Samsung PNxxF4500 Owners Thread - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 752 Old 04-24-2014, 09:03 PM
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It's seems people are enjoying their sets, the thread has been slow. smile.gif
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post #452 of 752 Old 04-24-2014, 09:11 PM
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How's the luminance/ gradation in hgh contrast stuff?Do you see really shiny bright white areas on any stuff? I've had some pink overload with my latest adjustment.I raised green gain a few notches.Ive read about people having pink problem in previous models.As the panel ages it does go pink I believe..Not sure if pinkng is a problem with F series like other series.
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post #453 of 752 Old 04-24-2014, 09:13 PM
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Too wrapped up in the new seasons of Mad Men and Game of Thrones to post. smile.gif. Watched Hobbit: Desolation of Smaug last night. This set is the best $400 I ever spent.
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post #454 of 752 Old 04-25-2014, 12:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic12345 View Post

How's the luminance/ gradation in hgh contrast stuff?Do you see really shiny bright white areas on any stuff? I've had some pink overload with my latest adjustment.I raised green gain a few notches.Ive read about people having pink problem in previous models.As the panel ages it does go pink I believe..Not sure if pinkng is a problem with F series like other series.
Vic, I was worrying about that, when whites had that pinking having had the set for a year plus and about 2000hrs.
Then after obsessing on it and reading a lot of calibration stuff I just reset the Tv then did the process I described above. All I can see are very pleasing whites with no pinking, colors are deep and well saturated without eye fatigue. I know with a meter this can be improved on but the way i have it still the PQ is very pleasing. Now I get why they say not to copy settings especially those related to greyscale calibration(white balance).
@DarkHorse88, Game of Thrones has some of the best sceneries for a tv show and brings out the best of plasma tvs. Did you get a meter?
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post #455 of 752 Old 04-25-2014, 12:42 AM
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These plasmas are a MAjOR pain too adjust.You can save yourself an unbelievable pain if you get a meter.Even at that its never gonna look that great on hockey,commercials etc. unless you get an 8500,but then it probably looks good enough out of the box.The only reason I even attempt adjusting it is because I've been doing it for so many years.
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post #456 of 752 Old 04-25-2014, 06:13 AM
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My UK (made in Hungary January 2014 version 09) PS43F4900, its a 3D version of the 4500



Picture

Picture Mode: Movie
Cell Light: 20
Contrast:95
Brightness: 44 (eliminates dancing dots in black, can still see video level 17 and 1% grey)
Sharpness: 0 (I really can't tell from a pattern because up close I can see all the sub pixels)
Colour:50
Tint (G/R): G50/R50

Picture Size: Screen Fit

Advanced Settings

Dynamic Contrast: Off
Black Tone: Off
Flesh Tone: 0
RGB Only Mode: Off
Colour Space: Custom

Custom
Red: R50 G6 B5
Green: R25 G51 B4
Blue: R0 G4 B56
Yellow: R50 G50 B0
Cyan: R19 G49 B51
Magenta: R49 G5 B51

White Balance:
(White balance controls on this model are reversed offsets=gains)
R Offset: 22
G Offset: 25
B Offset: 25
R Gain: 20
G Gain: 26
B Gain: 25

10p White Balance

Interval 4: R-3 G0 B-1
Interval 5: R-2 G+1 B0
Interval 6: R-4 G+1 B-1
Interval 7: R-4 G+2 B-1
Interval 8: R-1 G+1 B-2
Interval 9: R-3 G-1 B+3
Interval 10: R-3 G+2 B-2

Gamma: -1

Picture Options

Colour Tone: Warm 2
Digital Clean View: Off
MPEG Noise Filter:Off
Film Mode: Auto 2
Black Optimiser: Dark Room
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post #457 of 752 Old 04-25-2014, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 22point8 View Post

My UK (made in Hungary January 2014 version 09) PS43F4900, its a 3D version of the 4500

 

It's great to see a proper calibration of this set. Even if it may or may not translate well to any other TV than yours, it could provide some pointers for us "less fortunate" without means of calibration :)

 

That said, I certainly have no problem trying out other people's settings in full and possibly tweak them if necessary. I'm simply not happy with the default movie mode, nor am I pleased with the auto color space. I have a vague idea of the picture output that I want, but even getting anywhere close is difficult, while finding faults is all too easy.

