Official Panasonic VT60/VT65 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 118 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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Old 07-17-2013, 01:35 AM
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Originally Posted by chunon View Post

Light out put no contrast ratio yes the vt60 is better by a long shot and it maintains that contrast ratio despite apl changes the 8500 contrast ratio degrades as apl increases

Sharpness is subjective
In the end they are both darn good sets !
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Old 07-17-2013, 04:04 AM
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Originally Posted by mo949 View Post

Not true as I described earlier. They alternated between the two services for me on various products. Obviously if only one of them operates in your area you'll get that one for sure.
Could that just mean they are both local delivery services where you live?

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Old 07-17-2013, 05:54 AM
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In the end they are both darn good sets !

I absolutely agree Chris have never maintained otherwise

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Old 07-17-2013, 05:56 AM
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Originally Posted by 440michael View Post

First off thanks very much for answering. Yes, I'm using the standard mode but I have tried others. The default factory setting drives some of the settings to to very upper range. I have for the most part adjusted mine to about the middle but slightly on the lower side. I don't have any options turned on that adjust the picture. I have expermented with all source material. Older and very new. Same environment occurs. If it seems like I'm looking for people that might have the same kind of problems it's just beause times a-flying and I didn't want to let to much time slip by before I seek an enviroment that revolves around needing a tech. I was hoping that someone else might have had my problems and they had a concrete answer that corrected them. There is an authorized Panasonic repair service that's local here in the San Jose area that I am concidering. The picture gets so bad that I can't imagine an adjustment will correct this very grainy/screen door look that occurs in any darker environment. This is my first plasma and I wasn't aware of adjustments revolving around calibrating. The ultra grainy look that covers the darker portions during darker environments is so bad that I'm sure if an adjustment could take this out someone would have delt with this and had a fix. I don't like to be negative but I'm leaning towards I'm the one whos got the problem child. There is no way this condition of grain out could be discribed as something that's normal with plasmas. Not this bad. Thanks again. And maybe I'm wrong. Maybe there is an adjustment fix for this. Hopefully I'll find out.

I haven't followed the entire post history but what I can tell you is Standard mode is by far the worst for dithering and noise, it is basically a worthless mode used to meet energy star requirements.

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Old 07-17-2013, 05:58 AM
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Had my 60VT60 delivered by Pilot 2 weeks ago (purchased from Amazon). I have a TV stand that has the wall-mounting-style bracket on the back. I got the old TV out of the way the day before. On the day of delivery, ONE guy showed up with a van. He was outside getting ready to put the TV on a handcart when I went out to help him. The two of us carried it inside instead of using the cart thankfully.

The guy was very nice about telling me that I might want to throw a sheet or blanket down on the floor because the boxes are usually all covered in black dust on the bottom and many people have complained about dirty carpets afterwards. We took the top off of the box and left it sitting in the lower part of the box. Plugged it in to make sure it would turn on and inspected for any damage.

I had received the Pilot email the day before so I knew they weren't supposed to help lift it or put it on a base or a stand or anything like that, so I was prepared for that NOT to happen. However this guy did offer to help me lift it up onto the mount on my TV stand - even waited patiently for the few minutes that it took me to screw the mounting brackets onto the back of the TV. I gave the dude $10 for his help and all was good.
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Old 07-17-2013, 06:06 AM
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Originally Posted by SrValasco View Post

Had my 60VT60 delivered by Pilot 2 weeks ago (purchased from Amazon). I have a TV stand that has the wall-mounting-style bracket on the back. I got the old TV out of the way the day before. On the day of delivery, ONE guy showed up with a van. He was outside getting ready to put the TV on a handcart when I went out to help him. The two of us carried it inside instead of using the cart thankfully.

The guy was very nice about telling me that I might want to throw a sheet or blanket down on the floor because the boxes are usually all covered in black dust on the bottom and many people have complained about dirty carpets afterwards. We took the top off of the box and left it sitting in the lower part of the box. Plugged it in to make sure it would turn on and inspected for any damage.

I had received the Pilot email the day before so I knew they weren't supposed to help lift it or put it on a base or a stand or anything like that, so I was prepared for that NOT to happen. However this guy did offer to help me lift it up onto the mount on my TV stand - even waited patiently for the few minutes that it took me to screw the mounting brackets onto the back of the TV. I gave the dude $10 for his help and all was good.

