Official Samsung PNxxF8500 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 322 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #9631 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 06:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Studio5west View Post

I did a system reset from the support menu not the service menu and it did help some but not quite enough. In a dark room I have a pretty good picture but that's with the maximum luminance I can get out of the panel.

the support menu did nothing for the problem I had.The problem occurred after i had downloaded firmware update 1114. I had low brightness on all modes and the sharpness was gone also. After the service menu factory reset my tv is back to how it was when it was brand new. No brightness or picture problems at all on movie or any other mode. This solution also worked for mark_b. Anyway is the problem you are having something you noticed right out of the box? Or is it something you just noticed recently?

Samsung F8500 Service menu factory reset and activating cal modes instructions

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post24101072
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post #9632 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Phanes View Post


I don't think the set has any issues. Movie mode will seem dim when put next to Standard or Dynamic. It may serve you well to actually start with the Standard setting and work your way down to the Movie mode tones.

Have you played around with the Gamma in Movie mode?

Again, based on your description, it does seem like your set doesn't actually have any problems... just that you're not satisfied with the brightness in Movie mode. Can you post pictures that might show us what exactly you're talking about?

As a side note, even I saw myself going back to the Standard mode initially, but have come to appreciate the "realistic" rendering of the Movie mode tones/colors.

If you're right I guess my assumption that there should be head room is wrong. I just heard so often that this set is so bright that people are lowering cell levels to 14-15 in movie mode to avoid eye strain. Not possible on my set. 

 

It's possible that the reference issue for me is not only "Standard" mode but also my now departed 12 yr old Pioneer 50" Elite. It had a wonderful bright image for film based content and looked great with video captured material. (It started going markedly green in the shadows and no fix possible)

 

I do like standard mode after dialing it back somewhat. For me skin is the key. Can't be plasticky (must have detail not obtained through sharpening).  And yes, using the gamma control has been most productive. In movie, or standard, pushing the contrast and then opening the mid-tones through the gamma adjust works well. I don't know if you use photo image editing software, (Photoshop), but I would love to have a tone curve to adjust luminance across the range.

 

Anyway after I calibrate with a disc I'll try to see it as you suggest and dial down expectations for brightness. BTW, haven't done a calibration in years and wonder if the new blu-ray discs can reveal if luminance or shadows meet industry benchmarks or merely get your set relatively balanced to its own capabilities.

 

I'll shoot some pix after the calibration although it would seem that the variance in monitor calibration of those viewing would easily mask  the differences.

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post #9633 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Damien Inferno View Post


the support menu did nothing for the problem I had.The problem occurred after i had downloaded firmware update 1114. I had low brightness on all modes and the sharpness was gone also. After the service menu factory reset my tv is back to how it was when it was brand new. No brightness or picture problems at all on movie or any other mode. This solution also worked for mark_b. Anyway is the problem you are having something you noticed right out of the box? Or is it something you just noticed recently?

My set has been dark from the start (a week ago).

 

I'm very hesitant to get into the service menu, been burned there before. The Support Menu reset did give me a little more luminance.

 

For comparison's sake, are most people 18-20 on Cell level and 85-95 on Contrast in Movie mode in a moderately dim room? I'm at 20, 95 and just get the brightness I want but, as in my reply to Damien above, I could be expecting too much.

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post #9634 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Studio5west View Post

If you're right I guess my assumption that there should be head room is wrong. I just heard so often that this set is so bright that people are lowering cell levels to 14-15 in movie mode to avoid eye strain. Not possible on my set. 

It's possible that the reference issue for me is not only "Standard" mode but also my now departed 12 yr old Pioneer 50" Elite. It had a wonderful bright image for film based content and looked great with video captured material. (It started going markedly green in the shadows and no fix possible)

I do like standard mode after dialing it back somewhat. For me skin is the key. Can't be plasticky (must have detail not obtained through sharpening).  And yes, using the gamma control has been most productive. In movie, or standard, pushing the contrast and then opening the mid-tones through the gamma adjust works well. I don't know if you use photo image editing software, (Photoshop), but I would love to have a tone curve to adjust luminance across the range.

Anyway after I calibrate with a disc I'll try to see it as you suggest and dial down expectations for brightness. BTW, haven't done a calibration in years and wonder if the new blu-ray discs can reveal if luminance or shadows meet industry benchmarks or merely get your set relatively balanced to its own capabilities.