 

So I'm rather excited to try yours and see where it gets me, even down to the 10p white balance. Interval 1-3 seems to be missing though, or did you leave them at default value? Thanks.

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post #458 of 752 Old 04-25-2014, 03:18 PM
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Red gain
high abl/low contrast
Too high pink red color that really ruins colors
Too low looks dull
Low abl/hgh contrast
Too high harder too go too high as iit helps a lot
Too low gradation problems in brights.overly shiny luminous white areas
Blue gain
High abl/low contrast
Too high not bad but you see the blue
Too low dim yellow ugly mess
Low abl/ high contrast
Too high brightest areas shiny blue.gradation problems
Too low gives yellow tone




Bias you make look the same color as the white levels mainly with green bias on low/avg levels and is important.Most shows are adjusted with gains and bias and this is what you want too get right but is by far the hardest.High abl= gains.Low abl/low level=bias and gains....Avg levels -too much red can oversaturate and skintones noticable and put a horrendous red film on screen.Too little and it's dull and gradation shiny problem.too much blue and it's a sharp high contrast blue and shiny gradation problem.too little and it's a murky yellow blurry mess.Too much green washes things out makes it murky.too little magenta color mess.
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post #459 of 752 Old 04-25-2014, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zarlence View Post

It's great to see a proper calibration of this set. Even if it may or may not translate well to any other TV than yours, it could provide some pointers for us "less fortunate" without means of calibration smile.gif

That said, I certainly have no problem trying out other people's settings in full and possibly tweak them if necessary. I'm simply not happy with the default movie mode, nor am I pleased with the auto color space. I have a vague idea of the picture output that I want, but even getting anywhere close is difficult, while finding faults is all too easy.

So I'm rather excited to try yours and see where it gets me, even down to the 10p white balance. Interval 1-3 seems to be missing though, or did you leave them at default value? Thanks.

Yeah the interval 3 didn't need adjusting, and most meters can't reliably measure the RGB at 0, 10 or 20% grey so I didn't adjust them incase they tinted the picture.

Also, I was reading another topic about sharpness, I used the AVS709HD disc and turned up sharpness until I could see dither appearing on the edge of black level 16 (on the black clipping pattern), on my TV that was 5, so I set my sharpness to 4.
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post #460 of 752 Old 04-25-2014, 10:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic12345 View Post

In black room ,color at zero "all the varying white/abl levels" should look some combination of ,or in between "green and magenta"(not red,not dull gray,not blue,not yellow).This is the most important thing as most shows are affected here..You should not see any other colors(only maybe green or magenta)as much as the tv allows(my tv goes a bit pink/magenta on full screen white,but it's better not too have ANY magenta/pink).Most of this is done by adjusting the gains(mostly green).Once you correctly set all the varying white levels,then adjust the mid level stuff as this is where a lot of shows are."Seth Myers show is mid-avg picture level show.This is adjusted with the bias mostly(green bias).You don't want it too green for this or midlevel shows..Error on magenta side."Conan obrien" is a low picture level show(bias mostly), but is not as important too get correctly as mid /average/light picture levels is(mine looks magenta).You want the mid/ average level stuff very close too same color as the high abl and white stuff.Repeat starting with whites..Other shows I use is cartoons mid avg/high picture levels,dr oz for avg levels.You can't defeat the abl dimming the luminance,and gamma problems.Its a budget plasma..Do a little each day.You can't do it very long as the eyes get distorted easily if you look too long.You want medium-high abl shows and mid level shows the right color,low picture levels not as important.fInish with mid level shows,cartoons...Info button on cablebox brings up info bars and can reveal how active the abl is on that screens luminance is..abl mostly effects gains.The odd screens will show dark half too magenta and bright half too green or other way round.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic12345 View Post

How's the luminance/ gradation in hgh contrast stuff?Do you see really shiny bright white areas on any stuff? I've had some pink overload with my latest adjustment.I raised green gain a few notches.Ive read about people having pink problem in previous models.As the panel ages it does go pink I believe...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic12345 View Post

These plasmas are a MAjOR pain too adjust... its never gonna look that great on hockey,commercials etc. unless you get an 8500,but then it probably looks good enough out of the box.The only reason I even attempt adjusting it is because I've been doing it for so many years.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic12345 View Post