Seems the experience varies widely, I too had to help carry my tv in but had to get someone to help me put it on the stand later, believe me with this guy I felt fortunate to get it into my place undamaged dude was on the edge of a coronary just getting the box top off. I complained to Amazon since I had to help carry it in myself and received a $100 dollar credit. Enhanced delivery in many cases means you will have to help carry it yourself lol

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Old 07-17-2013, 06:51 AM
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Originally Posted by chunon View Post

I haven't followed the entire post history but what I can tell you is Standard mode is by far the worst for dithering and noise, it is basically a worthless mode used to meet energy star requirements.

+++1
I really like the Pro mode. 440michael if you are using Standard then I can understand why your picture is marginal, knowing your other settings and source material in use when getting a grainy picture would be helpful as others have stated.

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Old 07-17-2013, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted by chunon View Post

Seems the experience varies widely, I too had to help carry my tv in but had to get someone to help me put it on the stand later, believe me with this guy I felt fortunate to get it into my place undamaged dude was on the edge of a coronary just getting the box top off. I complained to Amazon since I had to help carry it in myself and received a $100 dollar credit. Enhanced delivery in many cases means you will have to help carry it yourself lol

Mine was supposed to be delivered on Wednesday July 3rd but it didn't arrive at the local delivery place in time. Had to wait until Friday July 5th because of the holiday. Amazon took blame for the late delivery and gave me a $175 credit!
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Old 07-17-2013, 07:39 AM
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Originally Posted by SrValasco View Post

Mine was supposed to be delivered on Wednesday July 3rd but it didn't arrive at the local delivery place in time. Had to wait until Friday July 5th because of the holiday. Amazon took blame for the late delivery and gave me a $175 credit!

That is a plus, I will give Amazon credit for taking the feedback and doing something to compensate folks that complain.

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Old 07-17-2013, 08:10 AM
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Guys, is there a way to adjust/shift the screen? I'm running slides now and it looks like my viewing area is shifted couple of pixels to the right.. Meaning it's like 6-7 pixel columns on the left and 3 pixel columns on the right side... I've looked for such settings but I can't find'em..

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Old 07-17-2013, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by 440michael View Post

First off thanks very much for answering. Yes, I'm using the standard mode but I have tried others. The default factory setting drives some of the settings to to very upper range. I have for the most part adjusted mine to about the middle but slightly on the lower side. I don't have any options turned on that adjust the picture. I have expermented with all source material. Older and very new. Same environment occurs. If it seems like I'm looking for people that might have the same kind of problems it's just beause times a-flying and I didn't want to let to much time slip by before I seek an enviroment that revolves around needing a tech. I was hoping that someone else might have had my problems and they had a concrete answer that corrected them. There is an authorized Panasonic repair service that's local here in the San Jose area that I am concidering. The picture gets so bad that I can't imagine an adjustment will correct this very grainy/screen door look that occurs in any darker environment. This is my first plasma and I wasn't aware of adjustments revolving around calibrating. The ultra grainy look that covers the darker portions during darker environments is so bad that I'm sure if an adjustment could take this out someone would have delt with this and had a fix. I don't like to be negative but I'm leaning towards I'm the one whos got the problem child. There is no way this condition of grain out could be discribed as something that's normal with plasmas. Not this bad. Thanks again. And maybe I'm wrong. Maybe there is an adjustment fix for this. Hopefully I'll find out.

You basically have 3 options with the current generation of Panasonic plasmas as far as dithering vs contrast ratio. I'll explain:
First, standard is absolutely the worst possible picture mode. It's extremely unfortunate that they labeled it "standard," as this implies that it would be a good place to start. Unfortunately this mode is simultaneously very dim and runs in the lowest gradation drive mode. Never, ever use it. In fact, you should really only use the "custom" or "pro" modes unless you want to use the THX mode.