I'll shoot some pix after the calibration although it would seem that the variance in monitor calibration of those viewing would easily mask  the differences.

Assuming you don't have the same problem like post #9633 above you, I think you'll appreciate how good the Movie mode is (out of box) if you put on some Game of Thrones and other full screen blu rays like Frozen Planet.

If someone were to leave the ZT60 with you, I'm sure they'd get it back with a broken screen smile.gif.
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post #9635 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:48 AM
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Didn't someone discover an Eco mode trick that changes the overall brightness of the F8500 regardless of mode?

I don't quite recall, but it was something like turn Eco mode On, change the Cell light settings or something, THEN turn Eco mode Off. Some user discovered this oddity. Without doing it, the set was very dim with Eco mode Off, no matter what the Cell level was set to. After doing this odd procedure, it restores the full Brightness range the F8500's are capable of. My recollection of the procedure may be far off so I'd search for it in the Owner's thread or this thread (it was in one of them, but I can't recall which).


Max
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post #9636 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Studio5west View Post

My set has been dark from the start (a week ago).

I'm very hesitant to get into the service menu, been burned there before. The Support Menu reset did give me a little more luminance.

For comparison's sake, are most people 18-20 on Cell level and 85-95 on Contrast in Movie mode in a moderately dim room? I'm at 20, 95 and just get the brightness I want but, as in my reply to Damien above, I could be expecting too much.

On movie mode I usually keep my pn64 at cell level 17, 18 and 95 contrast and its more then bright enough.
I understand being hesitant to go into the service menu and since you are saying it was like this right out of the box then it probably is the settings.
Have you tried any of the posted calibration settings here yet?

Samsung F8500 Service menu factory reset and activating cal modes instructions

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post24101072
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post #9637 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post

Didn't someone discover an Eco mode trick that changes the overall brightness of the F8500 regardless of mode?

I don't quite recall, but it was something like turn Eco mode On, change the Cell light settings or something, THEN turn Eco mode Off. Some user discovered this oddity. Without doing it, the set was very dim with Eco mode Off, no matter what the Cell level was set to. After doing this odd procedure, it restores the full Brightness range the F8500's are capable of. My recollection of the procedure may be far off so I'd search for it in the Owner's thread or this thread (it was in one of them, but I can't recall which).


Max
Floridaman discovered the eco trick. you turn eco on then all the way up and then turn it off. From my personal experience it only effected the CAL DAY and NIGHT modes on my tv and this was very early on.

Samsung F8500 Service menu factory reset and activating cal modes instructions

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post24101072
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post #9638 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 09:29 AM
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I have the 64 inch F8500. Last week I noticed I had to turn the TV on several times, I thought perhaps FIOS was dropping the signal causing an issue. After several times the TV worked fine so I thought nothing of it. Today while watching the NY Giant press conference the TV lost power at last 8 times in 10 minutes. I unplugged everything plugged it back in and ...NOTHING... well almost , I would get the Smart Hub logo up for a couple of seconds. After that it seems like the TV would try to turn on by itself!. I wasn't pressing any remotes. So I called Samsung, they had me do the usual, unplug it from the surge protector. It would not turn on. I do not use the TV all that much although yesterday it was on for around 10 hours. So it sits unplugged awaiting a service call. In doing some research I see that Samsung has a past history including a class action lawsuit for TV's failing to turn on. I was hoping to escape that with the flagship.

Anyone else experience this kind of failure so far? mad.gif
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post #9639 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 09:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Actually you have to make sure that is turned off on all the new TV's especially if you want your set brighter, most panels have that feature now.......
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post #9640 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 12:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KONICA TECH View Post

No

Does it depend on the screen apl? Low apl vs high apl?
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post #9641 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 05:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by music_to_my_ear View Post


Does it depend on the screen apl? Low apl vs high apl?

No, with no signal applied it is dark grey, even with cell, brightness and ,contrast all at 0.  Now I did get a reply that black levels increased with age. The picture is so good I am keeping mine and if it gets any better I will be happier. As long as it doesn't have the rising black level that the Panny's had a couple of years ago.  When I watch this 8500, I know why Panasonic is leaving the plasma business. Samsung knocked them out with this set and it was only going to be downhill from here on in.

