Official ZT60 Owners Thread - Page 340 - AVS Forum
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Old 03-03-2014, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Jason626 View Post

$2200 for the 60" isn't bad at all. The 65" is about 800 bucks high.

Have no idea where you are going to get a new 65ZT for $ 3,000 - in our area, unless you are willing to quit your job and search for a NEW 65ZT60 full-time I would jump on the $ 3,875 or search for a 65VT or a Sammy64.

If you absolutely must have a new ZT the sands of time are running out - or in plain English - there ain't no tomorrow baby!!

Panasonic TC-P65ZT60 - Oppo BDP-103D - Panasonic DMP-BDT220 - Toshiba HD-DVD-3A - OPPO DV-981HD - Harmony 880
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Old 03-03-2014, 05:28 PM
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But want the best ....thus smaller screen size
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Old 03-03-2014, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by bob brennan View Post

Have no idea where you are going to get a new 65ZT for $ 3,000 - in our area, unless you are willing to quit your job and search for a NEW 65ZT60 full-time I would jump on the $ 3,875 or search for a 65VT or a Sammy64.

If you absolutely must have a new ZT the sands of time are running out - or in plain English - there ain't no tomorrow baby!!
Boy your really stuck on those amazon market place sellers prices. Beginning to think you work for one of them. You quote them every other day.

Those were best buy prices he quoted. For the most part people did not pay that much at best buy especially after the exclusive ended with magnolia. Any normal business like BB, amazon, frys, etc would not jack up prices.

No body pays over msrp in there right mind. For those sellers trying to charge that much only hurts there reputation and legitimacy. I wouldn't trust them ever.

I believe in free markets and capitalism. They can try to sell it for whatever price they desire. But after that price gouging don't expect to get customers lining up to buy products. That's bad customer service. Even Cleveland plasma and value electronics would never do that. They value there customers.
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Old 03-03-2014, 06:05 PM
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I sold the extra zt in my bedroom. Walmart had a new in box p60u50 for 800. I didnt have a truck. The electronics guy at walmart offered to take it for me on his break for a small fee. I did it, got it home, plugged it in, BZZZZZZZZZZZZ, no picture. Cracked panel. Called the guy and he took it back for me with no extra charge. Saw a refurbished p50s60 for 5~ something at sears outlet. Went to see it, called ahead confirmed in stock, got there and no one could find it for 30 minutes. Looked at the tvs on display, had a 65 inch vt with 500 hours and slight IR (no burn in from what i could guess) for 1650. Finally they find the tv. Price was lower then i thought, 440. Base pretty scratched, a few blemishes on the bezel, the guy guessed it was a floor model but it had 3 hours on it. Had some stand alignment issues, got it sorted. No other issues. Will be a backup monitor, blacks are very good with my bias light. Even though at 10 inches smaller then my zt, the picture isnt as good, really surprised by that as i expected the higher pixel density to look a little better. Then again it might be the zts superior processing from lower res content, as i havnt tried bluray on it. Only a cable box in the bedroom (no porn here, still young, not a requirement yet, and yes im referencing you porn goers who were advising selfmade lol) Brightness is higher then the zt, by a small amount. Heres a few pics, one of the cracked u50 and my new backup. I went after cheap tvs with no IR issues and extremely good input lag.



Also had a chance to run a cal disk while it was in the living room, got it set up pretty good, pleased with the picture, it "looks" accurate.
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Old 03-03-2014, 06:23 PM
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My ZT60 Serial #3193 July 2013 A09630

No panel seperation
No fan noise
No buzzing

After owning the ZT for a little over a month I must say, this is a very mediocre panel!!! wink.gif Obviously I'm joking. I have really enjoyed it so far. I'm a little over 250 hrs and it keeps getting better as the hours increase. From gaming to movie watching, I have been very impressed with how it handles everything. I always felt a little bad that I never got to check out the F8500 at it's full potential. It was hanging on a wall at BB and every time I went in to see it, they had whatever causes SOE at full blast. So It was a complete turn off. I knew I wanted something that gave me that natural look with amazing depth that I'm accustomed to with my kuro and this is exactly what I got with the ZT60. I will get it calibrated some time this year, but I'm in no rush. I missed out on getting a 60 inch kuro before they were gone and didn't want to make that mistake with the ZT60! No regrets. Seems like some people on here are looking for issues on this tv. If you don't notice any, don't go looking for them and stay off the forums and enjoy this amazing panel!!!
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Old 03-03-2014, 06:31 PM
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I Had Michael Chen over to calibrate my ZT last night. He offers a THX Express service for $200 and he spent about two hours making measurements. Michael is a THX instructor based out of Calgary.

