Official Panasonic VT60/VT65 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 340 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews

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post #10171 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by whipit View Post

Just to clear things up, the VT HAS a single sheet of glass design like the ZT except it stops at the speakers. On the ZT the panel and front glass are bonded. The ZT has no speakers so it goes to the chrome trim. The VT/ZT bezel is under the glass. Nothing like an ST that has an exposed bezel.

So there you go cpc.
Interesting, I thought I had read the single sheet pane was an exclusive ZT feature. Maybe it was more about the bonding process like you mentioned.
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post #10172 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by smurraybhm View Post

I my not be an electrical engineer (like that matters in regards to your ability to set up a display correctly - I mean seriously the occupation drop gives you creed) but I too came from a Pioneer and my CALIBRATED VT exceeds and matches it various categories. I just finished watching a movie with the whole left side of the room flushed with sunlight (15 feet of floor to ceiling windows) and not only was the VT bright enough it looked a heck of a lot better than my Sony XBR and Samsung LEDs.

The VT is a great display that needs to be set up correctly. All this discussion about brightness blah blah, the set can get more than bright enough with the right person setting it up. I do think a lot of people are jumping into plasma due to the technology being at end of life who are having trouble adapting to the differences of plasma and LED. If anyone thinks this years LEDs (if those shown at CES even make it to our local stores) are going to match the picture of the better plasmas from Pioneer, Samsung and Panasonic then I say respectfully you will be wrong.

A plasma display needs to be set up correctly and too many people are plugging in other peoples settings or expecting the THX modes to be reference out of the box. I am here to tell you it doesn't work that way. If you go the DIY route on picture settings then get ready to tinker for a while, especially the first 300 hours or so. There are no magic settings or quick fixes - dare I say that some of the posts lately demonstrate the need for help calibrating. It's not only about reference but setting your display up to perform its best in the environment it is being used in. Why do you think plasmas always look crappy in the a/v store smile.gif

Debate all you want about calibration, but that $400 I spent getting one has let me enjoy a kick ass (maybe bad ass) picture now since August. The type of picture that I still admire after 8 months of ownership. That looks good be it a blu-Ray, DTV or streaming Netflix. The only other display I can say that about - 5 years later - is my Pioneer but I love the bigger screen of my VT. What do they both have in common besides being plasmas - DNice.

P.S. OLED excluded.
WOW, i could not have said that better, ty smile.gif

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post #10173 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 12:14 PM
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I've been waiting to move my Pioneer to another room and make room for something newer and bigger--the latest VT60.

I have been eyeing the 65" for awhile as my older plasma is only 50".

But now prices are coming down and the price for a ZT60 (60") is the same as the VT60 (65")!

What to do:

The "absolute best picture" at the end of the plasma era or "just as good but bigger" (at this price point, of course)?

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post #10174 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by CrazyNurse View Post

I've been waiting to move my Pioneer to another room and make room for something newer and bigger--the latest VT60.

I have been eyeing the 65" for awhile as my older plasma is only 50".

But now prices are coming down and the price for a ZT60 (60") is the same as the VT60 (65")!

What to do:

The "absolute best picture" at the end of the plasma era or "just as good but bigger" (at this price point, of course)?

It may be that the VT60s prices are going up as the supply dwindles. See my previous posts about the price of the 55VT60 rising significantly over the past two weeks and even past two days. Looks like the laws of supply and demand are alive and well.
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post #10175 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 12:37 PM
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Alright, I've been searching for hours and can't find any resolution, so will give these forums a shot.

 

I just purchased a 55VT60 and have immediately noticed an audio lag for everything I've hooked up - cable, blu-ray, xbox one and ps3. I've tried everything I can think of: ran the hdmi straight to the TV to use internal speakers, ran hdmi to tv and used an optical cable to my receiver, ran all hdmi through my receiver passed the signal through to tv, replaced my hdmi cables, updated firmware, tried various modes like standard & THX cinema, etc. Nothing is working. My receiver has the ability to delay the audio further up to 9 frames, but not to delay the video signal which seems to be what is needed.

 

My setup works just fine with an 8 year old dlp and with a brand new 60" LED SmartTV...so it has to be the Panasonic. Based on my research, I'm starting to wonder if my model is defective.

