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Pinger's Avatar Pinger 10:34 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

OK, so just back from the shootout and really tired. So if I sound incoherent, that's because I am.

Forgot about apparent sharpness. No surprises there, the Samsung looked the sharpest.

Oh yes, I ordered the F8500. smile.gif

Nighty night.

Thanks for sharing your observations of tonight's portion of the shootout.
And congrats on your order, welcome to the club biggrin.gif

vinnie97's Avatar vinnie97 10:37 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

Good question to ask tomorrow, it may ahve thrown something else off which is possibly why they chose not to use it....If your watchign the stream and they take questions from the web, make sure to bring it up.....
You took the thought from my brain. biggrin.gif Have to get some work done after all that I missed tonight, but I will try to fit it in.
bargervais's Avatar bargervais 10:38 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbyrnes View Post

Much better sound too, plus camera and much better input lag.
sound who still uses a TV for sound
DavidHir's Avatar DavidHir 10:39 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

OK, so just back from the shootout and really tired. So if I sound incoherent, that's because I am.

For me, the biggest surprises were the effectiveness of the filter on the ZT60. Yes, it really does help that panel in typical room lighting while displaying blacks. But as I said at the shootout, the same filter that's effective in combating room light also robs the panel of a precious 5flt of brightness.

Second surprise, and I'm not sure how it showed up on your screens at home, but the Panasonics seriously clip white. Half the scale was missing on the Panasonics and the entire scale was visible on the Samsung. Kevin Miller told me it was obvious that Panasonic designed this panel for blacks and were very aware they were sacrificing brightness in the process. I asked if it was possible to get more than the 30ftl from the ZT60 or 35ftl from the VT60. The answer was a definitive 'no'. It's already clipping at the levels they calibrated them at. On the flip side, I believe it was David who thought for actual material it probably wouldn't be all the visible.

I agree with what some of you saw regarding color saturation on the 8500. At times it looked a bit less saturated. At other times, such as when they played Skyfall, the colors looked identical to the ZT60 & VT60. I mean identical. I don't know why a few other times it appeared a bit less saturated. I also thought the 8500 was a bit redder than the VT & ZT. But it's important to note that all the calibrators said to me that the 8500 was absolutely tracking properly and was fully in compliance with Rec709. I believe it was D-Nice who said if you turned off the VT & ZT, you'd never see the disparity. Kevin Miller absolutely felt the 8500 was extremely accurate.

At times the black levels of the ZT looked a bit better than the VT, but that was primarily when the room lighting was on. Once off, they looked identical. The big surprise to me was at the end when they played the Kuro demo reel that was designed to highlight blacks. I'm telling you guys, 95% of that demo looked IDENTICAL on all 3 panels. The other 5% of the time I gave the edge to the ZT & VT.

I don't know if it came across on your monitors, but at times the brightness advantage was very obvious on the 8500, but not as often as you might think. I don't believe the material they played, IMO, really highlighted the brightness differences. When was the disparity the most obvious? If you caught the period when they were playing around with Directv, the brightness differences were at times, huge. It was during those times that the screen had the largest % of bright areas. Hello ABL!

The Panasonic clearly has some issues such as calibration, clipping & 3D resolution. I personally don't care about 3D, but I know some of you guys do.

Although I was initially surprised at how well the ZT handled the room lighting, by the end of the night I came to the conclusion that, IMO, the 8500 has the most versatile qualities and did more things better than the other panels. The black levels are really close and the Kuro demo showed that in spades. But there's no question that if your biggest concern is MLL, than the ZT/VT is your best choice. Personally, if I was choosing between the 2, I'd go for the ZT if you had the extra cash. I really believe that filter does enough in terms of combating room lights and keeping black levels respectable, that it's worth the extra cost. But IMO, it simply is not a versatile panel. It does one thing better than the others, many other things as well as the others and falls woefully short in the brightness department.

Forgot about apparent sharpness. No surprises there, the Samsung looked the sharpest.