He started by explaining a few things about setting brightness and contrast. He says that the four top items in the list of TV features are as follows: brightness (black level); contrast; colour accuracy; and detail. Panasonic designed the set in such a way that when you turn up the contrast past 60 there is no increase in the viewable detail in the image. You can see this when you put up a test pattern and try to go past 60 all the way to 100.

After instructing me on how to do it he put up a Spears and Muncil pattern to adjust brightness from my primary viewing position. We did the same with contrast. We had a talk about light output. He said that when THX first set standards it was 30 ftL. But some complained this wasn't bright enough so they revised that to 35. But you can go plus or minus 35% from there and still be in spec. It's all based on the users susceptibility to eye fatigue in viewing in a dark room. (THX specs were developed in a black hole essentially).

He then used his Spectrometer to measure the default THX Cinema setting out of the box. It came within 4.5% of perfect. The average error was 3.5% but there was some error at 100% white that affected the average. He commented that the THX standard has come a long way in the last 5 years. Most of the sets he has done recently are very close like mine was. The errors have to be over around 7% before they would start to bother you but it wouldn't stop you from watching it. At 10% it becomes bad enough that you will want to do something about it.

He said that people's obsession with breaking in the panel before calibration were unwarranted with today's technology. He said if it makes you feel better to run slides for 300 hours go ahead but improvements that people are seeing over time are really just their eyes getting used to what they are seeing.

He commented that sharing settings was not a good idea because the statistics say that you have about a 4% chance of improving the picture (bringing it closer to the correct white balance and colour settings) and a 96% chance of making it worse. But without a spectrometer to check your work you have no idea whether what you have done has helped or hurt the image. You are just choosing a personal preference of what you think looks good.

We calibrated in Cinema rather than either of the pro modes. I didn't ask for a daytime mode as I don't watch TV during the day and even on the few times on the weekend when I have, the panel was bright enough for my eyes.

He only needed to do a 2 point adjustment to the white balance to get it sorted out. Red was over represented and had to be turned down the most, along with a smaller reduction in Blue. I could've asked him to use the full 10 point adjustment but he pointed out that while that might make for a prettier graph you wouldn't be able to perceive any difference with human eyes.

He set the gamma at 2.4. Interesting note: film directors set their own gamma on a film by film basis. Some are 2.2 and some are 2.6 and they could be anywhere along that scale. Unfortunately there is no standard and the film studio doesn't print a suggested gamma setting on the BluRay packaging so most opt for 2.4 as the average to use.

Working on colour management my set was heavy on Magenta and light on Blue. Michael made the necessary adjustments and then tested for accuracy and found that all was good. We then copied the settings to all the instances of Cinema on all the inputs and we copied down the settings by taking photos of the screens. All settings are within 1.5% to 2% of perfect.

If I had paid for his higher end service he provides the finished reports, sample video material to show off the set and even a THX plaque to hang up. I'm happy without those but he did throw in a coffee mug!

I'm very satisfied. Like taking your kid to the doctor for a thorough check up and finding out all is well, this calibration was affordable and confirmed that for most of these sets you could just properly set up the brightness and contrast for your environment and then leave it on THX Cinema.
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Old 03-03-2014, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Jason626 View Post

Boy your really stuck on those amazon market place sellers prices. Beginning to think you work for one of them. You quote them every other day.

Those were best buy prices he quoted. For the most part people did not pay that much at best buy especially after the exclusive ended with magnolia. Any normal business like BB, amazon, frys, etc would not jack up prices.

No body pays over msrp in there right mind. For those sellers trying to charge that much only hurts there reputation and legitimacy. I wouldn't trust them ever.

I believe in free markets and capitalism. They can try to sell it for whatever price they desire. But after that price gouging don't expect to get customers lining up to buy products. That's bad customer service. Even Cleveland plasma and value electronics would never do that. They value there customers.