 

The picture on this TV is amazing, but the out of sync sound is a deal breaker. I'm really hoping someone can help because I don't want to return it!

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post #10176 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrazyNurse View Post

I've been waiting to move my Pioneer to another room and make room for something newer and bigger--the latest VT60.

I have been eyeing the 65" for awhile as my older plasma is only 50".

But now prices are coming down and the price for a ZT60 (60") is the same as the VT60 (65")!

What to do:

The "absolute best picture" at the end of the plasma era or "just as good but bigger" (at this price point, of course)?

Decide quickly…stock in many places is very very low!! I received my 60 today from Best Buy. When I went to Best Buy's website to see the currently price…they are sold out in my area.
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post #10177 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 12:49 PM
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How bad are the reflections compared to other Panny's and other plasmas? Can I assume the stronger (if that is the correct term) the "filter" that is used, the less light output (no free lunch)?

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post #10178 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greginaz1 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Oakley View Post

So, do what most of us do: fiddle with the settings in the Picture menu. You can make your new TV bright as hell. For example, try THX Bright Room (I think that's what its called). You won't solve your indecision typing about it here.

I'm an electrical engineer and have messed with all kinds of settings for 3 days now. THX Bright Room isn't even that bright...I'm thinking now maybe I have a defective set...standard mode on my set even when room is dark is very dark...unusable really...even in a cave...is this the way it is for everybody or is it maybe an indicator of abnormally low light output?

Quote:
Originally Posted by greginaz1 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhersco View Post

I have a brightness question for owners of the VT60:

I am considering replacing my ten-year old Fujitsu P50XHA10U 1080i/720p plasma display with a 55" VT60, but I am concerned about the new TV's brightness level. According to a November review of the VT60 on PCMag.com, "Its peak brightness of 158.42 cd/m2 can't match the Samsung PN60F8500 (301.21 cd/m2)." The brightness spec for my old Fujitsu is 600 cd/m2. Unless specs are measured differently today, it would appear that the new plasma TVs are nowhere near as bright as my old Fujitsu. Is that true? Is the VT60 really only about one-quarter as bright as my old monitor? Is the F8500 only half as bright? Or, is it impossible to compare the old specs to the new ones?

Wow, I guess this is what is spoiling me...my old Pioneer plasma has brightness of 1000 cd/m2!


My son-in-law is an ee and couldn't set up a video display with Joe Kane sitting next to him.

First of all, google the AVSHD calibration disc, download it and the patterns manual, burn the disc, read the manual, and "start" there. Set up your display, view content, and report back with your subjective findings as well as all your settings.

In no way was your old plasma putting out 1000 cd/m2. That's over 290 Foot Lamberts.

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post #10179 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by greginaz1 View Post

I took delivery of my 65" VT60 a few days ago and right out of the box in a dim room I was pretty disappointed by the brightness. My 50" Pioneer PDP-5040HD has a much brighter picture even in standard mode. I thought the VT would blow my 9 year old Pioneer away but it didn't. I've messed with all the popular calibrations here and nothing is really much better than THX Bright Room. The room I have it in gets light during the day but not direct on the panel and if THX Bright Room is as good as it gets this set is probably going back for a Sammy 7100.

I had the same Pioneer PDP-5040HD which I gave to my son when I bought the 65VT60. I'm thinking about asking for the Pioneer back smile.gif. Right now I'm using the CNET setting in Cinema with both Panel Brightness set to High and Black level set to bright. I keep messing with Contrast and Brightness to find that perfect setting. I cut the Color Temp back to Warm1 which seems to help with the contrast but after all of the great reviews of the VT60 I'm a bit disappointed that the PQ doesn't seem to match the Pioneer.

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post #10180 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 01:16 PM
 
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^Wha? The only area it might not match it is in max brightness (blame that on environmental regulations), but that Pioneer panel dates back to 2003. In every other area, you should be seeing improvements.
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post #10181 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 01:18 PM
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The bright room, IR, break-in, slides etc. talk can be a bit daunting. I fondly remember the clouding/flashlighting talk when I bought my current set four years ago. Seems nothing has changed for the latter in that time, sadly.