Red gain
high abl/low contrast
Too high pink red color that really ruins colors
Too low looks dull
Low abl/hgh contrast
Too high harder too go too high as iit helps a lot
Too low gradation problems in brights.overly shiny luminous white areas
Blue gain
High abl/low contrast
Too high not bad but you see the blue
Too low dim yellow ugly mess
Low abl/ high contrast
Too high brightest areas shiny blue.gradation problems
Too low gives yellow tone

Bias you make look the same color as the white levels mainly with green bias on low/avg levels and is important.Most shows are adjusted with gains and bias and this is what you want too get right but is by far the hardest.High abl= gains.Low abl/low level=bias and gains....Avg levels -too much red can oversaturate and skintones noticable and put a horrendous red film on screen.Too little and it's dull and gradation shiny problem.too much blue and it's a sharp high contrast blue and shiny gradation problem.too little and it's a murky yellow blurry mess.Too much green washes things out makes it murky.too little magenta color mess.

Vic...

You own an older/different model of Samsung Plasma than the models discussed in this thread...

You've also stated, in similar plasma threads, that you have altered picture settings within your plasma's Service Menu...

Those altered Service Menu settings have made your plasma look and behave the way it does...

Therefore, nothing you've posted or will post in this thread will apply to our particular models...

No offense intended, but PLEASE, stop posting content that can confuse others looking for legitimate information on their PxxxF4500/F4900 model plasmas...

I'm like a beaver...
A hot little beaver...
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post #461 of 752 Old 04-26-2014, 12:11 AM
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Yes I own the e450.I was just trying too help.Sorry if it confuses anyone.Carry on.
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post #462 of 752 Old 04-26-2014, 02:35 AM
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Not to derail but are some tv shows pushing very warm colors? I have noticed this on a few of them. Sometimes it's like a yellowish haze or reddish.
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post #463 of 752 Old 04-26-2014, 02:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lion Rider View Post

Not to derail but are some tv shows pushing very warm colors? I have noticed this on a few of them. Sometimes it's like a yellowish haze or reddish.

Yep...

NBC's "Hannibal", for example, has a very yellowish tinge to it's outside, daylight scenes...

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post #464 of 752 Old 04-26-2014, 03:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic12345 View Post

Yes I own the e450.I was just trying too help.Sorry if it confuses anyone.Carry on.

I know you were, and are, trying to help...

Thank you very much for understanding smile.gif.

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post #465 of 752 Old 04-26-2014, 03:23 AM
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Thanks Bizarro, was watching "True Detective" when I noticed this. Great Show
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post #466 of 752 Old 04-26-2014, 01:12 PM
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I checked the Samsung website earlier, as I do most days, and today there was an update 1031. This was on the UK support site, so I don't know if this is available is the US/rest of world. There was no changelog, but I did notice a few things:

  • At first I was concerned that the black level had tripled from 0.010 to 0.029cdm2...
  • But It turned out I had Cinema Smooth turned on and that had previously measured 0.046, so 0.029 is a significant improvement
  • The previously measured greyscale, all under 1 deltaE was now mostly 2.
  • The good news is that at default settings the deltaE was under 3 except at 60% (which is where the ABL kicks in according to previous posts)
  • I was able to get similar results to before within 45 minutes.
  • I didn't need to redo the CMS
  • I might be imagining it but less buzzing
  • Less dithering.
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post #467 of 752 Old 04-26-2014, 04:50 PM
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22point8-

 

Don't see it available on the U.S. PN4500AF site. Hopefully, we'll get it soon!

 

 

LionRider-

 

Did not get a meter package as of yet. I have some recreational funds coming in June, And I'll think save to get the CalMan package with the X-Rite 1DisplayPro. For now, still tinkering with WOW and Spears and Munsil. Can't wait to investigate and maybe use the advanced options/measurements on S&M once I get the meter package. Game of Thrones is a gorgeous show! 

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post #468 of 752 Old 04-27-2014, 01:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 22point8 View Post

I checked the Samsung website earlier, as I do most days, and today there was an update 1031. This was on the UK support site, so I don't know if this is available is the US/rest of world. There was no changelog, but I did notice a few things:
 
  • At first I was concerned that the black level had tripled from 0.010 to 0.029cdm2...
  • But It turned out I had Cinema Smooth turned on and that had previously measured 0.046, so 0.029 is a significant improvement
  • The previously measured greyscale, all under 1 deltaE was now mostly 2.
  • The good news is that at default settings the deltaE was under 3 except at 60% (which is where the ABL kicks in according to previous posts)
  • I was able to get similar results to before within 45 minutes.
  • I didn't need to redo the CMS
  • I might be imagining it but less buzzing
  • Less dithering.

