Official ZT60 Owners Thread - Page 419 - AVS Forum
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post #12541 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 07:08 AM
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I used an old (very old) Sony Cybershot. I got poor images in "Automatic" mode but was able to get better exposures setting it to shutter priority and using 80 - 100 / 1000 and leaving everything else on auto, then just pointing and shooting. I put up 100 IRE and hit the measure white balance button but it didn't work all that great. The room was moderately lit, it would have looked better in complete dark and no neon sculptures reflecting off the screen.
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post #12542 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grendell View Post
I made a separate longer thread here with more info.

I have started to notice uneven white balance. The top left corner of the screen looks way too red.

Here's 70 IRE, my camera doesn't show proper white levels but it does show the variation that has developed:


(click for bigger)

Does that look like normal wear? The set is 10 months old and has had some pretty heavy use, I'd say 12-16 hours a day. Because of this, I try to run the screen wipe for one hour a day, I wonder if that is ill advised?
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Originally Posted by repete66211 View Post
Is the discoloration at all angles? What I mean is, it's not the louvre effect from the AR filter, right? Uneven screen wear is a known factor. It looks more like DSE than banding. Either way, I'm not sure there's a fix or any way to prevent or reverse this. You say ten months. Does that mean you're still inside your warranty? If so, I'd make the call.
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Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post
<sigh>

It is a simple screen uniformity problem. There is only one thing that may help -- change Vsus from low to high. It's tricky because you have to get into the service menu to do it and from the quality of all the responses here, I do not recommend attempting it without someone knowledgeable walking you through the procedure.

Larry
Voltages need to be adjusted.....its a simple adjustment for someone who knows how to do it. Problem is I don't think anyone knows how to do it on the ZT60
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post #12543 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 08:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevekelso View Post
LOOK How bad mine is !
Panasonic has me jumping through Hoops!
It is so bad a Calibrator refused a $275 Job because of it..
He said I cant calibrate this screen because there is something wrong with it ..
So here is the ******** Panasonic is putting me through.
I send them a bunch of pictures...
I send the Certified Calibrators Letter stating the TV is Bad ....
They send some Idiot to the house to check the problem that showed up with a Pair of Pliers and a Screwdriver ( I'm not kidding)!
HE Sent them a response that the TV is BAD
Lastly... they said they want the same Idiot that didn't have a CLUE about plasmas Pick up the TV and Take it into the shop !!
I REFUSED, I said you cant be removing these screens safely, I read numerous posts where if the screws are replaced incorrectly you will start getting cracks in the screens !
So Needless to say I'm still in a Battle to get them to either Replace the set or Refund me !
Start the process NOW because I can assure you Panasonic is going to Try to Screw you over !
I saw your pic attached. I see some banding.....it isn't as bad as you said it was. I was expecting serious blotching or severe DSE like the Samsung E8000 series had. Worse in person??
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post #12544 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by stevekelso View Post
I called them, and went back and forth for about three weeks, I am not kidding you when I say the 2 guys who showed up in a beat up truck started the conversation with me before they even walked into the room, with ( Well I have to tell you we read your service call notice and First off you should Never Have a Modern TV Calibrated it messes them up )
I am not kidding! he said that to me and it completely caught me off guard, his words almost Verbatim !
The ZT60 panel was built and designed with ISF calibration in mind. It has ISF specific menu settings and options, so a complete ISF calibration can be done without the need to go into any service menus.

The statements made by those techs are ludicrous and shows ignorance and perhaps incompetence as well. I would not want them to touch let alone take my set either.

Try going back to Panasonic with your concerns and ask for an alternate service center.
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post #12545 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by music_to_my_ear View Post
Voltages need to be adjusted.....its a simple adjustment for someone who knows how to do it. Problem is I don't think anyone knows how to do it on the ZT60
Perhaps an authorized Panasonic service technician would?
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post #12546 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by music_to_my_ear View Post
Voltages need to be adjusted.....its a simple adjustment for someone who knows how to do it. Problem is I don't think anyone knows how to do it on the ZT60
I'd say the chances of Panasonic making that adjustment are slim and none. They would much rather replace the panel than apply common sense.

