F8500 Recommended Settings Thread..... - Page 115 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3421 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 12:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oneilscott View Post
amartin56 could you clarify a few things on your latest settings please

hdmi black level - normal or low?

film mode - cinema smooth seems to be greyed out and i cant select

thanks
I calibrate with test patterns on a disc via a bluray player feeding a 1080p/24 signal. So in that configuration HDMI Black Level is grayed out and Cinema Smooth is available. If you aren't doing the same Black Level to Low looks best to me. And leave film mode at default.
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post #3422 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 01:15 PM
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yes i went with low and film mode off as this looked best to me

so is it not possible for me to activate cinema smooth option?or is it of no benefit

thanks for your help
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post #3423 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMartin56 View Post
I calibrate with test patterns on a disc via a bluray player feeding a 1080p/24 signal. So in that configuration HDMI Black Level is grayed out and Cinema Smooth is available. If you aren't doing the same Black Level to Low looks best to me. And leave film mode at default.
Is there any particular reason you set your source to output RGB color space as opposed to YCbCr? I use YCbCr 4:4:4, which the 8500 will automatically choose the best hdmi black level (it's greyed out on my tv).

Last edited by DanF8500; 12-16-2014 at 01:29 PM.
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post #3424 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oneilscott View Post
yes i went with low and film mode off as this looked best to me

so is it not possible for me to activate cinema smooth option?or is it of no benefit

thanks for your help
Broadcast tv doesn't use 24Hz refresh rates. Cinema Smooth is for your blu-ray movies, which are recorded in 24Hz. You'll be able to activate Cinema Smooth when you watch a blu-ray movie.
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post #3425 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oneilscott View Post
amartin56 could you clarify a few things on your latest settings please

hdmi black level - normal or low?

film mode - cinema smooth seems to be greyed out and i cant select

thanks
HDMI BLACK LEVEL
low - 'limited range' 16-235 RGB source (some game consoles, media extenders, etc can be set to this)
normal - 'full range' 0-255 RGB source (usually only game consoles and pc's use this range)
greyed out - YCC source(not RGB) ('standard' video format found on many dedicated a/v gear and legacy products)

basically you want to make sure all your RGB sources are the same. either full range or limited, and then set the hdmi black level to the matching setting. it's ok if you mix YCC and rgb sources, the tv will automatically adjust between the two. for example, my cable box is YCC, i have my game consoles and htpc set to full range. when i watch cable, thte setting is grayed out and when i watch my htpc, it returns to the 'normal' setting automatically. both sources have the correct 'black level'.

FILM MODE
cinema smooth is ONLY available for 24hz content
i believe film mode is greyed out for all 60hz content. not 100% sure, but mine is greyed out every time i send it 60p
one of the settings is for 60p sources that have been changed to 30, the other is for 24p sources that have been changed to 30. i never remember which one is which, but i only have 60p and 24p sources, so it never comes up for me anyway.

like hdmi black level, this is a source dependent setting. basically if you watch blurays with 24p playback, decide whether you prefer CS on or off. set it to your preference, and leave it. when not watching blurays(or 24p content) it will automatically default back to your last setting, or 'off' and grayed out for 60p content. caution, if you turn on cs, and then turn it off, the tv will secretly turn on motion judder canceller. so you have to turn MJC on, and then off again. you only have to do this if you turn CS off, not every time it automatically changes when it detects a non-24p source.

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post #3426 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post
Is there any particular reason you set your source to output RGB color space as opposed to YCbCr? I use YCbCr 4:4:4, which the 8500 will automatically choose the best hdmi black level (it's greyed out on my tv).
My blu-ray player is set to 4:2:2 so HDMI black level is grayed out on that input.
On my cable box it gives me the option to use it...Low looks good. Normal looks washed out. My cable box doesn't let me choose a color space.
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post #3427 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMartin56 View Post
My blu-ray player is set to 4:2:2 so HDMI black level is grayed out on that input.
On my cable box it gives me the option to use it...Low looks good. Normal looks washed out. My cable box doesn't let me choose a color space.
Hmmm....that's kinda strange that your cable box is outputting RGB. What cable box do you have? I have Verizon FIOS, and can go into its service menu (not from normal menus) and change the color space.
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post #3428 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 01:43 PM
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Any recommendations for a good wall mount for this tv? PN64F8500
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post #3429 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post
Hmmm....that's kinda strange that your cable box is outputting RGB. What cable box do you have? I have Verizon FIOS, and can go into its service menu (not from normal menus) and change the color space.
AT&T Uverse wireless box made by Cisco. Not sure what the model number is. Wouldn't mind changing the settings if it had a service menu but honestly I really only watch blu-ray on this set for the most part so it's not a big deal.