I have mine - just very grateful that I didn't sit on the fence, complain & wait for the price to drop.

Nothing in BB in this area NY/NJ/Conn, repeat nothing within 100 miles - some local places were raising prices by including extend warranties, calibrations after break-in, fan fix, etc (they have one left). Another place said no free shipping and added $ 300.00 for "white glove delivery" $ 3,799 + $ 300 for 65ZT - ALL GONE!!!

Please note that the MSRP for the 65ZT was $ 4,100.00 & $3,500.00 for the 60ZT - so that $ 3,875.00 price was a saving of $ 225.00 off MSRP

I think some folks who really want a new ZT better accept the reality that the prices are never ever going to go down and they can complain about it all they want but if the want one they are going to have to pay the price.

Just a messenger.

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Old 03-03-2014, 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr Paw View Post

I Had Michael Chen over to calibrate my ZT last night. He offers a THX Express service for $200 and he spent about two hours making measurements. Michael is a THX instructor based out of Calgary.

I'm very satisfied. Like taking your kid to the doctor for a thorough check up and finding out all is well, this calibration was affordable and confirmed that for most of these sets you could just properly set up the brightness and contrast for your environment and then leave it on THX Cinema.
Great write up! Thanks for sharing.

I will say that not being able to turn on the pixel orbiter in THX mode has kept me from using it so as of now I do rely on other settings to satisfy my needs. $200 also seems like a pretty decent price and offered enough of a calibration that sounds like it would satisfy many.
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Old 03-03-2014, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr Paw View Post

I Had Michael Chen over to calibrate my ZT last night. He offers a THX Express service for $200 and he spent about two hours making measurements. Michael is a THX instructor based out of Calgary.
Thanks for posting your calibration comments. I've added a link to your post in the flat panel (post number two) lists that are linked in the signature area at the bottom of my post.

If you have further comments to make about your audio or video calibration, it would be great if you could use the edit command to add them to your original post.

Michael's AVS user name is Michael DTV.

Enjoy. smile.gif
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Old 03-03-2014, 08:22 PM
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Where are all the people that preach plugging in other peoples settings. Read the above cal review. What i been saying this whole time.
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Old 03-03-2014, 08:39 PM
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Why anyone would live with audible fan noise when it can be at least partially mitigated at no cost and without real risk is simply beyond me. Worried about microfractures - just pay close attention to the repair as it's done. Don't trust the panasonic provided technician - check them out beforehand. Stock market will crash - can't help you there. Why even bother spending $2800+ on something this nice without being able to enjoy it to the max extent possible?

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If you live near a metropolis of substantial size, there's not much reason to avoid the repair if it's bothersome. If not, the pickins will likely be slim from the authorized technician standpoint, and a ~50% reduction in sound is not worth the risk to me.

That!

GC3, I posted this earlier but I'll repost here because it'll answer your question, at least in my case:

My ZT suffers from a very loud and obnoxious fan noise. But, I plan to wait on the fix until at least we move to Houston where my chances of getting a more experienced service tech are much higher than here in Little Rock. I spoke with the only service tech available here. Not only did he have no clue what the problem with my TV was after his shop was contacted by Panasonic to schedule the fix, he insisted he needed to take the TV to his shop until I firmly asserted that I refuse to let the TV out of my house because that's not what Panasonic is advising. He then said OK I'll "talk to the engineers" (no clue what that means) and I'll call you back. He did, and said OK we'll do the fix at your house. He then proceeded to say that the needed foam set is on back order and that he'll get in touch when it's available. I thought that sounded a bit sketchy so I got the part number from him. It was different than the one that was posted on another forum. I went to Panasonic's parts ordering site, ordered both the one he wanted to get and the one posted there. Sure enough they were both available and I got them in a couple of days, and the one he wanted is the WRONG set. I am not going to call him and tell him I have the needed foam set because after all this I really don't trust him to do my TV. Would you?
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Old 03-03-2014, 08:42 PM
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That!