 

 

I upgraded from 1030 to 1031.

 

And the buzzing seems louder.

 

How can i go back to 1030?

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post #469 of 752 Old 04-27-2014, 09:33 AM
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These are my final settings based on Bizzaro Stormy's template - for my PNF4550


PICTURE
Mode: Movie
Cell Light: 16
Contrast: 91
Brightness: 43
Sharpness: 0
Color: 50
Tint: G49/R51


PICTURE SIZE
Screen Fit


ADVANCED SETTINGS
Dynamic Contrast: Off
Black Tone: Off
Flesh Tone: -2
Color Space: AUTO

WHITE BALANCE Submenu
R-Offset: 21
G-Offset: 24
B-Offset: 8
R-Gain: 45
G-Gain: 31
B-Gain: 15


10p WHITE BALANCE Off


Gamma: 0 HD Source / +1 SD Source
Motion Lighting: NA


PICTURE OPTIONS
Color Tone: Cool
Digital Clean View: Off
MPEG Noise Filter: Off
HDMI Black Level: Low
Film Mode: NA
Black Optimizer: Dark Room
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post #470 of 752 Old 04-27-2014, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 22point8 View Post

I checked the Samsung website earlier, as I do most days, and today there was an update 1031. This was on the UK support site, so I don't know if this is available is the US/rest of world. There was no changelog, but I did notice a few things:
 
  • At first I was concerned that the black level had tripled from 0.010 to 0.029cdm2...
  • But It turned out I had Cinema Smooth turned on and that had previously measured 0.046, so 0.029 is a significant improvement
  • The previously measured greyscale, all under 1 deltaE was now mostly 2.
  • The good news is that at default settings the deltaE was under 3 except at 60% (which is where the ABL kicks in according to previous posts)
  • I was able to get similar results to before within 45 minutes.
  • I didn't need to redo the CMS
  • I might be imagining it but less buzzing
  • Less dithering.


Watched some movies rich with color using your settings, and was more than pleased with how it looked throughout. Will watch more content and give it some more time before I say much else or eventually do some tweaking, but it's promising. There's always the chance of the placebo effect playing tricks on my mind too, so I'm gonna compare them with some more basic setups of mine :)

 

Gotta ask though, as I also have the EU/UK model ( currently on 1030 ) and tempted to update, but could you be so kind as to post those adjustments you made? Would be much appreciated. 

 

Also... no changelogs to go along with the firmware is a real bummer, so maybe I should just hold off updating as I'm always sceptical of them!

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post #471 of 752 Old 04-27-2014, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zarlence View Post


Watched some movies rich with color using your settings, and was more than pleased with how it looked throughout. Will watch more content and give it some more time before I say much else or eventually do some tweaking, but it's promising. There's always the chance of the placebo effect playing tricks on my mind too, so I'm gonna compare them with some more basic setups of mine smile.gif

Gotta ask though, as I also have the EU/UK model ( currently on 1030 ) and tempted to update, but could you be so kind as to post those adjustments you made? Would be much appreciated. 

Also... no changelogs to go along with the firmware is a real bummer, so maybe I should just hold off updating as I'm always sceptical of them!


Picture Mode: Movie
Cell Light: 20
Contrast:95
Brightness: 44 (eliminates dancing dots in black, can still see video level 17 and 1% grey)
Sharpness: 4
Colour:50
Tint (G/R): G50/R50

Picture Size: Screen Fit

Advanced Settings

Dynamic Contrast: Off
Black Tone: Off
Flesh Tone: 0
RGB Only Mode: Off
Colour Space: Custom


Custom
Red: R50 G6 B5
Green: R25 G51 B4
Blue: R0 G4 B56
Yellow: R50 G50 B0
Cyan: R19 G49 B51
Magenta: R49 G5 B51

White Balance:
(White balance controls on this model are reversed offsets=gains)
R Offset: 23
G Offset: 25
B Offset: 25
R Gain: 20
G Gain: 25
B Gain: 25

10p White Balance

Interval 2: R+1 G+1 B-1
Interval 4: R-1 G+2 B0
Interval 5: R-2 G0 B-2
Interval 6: R-2 G+2 B+1
Interval 7: R-2 G+1 B-2
Interval 9: R0 G-2 B+2

