Which display wins the shootout? Let's have some fun. Make your predictions here. - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:11 PM
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Well that was disappointing for me. I have the ZT on order but I think I will cancel it. The VT60 may be an option but it doesn't get as bright as my VT50. The 60 has deeper blacks and a better contrast ratio, but is it worth it. Then add the calibration issues........

Panasonic didn't have a good night.

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post #92 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

^Yes, so I really can't count the 500M against them. Good thing I only have the 111FD. wink.gif

Which can be tweaked to KRP-like black levels as well from what I hear. smile.gif
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post #93 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

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Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

I think that in order to get the best blacks on that Kuro, D-Nice has to make adjustments to the pots.

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Originally Posted by chunon View Post

He has special software I believe

Chunon is on the right path, I believe it is more of a method and custom solution.....it is not hardware related, DNice has put that rumor to bed a few weeks or so ago...

Thanks for the info. wink.gif

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post #94 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:21 PM
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Ken Ross, I must say that you did an really good job with your evaluations.

Thanks. I just try to call them as I see them. I know some don't think I'm objective, but I really try to be. smile.gif
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post #95 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by GobbityGotz View Post

The cool part is at the end D-Nice put up a KPR-500 against the Samsung and the Pannys. It did not lose, in fact its blacks were better than all of them to my eyes.

How about other than just blacks? Motion? Color? Shadow detail? Kuro clearly better or the same, just a bit blacker?

Hard for me to even tell the difference on my PC display (which is not unexpected)

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post #96 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:25 PM
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Thank you to all involved in the shootout. It's my first time watching it and I have to say it's been extremely fascinating and helpful. A few months ago, the 65ZT60 was actually a contender for me, and I thought about biting the bullet. Afterwards, after reading so many amazing things about the ST60, I hesitated. There is no question in my mind now that it's the steal of the decade. But in all honesty, after today's results, the VT seems to be the clear winner for those who can afford the difference, and the ZT is certainly not even worth considering anymore, at least not for me. I truly don't get the its appeal at this point, specially when one considers the better speakers in the VT60, the extra features, etc... I'm glad I waited before making any serious decisions.
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post #97 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:29 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hhaller View Post

Which can be tweaked to KRP-like black levels as well from what I hear. smile.gif
Yes, not quite as deep as he can go with the 500M but at least as deep as a full-array LED. smile.gif
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post #98 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TWD View Post

Well that was disappointing for me. I have the ZT on order but I think I will cancel it. The VT60 may be an option but it doesn't get as bright as my VT50. The 60 has deeper blacks and a better contrast ratio, but is it worth it. Then add the calibration issues........

Panasonic didn't have a good night.

calibration issues at this point would only affect calibrators smile.gif way too early to say anything else...

The surpsising thng is that all the sets this year will require a longer "suggested" break in period of 2-3x in time (from 1-150 to 300 hours)......

The sony was looking great for a bit, then it took a plummet ocne the tests started coming out and exhbited some of the "normal" LCD traits, at least this was from the camera feed, which I take with a HUGE grain of salt....
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post #99 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:34 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Esteban Medaglia View Post

Thank you to all involved in the shootout. It's my first time watching it and I have to say it's been extremely fascinating and helpful. A few months ago, the 65ZT60 was actually a contender for me, and I thought about biting the bullet. Afterwards, after reading so many amazing things about the ST60, I hesitated. There is no question in my mind now that it's the steal of the decade. But in all honesty, after today's results, the VT seems to be the clear winner for those who can afford the difference, and the ZT is certainly not even worth considering anymore, at least not for me. I truly don't get the its appeal at this point, specially when one considers the better speakers in the VT60, the extra features, etc... I'm glad I waited before making any serious decisions.
The filter will make ambient lighting scenarios easier to tolerate, which makes it slightly more versatile in some lighting environments. Also, I have no interest in better speakers or any other bells and whistles that the VT possesses. All that said, with my ZT preorder, I'm in a bigger quandary than ever before.
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post #100 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:37 PM
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Told you vinnie i wasn't expecting the ZT to be a large improvement over the VT.

And did anyone else notice how hot the room got once the kuro was brought up? lol.

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post #101 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by chunon View Post

He has special software I believe

Really? I thought it was hardware related.

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post #102 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:40 PM
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I thought the blacks were pretty equal between the Samsung and Panasonic. The shadow detail may have been a hair better on the Panny but it was really negligeable.
As far as other colors, the Samsung did seem to push reds just a bit more than the Panny but if they weren't side by side you'd never notice. Besides that can be tweeked to your liking as the Sammy has dedicated adjustments to RGB which the Panny doesn't offer.

Seems the Samsung would be a better choice in a more well lit environment as the light output of the F8500 was 40 FL(and could go higher if needed) but the Panny is maxed out at 30 FL for the ZT and 35 FL foir the VT. The Samsung was better in day mode to my eyes.

Regarding input lag it really wasn't tested tonight so I dont have anything to pass on regarding that.

I actually thought the Samsung was at least equal if not a hair better than both Panasonics overall.

Neither has supplanted the Kuro yet in this viewers eyes.
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post #103 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:40 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saprano View Post

Told you vinnie i wasn't expecting the ZT to be a large improvement over the VT.