 

I would like to add that when there is a black car or suit on the 8500....It is black and night scenes look so real.....amazing:)

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post #9642 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KONICA TECH View Post

No, with no signal applied it is dark grey, even with cell, brightness and ,contrast all at 0.  Now I did get a reply that black levels increased with age. The picture is so good I am keeping mine and if it gets any better I will be happier. As long as it doesn't have the rising black level that the Panny's had a couple of years ago.  When I watch this 8500, I know why Panasonic is leaving the plasma business. Samsung knocked them out with this set and it was only going to be downhill from here on in.

I would like to add that when there is a black car or suit on the 8500....It is black and night scenes look so real.....amazing:)

Thanks for the feedback. Im inbetween sets atm. 65ZT60 - 65VT60 - 65F8500. Havent been fortunate enough to see either in dark viewing environments always bright halogen light environments so I havent been able to see these differences and it makes my decision soo much harder. The only information I have gathered these past weeks is from owners like yourself. Screenshots do help tbh. I was leaning towards the ST60 for a bit because its able to hit a higher peak brightness than most panels and is exceedingly dark but I think the F8500 it a tad darker. The input lag is whats holding me back from the ST60...if only Panasonic would fix it with an update....Samsung is really looking good to me atm but I need to make a purchase to last me through the next several years and even stand up to OLEDS when they arrive in the masses. I have a feeling OLEDS will always be a high priced item. I dont think they will drop to near affordable pricing. I think its just to pricey to make even in large quantities. But what do I know lol.

From what Ive gathered about the F8500, in a dimly lit room the black bars will blend into the dark environment enough so it is indistinguishable. With all the lights off, they are visible. I always watch with a bias light and/or a pot light on or two anyways. The filter in the F8500 would help tremendulously and keep those blacks inky as well. The lastest frimware update I believe lowered the input lag as well. Its just those pesky floating blacks that keep me from thinking this will satisfy me for years to come. Its a real tough decision without seeing one in person.
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post #9643 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Damien Inferno View Post

On movie mode I usually keep my pn64 at cell level 17, 18 and 95 contrast and its more then bright enough.
I understand being hesitant to go into the service menu and since you are saying it was like this right out of the box then it probably is the settings.
Have you tried any of the posted calibration settings here yet?

Ok, I've done a calibration in movie mode and even with cell at 20 I can't quite hit the goal for the max white value unless I take brightness a few steps past where it calibrated.

Yes, I've tried many of the posted cals, all to varying degrees of success. Still at it though and I am enjoying the set, contrary to how it sounds. Your 64 at 17 in movie mode, I am not going to get there with the set in its current state.
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post #9644 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Studio5west View Post

Ok, I've done a calibration in movie mode and even with cell at 20 I can't quite hit the goal for the max white value unless I take brightness a few steps past where it calibrated.

Yes, I've tried many of the posted cals, all to varying degrees of success. Still at it though and I am enjoying the set, contrary to how it sounds. Your 64 at 17 in movie mode, I am not going to get there with the set in its current state.

I use phiwojos d nice settings. No matter how many settings I try I always wind up going back to them.

Samsung F8500 Service menu factory reset and activating cal modes instructions

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post24101072
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post #9645 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Damien Inferno View Post


I use phiwojos d nice settings. No matter how many settings I try I always wind up going back to them.

Tried a search but was unable to find these, can you post a link??

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post #9646 of 13110 Old 12-11-2013, 07:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KONICA TECH View Post

Tried a search but was unable to find these, can you post a link??

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1467675/f8500-recommended-settings-thread/930#post_23423384

only changes i made were turning up the cell light from 13 to 17-18 and brightness to 50

Samsung F8500 Service menu factory reset and activating cal modes instructions

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post24101072
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post #9647 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Damien Inferno View Post


I use phiwojos d nice settings. No matter how many settings I try I always wind up going back to them.

More information from my calibration efforts. Using the Disney disk, now in the advanced cal section, in both Movie and Standard, with Cell at 20 (!), my set, using the Contrast slider, cannot make even the lightest elements disappear into the white background. To achieve that I need to raise brightness into the high 60's which of course is unacceptable. On the other hand with Cell at 20, Contrast at 100 and Brightness at 52 (which I would prefer lower), I get a pretty nice picture.

 

For anyone out there using the Disney WOW disk, what results are you having?