In related news I'm watching my F8500 while I work (and post on the forums) and the picture continues to repeatedly wow me. Don't tell the wife but the experience is almost sexual at this point. Well maybe not SEXUAL but you know what I mean. Don't worry I'm currently fully clothed.

I've never owned a VT or ZT60 but this is one nice TV!
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post #3430 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by jeff2112 View Post
Any recommendations for a good wall mount for this tv? PN64F8500
Check out Monoprice.com. Their pricing will be fair and they have a lot of options. Pick one that matches what you want and is designed for the size and weight of your set. I have a low profile mount and have had no problems with cooling etc.
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post #3431 of 4140 Old 12-16-2014, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMartin56 View Post

In related news I'm watching my F8500 while I work (and post on the forums) and the picture continues to repeatedly wow me. Don't tell the wife but the experience is almost sexual at this point. Well maybe not SEXUAL but you know what I mean. Don't worry I'm currently fully clothed.
Awesome!! I understand perfectly! The 8500 still produces the "wow factor" every time I turn her on!
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post #3432 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 10:56 AM
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Hey, can't get my saturation's any better on my 64f8500.
Using oppo-103d set to 4:4:4
i1Display Pro
GDC disk with 10% APL and hcfr set to 75/75
Cell 17
Contrast 95
Brightness 49
Sharp 6
color 59

The last pic shows saturation sweep using 100/100 and Primary's and secondary's using 75/75.

Anything I can do to improve it? Thanks
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post #3433 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 11:11 AM
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Not sure if this helps the previous poster at all but I was going to post it anyways and it looks like I'm getting similar results.


I think I now know why a lot of the professional reviews stuck to 50 Color. It actually seems to work out the best for me as well considering my latest test results (attached).


Keep in mind that I am very likely limited by my knowledge (I'm even newer to color calibration than I am to grayscale and gamma calibration!) my equipment (iD3 profiled off a Colormunki Photo) and my choice of test patterns (CMS set off of 75/57 from GCD then I return color space to normal in HCFR before running saturation sweeps and color checkers).


I'm sure I'm just splitting hairs at this point so I'm going to trust the Samsung engineers (dangerous I know) and just run with the default 50 color and the settings in the attachment. Looks good and seems to include the best compromises.
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post #3434 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMartin56 View Post
Not sure if this helps the previous poster at all but I was going to post it anyways and it looks like I'm getting similar results.


I think I now know why a lot of the professional reviews stuck to 50 Color. It actually seems to work out the best for me as well considering my latest test results (attached).


Keep in mind that I am very likely limited by my knowledge (I'm even newer to color calibration than I am to grayscale and gamma calibration!) my equipment (iD3 profiled off a Colormunki Photo) and my choice of test patterns (CMS set off of 75/57 from GCD then I return color space to normal in HCFR before running saturation sweeps and color checkers).


I'm sure I'm just splitting hairs at this point so I'm going to trust the Samsung engineers (dangerous I know) and just run with the default 50 color and the settings in the attachment. Looks good and seems to include the best compromises.
Do your saturation sweeps look better using color 50 or 57?
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post #3435 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trp3383 View Post
Do your saturation sweeps look better using color 50 or 57?

Those are my sweeps in the attachment I provided. 'Red Sat' is average and max error for the entire sweep etc. Color checker is the 24 pt patterns on the GCD disc.


Just from memory 100% red is always a bit of a problem but seems worse as I raise the color. Which of course doesn't matter that much since 100% saturation is rare in normal content but I didn't feel like it improved the lower saturations that much anyways. I was also having some issues with blue. The meter wanted me to remove green and it was already bottomed out. This seemed to get worse as I raised color.