So I ponied up for the 65VT after the ZT went quickly. Delivery is set for next Friday.

This will be its new home:



Going to give the Harmony Smart and the Antec lighting a whirl as well.

Hopefully, all goes well and the swearing stays at a minimum. Having dealt with the Harmony software a few times before, I highly doubt this will happen.
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post #10182 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post


My son-in-law is an ee and couldn't set up a video display with Joe Kane sitting next to him.

First of all, google the AVSHD calibration disc, download it and the patterns manual, burn the disc, read the manual, and "start" there. Set up your display, view content, and report back with your subjective findings as well as all your settings.

In no way was your old plasma putting out 1000 cd/m2. That's over 290 Foot Lamberts.

Since I don't have the proper test equipment I can only go by the data sheet for Pioneer (see link below) and my own eyes compared it to the VT60 and there really is NO comparison at all to me in brightness and all condition PQ.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/Plasma/PDP-5040HD

I guess that I'm just spoiled by the Pioneer. The VT has a great pic when there is very little light but suffers otherwise when compared to the Pioneer. Oh well. No big deal as I will mess around some more and can just send back.
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post #10183 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

^Wha? The only area it might not match it is in max brightness (blame that on environmental regulations), but that Pioneer panel dates back to 2003. In every other area, you should be seeing improvements.

I hear ya. And yes but I go back and forth between both sets and I still prefer the old Pioneer. Believe it or not sometimes 'old' engineering is better than new too (due to implementation cost and the overall lack of genius analog designers these days)...especially in analog/RF things...

Maybe I was unrealistic in expecting huge differences in the performance on this new set???
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post #10184 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by dswierenga View Post

I had the same Pioneer PDP-5040HD which I gave to my son when I bought the 65VT60. I'm thinking about asking for the Pioneer back smile.gif. Right now I'm using the CNET setting in Cinema with both Panel Brightness set to High and Black level set to bright. I keep messing with Contrast and Brightness to find that perfect setting. I cut the Color Temp back to Warm1 which seems to help with the contrast but after all of the great reviews of the VT60 I'm a bit disappointed that the PQ doesn't seem to match the Pioneer.

I agree...I guess we are finding out how good the 5040 was...my BB guy said it was one of best panels ever made...for what that is worth! rolleyes.gif

I watch a lot of hockey too and the ice just doesn't look as good no matter what I do to settings.
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post #10185 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 01:33 PM
 
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Originally Posted by greginaz1 View Post

I agree...I guess we are finding out how good the 5040 was...my BB guy said it was one of best panels ever made...for what that is worth! rolleyes.gif

I watch a lot of hockey too and the ice just doesn't look as good no matter what I do to settings.
I can imagine the ABL on that set is much less restrictive than that on the ZT60, which is contributing to whites that are simply less bright. I owned the last Pioneer (Elite) Plasma and felt the ZT60 and Pioneer were pretty close (the ZT60 being slightly dimmer).
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post #10186 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by eric3316 View Post

Interesting, I thought I had read the single sheet pane was an exclusive ZT feature. Maybe it was more about the bonding process like you mentioned.

Just the bonding process and black filter are exclusive to the ZT. The VT also has the same new red Phosphor and 98% DCI color ability.
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post #10187 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by LewsTherin View Post

Alright, I've been searching for hours and can't find any resolution, so will give these forums a shot.

I just purchased a 55VT60 and have immediately noticed an audio lag for everything I've hooked up - cable, blu-ray, xbox one and ps3. I've tried everything I can think of: ran the hdmi straight to the TV to use internal speakers, ran hdmi to tv and used an optical cable to my receiver, ran all hdmi through my receiver passed the signal through to tv, replaced my hdmi cables, updated firmware, tried various modes like standard & THX cinema, etc. Nothing is working. My receiver has the ability to delay the audio further up to 9 frames, but not to delay the video signal which seems to be what is needed.

My setup works just fine with an 8 year old dlp and with a brand new 60" LED SmartTV...so it has to be the Panasonic. Based on my research, I'm starting to wonder if my model is defective.

The picture on this TV is amazing, but the out of sync sound is a deal breaker. I'm really hoping someone can help because I don't want to return it!

