Official Panasonic VT60/VT65 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 46 - AVS Forum
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post #1351 of 15551 Old 05-13-2013, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

I'm interested in the extra screen area of the 60" (over my 55" VT50). That, combined with presumably better black levels and better reds(?), could make it worth the expense. The "buggy" calibration situation is my concern. Hoping we'll continue to get feedback from VT60 owners.

yeah, that extra 19% of screen real estate is going to make a huge difference.

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post #1352 of 15551 Old 05-13-2013, 11:00 AM
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Oh it does, your 55" will look small...........
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post #1353 of 15551 Old 05-13-2013, 11:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

I'm sure you're a good guy but Televsioninfo has been questioned and discredited. The 1st sentence to the 2nd link is "Last week we paid a visit to Panasonic’s US headquarters to get our first post-CES look at Panasonic’s TC-P55VT60 plasma."

Nuff said. Nothing like critical viewing at a corporate setup. I have no doubt the VT60 is better -- the question is this -- I paid $2300 for a VT50 -- are the improvements enough to warrant another $3200 or so given the 2013 Pannys have according to some, buggy calibration software and other issues the VT50 doesn't have. The experts at the shootout said, "no".

I'm glad you're happy and I may still go for a VT60 but the reports making it less compelling.




Yes, the ultimate decision everyone needs to make whether really worth upgrading or not. Some will think it is worth it while others won't.

Besides the review you mentioned not being worth considering, there is a recent post by robbyrockets ( post #1335 of 1362 ) that went from a VT50 to a VT60 saying he felt the differences were easily worth it along with having $3k to spend on any display. Guess the folks at the shootout have a different set of priorities but would think robbyrockets would have a better idea living with both displays for quite a while. Still it is a lot of money for upgrading since the VT50 is no slouch either.

Enjoy!
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post #1354 of 15551 Old 05-13-2013, 03:52 PM
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Does anyone know if the screen glare on the VT60 is better than the VT30?
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post #1355 of 15551 Old 05-13-2013, 04:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Foolius View Post

Does anyone know if the screen glare on the VT60 is better than the VT30?
I don't know, but do you mean reflections on the screen?
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post #1356 of 15551 Old 05-13-2013, 04:16 PM
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Sorry, that's what I meant. Does it handle reflections and ambient lighting better than the VT30? I currently have a 65" VT30 and I really don't have any gripes for the way it looks during the day, even with the amount of windows I have in the room. I'm hoping the a 65" VT60 will look even better. smile.gif
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post #1357 of 15551 Old 05-13-2013, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foolius View Post

Sorry, that's what I meant. Does it handle reflections and ambient lighting better than the VT30? I currently have a 65" VT30 and I really don't have any gripes for the way it looks during the day, even with amount of windows I have in the the room. I'm hoping the a 65" VT60 will look even better. smile.gif
Probably safe to say the AR filter has improved, definitely better from 2011 to 2012

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post #1358 of 15551 Old 05-13-2013, 04:38 PM
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I would say the reflections probably are not better since I went from a VT30 to a VT60. In fact if anything, I wondered at first after looking at my VT60 after being installed by BB if it was slightly more reflective. Hard to really say not having them side by side but I definitely didn't have a passing thought that reflections on it were much reduced. To be fair not having the displays side by side, maybe the reflections are about the same at best but definitely don't feel like reflections are significantly reduced if the VT30 bothered you regarding reflections.

It did work out better for me after seeing the reflections that I realized that I didn't tilt the screen towards me like I did on my VT30. I use a really nice wall mount that is able to bring the display out considerably along with being able to tilt. Once I tilted it which isn't a lot, maybe 5% top tilting down, the reflections were greatly reduced. And for what it's worth, I have a room with windows but able to close blinds on all windows to keep all direct light out but indirect light makes it far from me saying my display is in a cave. smile.gif

Hope this helps.
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post #1359 of 15551 Old 05-13-2013, 08:34 PM
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Originally Posted by robertrobert View Post

I would say the reflections probably are not better since I went from a VT30 to a VT60. In fact if anything, I wondered at first after looking at my VT60 after being installed by BB if it was slightly more reflective. Hard to really say not having them side by side but I definitely didn't have a passing thought that reflections on it were much reduced. To be fair not having the displays side by side, maybe the reflections are about the same at best but definitely don't feel like reflections are significantly reduced if the VT30 bothered you regarding reflections.

It did work out better for me after seeing the reflections that I realized that I didn't tilt the screen towards me like I did on my VT30. I use a really nice wall mount that is able to bring the display out considerably along with being able to tilt. Once I tilted it which isn't a lot, maybe 5% top tilting down, the reflections were greatly reduced. And for what it's worth, I have a room with windows but able to close blinds on all windows to keep all direct light out but indirect light makes it far from me saying my display is in a cave. smile.gif

Hope this helps.

