Official Panasonic VT60/VT65 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 99 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #2941 of 16958 Old 06-26-2013, 10:33 AM
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post #2942 of 16958 Old 06-26-2013, 12:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

I never said not to look at a tv at Best Buy. Look all you want. As to drawing conclusions, well, I don't see how that's possible unless one brings a "dark room tent" and calibration gear, etc. Even then there's a good chance that the panel hasn't been broken in, etc. I doubt that D-Nice would opine on PQ based on a momentary BBY viewing. Correct me if I'm wrong.

You can't make conclusions on picture quality regarding black level, color accuracy, etc. in a setting like Best Buy but it is easy to spot posterization and motion related defects under any lighting conditions. When I saw it, I played various clips and tinkered around with setitngs, but the posterization remained. Also, the TV must have had several hundred hours on it. Of course, you will say I saw something that did not exist rolleyes.gif. I have had vt25 and now have vt30, so I know exactly what to look for since both these TVs are plagued with this problem (and I suspect a few other plasmas as well).
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post #2943 of 16958 Old 06-26-2013, 12:48 PM
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I know this is not the thread But my tv will b calibrated this weekend by D-nice .But i have a friend who has same tv 65vt60 but he has friend who will sell him cheap his dvdo.What are peoples thoughts on him getting a DVDO edge will that help him or are they for all of us Calibrated or not as he has cable tv... ty smile.gif

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post #2944 of 16958 Old 06-26-2013, 02:12 PM
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not worth it, unless he has some very specific application he's thinking of using it for. calibration is a better value imo.
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post #2945 of 16958 Old 06-26-2013, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PRO-630HD View Post

In the THX modes what is the panel brightness set too? Mid? This section is locked out so I was just curious.
In both THX modes for my 65VT60 the brightness is set at 0

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post #2946 of 16958 Old 06-26-2013, 08:09 PM
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I am asking panel brightness being low or mid. It is not adjustable in the THX setting so I am wondering what the preset is.
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post #2947 of 16958 Old 06-26-2013, 08:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

I have never measured anything like the above in the 25+ 60 series displays I have calibrated to date. I get a consistent 0.0012-0.0013fL MLL in Cinema, Custom, ISF-Day and ISF-Night. IF you are getting these measurements with your display, it's either your display, settings or software.

Yes you are correct, its in my settings. I think that was what I was referring to.

Also something I have only done once is to use Native Gamut setting rather than REC.709. I used Native Gamut in my last profile and probably will keep using that setting in my VT60, it looks to me that Native setting is the same as Wide was in the VT50.

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Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

Ok, hoping to hear more from SillySally. Appreciate the feedback!

I am talking about out of the box settings. However what I have found is to bring out what I consider the best PQ for my eyes in these different modes without a lot of give and take, is what I have stated.
By doing a lot of adjustments to grayscale/RGB balance/Gamma (wild swings in my settings), I am lowering my out of Gamut range %, going from a 99% correct down to a 88% correct when I profile.
So what this means imo is by over compensating in one area I am loosing in a different area. iow I am not going for bragging rights (the lowest dE's, and best looking grafts), I am going for the least compromised calibration settings, of-course being very mind full of the dE's and charts. So as long as my dE's are around 1 keeping well with-in the profile of what I think my VT60 can do, I am a happy camper.

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Originally Posted by DavidHir View Post

Just to be clear, Pro modes are the ISF modes, correct?

Yes it is.
For those of us that have gone from the VT50 to the VT60, the verbiage has changed. Like Orbiter off in the VT50 to using auto for off, or like wide Gamut in the VT50 now looks like Native in the VT60 is the same.

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post #2948 of 16958 Old 06-26-2013, 08:54 PM
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pro-630hd is referring too panel brightness under pro setting's. not the brightness adjust for black level.

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post #2949 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 04:25 AM
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I just found out something interesting about are VT60's that now explains why Custom Mode looks flat out of the box. Also I can now confirm Native Gamut will give us the widest Gamut for are VT60. And yes that is the setting I will be using form now on.

It seems "internal manufacture pre-sets are turned off". The key word in this Quote is Internal, not the enhancement settings we can turn off.
This info (along with many tips) came from Steve Shaw of Light Space.

ss

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post #2950 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 05:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

I just found out something interesting about are VT60's that now explains why Custom Mode looks flat out of the box. Also I can now confirm Native Gamut will give us the widest Gamut for are VT60. And yes that is the setting I will be using form now on.

It seems "internal manufacture pre-sets are turned off". The key word in this Quote is Internal, not the enhancement settings we can turn off.
This info (along with many tips) came from Steve Shaw of Light Space.

ss

So what are internal presets and what does this mean to the end user?