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post #12547 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by music_to_my_ear View Post
Voltages need to be adjusted.....its a simple adjustment for someone who knows how to do it. Problem is I don't think anyone knows how to do it on the ZT60
What makes you think adjusting voltage will have an impact on this problem?

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post #12548 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 09:26 AM
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Picture Orientation/Banding Issue

All- Over the past month, I've noticed that the picture on my 65ZT60 does not extend completely to the bezel. The degree of the effect varies from barely noticeable to very noticeable and always occurs on one horizontal and one vertical side simultaneously. The effect switches from the right and left side randomly and basically looks like the screen has been moved to the left or right. It gives the effect of one horizontal and one vertical bezel being much wider than the opposite two. Sometimes the movement is 1/4in but lately it can be over 1/2in. It is extremely annoying. It is most noticeable during regular cable viewing but has been noticed to a smaller degree when watching netflix. I have the X1 box from comcast for regular cable viewing but routinely watch Netflix via the wireless app on the tv itself, so the feeds are different. Also, haven't noticed it much with a blu-ray. All this leads me to believe that it's the cable feed, but I wanted to poll the forum in case others have experienced this and if it is in fact a flaw in the tv. I've had the TV since January 2014 and it's an october build. Thanks!

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post #12549 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 09:28 AM
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It sounds like you have the pixel orbiter engaged.
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post #12550 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 09:30 AM
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I'm fairly certain I do. That moves the screen? It's interesting that I just started noticing it. Thank you!

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post #12551 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 09:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by repete66211 View Post
What makes you think adjusting voltage will have an impact on this problem?
voltages are being driven too high or too low on certain areas of the screen. that can make the phosphors burn irregularly. i think some Pioneer Kuros had issues like this and got resolved when some voltages got adjusted

Last edited by music_to_my_ear; 08-12-2014 at 09:34 AM.
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post #12552 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwall1313 View Post
All- Over the past month, I've noticed that the picture on my 65ZT60 does not extend completely to the bezel. The degree of the effect varies from barely noticeable to very noticeable and always occurs on one horizontal and one vertical side simultaneously. The effect switches from the right and left side randomly and basically looks like the screen has been moved to the left or right. It gives the effect of one horizontal and one vertical bezel being much wider than the opposite two. Sometimes the movement is 1/4in but lately it can be over 1/2in. It is extremely annoying. It is most noticeable during regular cable viewing but has been noticed to a smaller degree when watching netflix. I have the X1 box from comcast for regular cable viewing but routinely watch Netflix via the wireless app on the tv itself, so the feeds are different. Also, haven't noticed it much with a blu-ray. All this leads me to believe that it's the cable feed, but I wanted to poll the forum in case others have experienced this and if it is in fact a flaw in the tv. I've had the TV since January 2014 and it's an october build. Thanks!
its the source material....cable box will have channels that are broadcasted weirdly - to put it simple - some channels are wider than others, vice versa....you should only see this problem on cable tv and such...blu rays and netflix even should be consistent with the frame as in they should always fit the screen if the screen setting is set as 16:9
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post #12553 of 12770 Old 08-12-2014, 06:20 PM
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Thanks, music. That's what I thought but I'm stilled baffled by the fact it's a recent phenomenon. FWIW, I hate the X1 system and comcast in general, but that's a different thread.