Gamma: -1

Picture Options

Colour Tone: Warm 2
Digital Clean View: Off
MPEG Noise Filter:Off
Film Mode: Auto 2 (HD Broadcast)/Cinema Smooth (24p BD)
Black Optimiser: Dark Room

Game mode:


Picture Mode: Standard
Warm 2
R Offset 25
G Offset 25
B Offset 25
R Gain 20
G Gain 26
B Gain 25

Colour: 45
Colour Space: Custom
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post #472 of 752 Old 04-28-2014, 05:02 AM
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Below are the results of my first calibration in a dark room with a bias backlight.  It was a real bear having to use that ColorHCFR junk (and dispcalGUI), because CalMan and ChromaPure do not support the ColorMunki (same exact hardware as the i1Display Pro).

 

Targeted luminance was 120 cd/m2 which I remain unconvinced is healthy/optimal (do they set that target on studio reference monitors?), but if you want the theatre effect (48 cd/m2), set the Cell Light to 5 and Brightness to 47.  I did not check to see if the theatre effect affected anything other than Brightness and Contrast.  I did not notice adjusting the Contrast making a difference in the white bars, so I kept it at the default 95 which I vaguely recall is supposed to prevent greyscale tinging.  Note that I use the D65 ten degrees white target; ColorHCFR may calculate the dE off of the standard fixed internal value it uses.

 

Incidentally, the theatre effect is probably why I prefered that luminance in the beginning when burning-in the plasma as it was in the general area of the luminace of my old Samsung LCD monitor (no idea of my old Sony LCD HDTV) which had the brightness at 0.  I set the new Dell P2412H LCD monitor to 48 cd/m2 which is brightness at 0 and default contrast down a notch or two....  somewhat brighter than the old Samsung but not enough to be in the annoying zone, thankfully!

 

I ran a test on Congo via Netflix on a whim and it looks great for a 1995 movie, but completely different from what I remember seeing on the VCR/cable (or the trailer as I can't actually remember watching the movie, just a trailer and a making of featurette).  The fog is definitely not as thick or heavy as I remember.  It could be the analog film effect made it more muddy and dark back then.  I had a negative expectation before watching the movie, so I think it must have been panned harshly by critics back then, especially the use of fake gorillas.  Overall, the movie was nothing great, so I'm thinking it must have a been a poor attempt at a summer blockbuster movie.  BTW, there are some severe artifacting in a dark scene at 48 minutes; I'm pretty sure its the Netflix encoding, can anyone confirm that its not the plasma?

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post #473 of 752 Old 04-28-2014, 07:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EatStatic14 View Post

Below are the results of my first calibration in a dark room with a bias backlight.  It was a real bear having to use that ColorHCFR junk (and dispcalGUI), because CalMan and ChromaPure intentionally do not support the ColorMunki (same exact hardware as the i1Display Pro).  It sure smells like an elitist protection racket to me and its of no use in arguing with them.

Targeted luminance was 120 cd/m2 which I remain unconvinced is healthy/optimal (do they set that target on studio reference monitors?), but if you want the theatre effect (48 cd/m2), set the Cell Light to 5 and Brightness to 47.  I did not check to see if the theatre effect affected anything other than Brightness and Contrast.  I did not notice adjusting the Contrast making a difference in the white bars, so I kept it at the default 95 which I vaguely recall is supposed to prevent greyscale tinging.  Note that I use the D65 ten degrees white target; ColorHCFR may calculate the dE off of the standard fixed internal value it uses.

Incidentally, the theatre effect is probably why I prefered that luminance in the beginning when burning-in the plasma as it was in the general area of the luminace of my old Samsung LCD monitor (no idea of my old Sony LCD HDTV) which had the brightness at 0.  I set the new Dell P2412H LCD monitor to 48 cd/m2 which is brightness at 0 and default contrast down a notch or two....  somewhat brighter than the old Samsung but not enough to be in the annoying zone, thankfully!

I ran a test on Congo via Netflix on a whim and it looks great for a 1995 movie, but completely different from what I remember seeing on the VCR/cable (or the trailer as I can't actually remember watching the movie, just a trailer and a making of featurette).  The fog is definitely not as thick or heavy as I remember.  It could be the analog film effect made it more muddy and dark back then.  I had a negative expectation before watching the movie, so I think it must have been panned harshly by critics back then, especially the use of fake gorillas.  Overall, the movie was nothing great, so I'm thinking it must have a been a poor attempt at a summer blockbuster movie.  BTW, there are some severe artifacting in a dark scene at 48 minutes; I'm pretty sure its the Netflix encoding, can anyone confirm that its not the plasma?