Sure does and if my local freight company plays nice, I'll know what the VT60 looks like in my living room tomorrow. biggrin.gif
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post #1360 of 15551 Old 05-13-2013, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Foolius View Post

Sure does and if my local freight company plays nice, I'll now what the VT60 looks like in my living room tomorrow. biggrin.gif

Awesome. Congrats. I am sure you will love it!
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post #1361 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 12:45 AM
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My VT60 is shipping and will arrive on Wednesday! I'm super excited. Will post impressions after I get it set up and dink around with it for a bit.
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post #1362 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 05:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robbyrockets View Post

Did a quick calibration last night just to get some numbers.

The highest on/off contrast ratio I could achieve after a full calibration on my VT50 was 13,953.

I registered a 28,973 on my new VT60.

There is a visible and dramatic difference in what my eyes see between the two sets.

The ANSI levels were also doubled.

The 2D picture on this set has an almost 3 dimensional look too it, I finally understand what people mean by depth.

I don't regret going from the VT50 to the VT60, granted the VT60 was a warranty replacement, but had I had $3000.00 too spend on a new set, I would have upgraded none the less.

Not too mention that motion capability on this set is far better than it was on the VT50.

Just watched I Am Legend, and I'll be damned if that Shelby GT500 didn't look like it was about too pop out of the set, the depth I see is just incredible.

Thats a great on/off number, i was wondering if you could tell me, what your black level was? thanks
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post #1363 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 05:29 AM
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Anybody know if there are any discrete IR on and off codes for the ZT or VT? I just bought a new Panasonic LED TV and it seems the discrete off works but the on does not? I used the standard Panasonic 0022 and 0026 IR codes (device 0250).
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post #1364 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 05:47 AM
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Originally Posted by wesslan1 View Post

How come the best gaming mode on VT60 (low input lag) is game mode + disable 1080p pure direct? Thought pure direct would be the best overall mode for 1080p sources with less tampering than other modes.

Any info on this?
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post #1365 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 06:40 AM
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Originally Posted by borat!!! View Post

Thats a great on/off number, i was wondering if you could tell me, what your black level was? thanks


0.001
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post #1366 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 07:36 AM
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I've begun thinking about the price diff on ST60 versus VT60. Let's not get into street pricing specifics (per thread rules), but one could buy a 60" ST60 and a 50" S60 for the price of a 60" VT60. Of course, I don't want two TVs anyhow, but rather one very, very good one. Can someone do me a favor and recap the difference between ST60 and VT60 as it pertains to PQ. While the VT60 has more features, I'd like to invest in PQ.

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post #1367 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 07:39 AM
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^
Quote:
Originally Posted by robbyrockets View Post

0.001


Per my concern, will the VT60s numbers outperform the ST60 (on/off contrast, etc) appreciably.

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post #1368 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 07:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

^
Per my concern, will the VT60s numbers outperform the ST60 (on/off contrast, etc) appreciably.

The ST60 also has a .001 MLL the difference is in the 4th decimal......I think (it was discussed in the shootout) that measured the ST60 at .0016 or .0018, the VT60 was .0013.......is there an appreciable difference betweeen the ~.0005 ? That is the question many are asking.....The ST60 is a great bang for the buck, but the VT60 you would see an improvement in other areas as well..
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post #1369 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

^
Per my concern, will the VT60s numbers outperform the ST60 (on/off contrast, etc) appreciably.
The ST60 will have a better On/Off CR as it can get much brighter than the VT60.
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post #1370 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

The ST60 is a great bang for the buck, but the VT60 you would see an improvement in other areas as well..

Appreciated. So, if we could summarize those other areas then I can make a better informed decision. I do plan to watch tons of blu-ray content in a darkened room, so nuances will matter.

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post #1371 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 07:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

The ST60 also has a .001 MLL the difference is in the 4th decimal......I think (it was discussed in the shootout) that measured the ST60 at .0016 or .0018, the VT60 was .0013.......is there an appreciable difference betweeen the ~.0005 ? That is the question many are asking.....The ST60 is a great bang for the buck, but the VT60 you would see an improvement in other areas as well..
I've measured mutiple sizes between these two models and the MLL difference between the two is roughly 0.0003fL. Can you see a difference? Depends on your eyes and room lighting. In a pitch black room, the difference would be visable... at least for me.
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post #1372 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 07:58 AM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

The ST60 will have a better On/Off CR as it can get much brighter than the VT60.