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post #12554 of 12770 Old 08-13-2014, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwall1313 View Post
Thanks, music. That's what I thought but I'm stilled baffled by the fact it's a recent phenomenon. FWIW, I hate the X1 system and comcast in general, but that's a different thread.
It is just the pixel orbiter. Turn it on and off and you'll see how it fills in the extra "bezel" when it's off.
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post #12555 of 12770 Old 08-13-2014, 05:43 PM
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Can someone who uses DNices new day settings comment on what they think of it? I have been using custom from day one and really like it, but is DNices day setting brighter than custom? If so by how much? Also, how are people liking DNices new night settings? My first post in a long time. Still enjoying my 65zt60. Thanks guys.
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post #12556 of 12770 Old 08-13-2014, 06:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AVKIK View Post
Can someone who uses DNices new day settings comment on what they think of it? I have been using custom from day one and really like it, but is DNices day setting brighter than custom? If so by how much? Also, how are people liking DNices new night settings? My first post in a long time. Still enjoying my 65zt60. Thanks guys.
Night setting is wonderful!!! Several post agree!

Day is just OK but I was not a real fan of custom - it also was "just OK"

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post #12557 of 12770 Old 08-13-2014, 07:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AVKIK View Post
Can someone who uses DNices new day settings comment on what they think of it? I have been using custom from day one and really like it, but is DNices day setting brighter than custom? If so by how much? Also, how are people liking DNices new night settings? My first post in a long time. Still enjoying my 65zt60. Thanks guys.
I entered D-Nice Day in the Custom slot so I can't compare those two. Both D-Nice Day & Night look pretty good but even though it has more dithering sometimes my custom calibration looks better in most applications.

D-Nice Night has almost a warm sepia tone to it if memory serves. I'm not really a believer in Day settings, since it's often just a compromise of other picture parameters for the sake of luminescence.

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post #12558 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 06:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdogg93 View Post
It is just the pixel orbiter. Turn it on and off and you'll see how it fills in the extra "bezel" when it's off.
How do you turn pixel orbiter off. I went into the ZT menu last night and it says ON and AUTO only.

Am I looking in the right sub menu?

Thanks
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post #12559 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 07:24 AM
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My understanding is that Auto equates to Off, which makes me wonder why they did not just call it Off instead of Auto. I'm guessing there must be more to the Auto setting of which I'm not aware.
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post #12560 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grendell View Post
I also see some temporary IR when powering the set on right away. I always thought that was normal... I have to wonder if that calibrator made the correct diagnosis of air in the panel.

Wouldn't air in the panel cause higher temps? Wish I could thermograph a "known good" 65ZT60.

I have a 4 year Square Trade warranty in case I go past my October purchase date, but I know at this point it would only be a refund as apparently there are no more new ZT60's.

I suppose you could put the refund toward an AX900, but that doesn't come out until September (likely a longer wait if you order from e-tailers), and will likely cost at least $1,000 more than the ZT60 for a 65 inch.

What is the best way to contact Panasonic? I e-mailed them the link to my pictures and asked them to have a look using the form at http://shop.panasonic.com/ecom/suppo...act-us?t=email

Should I use a different path than that?

I have seen image retention just after power up as well, when I rebooted my sky box when it froze up. It rebooted to a channel that wasn't broadcasting at that time and on the plain blue screen I saw the sky logo briefly as it faded away over about a second or two. When when everything is warmed up I've never seen any image retention though.
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post #12561 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 05:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grendell View Post
The ZT60 panel was built and designed with ISF calibration in mind. It has ISF specific menu settings and options, so a complete ISF calibration can be done without the need to go into any service menus.

The statements made by those techs are ludicrous and shows ignorance and perhaps incompetence as well. I would not want them to touch let alone take my set either.

Try going back to Panasonic with your concerns and ask for an alternate service center.
grendell, any updates about your screen uniformity issues??
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post #12562 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 06:49 PM
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Extremely late to this game but Ive had this set for a few months and its been pretty sweet. I have searched everywhere and cant really find a pin point answer for the situation I have going on. I want say this is normal but I have never owned a Panasonic before and like most have had the all might Pioneer Elite 111FD for about 6 years now. Was time for an upgrade but also over the 6 years my Pioneer has developed some defects so it is hard to compare directly with a brand new display.