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post #2951 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 06:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

I just found out something interesting about are VT60's that now explains why Custom Mode looks flat out of the box. Also I can now confirm Native Gamut will give us the widest Gamut for are VT60. And yes that is the setting I will be using form now on.

It seems "internal manufacture pre-sets are turned off". The key word in this Quote is Internal, not the enhancement settings we can turn off.
This info (along with many tips) came from Steve Shaw of Light Space.

ss

Precisely why I use "Wide" in the VT50 as part of the setup giving me 50 FtL output - http://www.avsforum.com/t/1408338/official-panasonic-vt50-owners-thread/12420#post_23404076

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post #2952 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 08:35 AM
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I have an interesting situation with my 65VT60. I use an Oppo BDP-103 BluRay Player with the VT60. On occasion, somehow the Motion Smoother gets turned on to Mid when I am using the Oppo! It does not happen everytime I use the Oppo, but has happened twice now in both the Custom and Cinema Settings. Any idea what is going on? I plan to report to AVJ and Panasonic. Thx.
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post #2953 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

I just found out something interesting about are VT60's that now explains why Custom Mode looks flat out of the box. Also I can now confirm Native Gamut will give us the widest Gamut for are VT60. And yes that is the setting I will be using form now on.

It seems "internal manufacture pre-sets are turned off". The key word in this Quote is Internal, not the enhancement settings we can turn off.
This info (along with many tips) came from Steve Shaw of Light Space.

ss

Quote:
Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post

Precisely why I use "Wide" in the VT50 as part of the setup giving me 50 FtL output - http://www.avsforum.com/t/1408338/official-panasonic-vt50-owners-thread/12420#post_23404076


ss,

Are you saying that the "internal" settings are hard wired and cannot be turned on even in the service menu? Are you saying that the only way around the limitations caused by the internal pre-sets is to use the Native gamut with an external processor?

Larry
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post #2954 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by mo949 View Post

not worth it, unless he has some very specific application he's thinking of using it for. calibration is a better value imo.
Nothing wrong with getting calibration done and using a high end scaler wink.gif
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post #2955 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rrollens View Post

I have an interesting situation with my 65VT60. I use an Oppo BDP-103 BluRay Player with the VT60. On occasion, somehow the Motion Smoother gets turned on to Mid when I am using the Oppo! It does not happen everytime I use the Oppo, but has happened twice now in both the Custom and Cinema Settings. Any idea what is going on? I plan to report to AVJ and Panasonic. Thx.

I too have the Oppo 103 paired with my 65VT60. Before Chad came out, I had been using THX Cinema and bright room modes and never noticed that. Of course, using Pro modes now and no problem.

Just to be sure, keep in mind that Cinema or any other mode will be different for each HDMI input. In other words, if you turn Motion Smoother off in HDMI 1 for Cinema, it will not be turned off in HDMI 2, etc. Each HDMI input has to be set accordingly.

If that's not the case, then that is bizarre! Let me know and I can still check it on mine.
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post #2956 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 11:10 AM
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post #2957 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 11:38 AM
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Good review and the Low panel mode does indeed raise black levels and decrease white levels for decreased contrast! So for the THX modes do they use the panel brightness in the Mid or Low level?
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post #2958 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 03:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidHir View Post

I too have the Oppo 103 paired with my 65VT60. Before Chad came out, I had been using THX Cinema and bright room modes and never noticed that. Of course, using Pro modes now and no problem.

Just to be sure, keep in mind that Cinema or any other mode will be different for each HDMI input. In other words, if you turn Motion Smoother off in HDMI 1 for Cinema, it will not be turned off in HDMI 2, etc. Each HDMI input has to be set accordingly.

If that's not the case, then that is bizarre! Let me know and I can still check it on mine.

Thanks so much for responding to me. I have unplugged and re-plugged in all of the HDMI cables thinking it might be a hand-off problem. We'll see. I do know about each HDMI input needing to be set up independently. Cant wait for Kevin Miller to get here!
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post #2959 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by TWD View Post

So what are internal presets and what does this mean to the end user?

In general it means nothing to the end user other than how the picture looks when they view what ever it is they view. Internal presets can be anything the manufacture wants to use to keep what ever mode within limits of how the video looks. Think of it this way if you use the THX modes most of those settings are locked, that is to preserve the PQ of those modes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post


ss,

Are you saying that the "internal" settings are hard wired and cannot be turned on even in the service menu? Are you saying that the only way around the limitations caused by the internal pre-sets is to use the Native gamut with an external processor?

Larry

I would not know for the simple reason that I would never go into the service menu. There really is no reason to use the service menu with a TV like the VT60.