Once you're out of standard you have three gradation vs contrast options. These are seen in the interface as "panel brightness," however that name is just there to avoid confusion (in reality it creates more). This is essentially the panel drive mode setting.
High: Increased brightness in exchange for increased dither. Basically no one ever uses this mode, because the damage it does to dark details is far worse than the slight increase in overall light output it provides. Standard uses this mode but also caps the power output, which is what makes it the worst mode.
Mid: This is the default setting for any of the calibrate-able modes. A Middle ground between high contrast and dithering in dark images. Generally considered the best choice for normal viewing distances, however you may still see dithering if you sit at what I'll call "monitor FOV" distances.
Low: In this mode the panel sacrifices contrast for excellent gradation, resulting in almost no dithering even at the darkest shades. It's less used than "mid" because it does bring the black levels up slightly and decreases the peak output. If you're setting very close to the TV then this might be a good trade, but we're talking about the "monitor FOV" distance I mentioned before. This means sitting close enough to the TV that it takes up as much of your field of view as a desktop monitor might.
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Originally Posted by chunon View Post

Seems the experience varies widely, I too had to help carry my tv in but had to get someone to help me put it on the stand later, believe me with this guy I felt fortunate to get it into my place undamaged dude was on the edge of a coronary just getting the box top off. I complained to Amazon since I had to help carry it in myself and received a $100 dollar credit. Enhanced delivery in many cases means you will have to help carry it yourself lol

Yeah, there's a huge amount of variance. It's not really an Amazon-specific issue, it's actually about how the freight carriers in your area handle things. In some places the large freight companies do direct delivery, while in other places (especially as you get farther from a major hub city) they sub-contract the delivery to basically anyone with a truck. In my case I had a relatively professional crew of 2 show up who were familiar with setting up the TV (probably done tons of them) and had it on the stand extremely quickly. But I'm in a city with the warehouse for the freight company no more than 20 miles from my house. Anyway, depending on your location the freight shipper might send it off with some other "company" which may consist of a guy with a van. Giving you some cash back is about the best Amazon can do because they don't have significant leverage over these freight companies, which make most of their money delivering incredibly large and heavy things to businesses. It's not optimal but you won't get companies like UPS or FedEx to even touch shipments this large and heavy.
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Old 07-17-2013, 09:20 AM
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Having ordered several large displays before, I can say Pilot shipping is the absolute worst for only sending out one person which meant I always got stuck helping the guy. CEVA has always been excellent. Your mileage may vary.
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Old 07-17-2013, 09:49 AM
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Pilot delivered mine and only one guy showed up so I had to help. No problems other than that and really didnt mind having to help. Would be bad if I was in a wheel chair or something. He didnt get a tip from me since I had to help and it took less than 5 minutes didnt even break a sweat.
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Old 07-17-2013, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by S T I G View Post

Pilot delivered mine and only one guy showed up so I had to help. No problems other than that and really didnt mind having to help. Would be bad if I was in a wheel chair or something. He didnt get a tip from me since I had to help and it took less than 5 minutes didnt even break a sweat.

I really don't understand why they'd show up with 1 person for a delivery like that. I truly believe, based on this as well as many other stories, that Pilot really couldn't care less about customer service. I suspect they don't have any solid competition, otherwise how could they afford to get so complacent in their position?

Though I am an employee of Magnolia Home Theater, the views and opinions I express on this forum are those of my own and not my employer.
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Old 07-17-2013, 10:15 AM
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It's very common unfortunately it was. Contracted out locally in my case

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Old 07-17-2013, 10:15 AM
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I wouldn't tip a guy delivering a box unless he really really did something special. The UPS guy never gets tipped, and that dude is like santa to me biggrin.gif
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Old 07-17-2013, 10:28 AM
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I received my new 55VT60 yesterday (Thanks Chris @ Cleveland) and have been running D-Nice's slide ever since. It is pretty quiet. It is sitting down in my man cave on the bar though. It will be wall mounted upstairs when its broken in so hopefully the sound level won't change. I've been pretty concerned about that after reading post from this thread.

Anyway my question is: Where is the microphone? If I want to Skype how do I transmit audio? Is it the mic on the touch remote?
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Old 07-17-2013, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

That's right.
The internal sources, TV Tuner, TV USB ports, and Netflix like applications, should all output more than stereo if the source has surround audio. The only way to get those results from your player or your TiVo is to go through your AVR for audio. Again, my impression is that Amazon isn't outputting 5.1, and 5.1 sources at Netflix are a small minority of their streaming content.
Is your TV hard wired to the Internet or is it wireless? This setup should work for you but you're going to need to figure out why you're not getting surround sound out from the TV's Netflix.
Clean cable setup, easier control of all audio sources, and lossless audio from Blu-ray disks are the main advantages. Why do you prefer to do your streaming from the TV? Many people use the Roku or Apple TV as stand alone streaming devices.
Unless your current AVR is underpowered for your room and speakers, then an increase in real power won't make much difference. The Sony seems to have a lot of features for the price. Sony may be using an inflated way to produce high power numbers. If you're interested in 3D that would be an advantage. Don't expect anything from the 4K pass through feature. At the moment it's mostly hype.