Oh yes, I ordered the F8500. smile.gif


Nighty night.

Great feedback, thanks.
DavidHir's Avatar DavidHir 10:42 PM 05-10-2013
Did I hear correctly, early on tonight from the Samsung rep, that one could upgrade the processor to get picture quality improvements that come each year (assuming hardware still the same)? In other words, if next year's F8500 is still the same hardware, but they make software PQ tweaks, can you get those in your 2013 model?
Ken Ross's Avatar Ken Ross 10:44 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidHir View Post

Did I hear correctly, early on tonight from the Samsung rep, that one could upgrade the processor to get picture quality improvements that come each year (assuming hardware still the same)? In other words, if next year's F8500 is still the same hardware, but they make software PQ tweaks, can you get those in your 2013 model?

Yes you can Dave. A really wonderful concept.
DavidHir's Avatar DavidHir 10:46 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Yes you can Dave. A really wonderful concept.

Very cool!
Halimali's Avatar Halimali 10:46 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

OK, so just back from the shootout and really tired. So if I sound incoherent, that's because I am.

For me, the biggest surprises were the effectiveness of the filter on the ZT60. Yes, it really does help that panel in typical room lighting while displaying blacks. But as I said at the shootout, the same filter that's effective in combating room light also robs the panel of a precious 5flt of brightness.

Second surprise, and I'm not sure how it showed up on your screens at home, but the Panasonics seriously clip white. Half the scale was missing on the Panasonics and the entire scale was visible on the Samsung. Kevin Miller told me it was obvious that Panasonic designed this panel for blacks and were very aware they were sacrificing brightness in the process. I asked if it was possible to get more than the 30ftl from the ZT60 or 35ftl from the VT60. The answer was a definitive 'no'. It's already clipping at the levels they calibrated them at. On the flip side, I believe it was David who thought for actual material it probably wouldn't be all the visible.

I agree with what some of you saw regarding color saturation on the 8500. At times it looked a bit less saturated. At other times, such as when they played Skyfall, the colors looked identical to the ZT60 & VT60. I mean identical. I don't know why a few other times it appeared a bit less saturated. I also thought the 8500 was a bit redder than the VT & ZT. But it's important to note that all the calibrators said to me that the 8500 was absolutely tracking properly and was fully in compliance with Rec709. I believe it was D-Nice who said if you turned off the VT & ZT, you'd never see the disparity. Kevin Miller absolutely felt the 8500 was extremely accurate.

At times the black levels of the ZT looked a bit better than the VT, but that was primarily when the room lighting was on. Once off, they looked identical. The big surprise to me was at the end when they played the Kuro demo reel that was designed to highlight blacks. I'm telling you guys, 95% of that demo looked IDENTICAL on all 3 panels. The other 5% of the time I gave the edge to the ZT & VT.

I don't know if it came across on your monitors, but at times the brightness advantage was very obvious on the 8500, but not as often as you might think. I don't believe the material they played, IMO, really highlighted the brightness differences. When was the disparity the most obvious? If you caught the period when they were playing around with Directv, the brightness differences were at times, huge. It was during those times that the screen had the largest % of bright areas. Hello ABL!

The Panasonic clearly has some issues such as calibration, clipping & 3D resolution. I personally don't care about 3D, but I know some of you guys do.

Although I was initially surprised at how well the ZT handled the room lighting, by the end of the night I came to the conclusion that, IMO, the 8500 has the most versatile qualities and did more things better than the other panels. The black levels are really close and the Kuro demo showed that in spades. But there's no question that if your biggest concern is MLL, than the ZT/VT is your best choice. Personally, if I was choosing between the 2, I'd go for the ZT if you had the extra cash. I really believe that filter does enough in terms of combating room lights and keeping black levels respectable, that it's worth the extra cost. But IMO, it simply is not a versatile panel. It does one thing better than the others, many other things as well as the others and falls woefully short in the brightness department.