GC3, I posted this earlier but I'll repost here because it'll answer your question, at least in my case:

My ZT suffers from a very loud and obnoxious fan noise. But, I plan to wait on the fix until at least we move to Houston where my chances of getting a more experienced service tech are much higher than here in Little Rock. I spoke with the only service tech available here. Not only did he have no clue what the problem with my TV was after his shop was contacted by Panasonic to schedule the fix, he insisted he needed to take the TV to his shop until I firmly asserted that I refuse to let the TV out of my house because that's not what Panasonic is advising. He then said OK I'll "talk to the engineers" (no clue what that means) and I'll call you back. He did, and said OK we'll do the fix at your house. He then proceeded to say that the needed foam set is on back order and that he'll get in touch when it's available. I thought that sounded a bit sketchy so I got the part number from him. It was different than the one that was posted on another forum. I went to Panasonic's parts ordering site, ordered both the one he wanted to get and the one posted there. Sure enough they were both available and I got them in a couple of days, and the one he wanted is the WRONG set. I am not going to call him and tell him I have the needed foam set because after all this I really don't trust him to do my TV. Would you?
It says in all panasonic manuals that 42 inches and below are carry in for service, and anything above is in home service. Dont let him touch it. Wait till you get to houston. On the upside, since yourr fans double as jet engines, you can just fly over on your zt
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Old 03-03-2014, 08:42 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Mr Paw View Post

He then used his Spectrometer to measure the default THX Cinema setting out of the box. It came within 4.5% of perfect. The average error was 3.5% but there was some error at 100% white that affected the average. He commented that the THX standard has come a long way in the last 5 years. Most of the sets he has done recently are very close like mine was. The errors have to be over around 7% before they would start to bother you but it wouldn't stop you from watching it. At 10% it becomes bad enough that you will want to do something about it.
I have to say, I am pretty satisfied with THX Cinema, and this confirms why I'm satisfied. $400 is not worth an average improvement of such a small percentage. Now getting a bright room calibration would be an entirely different story.
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Old 03-03-2014, 08:47 PM
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It says in all panasonic manuals that 42 inches and below are carry in for service, and anything above is in home service. Dont let him touch it. Wait till you get to houston. On the upside, since yourr fans double as jet engines, you can just fly over on your zt

Flying carpet style! If only I could find a way to power the TV while in flight...
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Old 03-03-2014, 08:56 PM
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Good stuff Mr Paw. Thanks for posting it.
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Old 03-03-2014, 09:10 PM
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After using the avshd disk more. I was able to get my settings more to my liking. I am still going to get a ideal lume light. I feel this will deepen blacks more to my taste.

With this panels pq and if it had 9.5 kuro blacks it would be a perfect set. With adding the light I'm hoping it hits 10g. 😄. I really am enjoying this panels pq and size. Panasonic did a great job. 😉

Thanks paw for posting about contrast above 60. I was wondering why nothing would change past that point.
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Old 03-03-2014, 09:25 PM
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Myared, you get a pass for now. No problem.
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Old 03-03-2014, 09:32 PM
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Where are all the people that preach plugging in other peoples settings. Read the above cal review. What i been saying this whole time.

I'll also echo that. Copying other people's settings is not the proper way to calibrate a TV.

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Old 03-03-2014, 09:38 PM
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Where are all the people that preach plugging in other peoples settings. Read the above cal review. What i been saying this whole time.
Never seen anyone preach about using someone else's settings and I don't think anything was said that everyone here doesn't already know in regards to that. Doesn't mean if you find settings you like you shouldn't use it. It is all about what looks good to the person viewing the TV.

No one here is doing that to replace a pro cal. It is usually people that wouldn't be getting a pro cal either way.
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Old 03-03-2014, 09:49 PM
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My point was more towards the fact he said statistically it will make it worse then better, something i always thought myself. I always said if it looks good to you thats what matters. Others have straight out claimed over and over that plugging in settings is a good idea and/or will get you closer then leaving it alone.
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Old 03-03-2014, 09:52 PM
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No one here is doing that to replace a pro cal. It is usually people that wouldn't be getting a pro cal either way.

Exactly. Some of us would rather spend our money something else.
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Old 03-03-2014, 09:56 PM
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I have to say, I am pretty satisfied with THX Cinema, and this confirms why I'm satisfied. $400 is not worth an average improvement of such a small percentage. Now getting a bright room calibration would be an entirely different story.
THX Bright should cover that, no?