And did anyone else notice how hot the room got once the kuro was brought up? lol.
There was no way of knowing definitively until somebody got hands on with them. And notice they didn't use 96 hz with the VT60 (or ZT60), so the blacks were still not even as deep as plain vanilla 9G. This puts a bit of a wrench in my plans to upgrade, since that was the line in the sand I had drawn.

Yes, the civility went south when the Kuro was given center stage. wink.gif
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post #104 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

The filter will make ambient lighting scenarios easier to tolerate, which makes it slightly more versatile in some lighting environments. Also, I have no interest in better speakers or any other bells and whistles that the VT possesses. All that said, with my ZT preorder, I'm in a bigger quandary than ever before.

I do 100% of my watching in a completely dark room, so the above doesn't apply in my case, even though I can see how the way the ZT deals with ambient light could be a plus for some folks. But the speakers do matter to me for those instances when one just wants to enjoy decent sound without being in the mood to fire up the whole surround set-up. I do appreciate your comments, though.
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post #105 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

There was no way of knowing definitively until somebody got hands on with them. And notice they didn't use 96 hz with the VT60 (or ZT60), so the blacks were still not even as deep as plain vanilla 9G. This puts a bit of a wrench in my plans to upgrade, since that was the line in the sand I had drawn.

Yes, the civility went south when the Kuro was given center stage. wink.gif

Oh wait - do we know for sure they didn't use 96hz on the Panasonics to measure?

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post #106 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:47 PM
 
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^No, I can't say that we do. The question should be posed tomorrow if one of us are on.
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Originally Posted by Esteban Medaglia View Post

I do 100% of my watching in a completely dark room, so the above doesn't apply in my case, even though I can see how the way the ZT deals with ambient light could be a plus for some folks. But the speakers do matter to me for those instances when one just wants to enjoy decent sound without being in the mood to fire up the whole surround set-up. I do appreciate your comments, though.
I typically watch in a dark room, but it *is* a living room, so I wouldn't complain about better daytime viewing. wink.gif The quality of the speakers is fortunately inconsequential to me, and I understand your scenario but would not care about high fidelity on the rare occasion I might need the TV speakers.
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post #107 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:49 PM - Thread Starter
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500M is a 50 inch. Put the 65 inch Kuro up there for a fair comparison. What? Wait! No 65 inch Kuro?
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post #108 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:51 PM
 
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^I would've preferred they compared a 600M.
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post #109 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 09:58 PM
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500M is a 50 inch. Put the 65 inch Kuro up there for a fair comparison. What? Wait! No 65 inch Kuro?


That is why Panasonic should have made a 70-75" ZT.....
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post #110 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:00 PM
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That is why Panasonic should have made a 70-75" ZT.....

The price would have been too high IMO.

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post #111 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:09 PM
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So all that hype they made with the ZT and some of the reviewers blindly were diving into it when even the meter did not measure a difference between it and the VT?
ST,VT,ZT are all similar with few differences except for the price!!
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post #112 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:10 PM
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^Yes, so I really can't count the 500M against them. Good thing I only have the 111FD. wink.gif
Vinnie, are you going to cancel thd ZT and get the VT?

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post #113 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:17 PM
 
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Vinnie, are you going to cancel thd ZT and get the VT?
If none of the panels can at least reach 0.001 fL (both Chad's domestic and McKenzie's UK reviews showed that the VT could), I might end up delaying for a year. I'm on a limb at the moment.
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post #114 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:19 PM
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If none of the panels can at least reach 0.001 fL (both Chad's domestic and McKenzie's UK reviews showed that the VT could), I might end up delaying for a year. I'm on a limb at the moment.

In the same situation right now smile.gif Finally finish to watch DVR of Shootout
More time, more money...VT70 or G8500?
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post #115 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:22 PM
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Looks like I'm keeping my vt50 too. If only they came out with the big screen 3d version of the kuro we could all be happy...
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post #116 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:45 PM
 
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In the same situation right now smile.gif Finally finish to watch DVR of Shootout
More time, more money...VT70 or G8500?
fingers crossed, right? I would at least like to hear more about this vanishing 96 hz mode with unparalleled out-of-the-box plasma blacks.
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post #117 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:51 PM
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I always say to myself...my GT is Great...i want something really better...Kuro-Like or Kuro KRP Best...if samsung or panasonic make one i will buy another tv...it really cost me a lot of money to buy one and i think (i hope i'm wrong tomorrow) this is not my upgrade year.
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post #118 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:52 PM
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Did they have the ST60 in the shootout?

Just debating with myself if the VT60 is really worth the extra 1k, and ultimately if its really worth upgrading from my less than 3 year old Samsung pn63c8000.

Bonus question -- how are you guys able to upgrade so often? Infinite cash or putting your TV on craigslist or?
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post #119 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:55 PM
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Originally Posted by terminaldawn View Post

Did they have the ST60 in the shootout? Just debating with myself if the VT60 is really worth the extra 1k, and ultimately if its really worth upgrading from my Samsung less than 3 year old pn63c8000.

Bonus question -- how are you guys able to upgrade so often? Infinite cash or putting your TV on craigslist or?

No, they don't but it's very similar to VT/ZT and have more light output (Almost the Double).
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post #120 of 1489 Old 05-10-2013, 10:58 PM
 
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My TV is over 4 years old, that's why I'm trying to make the next upgrade count. wink.gif

Agkss, it seems like they creep closer (ok, leap in the case of Samsung) every year but ultimately end up falling a hair short.mad.gif
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