, if you do a quick search youll find it in this section of the forums, its beenposted to recently so it shouldnt be too far from this one......
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post #3263 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 10:48 AM
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Thanks, im working my way around this site and its great. A little over my head in some aspects. What ive learned is that each TV set is unique and needs a Pro with a meter to callibrate it to the specific TV, not just cut and paste someone else's settings.
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post #3264 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by ucsbrandall View Post

Thanks, im working my way around this site and its great. A little over my head in some aspects. What ive learned is that each TV set is unique and needs a Pro with a meter to callibrate it to the specific TV, not just cut and paste someone else's settings.

Indeed if you want the most accurate picture than have a professional come out and callibrate it.....Each set has its variances so each may have different settings to get the "same" reference. Sure you can cut and paste someone elses settings just dont expect an accurate picture
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post #3265 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 11:08 AM
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I would think and certainly hope that .002 vs .005 in a dark room would be noticeable. My 65ST30 measures around .005 and I am really not impressed with its black levels particularly in low APL scenes (dark room viewing).

I think you would be surprised. I briefly had a 60ST30 next to a 60" Elite LCD (with arguably the best blacks available at the time). When watching a movie like The Descent, the difference in blacks was hardly noticeable when watching in a batcave room. Both appeared gray with the Elite slightly darker but nowhere near black. The fact is that no FPD can really produce anything that resembles true black - not even the Kuro. Possibly the local dimming Sony LED's that totally turn off the lights but the trade-offs are not worth it IMHO.

To put things in perspective, I have a front projector that puts out blacks at 0.001 (maybe lower but that's the limit of my meter) and they still appear as gray after my eyes adjust to the dark room. The best blacks in my home still come from an aging Sony XBR CRT. I think we'll need to wait for OLED to become mainstream before we see a set that can produce a noticeable improvement in dark rooms.

Arguing over anything in the range of 0.001 to 0.004 is pointless to me since they are all an unsatisfying gray to my eyes. I would rather focus on other attributes of the display such as uniformity, color accuracy, etc.

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post #3266 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 11:44 AM
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I updated my original calibration report post with these, but here they are in this post as well, my post-calibration video results (after measured adjustments. There was still some manual tweaking performed after this.)

dutugumy.jpg
darybupu.jpg


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post #3267 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Wizziwig View Post

I think you would be surprised. I briefly had a 60ST30 next to a 60" Elite LCD (with arguably the best blacks available at the time). When watching a movie like The Descent, the difference in blacks was hardly noticeable when watching in a batcave room. Both appeared gray with the Elite slightly darker but nowhere near black. The fact is that no FPD can really produce anything that resembles true black - not even the Kuro. Possibly the local dimming Sony LED's that totally turn off the lights but the trade-offs are not worth it IMHO.

To put things in perspective, I have a front projector that puts out blacks at 0.001 (maybe lower but that's the limit of my meter) and they still appear as gray after my eyes adjust to the dark room. The best blacks in my home still come from an aging Sony XBR CRT. I think we'll need to wait for OLED to become mainstream before we see a set that can produce a noticeable improvement in dark rooms.

Arguing over anything in the range of 0.001 to 0.004 is pointless to me since they are all an unsatisfying gray to my eyes. I would rather focus on other attributes of the display such as uniformity, color accuracy, etc.

-Mark

I had a Sony 57" CRT RP that had phenomenal blacks. At the time, I basically took it for granted and since moving to digital displays, I've been a bit disappointed as I still have that Sony look in my head.

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post #3268 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 12:55 PM
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Anyone compared the F8500 to the S60 or ST60 to see which display has a sharper, crisper image? TIA.

I was at BB last night comparing the VT60 to the F8500 and the F8500 has the VT beat by a nose in the sharpness department. Not a huge difference but it was noticeable. For those who value sharpness I'd say its enough of a difference for a prospective owner to be proud of. I for one came away thinking that I prefer the F8500. Granted the viewing conditions were not optimal. There's something about the F8500 that I really like. I think it's the motion handling.
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post #3269 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by ucsbrandall View Post

Hello All. Newbie here. So Best Buy messed up and gave me a crappy PN60E8000. Long story short I did my research and just had the PN60F8500 delivered. I was looking forward to all the dark blacks and crazy brightness. To be HONEST out of the box and on the wall it looks only slightly better than my e8000. Couple questions who is a Good guy in the Los Angeles area to get a proffesional calibration?? Second, I dont want to take any money out of these guys pockets,where can I find some callibration settings to play with until I can get a Pro out. Thanks for the help, any other help for a newbie with a sweet TV that I cant get to look good would be great.
You can start with David Abrams who works out of LA. Then UMR and D-Nice do tours to the LA area on a regular basis. You can read recommendations from plasma owners by clicking on the link in the signature area at the bottom of my post. The flat panel reports are in post number two.

It's early days for settings since the F8500 has been out for such a short time. In fact, we only have two owners who have reported getting their F8500 professionally calibrated. UMR (Jeff Meier) did one of them. As it happens he posted in this thread today.
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post #3270 of 12296 Old 04-21-2013, 05:42 PM
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Is there no official f8500 owners thread anywhere? Also, I'm really surprised that there's no talk about the recent firmware update samsung issued on 3/19. Does it address the brightness pos and/or black fluctuations? I returned my f8500 to amazon on Thursday with the intent of waiting for the ZT60 and of course, no sooner than I return mine, a firmware update is issued! Murphy's law...

Any feedback on the firmware update?
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