Will the On/Off CR show up in the viewing of movies? I suppose I'm looking for a quick summary of measured differences which will show up when I watch blu-ray movies.

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post #1373 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

Appreciated. So, if we could summarize those other areas then I can make a better informed decision. I do plan to watch tons of blu-ray content in a darkened room, so nuances will matter.

I believe the differences are gone over in this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1469629/s60-or-s64-or-st60-or-vt60-or-maybe-zt60-oh-yeah-60-or-65

The official differences I cant remember outside of difference panel, AR filter, gradiations, Full Field Drive (I think), HexProcessing........
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post #1374 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saril View Post

ST
Panel: NeoPlasma
Panel Drive: 2500 Focused Field Drive
Shades of Gradation: 12,288 equivalent
DCI 98% Color Space: No
Contrast: 1:5,500,000
Filter: Infinite Black Pro
Hexa-processing Engine: No
THX Mode: No


VT
Panel: NeoPlasma black 3000
Panel Drive: 3000 Focused Field Drive
Shades of Gradation: 30,720 gradation steps
DCI 98% Color Space: Yes
Contrast: 1:6,000,000
Filter: Infinite Black Ultra
Hexa-processing Engine: Yes
THX Mode: Yes

Here are some basics.

Wondering if D-Nice favors the ST60 over VT60 in some ways?

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post #1375 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 08:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

Here are some basics.

Wondering if D-Nice favors the ST60 over VT60 in some ways?

Wondering the same. D-Nice, if you do not mind, would you care to comment on why, other than what has already been established are the main differences, you went with the ST60 instead of the VT60? I do not care about 3D, apps, web gadgets, gaming, etc... I would really appreciate your input regarding the real-world, 2D/movie only differences between both sets. If the VT were about $300/$400 extra it'd be a no-brainer, but for $1K more it's a tough sell...
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post #1376 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

I've measured mutiple sizes between these two models and the MLL difference between the two is roughly 0.0003fL. Can you see a difference? Depends on your eyes and room lighting. In a pitch black room, the difference would be visable... at least for me.

How visible is the overall color and gamma difference on content between the ST60 and VT60?

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post #1377 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 08:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Esteban Medaglia View Post

Wondering the same. D-Nice, if you do not mind, would you care to comment on why, other than what has already been established are the main differences, you went with the ST60 instead of the VT60? I do not care about 3D, apps, web gadgets, gaming, etc... I would really appreciate your input regarding the real-world, 2D/movie only differences between both sets. If the VT were about $300/$400 extra it'd be a no-brainer, but for $1K more it's a tough sell...
Its an impossible sell imo. Particularly if your main concern is 2d movies. You can get an ST60 and have it professionally calibrated and still save $600. No brainer for me.

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post #1378 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 08:41 AM
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D-Nice:

The difference between the 3D performance on the ST60 vs. VT60 matters to me, so it'd be great if you could comment on that. Of course 2d pq is more important and paramount, but on the relatively few occasions that I need to watch 3d, I need it to be as good as it can be, so if the 3d pq on the ST60 suffers significant compromises as compared to 3d pq on the VT60, that would be important for me to know in making a decision.

Thanks in advance.
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post #1379 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 08:55 AM
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After getting home last night from work and watching more high quality HD movies, I still couldn't believe the PQ on the VT60. I picture to me is so amazing that it just draws me in with all thoughts fading away regarding whether some aspect of the PQ could be better or if the ZT60 or some other display would have been a better choice. I can control all outside light so to me, the VT60 provides plenty bright enough of a picture.

It will be interesting what other professionals say about the VT60 in the upcoming weeks and months along with the detailed results of the shootout. This will be more to read out of curiosity because all I know is that I finally have the level of PQ that I always wanted. Being an owner of a Pioneer Elite, I'm considering the VT60 PQ being reference quality IMHO.

I have paid to have every display professionally calibrated but honestly I really don't know how much more could be improved. The PQ of my VT60 is leagues past the PQ of the VT30 that died and it was calibrated by one of the best, waited until he did his tour of my state to have it done even. It seems some have posted agreeing how much they are also blown away by the PQ. It is all there; inky blacks, spot on colors, great shadow detail, plenty of sharpness to the picture, bright enough picture (except for those that prefer LCD typ of brightness then better to look elsewhere), almost a 3D look to the 2D HD PQ since depth of picture is amazing, clean picture, etc.

Honestly for those sitting on the fence, this seems to be the year not to wait any longer whether the VT60 or one of the other top displays.
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post #1380 of 15551 Old 05-14-2013, 09:06 AM
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Good to hear Robert. I have a pro cal'd 65ST30 and will be replacing it with the VT60 or the F8500...not sure yet. Either should be a huge upgrade.

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