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Old 03-03-2014, 09:57 PM
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I am still considering a pro calibration but only from the likes of Chad or someone else that can get a bit more brightness out of the set. Also, would be cool to see if any calibrator is able to get even more black level out of the service menu, if possible, like the Kuros later in their life.
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Old 03-03-2014, 10:01 PM
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Never seen anyone preach about using someone else's settings and I don't think anything was said that everyone here doesn't already know in regards to that. Doesn't mean if you find settings you like you shouldn't use it. It is all about what looks good to the person viewing the TV.

No one here is doing that to replace a pro cal. It is usually people that wouldn't be getting a pro cal either way.

I thought that video was interesting how they spoke of this near the end.
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Old 03-03-2014, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr Paw View Post

...

He said that people's obsession with breaking in the panel before calibration were unwarranted with today's technology. He said if it makes you feel better to run slides for 300 hours go ahead but improvements that people are seeing over time are really just their eyes getting used to what they are seeing.

Thanks for reporting and glad you had a good experience and I am sure Mr Chen will forget more about calibration that I will ever learn... but its not my eyes "getting used to the panel" ..."slides or content"... "breakin" ...."curing" etc... my picture has changed noticeably for the better over about my ~500 hours using the presets so something is changing.

By the way I have plugged in some of the other setting and have decent results... noticed that they are starting to converge i.e. THX Cinema and S&V settings are looking quite similar these days... even testing with WOW...

I keep reading... don't use others calibration settings because everyone's panel is different... well by using that logic...the presets are just pre-set calibrations setting so wouldn't they be different on everyone's set too? So what's the point of using them? And yet we just read from the Pro that THX Cinema is really close +/- 5% on most sets he has measure...... that means to me similar calibration numbers should yield similar results.... so which one is it.?

I am sure a Pro Cal can really squeeze out the best PQ you can get for your individual / exact set, but seems from what MR Chen saying using someone else's numbers, assuming that you are in the statistical medium of the performance response, that you ought to be within 5% or so of the the calibrated set.

BTW I do expect outliers... but really do we think that each of these panels are soooo different with respect to PQ / Response?

Man...probably just stirred the pot good!... but it seems you can not have it both ways, either the sets are fairly repeatable with pre-sets or cal numbers or they are not.

Anyways ... love my picture... will continue to doddle with other's setting WOW S&M etc...then maybe get pro cal some day.

Feel Free to ignore the Ramblings of an Amateur.

Long Live The Gorn!
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Old 03-03-2014, 10:14 PM
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I thought that video was interesting how they spoke of this near the end.

Who are the people speaking, from left to right?
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Old 03-03-2014, 10:51 PM
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Who are the people speaking, from left to right?
Umm I believe it's Kevin Miller, David Mackenzie and D-Nice.
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Old 03-03-2014, 10:56 PM
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Originally Posted by bvader View Post

BTW I do expect outliers... but really do we think that each of these panels are soooo different with respect to PQ / Response?

Man...probably just stirred the pot good!... but it seems you can not have it both ways, either the sets are fairly repeatable with pre-sets or cal numbers or they are not.

It's not that specific examples of the sets are so different in standard THX mode. They may all be within 3-5% of "perfect." It's just that you don't know whether they are all imperfect in the same way. Therefore, you don't know whether using someone else's settings are actually making your set better OR worse, i.e. closer or further away from "perfect". The differences between the S&V and CNET settings are a good example of this. They changed different settings to different degrees, so you can see that different sets require different changes to come closer to ideal.

But it does appear that these sets are so good out of the box that it may not make much of a difference. My set is being professionally calibrated in the morning too, so I guess goodbye to some hard earned cash. Will write up a report tomorrow as well.
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Old 03-03-2014, 11:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr Paw View Post

I Had Michael Chen over to calibrate my ZT last night. He offers a THX Express service for $200 and he spent about two hours making measurements. Michael is a THX instructor based out of Calgary.

Thanks for the report. A very reasonable price IMO. Did he also calibrate 3D? From what I've seen, that setting tends to be more out of wack than regular THX Cinema.
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Old 03-03-2014, 11:14 PM
 
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Originally Posted by repete66211 View Post

THX Bright should cover that, no?
To a point, but I'm not so sure it achieves that 50+ fTL that Chad achieved using the high panel brightness setting. And my Bright Room setting showed a particular green push in fleshtones, though I haven't noticed it as much lately at nearly 1600 hours.
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