Official ZT60 Owners Thread - Page 404 - AVS Forum
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post #12091 of 12736 Old 06-20-2014, 08:50 AM
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how long did you leave the Nav-bar up on Netflix ?

I've got a ZT arriving on Monday and you have slightly concerned me considering how much my wife likes Netflix
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post #12092 of 12736 Old 06-20-2014, 09:01 AM
 
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It's hard to say exactly. This IR mirrors that of the scoreboard that retained after watching football all day back in October (in fact, some of what remains could be traces of it).

Regarding Netflix, it was first used with Oppo's on-board app about 4 months back, but once I realized there is a lack of screensaver (it would only dim the screen after 5 minutes), I switched to the one housed in Panasonic's SmartTV apps. There is a screensaver here, but it's impossible to engage the pixel orbiter for that extra layer of protection. That one has been used for at least the last 4 months, so the nav bar would never be on the screen for more than 5 minutes at a time. During the Oppo usage, I don't recall there being any severe abuse (where it was left on pause for more than 5 minutes), but it almost seems like there's a cumulative effect taking place here and between its appearance on-screen, the phosphors are not refreshing sufficiently. It will be interesting to see what happens with Netflix on Roku.
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post #12093 of 12736 Old 06-20-2014, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post
250 hours of nonstop IR removal methods (screen wipe, slides, and pixel flipper) now, and the presence of the Netflix nav bar at the bottom of the screen is about 80% gone on white (on colors it's 99-100% gone). In its wake are slightly darker shades where it once lied (perhaps MgO sputtering, uneven wear, or burn-in itself). It has been at this current level for at least the last 100 hours or so, so I'm beginning to lean towards permanent. Fortunately, it won't be visible 90% of the time (and probably 100% of the time from my typical seating distance). It still has me frantic of ever using Netflix again as well as from watching much content with stationary graphics (sports, cable stations with logos, tickers, etc.). That being said, the Roku stick for my Oppo is en route, and it will enable me to do 2 things: Put the pixel orbiter to use and have the benefit of a screensaver during Netflix viewing.


Funny you should mention that Vinnie as I just ordered mine yesterday for the 103D. I could no longer stand the mediocre PQ of the Amazon prime app on my 65VT60.
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post #12094 of 12736 Old 06-20-2014, 07:59 PM
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Glad your IR has reduced in severity. Odd that some of these sets have IR problems. We run Netflicks all the time without issue. Maybe slight differences in voltage is the cause?
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post #12095 of 12736 Old 06-20-2014, 09:04 PM
 
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^Maybe...and some of those values are actually adjustable in the service menu (vol sus if my failing memory is reliable).
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Originally Posted by Chere View Post
Funny you should mention that Vinnie as I just ordered mine yesterday for the 103D. I could no longer stand the mediocre PQ of the Amazon prime app on my 65VT60.
Do you anticipate the PQ on the Roku will be better?

Last edited by vinnie97; 06-20-2014 at 09:07 PM.
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post #12096 of 12736 Old 06-21-2014, 08:21 AM
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^^^^ Without a doubt. With the Oppo doing the video processing instead of the VT60 it'll do a better job cleaning up the image for a slightly better PQ.

Last edited by Chere; 06-21-2014 at 06:50 PM.
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post #12097 of 12736 Old 06-21-2014, 10:30 AM
 
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Ah, duh!..and on top of that you have the 103D for even further enhancement.
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post #12098 of 12736 Old 06-22-2014, 03:55 PM
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I need help? I bought a tcp60zt60 I never broke it in properly my fault my first plasma. I am a gamer and now I have some ghosting in the corners were the game hub would be. I dont know how long they have been there. I do know I have had the tv about 4 months now. I have been running a screen fixer for plasmas on youtube for about two days now it is lightning up a bit but will it ever go away? Id hate to spend 3 grand on a tv that has this. I only see it on light colors not when im watching movies. Any suggestions? I can post pictures if needed or if you guys need more info let me know. Also how long could it take to remove this if it can be removed or am I doing this all in vain. Heeeeelllllllppppppp.
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post #12099 of 12736 Old 06-22-2014, 04:15 PM
 