 

So my question to all, and especially anyone who's had similar issues, is this. Is there a way to raise the luminance, beyond where I am now, in the Service Menu? Any other suggestions welcome!

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post #9648 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 08:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Studio5west View Post

More information from my calibration efforts. Using the Disney disk, now in the advanced cal section, in both Movie and Standard, with Cell at 20 (!), my set, using the Contrast slider, cannot make even the lightest elements disappear into the white background. To achieve that I need to raise brightness into the high 60's which of course is unacceptable. On the other hand with Cell at 20, Contrast at 100 and Brightness at 52 (which I would prefer lower), I get a pretty nice picture.

For anyone out there using the Disney WOW disk, what results are you having?

So my question to all, and especially anyone who's had similar issues, is this. Is there a way to raise the luminance, beyond where I am now, in the Service Menu? Any other suggestions welcome!

Note: Disney WOW Basic setups are closer to the proper settings. Advanced settings have you going too high!
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post #9649 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 10:19 AM
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Note: Disney WOW Basic setups are closer to the proper settings. Advanced settings have you going too high!

Good to know and since my brightness is maxed out I wouldn't be able to if going brighter would or would not give me a better image. I'm still curious if there is a way, perhaps through the Service Menu, to go beyond the Cell at 20 levels.

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post #9650 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 12:08 PM
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Guys, do we have a noise (from the fan/cooling) in F8500? I read a lot of complains about the noise on VT/ZT60 and this stops me buying Panasonic.. Now, looking for F8500 (if no such noise)

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post #9651 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by johnschwei View Post

Ok, I play a ton  of video games on a ps3(launch version, yes I stood in line) and am noticing this on two games I have played on my new Sammy.  Ghosts COD(online play) and Madden 25 (online and offline play).  I am pleased to find someone else with this same "screen tear" issue as I originally thought it was just my TV.  Any info on this and how to fix ?


What I did was follow the advice of titancrusher1, however, when playing online I still have a little input lag and it does bother me mad.gif


This screen tearing has gone but when I run when playing BF occasionally my screen starts to falter half a second and then you can move on again..


I am still not sure whether it's the television or the server (my internet is 20Mbit+ so that won't be the problem).


Pfff..... I hate it mad.gif
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post #9652 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 12:54 PM
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The f8500 has no noise coming from the back no matter how close you get to it. The only thing people complain about is the buzz but no fan noise what so ever or anything like that. My 64f8500 has no buzz coming from it at all I just love this TV my wife does too
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post #9653 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Studio5west View Post

More information from my calibration efforts. Using the Disney disk, now in the advanced cal section, in both Movie and Standard, with Cell at 20 (!), my set, using the Contrast slider, cannot make even the lightest elements disappear into the white background. To achieve that I need to raise brightness into the high 60's which of course is unacceptable. On the other hand with Cell at 20, Contrast at 100 and Brightness at 52 (which I would prefer lower), I get a pretty nice picture.

For anyone out there using the Disney WOW disk, what results are you having?

So my question to all, and especially anyone who's had similar issues, is this. Is there a way to raise the luminance, beyond where I am now, in the Service Menu? Any other suggestions welcome!
So obviously there is a real problem with your set. Its not the settings. You should tell Samsung this and demand they send a tech out IMO. But as ive said I would try doing the service menu factory reset first. Your brightness problem really sounds like the one i had.

Samsung F8500 Service menu factory reset and activating cal modes instructions

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post24101072
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post #9654 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Studio5west View Post

My set has been dark from the start (a week ago).

I'm very hesitant to get into the service menu, been burned there before. The Support Menu reset did give me a little more luminance.

For comparison's sake, are most people 18-20 on Cell level and 85-95 on Contrast in Movie mode in a moderately dim room? I'm at 20, 95 and just get the brightness I want but, as in my reply to Damien above, I could be expecting too much.

I'm at a cell light of 10, contrast of 100, brightness of 48 and gamma at 0 in movie and find it more than bright enough in my dark to dim room. cell at 20 is too bright to comfortably watch, even with all my lights on full and the windows open(though it is still a basement, so it's far from the crazy bright in that situation) I feel it's a bit much.

I would normally say the f8500 is brighter than anybody should ever need, but there's an entire market of LED owners to prove that statement wrong. so instead, i'll say that the f8500 is brighter than I will ever need.