Picture Mode: Movie

Cell Light: 16
Contrast: 95
Brightness: 45
Sharpness: 0
Color: 50
Tint: G50/R50

Picture Size: Screen Fit
PIP: Off

Advanced Settings
Dynamic Contrast: Off
Black Tone: Off
Flesh Tone: -2
RGB Only Mode: Off

Color Space: Custom
Red: Red 48, Green 17, Blue 14
Green: Red 43, Green 51, Blue 0
Blue: Red 8, Green 13, Blue 54
Yellow: Red 50, Green 50, Blue 0
Cyan: Red 45, Green 50, Blue 50
Magenta: Red 48, Green 22, Blue 53

White Balance:
R-Offset: 22, G-Offset: 27, B-Offset: 7
R-Gain: 27, G-Gain: 32, B-Gain: 6

10pt White Balance: On
Interval 1: R+1, B+1
Interval 2: R+1
Interval 3: B+3
Interval 4: B-1
Interval 5: R-2, B+1
Interval 6: R-4, B-2
Interval 7: R-5, B-7
Interval 8: R-1, G+2, B-2
Interval 9: R+2, B+9
Interval 10: R-2, G+1, B-6

Gamma: 0
Expert Pattern: Off
Motion Lightning: Off

Picture Options:
Color Tone: Standard
Digital Clean View: Off
MPEG Noise Filter: Off
HDMI Black Level: Low
Film Mode: Off
Black Optimizer: Dark Room





Can anyone confirm this looks best on their f4500? I've played with my settings so much already that I don't feel like checking to see if this is better than what I ended up with unless others seem to like this one. I'm surprised that most people like the Warm 2 setting. On my f4500, warm 2 destroys the white balance - what is supposed to look white actually looks a horrible greenish yellow (even where all the settings are someone else's calibrated settings).
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post #474 of 752 Old 04-28-2014, 07:45 AM
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Hey good effort!

This is how I did it:
  • Connected i1 Pro Rev D and Monaco Optix XR DTP94 to laptop (mains power)
  • Opened new windows selecting the relevant meter and calibrating the meters
  • Measure red, green, blue and white with the i1 pro, tick the reference box in the top corner
  • Measure red green, blue and white with DT94, go to advanced/ create meter correction file from reference measures
  • Use DTP 94 for all measurements, use i1 pro for all CMS Except Blue (too dark to read accurately)
  • This is using the 10% size windows on the Gamut Calibration Disc, not to be confused with Masciors disc, the windows on the AVS disc are 14% and the small APL windows are 2% (the gamma should be a flat line if you use those windows to check, the gamma would measure higher
  • This are the 75% saturation 75% stimulus windows wih HCFR set to 'HD709 75%)
  • Set all the white balance to default, measure, find the worst point out of 80/90/100% do the white balance there and at 30% try to avoid using the G Gain/Offset if you can
  • Use the 10 point to make everything flat, bear in mind interval 6 might affect 60% and 65% etc Interval 10 might affect 100 and 95, and 90 might affect 90 and 95
  • Your CMS results and settings look almost identical to my initial try at the CMS using 100% stimulus 100% saturation windows so its pretty amazing how much similarity there is between panels
  • Why did you start with the colour tone at Standard? Normally Warm 2 is the best place to start, on mine its about 3% too red and 3% few blue. But measure Warm 1 as well because on a Sony LCD I have Warm 1 is better than Warm 2
  • Try measuring 20 point greyscale to look for strange things happening, go to measures parameters and change steps from 10 to 20
  • Measure the saturations and colorchecker and see if the line up with the references
  • You can set sharpness by using the AVSHD black clipping test pattern, turn sharpness up until you see dithering on the edge of where 16 was, go back until it disappears again
  • With input set to PC leave sharpness at 50, same with component
  • Playstation 2 480p games like Guilty Gear XX Accent Core Plus and Outrun 2006: Coast to coast look amazing! Might stop using CRT for those.
  • Full screen white is only 40cdm2, I'm sure my near death 24 year old Sony PVM 2044QM CRT (maximum light output with looking crap is 80cdm2 in component/40cdm2 in RGB) can do better than that!
  • PS3 set to RGB Full and HDMI Black set to Normal
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post #475 of 752 Old 04-28-2014, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 22point8 View Post