I was watching the CBS Morning show today and said Damn that looks awesome, sorry but I was blown away that a tv service could look that good. Most feeds dont't. It was so good I watched the whole show. During the show i hit my Denon's mute button and hit it again and got lag. I had video lag that was behind the audio about a half second, it was bad and very abnormal, something I never see or notice anyway. So I power cycled the AVR and not much better then I turned everything off and came back an hour later and it went to a good sync, so maybe give that or some combo a try. I think it's a handshake issue making some timing off and this tv is more sensitive to it than my G10 with the same equipment. It does seem very rare that it happens and we watch lots of tv shows off U-verse.
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post #10188 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by greginaz1 View Post

Great deal or not it still is a lot of money to be spending if I'm going to second guess and not be happy with my decision...and heaven forbid I ever have to move this TV to a room that is even brighter...ugh.

As I said earlier the 'standard' mode picture on my 9 year old PDP-5040HD is more to my liking...hence my disappointment right out of box.

I know...I know....but as I explained before....its the aggravation of sending it back and paying $1300 for the other plasma option or just waiting until something better comes on the market. rolleyes.gif

I'm trying to be happy with it and for the most part, I am.
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post #10189 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greginaz1 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post


My son-in-law is an ee and couldn't set up a video display with Joe Kane sitting next to him.

First of all, google the AVSHD calibration disc, download it and the patterns manual, burn the disc, read the manual, and "start" there. Set up your display, view content, and report back with your subjective findings as well as all your settings.

In no way was your old plasma putting out 1000 cd/m2. That's over 290 Foot Lamberts.

Since I don't have the proper test equipment I can only go by the data sheet for Pioneer (see link below) and my own eyes compared it to the VT60 and there really is NO comparison at all to me in brightness and all condition PQ.

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/Plasma/PDP-5040HD

I guess that I'm just spoiled by the Pioneer. The VT has a great pic when there is very little light but suffers otherwise when compared to the Pioneer. Oh well. No big deal as I will mess around some more and can just send back.

You've stumped me. I checked on posts from calibrator acquaintances who were working back then and could find no info. Although the Pioneer documentation does say 1000 cd/m2 it is highly improbable in realty. First of all there is no need short of viewing on the sun for 290 FtL output. The Samsung F8500 max's out somewhere around 70 and that is too bright for nearly all lighting environments.

Regardless, try this with your VT60: CATs Off, PNL BRT HIGH, Contrast 100, Gamma 2.4 (yields about 2.2), Color Temp anything but Warm. Turn off anything that says or infers AUTO. If your display is still too dark it's either broken or you just aren't cut out for plasma. smile.gif

Edit: use pro 1 or 1 mode

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post #10190 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by mbroadus View Post

You're correct…received the 60" today and while it will be perfect, the 65" would not have been too big. So far, very happy I returned the 55 for the 60.

Glad to hear it! Enjoy!!
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post #10191 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 02:35 PM
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Could somebody please provide a download link to the break in slides for a USB stick? Thanks kindly
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post #10192 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 02:43 PM
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Could somebody please provide a download link to the break in slides for a USB stick? Thanks kindly

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1466472/2013-panasonic-settings-issues-thread
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post #10193 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 02:55 PM
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Thanks

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post #10194 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 03:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

You've stumped me. I checked on posts from calibrator acquaintances who were working back then and could find no info. Although the Pioneer documentation does say 1000 cd/m2 it is highly improbable in realty. First of all there is no need short of viewing on the sun for 290 FtL output. The Samsung F8500 max's out somewhere around 70 and that is too bright for nearly all lighting environments.