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It may never completely be removed. I still see traces of what I believe to be the Netflix navbar after 250 hours of slides, pixel flipping, and the screen wiper. It's 80% vanished fortunately and, as with your panel, not visible on actual content anymore.
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post #12100 of 12736 Old 06-22-2014, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post
It may never completely be removed. I still see traces of what I believe to be the Netflix navbar after 250 hours of slides, pixel flipping, and the screen wiper. It's 80% vanished fortunately and, as with your panel, not visible on actual content anymore.
How do you know if its permanent or just hard IR? Ive been reading alot of posts were people say burn in is a thing of the past and eventually can be removed over time with getting the panel to age more evenly. Is there even a small chance that it can completely disappear with time? If thats the case even your tv should be fine with time of course. It sounds like to me only time will tell but the plus side is that it is fading. Im just going to buy a small led for gaming. You cant beat this picture for regular content and movies best ive ever had.
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post #12101 of 12736 Old 06-23-2014, 02:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post
It may never completely be removed. I still see traces of what I believe to be the Netflix navbar after 250 hours of slides, pixel flipping, and the screen wiper. It's 80% vanished fortunately and, as with your panel, not visible on actual content anymore.
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Originally Posted by Jarad Goldstein View Post
How do you know if its permanent or just hard IR? Ive been reading alot of posts were people say burn in is a thing of the past and eventually can be removed over time with getting the panel to age more evenly. Is there even a small chance that it can completely disappear with time? If thats the case even your tv should be fine with time of course. It sounds like to me only time will tell but the plus side is that it is fading. Im just going to buy a small led for gaming. You cant beat this picture for regular content and movies best ive ever had.
I have a similar situation to Vinnie.......... an avid car nut, I "used to" watch Velocity channel for hours on end at times. The "V" from the velocity logo "retained" itself on my screen. Closer inspection revealed that while most of this logo is transparent, the upper two tips of the V are a solid silver-white in color. Those "V tips" are now visible on the screen. I don't honestly know how many hours I have run the screen wipe and WOW pixel flipper since discovering this IR, I would guess maybe 150....... plus hundreds of hours of regular content and NO MORE VELOCITY CHANNEL. My "V" has faded like Vinnie's IR, about 80% gone. I can still see it on white and light colored solid screens. I am starting to think the remaining IR is permanent. I sure hope not, but it should be gone by now with the the amount of screen wipe, pixel flipper, and regular viewing I've done. It is a disappointment that a set this expensive and of this generation would still be susceptible to this...... it's not like I left it on that channel 24/7...... I'm talking maybe 4 to 5 hours max at a single viewing.
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post #12102 of 12736 Old 06-23-2014, 01:45 PM
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I recently had the pleasure of Jeff Meier of AccuCal (UMR at AVS) calibrate my home theater.
Thanks for posting your calibration comments. I've added a link to your post in the flat panel (post number two) lists that are linked in the signature area at the bottom of my post.

If you have further comments to make about your audio or video calibration, it would be great if you could use the edit command to add them to your original post. Enjoy.

P.S., Sorry for the vacation delay.

Calibration Resources:

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post #12103 of 12736 Old 06-23-2014, 08:39 PM
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Does anyone know of a way to turn off the TV audio. I'm having issues with a receiver that keeps defaulting the HDMI audio to the TV instead of rendering it itself. I had an old Panasonic LCD that let me disable the HDMI audio, but I can't find a setting on the ZT60. Anyone know if I can do this? Thanks.
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post #12104 of 12736 Old 06-23-2014, 09:00 PM
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Does anyone know of a way to turn off the TV audio. I'm having issues with a receiver that keeps defaulting the HDMI audio to the TV instead of rendering it itself. I had an old Panasonic LCD that let me disable the HDMI audio, but I can't find a setting on the ZT60. Anyone know if I can do this? Thanks.

I set my volume to zero on the Panasonic and I use only my receiver and speakers. It works perfectly for me. My previous TV had the option as you stated to turn audio off.
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post #12105 of 12736 Old 06-23-2014, 09:03 PM
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Figured it out. YOu have to turn Viera link on and then you can choose between Receiver audio or TV audio.
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post #12106 of 12736 Old 06-24-2014, 04:48 AM
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Unfortunately my set has a lot of burn-in !

1) I am not american / english so I watch all the movies with subtitles. I have now two bars on the tv (where the subtitles are displayed). even though it is not a static image, the mark is now clearly visible (and its getting worse)

2) I was on vacations and the maid spent a lot of time in one channel, the logo (bottom right) is clearly visible (I have now included parental controls on that channel)

3) I have been watching too many world cup matches, and the logo of the channel (upper right) is now visbile as well. I want to watch the games so the problem will persist or worsen.

I have used pixel flipper and other methods (such as slides during the night) but the issues remain.