Forgot about apparent sharpness. No surprises there, the Samsung looked the sharpest.

Oh yes, I ordered the F8500. smile.gif

Nighty night.

Thank you for sharing your observation. Very valued
Congratulations and welcome to the club
PRBR's Avatar PRBR 11:10 PM 05-10-2013
So im glad i pull the trigger today for the 60f8500!!!
airgas1998's Avatar airgas1998 11:10 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Yes you can Dave. A really wonderful concept.

ken, get to bed. it was great seeing the back of your head again.biggrin.gif hopefully, some day I'll be able to meet you and Robert in person. thx for your evaluation. oh, and welcome to the most versatile panel club.wink.gif
Halimali's Avatar Halimali 11:11 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRBR View Post

So im glad i pull the trigger today for the 60f8500!!!

Congratulations, when are expecting it to be delivered?
donstim's Avatar donstim 11:27 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

OK, so just back from the shootout and really tired. So if I sound incoherent, that's because I am.

For me, the biggest surprises were the effectiveness of the filter on the ZT60. Yes, it really does help that panel in typical room lighting while displaying blacks. But as I said at the shootout, the same filter that's effective in combating room light also robs the panel of a precious 5flt of brightness.

.
.
.
Nighty night.

Thanks Ken. Nice, meaningful, succinct summary.
PRBR's Avatar PRBR 11:34 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halimali View Post

Congratulations, when are expecting it to be delivered?

May 18!! Thanks for asking
agkss's Avatar agkss 11:35 PM 05-10-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

OK, so just back from the shootout and really tired. So if I sound incoherent, that's because I am.

For me, the biggest surprises were the effectiveness of the filter on the ZT60. Yes, it really does help that panel in typical room lighting while displaying blacks. But as I said at the shootout, the same filter that's effective in combating room light also robs the panel of a precious 5flt of brightness.

Second surprise, and I'm not sure how it showed up on your screens at home, but the Panasonics seriously clip white. Half the scale was missing on the Panasonics and the entire scale was visible on the Samsung. Kevin Miller told me it was obvious that Panasonic designed this panel for blacks and were very aware they were sacrificing brightness in the process. I asked if it was possible to get more than the 30ftl from the ZT60 or 35ftl from the VT60. The answer was a definitive 'no'. It's already clipping at the levels they calibrated them at. On the flip side, I believe it was David who thought for actual material it probably wouldn't be all the visible.

I agree with what some of you saw regarding color saturation on the 8500. At times it looked a bit less saturated. At other times, such as when they played Skyfall, the colors looked identical to the ZT60 & VT60. I mean identical. I don't know why a few other times it appeared a bit less saturated. I also thought the 8500 was a bit redder than the VT & ZT. But it's important to note that all the calibrators said to me that the 8500 was absolutely tracking properly and was fully in compliance with Rec709. I believe it was D-Nice who said if you turned off the VT & ZT, you'd never see the disparity. Kevin Miller absolutely felt the 8500 was extremely accurate.

At times the black levels of the ZT looked a bit better than the VT, but that was primarily when the room lighting was on. Once off, they looked identical. The big surprise to me was at the end when they played the Kuro demo reel that was designed to highlight blacks. I'm telling you guys, 95% of that demo looked IDENTICAL on all 3 panels. The other 5% of the time I gave the edge to the ZT & VT.

I don't know if it came across on your monitors, but at times the brightness advantage was very obvious on the 8500, but not as often as you might think. I don't believe the material they played, IMO, really highlighted the brightness differences. When was the disparity the most obvious? If you caught the period when they were playing around with Directv, the brightness differences were at times, huge. It was during those times that the screen had the largest % of bright areas. Hello ABL!

The Panasonic clearly has some issues such as calibration, clipping & 3D resolution. I personally don't care about 3D, but I know some of you guys do.