First of all, I want to thank you and the others who have helped me with this. I only have a moment to post right now, but did want to report that I used the VT60's native Viera apps Netflix app last night, cued up an episode of Breaking Bad, fed it to the AVR via an optical cable and, sure enough, it pushed Dolby D.

Also, because my pre-HDMI 2002 Onkyo AVR is so 'long in the tooth' now, and because i'm having some unrelated power on/off issues with it, I ordered from Amazon Warehouse deals a 'Like New' Sony STR-DH830 AVR for a steal, i.e. less than two fifty. If nothing else, it should save me from pulling a few extra HDMI cables from the AVR to the VT60 when I start tidying things up after this initial shakedown.

Thanks again!
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Old 07-17-2013, 10:43 AM
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Chunon......Thanks for your comment.

headlesschicken.Thank you very much for your detailed explanation. I will certainaly ditch the standard mode and adjust from there. This could very well be my entire problem.

Thanks again....Mike
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Old 07-17-2013, 10:43 AM
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Chunon......Thanks for your comment.

headlesschicken.Thank you very much for your detailed explanation. I will certainaly ditch the standard mode and adjust from there. This could very well be my entire problem.

Thanks again....Mike
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Old 07-17-2013, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by 440michael View Post

Chunon......Thanks for your comment.

headlesschicken.Thank you very much for your detailed explanation. I will certainaly ditch the standard mode and adjust from there. This could very well be my entire problem.

Thanks again....Mike

I truly hope that is it, VT60 is a great set

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Old 07-17-2013, 10:58 AM
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It will do the same thing (less than hockey) on basketball games. After several contacts with the Panasonic help line a tech was finally able to re-produce the brightness flickering. According to him they are working on it. Don't know what that means or if a correction can be made. I'll tell you........watching a game with the picture constantly brightening every 10 seconds is not something a $3000 TV should do. I have talked to the store manager a couple of times and now I am the enemy for bringing up ANY issue with this set. It's now like the rip off car dealer. You paid. You signed the bottom line. Now get off the lot !!

If changing modes like many many people have advised you to do 'fixes' it, maybe you should call panasonic back and let them know since they are hard at work on a fix for your issue.
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Old 07-17-2013, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Bazylik View Post

Guys, is there a way to adjust/shift the screen? I'm running slides now and it looks like my viewing area is shifted couple of pixels to the right.. Meaning it's like 6-7 pixel columns on the left and 3 pixel columns on the right side... I've looked for such settings but I can't find'em..

I believe what you're describing is pixel orbit. You want it off while running slides.

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Old 07-17-2013, 11:26 AM
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So I have a dilema. I can get the 60"VT60 or 65"ST60 for the same price. I will feed the unit through a Pioneer Elite AV system (HDMI signalt for DTV and DVD/Blueray) and have no need for audio output. Minimal "smart TV" feature use as well. Viewing distance is 10ft in fairly bright room.

Do I opt for the larger size or the better screen filter to reduce room glare?!?!?!!?

Thanks for your input.
B.
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Old 07-17-2013, 11:32 AM
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imo size matters. Only if I were sitting in a way where my eyes were within 6ft of the screen would I consider something smaller like a 60
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Old 07-17-2013, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by kimolaoha View Post

First of all, I want to thank you and the others who have helped me with this. I only have a moment to post right now, but did want to report that I used the VT60's native Viera apps Netflix app last night, cued up an episode of Breaking Bad, fed it to the AVR via an optical cable and, sure enough, it pushed Dolby D.

Also, because my pre-HDMI 2002 Onkyo AVR is so 'long in the tooth' now, and because i'm having some unrelated power on/off issues with it, I ordered from Amazon Warehouse deals a 'Like New' Sony STR-DH830 AVR for a steal, i.e. less than two fifty. If nothing else, it should save me from pulling a few extra HDMI cables from the AVR to the VT60 when I start tidying things up after this initial shakedown.

