Which display wins the shootout? Let's have some fun. Make your predictions here. - Page 50 - AVS Forum
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post #1471 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 02:14 PM
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post #1472 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

I think the question would be do you plan to get your set calibrated and if so then if brightness is a concern you may want to choose less acurate, but brighter for day viewing and then the "darker" for night....If you dont plan on watching of keeping the TV until it reaches that half life though, then its all moot as youll never really see the "change";..

That's true, unless a TV can barely make it to the appropriate brightness when brand-new. If one were to believe the VE shootout calibrators's results, the ZT60 is going to start at 30fL when fully calibrated in ISF mode, and will only drop from there. From day one, the ZT60 is getting dimmer, if properly calibrated for gamma and color. That's the only logical conclusion, if the 30 fL number cited at the shootout is in fact accurate.

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post #1473 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 02:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post

That's true, unless a TV can barely make it to the appropriate brightness when brand-new. If one were to believe the VE shootout calibrators's results, the ZT60 is going to start at 30fL when fully calibrated in ISF mode, and will only drop from there. From day one, the ZT60 is getting dimmer, if properly calibrated for gamma and color. That's the only logical conclusion, if the 30 fL number cited at the shootout is in fact accurate.

Lets say it takes 50k hours for the dimming to be noticeable -- if one watched tv 24 hours a day -- it would take 2083 days to get to 1/2 life or 5.7 years. Even if I leave the tv on non-stop I have 5.7 years before I hit the dimming point and by then OLED or 3d brain implants will be all the rage and cheap too.
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post #1474 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post

That's true, unless a TV can barely make it to the appropriate brightness when brand-new. If one were to believe the VE shootout calibrators's results, the ZT60 is going to start at 30fL when fully calibrated in ISF mode, and will only drop from there. From day one, the ZT60 is getting dimmer, if properly calibrated for gamma and color. That's the only logical conclusion, if the 30 fL number cited at the shootout is in fact accurate.

I would agree with you, if you want the most accurate picture and use the ISF modes then you will be limited and it will only get "worse". Im thinking many will choose a less accurate mode to attain a brigher picture when needed and choose the "calibrated" for "night" viewing......It will be intereting to see how everything turns out in the months and years to come with these sets. I dont ahve any doubt that the numebrs in the shootout are accurate though. As it was said there it all depends on the mode you have your set in wink.gif
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post #1475 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 02:37 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

Lets say it takes 50k hours for the dimming to be noticeable -- if one watched tv 24 hours a day -- it would take 2083 days to get to 1/2 life or 5.7 years. Even if I leave the tv on non-stop I have 5.7 years before I hit the dimming point and by then OLED or 3d brain implants will be all the rage and cheap too.
Concurred that It's definitely a nonissue.

I noticed you recently came around to the ZT60 also after originally shunning it. What changed your mind?
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post #1476 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 02:50 PM
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Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

Concurred that It's definitely a nonissue.

I noticed you recently came around to the ZT60 also after originally shunning it. What changed your mind?

The difference between 30 fL and 15fL is more than noticeable to me, it's super-duper obvious. A ZT60 that's calibrated but running at half brightness will look quite dim, but again that assumes 30fL is as good as it gets in ISF mode, and I've seen several instances people have reported achieving 40+ fL in ISF mode. Fortunately, Panasonic says the half-bright point comes at 100,000 hours, or 11 years of continuous use. Like you said, it's basically a non-issue.
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"The ZT60 Series display panel is free of mercury and lead. A newly designed phosphor process and rear panel process give the Plasma panel longevity of up to 100,000 hours before the brightness of the panel decreases to half. This is more than 30 years of viewing when watched 8 hours a day." - Panasonic

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post #1477 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 02:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

Concurred that It's definitely a nonissue.

I noticed you recently came around to the ZT60 also after originally shunning it. What changed your mind?