Although I was initially surprised at how well the ZT handled the room lighting, by the end of the night I came to the conclusion that, IMO, the 8500 has the most versatile qualities and did more things better than the other panels. The black levels are really close and the Kuro demo showed that in spades. But there's no question that if your biggest concern is MLL, than the ZT/VT is your best choice. Personally, if I was choosing between the 2, I'd go for the ZT if you had the extra cash. I really believe that filter does enough in terms of combating room lights and keeping black levels respectable, that it's worth the extra cost. But IMO, it simply is not a versatile panel. It does one thing better than the others, many other things as well as the others and falls woefully short in the brightness department.

Forgot about apparent sharpness. No surprises there, the Samsung looked the sharpest.

Oh yes, I ordered the F8500. smile.gif

Nighty night.

Congrats for your choice and thanks for info...i think i will wait for 2014 models for both brands.
Halimali's Avatar Halimali 12:13 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRBR View Post

May 18!! Thanks for asking

Wonderful. Expecting mine on 16th
It will be a long long week for both of us frown.gif
Halimali's Avatar Halimali 12:16 AM 05-11-2013
These threads are moving way fast.
I guess you just need to put F8500 in the title and the thread will move and move with posts eek.gif
Top_Cat's Avatar Top_Cat 02:48 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

OK, so just back from the shootout and really tired. So if I sound incoherent, that's because I am.

For me, the biggest surprises were the effectiveness of the filter on the ZT60. Yes, it really does help that panel in typical room lighting while displaying blacks. But as I said at the shootout, the same filter that's effective in combating room light also robs the panel of a precious 5flt of brightness.

Second surprise, and I'm not sure how it showed up on your screens at home, but the Panasonics seriously clip white. Half the scale was missing on the Panasonics and the entire scale was visible on the Samsung. Kevin Miller told me it was obvious that Panasonic designed this panel for blacks and were very aware they were sacrificing brightness in the process. I asked if it was possible to get more than the 30ftl from the ZT60 or 35ftl from the VT60. The answer was a definitive 'no'. It's already clipping at the levels they calibrated them at. On the flip side, I believe it was David who thought for actual material it probably wouldn't be all the visible...................................................................................................................................................................................

As usual a very interesting read. Much appreciated. BIG THANKS smile.gif
Quote:
Wonderful. Expecting mine on 16th
It will be a long long week for both of us

Congrats! Lucky Halimali, lucky Ken, lucky owners and future owners (including me biggrin.gif, waiting for prices but hopefully in a few weeks my oldie but more or less goodie C8000 will be resting in the bedroom).

Best Regards smile.gif
gmarceau's Avatar gmarceau 04:00 AM 05-11-2013
Samsung really made a revolutionary leap in brightness and considering the kind of light output it's capable of, even with it's strong filter, that makes you think it could be brighter than an LED if that filter wasn't on the panel.

Did anyone catch D-Nice saying he calibrated an ST60 with a light output of 60fL?

I wouldn't be surprised if people decide to go ST60 or F8500.
floridaman's Avatar floridaman 04:20 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

OK, so just back from the shootout and really tired. So if I sound incoherent, that's because I am.

For me, the biggest surprises were the effectiveness of the filter on the ZT60. Yes, it really does help that panel in typical room lighting while displaying blacks. But as I said at the shootout, the same filter that's effective in combating room light also robs the panel of a precious 5flt of brightness.

Second surprise, and I'm not sure how it showed up on your screens at home, but the Panasonics seriously clip white. Half the scale was missing on the Panasonics and the entire scale was visible on the Samsung. Kevin Miller told me it was obvious that Panasonic designed this panel for blacks and were very aware they were sacrificing brightness in the process. I asked if it was possible to get more than the 30ftl from the ZT60 or 35ftl from the VT60. The answer was a definitive 'no'. It's already clipping at the levels they calibrated them at. On the flip side, I believe it was David who thought for actual material it probably wouldn't be all the visible.