Of course that brings a question to mind...my Colormunki Spectro has temporarily left the building but when it returns would it be more accurate than the iD3 I profiled off of it for calibrating the colors? Or is it pretty much a wash?
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post #3436 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 12:04 PM
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The default color setting of 50 for this display seems to work well for transfer curves that average 2.2 or a little lower (using APL patterns). For gamma closer to 2.4 (and BT.1886) 55-58 has yielded the best overall averages for large test sets.
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post #3437 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 02:24 PM
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I just installed a PS4 to replace a PS3. Are there any settings that should be checked/adjusted in order to ensure everything is working well with the F8500?


Thanks.
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post #3438 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 03:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trp3383 View Post
Hey, can't get my saturation's any better on my 64f8500.
Using oppo-103d set to 4:4:4
i1Display Pro
GDC disk with 10% APL and hcfr set to 75/75
Cell 17
Contrast 95
Brightness 49
Sharp 6
color 59

The last pic shows saturation sweep using 100/100 and Primary's and secondary's using 75/75.

Anything I can do to improve it? Thanks
when you're adjusting the CMS values, are you looking at dE's or the dots on the chart?

i found, especially with red, that my dE's are lower when the dots don't line up perfectly. i mean in a perfect world yeah, but in practice, i lowered my dE's by reducing delta luminance more than by reducing the x,y error.

so, in your red, i would try reducing the red value until you dE's stop improving. the chart might not look as pretty, but the dE's will be lower, and the picture should look better.

that being said, personally, i was never able to get all my colors really low. if green was under 1.0, red and blue were higher. if red is under 1.0, green and blue were off. i've never even bothered to get blue really low, but i assume the same would happen. i found i needed different values for color to get red dE's low than green dE's. iirc, i needed a higher value for red, something like 62. green was better around 54. i opted for some 'middle ground' at 57. i was able to get all colors dE's under 3.0 at this, but with other values i was able to get green under 1.0, and red under 2.0, just not at the same time

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post #3439 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 03:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tbird8450 View Post
I just installed a PS4 to replace a PS3. Are there any settings that should be checked/adjusted in order to ensure everything is working well with the F8500?


Thanks.
i don't have a ps4, but probably just need to make sure the colorspace/rgb range is correct.

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post #3440 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by fierce_gt View Post
when you're adjusting the CMS values, are you looking at dE's or the dots on the chart?



i found, especially with red, that my dE's are lower when the dots don't line up perfectly. i mean in a perfect world yeah, but in practice, i lowered my dE's by reducing delta luminance more than by reducing the x,y error.



so, in your red, i would try reducing the red value until you dE's stop improving. the chart might not look as pretty, but the dE's will be lower, and the picture should look better.



that being said, personally, i was never able to get all my colors really low. if green was under 1.0, red and blue were higher. if red is under 1.0, green and blue were off. i've never even bothered to get blue really low, but i assume the same would happen. i found i needed different values for color to get red dE's low than green dE's. iirc, i needed a higher value for red, something like 62. green was better around 54. i opted for some 'middle ground' at 57. i was able to get all colors dE's under 3.0 at this, but with other values i was able to get green under 1.0, and red under 2.0, just not at the same time

So I'm not trying to get the dots in the target on the graph? Just get de's low instead?
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post #3441 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by trp3383 View Post
So I'm not trying to get the dots in the target on the graph? Just get de's low instead?
yeah. it'd be nice if you could get them in the dots too, but dE accounts for x,y, AND z coordinates. the chart only looks at x,y

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post #3442 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 05:53 PM
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I'm narrowing in on a good calibration. All dE's under 3 (not under 2 yet like Zoyd ).

Chris Mathews is hard to get right but I like what I'm seeing. I've done my best to photograph it but it's not easy to get a photo that matches what I'm seeing onscreen.
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post #3443 of 4140 Old 12-17-2014, 10:00 PM
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Best Gaming Settings

Hi guys,

Have had this TV for almost a year and love it. I thought I recall seeing some recommended settings in here for gaming (which I plan to do a good bit of once I finish building my new PC). Could somebody link me to them or point me in the right direction? Would really be appreciated!

Also, if anyone has any tips for using this TV as a PC monitor - I'm all ears!

- Stan
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post #3444 of 4140 Old 12-18-2014, 07:05 AM
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Originally Posted by demonwareltd View Post
Also, if anyone has any tips for using this TV as a PC monitor - I'm all ears!