I am a little bit sad as I find the image stunning but I am afraid that in one year time my TV will go to the garbage. (I have now approx 1100 hours)
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post #12107 of 12736 Old 06-24-2014, 05:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PBC PT View Post
Unfortunately my set has a lot of burn-in !

1) I am not american / english so I watch all the movies with subtitles. I have now two bars on the tv (where the subtitles are displayed). even though it is not a static image, the mark is now clearly visible (and its getting worse)

2) I was on vacations and the maid spent a lot of time in one channel, the logo (bottom right) is clearly visible (I have now included parental controls on that channel)

3) I have been watching too many world cup matches, and the logo of the channel (upper right) is now visbile as well. I want to watch the games so the problem will persist or worsen.

I have used pixel flipper and other methods (such as slides during the night) but the issues remain.

I am a little bit sad as I find the image stunning but I am afraid that in one year time my TV will go to the garbage. (I have now approx 1100 hours)
One thing that others advised in this situation..... and I was skeptical of............... but the advice turned out to be true........... don't be afraid to run what seems like a ridiculous amount of screen wipe and pixel flipper time on the set............. hundreds of hours worth .......... it's like it took hundreds of hours to retain the images.......... and to reverse the damage will take hundreds of hours. The sad thing for me in this situation is I don't watch the Velocity Channel anymore on my ZT60 ....... if something is on that channel I have to see it's on the bedroom KURO ....... ZERO retention issues on that baby
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post #12108 of 12736 Old 06-24-2014, 06:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antennahead View Post
One thing that others advised in this situation..... and I was skeptical of............... but the advice turned out to be true........... don't be afraid to run what seems like a ridiculous amount of screen wipe and pixel flipper time on the set............. hundreds of hours worth .......... it's like it took hundreds of hours to retain the images.......... and to reverse the damage will take hundreds of hours. The sad thing for me in this situation is I don't watch the Velocity Channel anymore on my ZT60 ....... if something is on that channel I have to see it's on the bedroom KURO ....... ZERO retention issues on that baby
Thanks

The only issue here is that if I cannot watch movies with subtitles the whole point of having this tv is useless! I was really unaware that subtitles would create burn in / IR
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post #12109 of 12736 Old 06-24-2014, 03:31 PM
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Hey all,

Just curious if any thoughts have changed lately regarding the proper window type and size (standard vs APL, large vs small, etc) to use while doing a home calibration?

Thanks!
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post #12110 of 12736 Old 06-24-2014, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antennahead View Post
One thing that others advised in this situation..... and I was skeptical of............... but the advice turned out to be true........... don't be afraid to run what seems like a ridiculous amount of screen wipe and pixel flipper time on the set............. hundreds of hours worth .......... it's like it took hundreds of hours to retain the images.......... and to reverse the damage will take hundreds of hours. The sad thing for me in this situation is I don't watch the Velocity Channel anymore on my ZT60 ....... if something is on that channel I have to see it's on the bedroom KURO ....... ZERO retention issues on that baby
The only channel that really gave me trouble was Tnt with their logo. I recently got rid of satellite so it's not an issue anymore. My kuros were definitely better with IR than the ZT60. The only IR I get now seems to go away pretty quickly though.
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post #12111 of 12736 Old 06-24-2014, 04:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonyboy View Post
The only channel that really gave me trouble was Tnt with their logo. I recently got rid of satellite so it's not an issue anymore. My kuros were definitely better with IR than the ZT60. The only IR I get now seems to go away pretty quickly though.
After my incident, I started observing closely the various channel logos......... "most" are opaque/semi-transparent, but quite a few of those have solid color sections to the design. It's these solid sections I think that does the most damage, like the tips of my Velocity Channel "V". I broke-in both my Kuro and ZT60 properly, and never have had a single IR issue with the Kuro. This was a wake-up call for me, as I had pretty much ignored IR on the ZT60 after break-in and watched anything I wanted for however long I wanted, within reason ......... I wouldn't leave a static stock ticker or football scoreboard up for 10 hours at a time, but channel logos, ignored them.............. not anymore
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post #12112 of 12736 Old 06-24-2014, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antennahead View Post
One thing that others advised in this situation..... and I was skeptical of............... but the advice turned out to be true........... don't be afraid to run what seems like a ridiculous amount of screen wipe and pixel flipper time on the set............. hundreds of hours worth .......... it's like it took hundreds of hours to retain the images.......... and to reverse the damage will take hundreds of hours. The sad thing for me in this situation is I don't watch the Velocity Channel anymore on my ZT60 ....... if something is on that channel I have to see it's on the bedroom KURO ....... ZERO retention issues on that baby
Totally agree with your response above, antennahead.
I do the same thing, if I want to watch a ton of programming with a fixed image, I will go to the bedroom where the Pro-111 Kuro is and I will give the 65 inch ZT60 a break.