I agree with what some of you saw regarding color saturation on the 8500. At times it looked a bit less saturated. At other times, such as when they played Skyfall, the colors looked identical to the ZT60 & VT60. I mean identical. I don't know why a few other times it appeared a bit less saturated. I also thought the 8500 was a bit redder than the VT & ZT. But it's important to note that all the calibrators said to me that the 8500 was absolutely tracking properly and was fully in compliance with Rec709. I believe it was D-Nice who said if you turned off the VT & ZT, you'd never see the disparity. Kevin Miller absolutely felt the 8500 was extremely accurate.

At times the black levels of the ZT looked a bit better than the VT, but that was primarily when the room lighting was on. Once off, they looked identical. The big surprise to me was at the end when they played the Kuro demo reel that was designed to highlight blacks. I'm telling you guys, 95% of that demo looked IDENTICAL on all 3 panels. The other 5% of the time I gave the edge to the ZT & VT.

I don't know if it came across on your monitors, but at times the brightness advantage was very obvious on the 8500, but not as often as you might think. I don't believe the material they played, IMO, really highlighted the brightness differences. When was the disparity the most obvious? If you caught the period when they were playing around with Directv, the brightness differences were at times, huge. It was during those times that the screen had the largest % of bright areas. Hello ABL!

The Panasonic clearly has some issues such as calibration, clipping & 3D resolution. I personally don't care about 3D, but I know some of you guys do.

Although I was initially surprised at how well the ZT handled the room lighting, by the end of the night I came to the conclusion that, IMO, the 8500 has the most versatile qualities and did more things better than the other panels. The black levels are really close and the Kuro demo showed that in spades. But there's no question that if your biggest concern is MLL, than the ZT/VT is your best choice. Personally, if I was choosing between the 2, I'd go for the ZT if you had the extra cash. I really believe that filter does enough in terms of combating room lights and keeping black levels respectable, that it's worth the extra cost. But IMO, it simply is not a versatile panel. It does one thing better than the others, many other things as well as the others and falls woefully short in the brightness department.

Forgot about apparent sharpness. No surprises there, the Samsung looked the sharpest.

Oh yes, I ordered the F8500. smile.gif

Nighty night.
Completely agree about the Panasonic clipping the whites. It clips nearly 50% of the whites which was just another reason I returned the VT60. Panasonic IMO took a step backwards with the exception of the black levels. I suspect a lot of people will be canceling the ZT60 pre orders. Samsung truly stepped it this year and I am overly impressed with the F8500. You could say it is one of the best plasma sets ever!
Plutotype's Avatar Plutotype 04:55 AM 05-11-2013
Watched the DVR stream. My first impressions from the shootout:

I think, the F8500 is different from all 3 ZT, VT and KURO. D-Nice confirmed they calibrated it to 40ftl, while the Panasonics couldnt go higher than 35ftl. The max standard is 35ftl and that is why its a standard = going higher can crush whites. Regarding Panasonics whites - there was a white pattern, where I think it showed, Panasonics cant be pushed to 35ftl peak whites = they crush the whites then. The winning whites of the F8500 caused the captured stream I observe as "too much white". Maybe Ken ( attended the shootout ) can confirm, the white details on F8500 ARE NOT LOST in any way as the F8500 is much brighter and "whiter" as the other sets. Are the yellow whites on other Panasonics correct and F8500 is wrong?
http://s1281.photobucket.com/user/Plutotype/media/F8500whites_zpse9cde3d3.jpg.html

ZT max is at 30ftl, VT can go higher. But there is a issue. I did a snapshot from the 2013 VE Shootout and recommend you to watch the day 1 replay at the 1hour 26min mark.
http://s1281.photobucket.com/user/Plutotype/media/WhitespatternZTvsF8500_zps7c556f06.jpg.html
http://s1281.photobucket.com/user/Plutotype/media/WhitespatternZTvsF8500-2_zpsd07df1eb.jpg.html

Colors on the F8500 looked too luminant to me or better said less saturated than the other 3 sets. But who confirms, which TV adds colors saturation on the top and what if F8500 is the reference and other 3 are a little oversaturated?