- Stan
This post has some useful info in it about the video signal going from your PC to the TV.
HCFR - Open source projector and display calibration software

Samsung PN60F8500, TiVo Roamio, ASRock Vision 3D HTPC, Chromecast
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post #3445 of 4140 Old 12-18-2014, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMartin56 View Post

I'm sure I'm just splitting hairs at this point so I'm going to trust the Samsung engineers (dangerous I know) and just run with the default 50 color and the settings in the attachment. Looks good and seems to include the best compromises.
AMartin,
First, I wanted to thank you. I've been playing with many different settings and have found working off of yours gave me the best initial results for my Nov 14 60". The depth of the picture is amazing. I won't break out my meter until I get a few more hours on mine, but I love what I see.

As far as your comments on color... do you feel your color settings at 50 are more appealing when you watch versus the 55 settings? I think the 55 settings you provided look nice but have wondered about what's going on behind the scenes by moving from that 50 default. Typically, I don't try to get too caught up in where the settings are if I like the picture, but the differences in this area are confusing me.

Thanks again for contributions.

Last edited by Milwaukeesk; 12-18-2014 at 08:34 AM.
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post #3446 of 4140 Old 12-18-2014, 08:26 AM
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Glad you enjoyed them! I would go with my settings for 55 color based upon Zoyd's comment a few posts ago. Let me know if that helps.
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post #3447 of 4140 Old 12-18-2014, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Milwaukeesk View Post
AMartin,
First, I wanted to thank you. I've been playing with many different settings and have found working off of yours gave me the best initial results for my Nov 14 60". The depth of the picture is amazing. I won't break out my meter until I get a few more hours on mine, but I love what I see.

As far as your comments on color... do you feel your color settings at 50 are more appealing when you watch versus the 55 settings? I think the 55 settings you provided look nice but have wondered about what's going on behind the scenes by moving from that 50 default. Typically, I don't try to get too caught up in where the settings are if I like the picture, but this differences in this area are confusing me.

Thanks again for contributions.
Also keep in mind that there is no real harm in taking some readings with your own meter now. Just avoid static images for a long period of time if you have less than two hundred hours on the panel. IMO The input label in the upper right is what you have to be most careful with. The 'wait to calibrate' is really only if you are hiring a professional since you want the panel to stabilize a bit first so you don't have to pay them again right away. If you are going DIY you can do it as many times as you want!

If you do take some readings be aware that I profiled mine off a spectro so a colorimeter alone might give higher errors! (Not that I'm trying to defend my settings LOL...just pointing it out). Also keep in mind that my errors are all in the 1.0 average / 1.5 max range with my equipment. I found that tweaking it lower did strange things to the inbetween points on my 20 point grayscale passes. I also didn't go forr prettty charts...my color temp and gamma is a bit jagged but if you looke at the actual numbers the difference is EXTREMELY slight. Meaning not enough to try to tweak into oblivion IMO.
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post #3448 of 4140 Old 12-18-2014, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMartin56 View Post
Also keep in mind that there is no real harm in taking some readings with your own meter now. .
Guess maybe i'll break it out. I've been holding off, because like many after that comes out, it's many many nights after others are a sleep staring at settings, over and over again. I've never calibrated a plasma, my only experience is with projectors, but thinking this shouldn't be much different.

At some point with these TV's you just have to forget about the HCFR reports, and enjoy a damn fine picture that your tweaking will probably make no difference with. Easier said than done though.

Thanks again to all that have been so helpful.
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post #3449 of 4140 Old 12-18-2014, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by WPWoodJr View Post
I'm narrowing in on a good calibration. All dE's under 3 (not under 2 yet like Zoyd ).

Chris Mathews is hard to get right but I like what I'm seeing. I've done my best to photograph it but it's not easy to get a photo that matches what I'm seeing onscreen.

The picture of that windbag does look good.

Just enough color saturation. I don't like high color saturation.
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post #3450 of 4140 Old 12-18-2014, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Blue Rain View Post
The picture of that windbag does look good.

Just enough color saturation. I don't like high color saturation.
lol
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ISF Calibrator
Samsung PN64F8500
Pioneer Kuro Elite Pro-111FD
Pioneer Kuro BDP-320
Displays are like 100% cotton t-shirts. Always buy a size larger than you think you'll need, as they tend to shrink over time.
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