I have less than 300 hours on it, no calibration, plugged in DNICE settings and a few others but mostly watch in THX Cinema. I also get some pretty quick onset IR, literally I could turn on my Bolu Ray player and let it sit for 5 seconds and turn and I will see IR that lasts about 30-60 seconds. Quickly fades so its not a concern at this point thought I do read that IR can happen at any point.

The ZT60 is a magnificent display with some minor issues but very minor. Only regret I have is not getting the 65". My question is about the blacks..they are very inky and dark when there
Is 1.) light in the room 2.) when controlled lighting is at a dim setting 3.) with ambient/bias lighting. Blacks look jaw dropping in these environments.

My concern lies with the panel at night time in a completely dark room (black sheets up for now until I get curtains), not quite man cave dark but dark none the less. I would have thought with lights out blacks would be even better but they are not. They actually seem to be worse or "lighter" in a pitch black room. With blank screen playing you can easily see the panel glow.
Last night I watched Gravity for the first time, tremendous visual movie especially to test blacks in a dark room. With lights on or dimmed low the blacks looked like a black hole in space, deep inky, made the picture punch that much more.
But with lights off(all in THX cinema btw) those blacks no longer look as deep. For example there is a scene where Sandra bullock is spinning out of control still attached to the destroyed satellite and before she unbuckles the blacks around her looked incredible at night, bezel blending almost. BUT once she detached and the satellite was off the screen and she was floating further into space, those black areas especially the letterbox bars became very gray colored ashy looking almost, and no longer had the deep feeling anymore. I could make out all sides of the border for the tv. Obviously with moderate to high amounts of light on a black background blacks look deep like it is with the closeup of her spinning, then when she unbuckles you see her floating out into space which leave little light on the screen and the nice big universe that was once black looks grayish black.

I understand to get true black you need OLED or FALD sets in a pitch black room to achieve no glow. But the glow I described seem normal to you? With medium to bright images on a black background it's like they are floating in mid air.
With low or very low light and low APL scenes it's like the blacks are brighter and you can distinguish the whole set with a fully dark scene with very low to no light in it.

Is this normal? If plasmas do this then I can only imagine how bad a LCD OR LED would look next to this. If I remember when my 111 was great with no defects that it also glowed a bit but I don't remember it doing it this much. I did do a reset (completely unplugging everything and replugged it in) and seemed to do a little something to the PQ overall so maybe my voltage or boards are faulty. Its a July 2013 build, so maybe its a return but I bought it from Chris at Cleveland AV (formerly Cleveland Plasma) which was at one of his other locations (extreme electronics I think was the name in PA, Im in the New England area, so I doubt very much it was used especially with Chris being sponsored by AVS and having a stellar rep. Set was pristine looking as well. and inspected fully.

Lastly I was going to invest in some proper D6500K bias lighting but I thought the purpose (especially from reviews) of this ZT was that the blacks were so good that Bias lighting seemed like it shouldn't have to be a option. Maybe my standard is to high but some help is always appreciated.

Thank You AVS
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post #12563 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamtheonewhoknocks99 View Post
Extremely late to this game but Ive had this set for a few months and its been pretty sweet. I have searched everywhere and cant really find a pin point answer for the situation I have going on. I want say this is normal but I have never owned a Panasonic before and like most have had the all might Pioneer Elite 111FD for about 6 years now. Was time for an upgrade but also over the 6 years my Pioneer has developed some defects so it is hard to compare directly with a brand new display.

I have less than 300 hours on it, no calibration, plugged in DNICE settings and a few others but mostly watch in THX Cinema. I also get some pretty quick onset IR, literally I could turn on my Bolu Ray player and let it sit for 5 seconds and turn and I will see IR that lasts about 30-60 seconds. Quickly fades so its not a concern at this point thought I do read that IR can happen at any point.