I liked the colors and whites on KURO though smile.gif

Hmm..
Halimali's Avatar Halimali 05:29 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Top_Cat View Post

As usual a very interesting read. Much appreciated. BIG THANKS smile.gif
Congrats! Lucky Halimali, lucky Ken, lucky owners and future owners (including me biggrin.gif, waiting for prices but hopefully in a few weeks my oldie but more or less goodie C8000 will be resting in the bedroom).

Best Regards smile.gif

Thank you cat. I hope you will be an owner very soon smile.gif
Halimali's Avatar Halimali 05:34 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plutotype View Post

Watched the DVR stream. My first impressions from the shootout:

I think, the F8500 is different from all 3 ZT, VT and KURO. D-Nice confirmed they calibrated it to 40ftl, while the Panasonics couldnt go higher than 35ftl. The max standard is 35ftl and that is why its a standard = going higher can crush whites. Regarding Panasonics whites - there was a white pattern, where I think, Panasonics cant be pushed to 35ftl peak whites = they crush the whites then. The winning whites of the F8500 caused the captured stream I observe as "too much white". Maybe Ken ( attended the shootout ) can confirm, the white details on F8500 ARE NOT LOST in any way as the F8500 is much brighter and "whiter" as the other sets. Are the yellow whites on other Panasonics correct and F8500 is wrong?
http://s1281.photobucket.com/user/Plutotype/media/F8500whites_zpse9cde3d3.jpg.html

ZT max is at 30ftl, VT can go higher. But there is a issue. I did a snapshot from the 2013 VE Shootout and recommend you to watch the day 1 replay at the 1hour 26min mark.
http://s1281.photobucket.com/user/Plutotype/media/WhitespatternZTvsF8500_zps7c556f06.jpg.html
http://s1281.photobucket.com/user/Plutotype/media/WhitespatternZTvsF8500-2_zpsd07df1eb.jpg.html

Colors on the F8500 looked too luminant to me or better said less saturated than the other 3 sets. But who confirms, which TV adds colors saturation on the top and what if F8500 is the reference and other 3 are a little oversaturated?

I liked the colors and whites on KURO though smile.gif

Hmm..

In your first picture (face of a woman) I can't say the brand of the TVs as it is not visible but what I can say is that I'm liking the middle TV most followed by the one in the right then the one in the left

So what are these TVs?
airgas1998's Avatar airgas1998 05:43 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halimali View Post

In your first picture (face of a woman) I can't say the brand of the TVs as it is not visible but what I can say is that I'm liking the middle TV most followed by the one in the right then the one in the left

So what are these TVs?

that would be: 8500,vt,zt in the order that you chose.
Halimali's Avatar Halimali 05:53 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by airgas1998 View Post

that would be: 8500,vt,zt in the order that you chose.

So it is THE F8500?
looks GORGEOUS. I'm liking its white very much. It looks like the white of LED
I'm in love tongue.gif
Pinger's Avatar Pinger 05:56 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by agkss View Post

Congrats for your choice and thanks for info...i think i will wait for 2014 models for both brands.

Agkss I have to say you have great willpower being able to hold off with this years choices smile.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidHir View Post

Did I hear correctly, early on tonight from the Samsung rep, that one could upgrade the processor to get picture quality improvements that come each year (assuming hardware still the same)? In other words, if next year's F8500 is still the same hardware, but they make software PQ tweaks, can you get those in your 2013 model?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Yes you can Dave. A really wonderful concept.