I tried snapping a couple pics, but I'm not sure it really shows anything beyond a comparison of cell light at 10 and 20. I'm not so up to date with photography, so not sure how to take accurate pics. in all shots, the shadow detail I could clearly see became lost, and the brights that looked natural became way overexposed... I had to keep the exposure really low(min ISO I could set was 100) and at this setting the room lighting is hardly even noticeable. it's about 1/3-1/4 as bright in the pics as in real life. ??

anyway, here's a shot of the tv with cell light 20 with all lights on
1485903_10153594707725032_1005897416_o.jpg
cell light 10 with all lights on
1485903_10153594707730032_1544712113_o.jpg
cell light 10 with no lights on
1485903_10153594707735032_1976841963_o.jpg

Displays: Samsung PN64F8500/JVC X35
AVR: Pioneer VSX-1018AH, 5.1 audio
Sources: HTPC(Mediabrowser), PS3, XBOX360, Wii, Sony DVP-CX995V
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post #9655 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Damien Inferno View Post

So obviously there is a real problem with your set. Its not the settings. You should tell Samsung this and demand they send a tech out IMO. But as ive said I would try doing the service menu factory reset first. Your brightness problem really sounds like the one i had.


If I can gat a samsung tech to walk me thru the factory reset in the service menu, I'm in! No chance, right?
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post #9656 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Studio5west View Post

If I can gat a samsung tech to walk me thru the factory reset in the service menu, I'm in! No chance, right?

Its very simple to do. Heres instructions I posted for marc b he had no problem and it fixed his tv


http://www.avsforum.com/t/1463454/official-samsung-pnxxf8500-series-discussion-thread-no-street-price-talk/9450#post_23985438

Samsung F8500 Service menu factory reset and activating cal modes instructions

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post24101072
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post #9657 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 08:08 PM
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There were a few complaints out there with the previous firmware (1114) update, anyone seeing anything odd after applying 1115?
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post #9658 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post

I'm at a cell light of 10, contrast of 100, brightness of 48 and gamma at 0 in movie and find it more than bright enough in my dark to dim room. cell at 20 is too bright to comfortably watch, even with all my lights on full and the windows open(though it is still a basement, so it's far from the crazy bright in that situation) I feel it's a bit much.

I would normally say the f8500 is brighter than anybody should ever need, but there's an entire market of LED owners to prove that statement wrong. so instead, i'll say that the f8500 is brighter than I will ever need.

I tried snapping a couple pics, but I'm not sure it really shows anything beyond a comparison of cell light at 10 and 20. I'm not so up to date with photography, so not sure how to take accurate pics. in all shots, the shadow detail I could clearly see became lost, and the brights that looked natural became way overexposed... I had to keep the exposure really low(min ISO I could set was 100) and at this setting the room lighting is hardly even noticeable. it's about 1/3-1/4 as bright in the pics as in real life. ??

anyway, here's a shot of the tv with cell light 20 with all lights on
1485903_10153594707725032_1005897416_o.jpg
cell light 10 with all lights on
1485903_10153594707730032_1544712113_o.jpg
cell light 10 with no lights on
1485903_10153594707735032_1976841963_o.jpg

Thanks for the pics and the settings. I'm sitting in a dark room watching The set and I've actually got the cell down to 17 in standard, (still 20 in movie) and have to admit, this is a great set. However, I don't think I would be saying that in a bright room.Need the head room!

As to the pics, you have to be in manual mode to avoid auto exposure compensation and a picture of a picture will always be contrastier than as seen by the naked eye.
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post #9659 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Damien Inferno View Post



Its very simple to do. Heres instructions I posted for marc b he had no problem and it fixed his tv


http://www.avsforum.com/t/1463454/official-samsung-pnxxf8500-series-discussion-thread-no-street-price-talk/9450#post_23985438

My history of venturing into service menus is painful. I'd love to have tech on the line but you've got me thinking.
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post #9660 of 13110 Old 12-12-2013, 08:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Studio5west View Post

My history of venturing into service menus is painful. I'd love to have tech on the line but you've got me thinking.

i understand. Calling samsung and asking them to walk you through it isnt a bad idea. If they refuse insist on them sending a tech over. Also alot of us have gone into the service menu for another reason---- to turn the CAL DAY and NIGHT modes on.

Samsung F8500 Service menu factory reset and activating cal modes instructions

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/167-pl...l#post24101072
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