I don't know if ZT owners agree with my following statement here but IMO I find that if you watch a solid hour of a fixed image on a ZT, it will take another hour of watching a program with no fixed images to get rid of it. If you are a avid gamer, newscast or sports channel viewer I can see where a lot of ZT owners could run into persistant image retention problems.

However, the good news for ZT owners here is that if you vary your TV viewing habits you shouldn't have any long term problems and can have thousands of hours of viewing enjoyment without permanent burn in/IR problems.

To all, please enjoy your ZT60 panel. It is such a fine display.
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post #12113 of 12736 Old 06-24-2014, 04:40 PM
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Totally agree with your response above, antennahead.
I do the same thing, if I want to watch a ton of programming with a fixed image, I will go to the bedroom where the Pro-111 Kuro is and I will give the 65 inch ZT60 a break.

I don't know if ZT owners agree with my following statement here but IMO I find that if you watch a solid hour of a fixed image on a ZT, it will take another hour of watching a program with no fixed images to get rid of it. If you are a avid gamer, newscast or sports channel viewer I can see where a lot of ZT owners could run into persistant image retention problems.

However, the good news for ZT owners here is that if you vary your TV viewing habits you shouldn't have any long term problems and can have thousands of hours of viewing enjoyment without permanent burn in/IR problems.

To all, please enjoy your ZT60 panel. It is such a fine display.
I agree, and some channels are better than others at cycling their logo on and off during the broadcast. If they would all just adopt a 50% rule, we might have a lot less of this to worry about
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post #12114 of 12736 Old 06-24-2014, 06:06 PM
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In my experience some logos and some fixed images (i.e. gaming) are worse than others. Fixed, solid white is the worst offender. For that reason, contrast should be kept under 70 in all modes.
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post #12115 of 12736 Old 06-25-2014, 12:08 PM
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how long did you leave the Nav-bar up on Netflix ?

I've got a ZT arriving on Monday and you have slightly concerned me considering how much my wife likes Netflix
Get an AppleTV best Netflix interface out there and has a built in screen saver. It's a no brainer you can break in the TV and save it at the same time.
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post #12116 of 12736 Old 06-25-2014, 12:12 PM
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Thanks

The only issue here is that if I cannot watch movies with subtitles the whole point of having this tv is useless! I was really unaware that subtitles would create burn in / IR
Rejoice. Not sure there is reliable data to back up that perception. I suggest calibrating your display properly with one of the BluRay discs and that will most likely yield a contrast between 65-75 that I think is the bigger issue. Turn on pixel orbiter too and you should be just fine.
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post #12117 of 12736 Old 06-25-2014, 12:34 PM
 
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^For a dark room, sure, but when watching in daylight, one needs to pump up the contrast (see D-Nice's ISF day setting where he has it set for 90 for reference). Can't wait for OLED.
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post #12118 of 12736 Old 06-25-2014, 12:47 PM
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I've played a few games on my ZT and haven't had any major issues with IR. I've only seen really short term IR like the Oppo logo immediately after going to a black screen before disc playback starts. That goes away almost immediately.

I set up my TV with Spears and Munsil in a dark room and don't change settings for daytime viewing. I think my contrast is relatively low.

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post #12119 of 12736 Old 06-25-2014, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post
^For a dark room, sure, but when watching in daylight, one needs to pump up the contrast (see D-Nice's ISF day setting where he has it set for 90 for reference). Can't wait for OLED.
I'm curious how he arrived at that setting. Look at a gray scale pattern and there is no change from about 70 to 100 contrast. On one hand, that indicates that the contrast needn't be any higher than 70, but it also apparently indicates that because 100 looks no different than 70 that setting it to 100 shouldn't cause any more IR than if it's set at 70 or somewhere in between. Who knows?


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post #12120 of 12736 Old 06-25-2014, 02:40 PM
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I've got my contrast set to 10 atm (for when the wife is viewing tv ... logos and allthat)

for "dark room viewing" I'm finding 40 or so contrast plenty

and for pseudo bright room - I'm finding about 60 more than adequate

I like quite a dim display though
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