That's incredible, I take it it's in the Evolution Kit? Damn if that's the case and with the 4 year upgrade window on the Evolution Kits you can practically have a new TV every year for the next 4 years fit $299 biggrin.gif
I myself would prob upgrade the E Kit every 2 years...
Chad B's Avatar Chad B 06:06 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

We're OT but what am I missing in regards to the 96 hz mode of the VT where blacks went below 0.001 fL? Does this alter the picture to the extent that it throws off one's calibration?
No, it didn't throw it off significantly. There were tiny differences, but then with the quirky calibration there were tiny differences between runs no matter what.
Ph8te's Avatar Ph8te 06:53 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plutotype View Post

Watched the DVR stream. My first impressions from the shootout:

I think, the F8500 is different from all 3 ZT, VT and KURO. D-Nice confirmed they calibrated it to 40ftl, while the Panasonics couldnt go higher than 35ftl. The max standard is 35ftl and that is why its a standard = going higher can crush whites. Regarding Panasonics whites - there was a white pattern, where I think it showed, Panasonics cant be pushed to 35ftl peak whites = they crush the whites then. The winning whites of the F8500 caused the captured stream I observe as "too much white". Maybe Ken ( attended the shootout ) can confirm, the white details on F8500 ARE NOT LOST in any way as the F8500 is much brighter and "whiter" as the other sets. Are the yellow whites on other Panasonics correct and F8500 is wrong?
http://s1281.photobucket.com/user/Plutotype/media/F8500whites_zpse9cde3d3.jpg.html

ZT max is at 30ftl, VT can go higher. But there is a issue. I did a snapshot from the 2013 VE Shootout and recommend you to watch the day 1 replay at the 1hour 26min mark.
http://s1281.photobucket.com/user/Plutotype/media/WhitespatternZTvsF8500_zps7c556f06.jpg.html
http://s1281.photobucket.com/user/Plutotype/media/WhitespatternZTvsF8500-2_zpsd07df1eb.jpg.html

Colors on the F8500 looked too luminant to me or better said less saturated than the other 3 sets. But who confirms, which TV adds colors saturation on the top and what if F8500 is the reference and other 3 are a little oversaturated?

I liked the colors and whites on KURO though smile.gif

Hmm..

Pluto, the stream was "killing" the white samples you were showing. Once the cameraman zoomed in on the set and the autofocus came in you were actually able to see where the clipping was (partially) at any distance it was not visable.

I should mention that you should take what you see via the stream with a HUGE grain of salt as the camer is introducing things you will never see in person.

Looking forward to seeing the results (calibration) and Q&A today.....
pieandchips's Avatar pieandchips 06:54 AM 05-11-2013
There's no way cell light was at 20 for that 35 fL F8500.
mbyrnes's Avatar mbyrnes 06:58 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by pieandchips View Post

There's no way cell light was at 20 for that 35 fL F8500.

I don't think it was at 35 fL. I thought at the beginning they said that they calibrated to 40 fL if possible (Pannys couldn't) and that they let the others get as bright as they could without ruining the picture. I think the F8500 was at something like 56 fL. Maybe someone else will remember the exact number.

One question I have is what mode was the F8500 in? The one setting lowers blacks but then it loses shadow detail right? Hopefully someone can chime in who was there.
Ph8te's Avatar Ph8te 07:04 AM 05-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by pieandchips View Post

There's no way cell light was at 20 for that 35 fL F8500.

It was at 16 for most of the night....
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbyrnes View Post

I don't think it was at 35 fL. I thought at the beginning they said that they calibrated to 40 fL if possible (Pannys couldn't) and that they let the others get as bright as they could without ruining the picture. I think the F8500 was at something like 56 fL. Maybe someone else will remember the exact number.

One question I have is what mode was the F8500 in? The one setting lowers blacks but then it loses shadow detail right? Hopefully someone can chime in who was there.

All of the sets were calibrated for 40ftL except for the 2 Panasonics which were not able to be calibrated that high....

The set was in movie mode...After the update I do not believe it looses shadow detail with the black optimizer on. If tt was crushing blacks it would have come up during the black pattern display.....
Tags: Samsung Pn51f8500 51 Inch 3d Smart Plasma Hdtv
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