Thanks again!

Not sure if this help but I have a Elite AVR that's has ARC I just tried the you tube app and I can not get the sounds to come out of my AVR. The sound comes out of the TV speakers only I am using HDMI. I'm guess that's this issue is because Panasonic for got to add the option to turn off the Internal TV speakers. I haven't tried optic yet maybe it will work then.
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Old 07-17-2013, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bkaushansky View Post

So I have a dilema. I can get the 60"VT60 or 65"ST60 for the same price. I will feed the unit through a Pioneer Elite AV system (HDMI signalt for DTV and DVD/Blueray) and have no need for audio output. Minimal "smart TV" feature use as well. Viewing distance is 10ft in fairly bright room.

Do I opt for the larger size or the better screen filter to reduce room glare?!?!?!!?

Thanks for your input.
B.

I also would lean towards a bigger screen. At 10', I think a 65" screen is ideal, and the ST60 is no slouch in terms of PQ. Unless you do a lot of gaming, I would opt for the larger size of the ST over the VT with all things being equal.

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Old 07-17-2013, 12:14 PM
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Just a quick question for clarity. I notice that there is a lot of talk about pro calibration settings (CNET settings and the like), but I thought all panels are unique and thus one set of calibrations settings for the VT60 would not necessarily work for another -- and thus the reason to have a VT60 calibrated by a pro in the first place? From what I understand, factory setups are not precise and there is considerable variability among LED or Plasma units due to the interactions of dozens of internal components that are not built to military spec. Also, the most important setting is the grayscale -- from near black to reference white -- since grayscale affects all other controls, and it can only be set correctly by a pro. I have had, and still enjoy two other Panny plasmas before my recent VT60 purchase, and they were great without pro calibration -- but I am thinking of getting the 65-inch VT60 pro calibrated after a few 100 hours just to see the difference though I think the VT60 is remarkable just out of the box -- best PQ I have seen. By the way, purchased the VT60 from Cleveland Plasma and would have to say they have great service and easy delivery. Per some other posts, it is pretty easy to get the delivery guys to set up the TV on the stand so you can make a proper inspection of the set -- just say you will tip them. I didn't tell them what I was going to tip and not sure what the going tip price is nationwide, but in DC I gave them $20 each, and that is actually a small price when you consider that it is just some quick insurance on an expensive TV purchase.
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Old 07-17-2013, 01:39 PM
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The VT60 will look far different once professionally calibrated by one of the guys recommended here. While I did mess around with various settings, including trying out Disney WOW, there is simply no substitute for the all-around accuracy you will experience post-calibration.

I was definitely a skeptic, but I felt that I had to give it a go. Very, very happy that I did.
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Old 07-17-2013, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ptbenic View Post

Just a quick question for clarity. I notice that there is a lot of talk about pro calibration settings (CNET settings and the like), but I thought all panels are unique and thus one set of calibrations settings for the VT60 would not necessarily work for another -- and thus the reason to have a VT60 calibrated by a pro in the first place? From what I understand, factory setups are not precise and there is considerable variability among LED or Plasma units due to the interactions of dozens of internal components that are not built to military spec. Also, the most important setting is the grayscale -- from near black to reference white -- since grayscale affects all other controls, and it can only be set correctly by a pro. I have had, and still enjoy two other Panny plasmas before my recent VT60 purchase, and they were great without pro calibration -- but I am thinking of getting the 65-inch VT60 pro calibrated after a few 100 hours just to see the difference though I think the VT60 is remarkable just out of the box -- best PQ I have seen. By the way, purchased the VT60 from Cleveland Plasma and would have to say they have great service and easy delivery. Per some other posts, it is pretty easy to get the delivery guys to set up the TV on the stand so you can make a proper inspection of the set -- just say you will tip them. I didn't tell them what I was going to tip and not sure what the going tip price is nationwide, but in DC I gave them $20 each, and that is actually a small price when you consider that it is just some quick insurance on an expensive TV purchase.

Pro Calibration will make a big difference imo and you are correct the grayscale has the most variance from set to set, The VT60 has a longer break in period tho the recommendation is 300 hours for the 2013 Pannys

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