Yep. Sad but true. It's coming between 4 &5 on Saturday. May hold on to the VT50 for a while to make sure I like it.
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post #1478 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 02:59 PM
 
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post

The difference between 30 fL and 15fL is more than noticeable to me, it's super-duper obvious. A ZT60 that's calibrated but running at half brightness will look quite dim, but again that assumes 30fL is as good as it gets in ISF mode, and I've seen several instances people have reported achieving 40+ fL in ISF mode. Fortunately, Panasonic says the half-bright point comes at 100,000 hours, or 11 years of continuous use. Like you said, it's basically a non-issue.
100,000 hours? That's better than I thought.eek.gif
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post #1479 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 03:05 PM - Thread Starter
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I suppose any of us could come up with a dozen reasons not to buy any plasma other than a Kuro -- maybe that's why people end up buying disposable LEDs? But the glory of a plasma before it starts dimming or screwing up in all the different ways it could screw up, huh? You only live once.
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post #1480 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

I suppose any of us could come up with a dozen reasons not to buy any plasma other than a Kuro -- maybe that's why people end up buying disposable LEDs? But the glory of a plasma before it starts dimming or screwing up in all the different ways it could screw up, huh? You only live once.

If I had $3,000 to spend on a display device tomorrow—I would spend it on a projector, not on a plasma. biggrin.gif

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post #1481 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 03:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Lucky you to have a place to set up a projector Mark. Here in Cali 500K gets you about 920 square feet in a not prime but not bad by any means neighborhood.
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post #1482 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

100,000 hours? That's better than I thought.eek.gif

Back in 2004, I sold this Panasonic Enhanced Definition TV to a friend of mine. $1799.99 at BBY for a 42 inch plasma.
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-PIx556Qzw2s/p_13342PD50U/Panasonic-TH-42PD50U.html

Have not talked to him in years, but he recently popped up on FB - asked if the ED TV was still operational. Told me it's still crankin 9 years later. Back then, the average time to 1/2 brightness was 60,000 hours.
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post #1483 of 1489 Old 05-30-2013, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

Lucky you to have a place to set up a projector Mark. Here in Cali 500K gets you about 920 square feet in a not prime but not bad by any means neighborhood.

I live in Philly, in a rowhouse so I know what having limited space is like. That said, I'm more than willing to deal with the cramped installation and watch an 84" image. 96" diagonal is the very maximum I could get away, with and still be within THX viewing parameters for 1080p/2K. I used a projector up until about 18 months ago, with a 720p Bravia that was getting a bit long-in-tooth; 3D got me into a 55" panel, but I do miss the larger presentation and the very deep blacks I could get with projection.

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post #1484 of 1489 Old 05-31-2013, 06:25 AM
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Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

^I think the Samsung will be superior with video processing, especially when it comes to lower resolutions.

Does Samsung's smart Revolution Kit upgrade only the smart features or will it improve video processing (i.e. picture quality) too?
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post #1485 of 1489 Old 05-31-2013, 06:41 AM
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Originally Posted by sanramon94582 View Post

Does Samsung's smart Revolution Kit upgrade only the smart features or will it improve video processing (i.e. picture quality) too?

It upgrades smart features CPU and memory if I remember correctly (at least it did this year)........So could video processing be improved, yes, will it be "readily" noticeable, that is an unknown. at some point you start to reach the limits of the Panel itself...
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post #1486 of 1489 Old 05-31-2013, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

It upgrades smart features CPU and memory if I remember correctly (at least it did this year)........So could video processing be improved, yes, will it be "readily" noticeable, that is an unknown. at some point you start to reach the limits of the Panel itself...

RIght, if any kind of internal change is put forth (phosphor enhancement, new internal part, etc.) nothing can be done about it.

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post #1487 of 1489 Old 06-02-2013, 12:43 PM
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Are all the videos of the shootout on youtube? There's seem to be some presentations and test missing.

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post #1488 of 1489 Old 06-02-2013, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by sanramon94582 View Post

Does Samsung's smart Revolution Kit upgrade only the smart features or will it improve video processing (i.e. picture quality) too?

I'd sure hope it more than firmware but you really don't know.

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post #1489 of 1489 Old 06-03-2013, 12:19 AM
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I'd sure hope it more than firmware but you really don't know.

The TV's CPU and GPU are inside the kit. There has never been any ambiguity on this topic. I have personally asked the question to Samsung's reps—the answer is always the same:

"The Evolution Kit upgrades the Smart TV's CPU, memory, and GPU to the level of the latest Smart TVs."

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