White Balance:
(White balance controls on this model are reversed offsets=gains)
R Offset: 23
G Offset: 25
B Offset: 25
R Gain: 20
G Gain: 25
B Gain: 25

 

I updated my firmware to 1031 and tried your revised settings and have this silly little question regarding the above. You say the controls are reversed, and you're not the first to say this, so I dont doubt it.. but I just wanted to see if I got this right. Did you input those values as seen in the quote above or did you reverse them like this : 

 

R Offset: 20
G Offset: 25
B Offset: 25
R Gain: 23
G Gain: 25
B Gain: 25

 

Like I said, a silly question. However, setting the values as seen in the quote I get this red push in the AVSHD white clipping test, while reversing them seem to eliminate most of it. Might be where the model differences play in, but I wanted to make sure I tried your original settings in full before any foolish tinkering. Cheers :)

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post #476 of 752 Old 04-28-2014, 08:10 AM
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Probably model differences, you might need them reversed for F4500 so you would want:

R Offset: 20
G Offset: 25
B Offset: 25
R Gain: 23
G Gain: 25
B Gain: 25

I think the F4900 is more similar to the F5300. The Gains on my model should affect the near white but actually affect near black. The 10 point works fine though. VERY slight pink tinge to a white clipping pattern, but 100% is 235 and it isn't tinged until about 245, which no bluray or dvd would use.
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post #477 of 752 Old 04-28-2014, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by 22point8 View Post

Probably model differences, you might need them reversed for F4500 so you would want:

R Offset: 20
G Offset: 25
B Offset: 25
R Gain: 23
G Gain: 25
B Gain: 25

I think the F4900 is more similar to the F5300. The Gains on my models should affect the near white but actually affect near black. The 10 point works fine though. VERY slight pink tinge to a white clipping pattern, but 100% is 235 and it isn't tinged until about 245, which no bluray or dvd would use.


Appreciate the quick response :)

 

Will simply have to eyeball some content while tossing around the red gain and offset values. There's also the question if the color control needs changing for me ( could be a personal preference ) as they can almost come across a bit strong/oversaturated overall.

 

Using your Standard Picture Mode settings, but decreasing the color to about 41 ( where I usually set color using standard ), I got some very pleasing results. Really close to the picture quality I'm used to with my monitors. There's no accuracy in my guesses of course, and the blue/red/green filter method for the color value tells me its better set in the upper range.

 

Overall I really like these settings and the custom color space especially seem to transfer very well to my model. So once again, thanks for posting them :)

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 22point8 View Post
  • Playstation 2 480p games like Guilty Gear XX Accent Core Plus and Outrun 2006: Coast to coast look amazing! Might stop using CRT for those.

 

 

This set handles 480p gaming content like a champ.  I still find it amazing how good it looks with Wii/GC/Xbox/PS2 progressive scan titles...

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This set handles 480p gaming content like a champ.  I still find it amazing how good it looks with Wii/GC/Xbox/PS2 progressive scan titles...
Close up Outrun 2006, never noticed the grille before

Guilty Gear XX Accent Core Plus



A scene from 'Kuro the Best 1' test clip, taken in the dark you can see where the screen ends, looks blacker than it is. The USB player doesn't have Black optimiser...
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 22point8 View Post
 
  • With input set to PC leave sharpness at 50, same with component
  • Playstation 2 480p games like Guilty Gear XX Accent Core Plus and Outrun 2006: Coast to coast look amazing! Might stop using CRT for those.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh128 View Post
 

This set handles 480p gaming content like a champ.  I still find it amazing how good it looks with Wii/GC/Xbox/PS2 progressive scan titles...

Speaking of gaming. From what I've gathered the input lag on this TV is somewhere around 50ms when Game Mode is enabled. A decent number I guess. What I'm curious about is if the input lag improves further when the input name is set to PC? My PS3 broke down recently so I havent been able to test it much myself. The only thing I noted on was that the image quality took a severe hit in PC mode, which might have been due to the sharpness being set way too low.

 

Thinking of plugging in some older consoles now that you both rave about how good it looks! Playstation 2 for sure, but maybe even some machines older than that. Pixel games on a big screen ought to be fun. Cant wait to try out Metal Slug for example!

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