The ZT60 is a magnificent display with some minor issues but very minor. Only regret I have is not getting the 65". My question is about the blacks..they are very inky and dark when there
Is 1.) light in the room 2.) when controlled lighting is at a dim setting 3.) with ambient/bias lighting. Blacks look jaw dropping in these environments.

My concern lies with the panel at night time in a completely dark room (black sheets up for now until I get curtains), not quite man cave dark but dark none the less. I would have thought with lights out blacks would be even better but they are not. They actually seem to be worse or "lighter" in a pitch black room. With blank screen playing you can easily see the panel glow.
Last night I watched Gravity for the first time, tremendous visual movie especially to test blacks in a dark room. With lights on or dimmed low the blacks looked like a black hole in space, deep inky, made the picture punch that much more.
But with lights off(all in THX cinema btw) those blacks no longer look as deep. For example there is a scene where Sandra bullock is spinning out of control still attached to the destroyed satellite and before she unbuckles the blacks around her looked incredible at night, bezel blending almost. BUT once she detached and the satellite was off the screen and she was floating further into space, those black areas especially the letterbox bars became very gray colored ashy looking almost, and no longer had the deep feeling anymore. I could make out all sides of the border for the tv. Obviously with moderate to high amounts of light on a black background blacks look deep like it is with the closeup of her spinning, then when she unbuckles you see her floating out into space which leave little light on the screen and the nice big universe that was once black looks grayish black.

I understand to get true black you need OLED or FALD sets in a pitch black room to achieve no glow. But the glow I described seem normal to you? With medium to bright images on a black background it's like they are floating in mid air.
With low or very low light and low APL scenes it's like the blacks are brighter and you can distinguish the whole set with a fully dark scene with very low to no light in it.

Is this normal? If plasmas do this then I can only imagine how bad a LCD OR LED would look next to this. If I remember when my 111 was great with no defects that it also glowed a bit but I don't remember it doing it this much. I did do a reset (completely unplugging everything and replugged it in) and seemed to do a little something to the PQ overall so maybe my voltage or boards are faulty. Its a July 2013 build, so maybe its a return but I bought it from Chris at Cleveland AV (formerly Cleveland Plasma) which was at one of his other locations (extreme electronics I think was the name in PA, Im in the New England area, so I doubt very much it was used especially with Chris being sponsored by AVS and having a stellar rep. Set was pristine looking as well. and inspected fully.

Lastly I was going to invest in some proper D6500K bias lighting but I thought the purpose (especially from reviews) of this ZT was that the blacks were so good that Bias lighting seemed like it shouldn't have to be a option. Maybe my standard is to high but some help is always appreciated.

Thank You AVS
Everything you've described sounds perfectly normal. Enjoy your ZT60!!
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post #12564 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 07:28 PM
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^ I agree

Try getting some poster board and a movie with the black letter box bars. Cover the movie portion of the screen and leave the black letter box exposed. Turn out the light watch the movie see if they fluctuate. Just to put your mind at ease. It's likely your pupils dialated between the dark scene and lighter scenes.
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post #12565 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 07:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamtheonewhoknocks99 View Post
I understand to get true black you need OLED or FALD sets in a pitch black room to achieve no glow.
No plasma ever sold gave zero-glow blacks in a pitch black room. Not even a kuro/kuro elite/sharp elite.

I welcome anyone to correct me on that
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post #12566 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 07:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Iamtheonewhoknocks99 View Post

With low or very low light and low APL scenes it's like the blacks are brighter and you can distinguish the whole set with a fully dark scene with very low to no light in it.

Is this normal? If plasmas do this then I can only imagine how bad a LCD OR LED would look next to this. If I remember when my 111 was great with no defects that it also glowed a bit but I don't remember it doing it this much.
Get a meter and measure the black level and get back to us.....FYI anything above 0.001 mll for a zt60 would be unusual ( so far no reports of rising black levels )

Or take a picture with a really good camera of what you see.
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post #12567 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 08:21 PM
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The perception of black is affected by ambient light. The TV isn't behaving differently, your eyes are. With light in the room they are "over exposing" what you see. In a black room the light emitted by the letterbox part of the screen is the same as it was in a brighter room, but it's relatively brighter to your retina because there's less light to compete with.