No I am not saying that at all. What my key word is use the TV's limits to there fullest, "don't try and make a silk pursue out of a sow's ear".
And that's why I like using the Wide Gamut over the 709 Gamut, imo I am taking the VT60 to its limits by stretching out the primary's and secondary's. I always used the wide Gamut in my VT50, once I was shown the Light. cool.gif

If the TV that I was profiling/calibrating had the capability to store and process these "taking it to the limits" type of calibration, there would be no need for a external processor.

ss

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post #2960 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 05:37 PM
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ss,

Thanks. But we are talking on different levels. I'm talking about technical (EE) issues and you're talking about calibration. I have no problem going into any service menu. cool.gif

So the definition of "internal" is the "TV's limits" -- which is the same as hard-wired. smile.gif

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post #2961 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 06:07 PM
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SS, did selection of Native gamut impact the calibration settings you posted?

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post #2962 of 16958 Old 06-27-2013, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

SS, did selection of Native gamut impact the calibration settings you posted?

Yes, but only slightly.

ss

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post #2963 of 16958 Old 06-28-2013, 04:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sillysally View Post

Yes, but only slightly.

ss

Toggling between the two it is easy to see skin tone changes. I'm assuming you compensate for that. Are virtually all pro/"amateur" calibrators going with Native gamut (as opposed to 709) on the VT60?

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post #2964 of 16958 Old 06-28-2013, 05:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

Toggling between the two it is easy to see skin tone changes. I'm assuming you compensate for that. Are virtually all pro/"amateur" calibrators going with Native gamut (as opposed to 709) on the VT60?

I don't think so, most pro calibrators that I know of that only do normal calibrations use 709 Gamut. Mater of fact I haven't read any post about the Native Gamut setting in the VT60, and that's why I am posting this.

Below are two examples of 709 and Native CIE charts (xy, uv) from my last profile..


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post #2965 of 16958 Old 06-28-2013, 05:45 PM
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Got a Question im stressing out. D-nice should be here sunday and my vt60 has had over 400 hrs since last week and seems somethin change,as i see skin tones bad now what i see is red/blue/yellow in skin tones seems to very by scene content etc.From what pics and i have read it could be drift or posterzation how ever you spell it..is it somethin he can fix calibrateing tv or should i call him off and have tech see it..got a feeling i should keep appt ..but i have to pay him to tell me..any thoughts ty eek.gif

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post #2966 of 16958 Old 06-28-2013, 06:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Denniswrly View Post

Got a Question im stressing out. D-nice should be here sunday and my vt60 has had over 400 hrs since last week and seems somethin change,as i see skin tones bad now what i see is red/blue/yellow in skin tones seems to very by scene content etc.From what pics and i have read it could be drift or posterzation how ever you spell it..is it somethin he can fix calibrateing tv or should i call him off and have tech see it..got a feeling i should keep appt ..but i have to pay him to tell me..any thoughts ty eek.gif
Keep the appt. DNice is a good guy. If theres something wrong with the tv he probably wont charge you much (gas?). Id say theres a good chance theres nothing wrong with it anyway.

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post #2967 of 16958 Old 06-28-2013, 06:47 PM
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I love the vt60, but it seems like its got some IR issues, at least for me. I did the 100 hours break in, but now I've got IR from watching something with CC for about 8 hours over 2 days. Not even the black bar kind, just simply text. Now there is like a ghosting on solid screens. I watched content for another 5 hours without and ran the wow pixel flipper for 2 hours and the screen wipe for an hour. It's barely there anymore, but is this something I'm gonna have to always deal with? My wife and I aren't hard of hearing but we like to watch all programming with CC on. Is that a bad idea with plasma? Should I just bite the bullet and make the compromise and go to a f8000?
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post #2968 of 16958 Old 06-28-2013, 06:48 PM
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And before its asked. I used custom for the break in, and watch everything else on thx cinema.
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post #2969 of 16958 Old 06-28-2013, 06:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Keep the appt. DNice is a good guy. If theres something wrong with the tv he probably wont charge you much (gas?). Id say theres a good chance theres nothing wrong with it anyway.
Ok, i will ty.Just don't wanna waste his time but darn it hes here in cali and is one of the best..ty cause ya it seems skin tones only...Im sure he he has test or can see by eye if it's worth continuing..smile.gif

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post #2970 of 16958 Old 06-28-2013, 08:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Denniswrly View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

Keep the appt. DNice is a good guy. If theres something wrong with the tv he probably wont charge you much (gas?). Id say theres a good chance theres nothing wrong with it anyway.
Ok, i will ty.Just don't wanna waste his time but darn it hes here in cali and is one of the best..ty cause ya it seems skin tones only...Im sure he he has test or can see by eye if it's worth continuing..smile.gif
Why not let D-Nice know what you're seeing? Use the email in the signature area at the bottom of his posts, or call him if he gave you a contact number. You are in a TV panic mode right now, but there's no need to add worry about D-Nice. smile.gif
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