Regardless, try this with your VT60: CATs Off, PNL BRT HIGH, Contrast 100, Gamma 2.4 (yields about 2.2), Color Temp anything but Warm. Turn off anything that says or infers AUTO. If your display is still too dark it's either broken or you just aren't cut out for plasma. smile.gif

Edit: use pro 1 or 1 mode

Thanks...minor correction...I may not be cut out for 'modern' plasma...lol!
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post #10195 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Scott Oakley View Post

The only change I made, which will considered sacrilege by some is boosted the Sharpness to 80. I like a sharp, focused picture. Just a preference.
Scott

After 3 months and 300 hours of 60 inch VT60 ownership, I can say the single biggest (and unexpected) boost in pq (along with raising the contrast in THX to 80) I have experienced was setting the sharpness to 80! Up until doing this, I always felt that the picture was lacking in "punch" and detail— and was certainly nowhere near what I was used to coming from my 50 inch Pioneer. I gradually just accepted the trade-off and attributed it to the inherent drop-off in brightness of the larger display. Now, I am consistetnly having my head knocked off by this tv's image and find myself throwing my hands in the air in utter disbelief of the image before me.

And yes, I know what you mean about "sacrilege"; until I began my own extensive tinkering, I never bothered with the sharpness setting since every posted calibration setting I tried always left it at default and I've had my own long-standing misgivings about using any "artificial" pq enhancements. Of course, I was initially worried about introducing all sorts of unwanted artefacts and losing the film-like image the VT is known for, but hours upon hours of viewing have revealed nothing. (The Disney WOW zone plates also reveal nothing; in fact even setting sharpness at 100 on those patterns still reveals nothing untoward—at least on my set.)
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post #10196 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 03:36 PM
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Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

You've stumped me. I checked on posts from calibrator acquaintances who were working back then and could find no info. Although the Pioneer documentation does say 1000 cd/m2 it is highly improbable in realty. First of all there is no need short of viewing on the sun for 290 FtL output. The Samsung F8500 max's out somewhere around 70 and that is too bright for nearly all lighting environments.

Regardless, try this with your VT60: CATs Off, PNL BRT HIGH, Contrast 100, Gamma 2.4 (yields about 2.2), Color Temp anything but Warm. Turn off anything that says or infers AUTO. If your display is still too dark it's either broken or you just aren't cut out for plasma. smile.gif

Edit: use pro 1 or 1 mode

Actually been playing around with Pro 1 since you mentioned it and I have a picture I like better than most...changes I made are sharpness to 55...color temp to Cool1...all 'stuff' off...panel at mid...AGC at 4...gamma at 2.2
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post #10197 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Boos View Post

After 3 months and 300 hours of 60 inch VT60 ownership, I can say the single biggest (and unexpected) boost in pq (along with raising the contrast in THX to 80) I have experienced was setting the sharpness to 80! Up until doing this, I always felt that the picture was lacking in "punch" and detail— and was certainly nowhere near what I was used to coming from my 50 inch Pioneer. I gradually just accepted the trade-off and attributed it to the inherent drop-off in brightness of the larger display. Now, I am consistetnly having my head knocked off by this tv's image and find myself throwing my hands in the air in utter disbelief of the image before me.

And yes, I know what you mean about "sacrilege"; until I began my own extensive tinkering, I never bothered with the sharpness setting since every posted calibration setting I tried always left it at default and I've had my own long-standing misgivings about using any "artificial" pq enhancements. Of course, I was initially worried about introducing all sorts of unwanted artefacts and losing the film-like image the VT is known for, but hours upon hours of viewing have revealed nothing. (The Disney WOW zone plates also reveal nothing; in fact even setting sharpness at 100 on those patterns still reveals nothing untoward—at least on my set.)

Couldn't agree more. Please look up my thread on Calibration and Break-In; I think you'll find it interesting.

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post #10198 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by greginaz1 View Post

Actually been playing around with Pro 1 since you mentioned it and I have a picture I like better than most...changes I made are sharpness to 55...color temp to Cool1...all 'stuff' off...panel at mid...AGC at 4...gamma at 2.2
If you think the color setting of Cool1 looks good, you have purchased the wrong TV.
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post #10199 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Scott Oakley View Post

Couldn't agree more. Please look up my thread on Calibration and Break-In; I think you'll find it interesting.

Oh, I've seen it. I've been in this thread in lurk-mode every day since it started. Very interesting indeed.
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post #10200 of 16728 Old 01-11-2014, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by greginaz1 View Post

Wow, I guess this is what is spoiling me...my old Pioneer plasma has brightness of 1000 cd/m2!


290 ftL? eek.gif What brand of sun glasses did you wear when viewing the Pioneer? smile.gif

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