Your TV is normal. Sorry you didn't get a 65" model. Enjoy.
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post #12568 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 08:35 PM
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Originally Posted by music_to_my_ear View Post
grendell, any updates about your screen uniformity issues??
No, pretty much still the same.

No response from the Panasonic web form... phone or e-mail. Nice.

I'm just sort of "going with it" for now, hoping it doesn't get worse.

I've *never* had to call a tech for any set I've owned, so I'm kind of lost in terms of trying to find a competent one, should it come to that.
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post #12569 of 12770 Old 08-14-2014, 08:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamtheonewhoknocks99 View Post

[snip]
My concern lies with the panel at night time in a completely dark room (black sheets up for now until I get curtains), not quite man cave dark but dark none the less. I would have thought with lights out blacks would be even better but they are not. They actually seem to be worse or "lighter" in a pitch black room. With blank screen playing you can easily see the panel glow.
Last night I watched Gravity for the first time, tremendous visual movie especially to test blacks in a dark room. With lights on or dimmed low the blacks looked like a black hole in space, deep inky, made the picture punch that much more.
But with lights off(all in THX cinema btw) those blacks no longer look as deep. For example there is a scene where Sandra bullock is spinning out of control still attached to the destroyed satellite and before she unbuckles the blacks around her looked incredible at night, bezel blending almost. BUT once she detached and the satellite was off the screen and she was floating further into space, those black areas especially the letterbox bars became very gray colored ashy looking almost, and no longer had the deep feeling anymore. I could make out all sides of the border for the tv. Obviously with moderate to high amounts of light on a black background blacks look deep like it is with the closeup of her spinning, then when she unbuckles you see her floating out into space which leave little light on the screen and the nice big universe that was once black looks grayish black.

I understand to get true black you need OLED or FALD sets in a pitch black room to achieve no glow. But the glow I described seem normal to you? With medium to bright images on a black background it's like they are floating in mid air.
With low or very low light and low APL scenes it's like the blacks are brighter and you can distinguish the whole set with a fully dark scene with very low to no light in it.

Is this normal? [... snip]


Thank You AVS

Lower the Brightness setting until the gray (the dithering) goes away. Or if you are using one of the Custom, Cinema, or Pro modes, reduce the 10 IRE gamma gain until the dithering goes away. You may need to drop the gain down to less than -30 or so. (Yes, I know that IRE is analog terminology but Panasonic uses it for digital. )

Larry
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post #12570 of 12770 Old 08-15-2014, 07:58 AM
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Edit

Wow didn't expect to get so much great feedback just cause of how far gone these sets are.

Repete..It's a bedroom and 65" might have been overkill at about 6-8ft away. But yes 65" would be awesome and i believe blacks would be slightly better too.

Unfortunately Music to my Ear I can't measure the level because I do not own one. And I think that are relatively expensive and am limited in cash at the moment. Unless there's another way I won't be able to tell the level unless I get a pro or someone's nice enough to do this for me or there's a program I'm missing.

LarryInRi I have tried all different settings and none seem to do the trick. Would a board replacement do the trick say if blacks floated or if they were measuring off? Something with voltage maybe?

Thanks to all for the feed back. I love the set it's better than any LED even with the grayness in a pitch black room. The reason I asked this was because I saw a few pics in here (I know..it's pics) but they can't be too far off.
Page 6 post #s 151&156 I see NOTHING like this on my set in a blacked out room at night.
Page 6 post 157 is exactly what I see with light in the room or with dimmed environment. I do not see those super dark barely bezel noticing blacks that are in those pics I mentioned.

Everyone talks about how dark and unnoticeable the blacks are at night time. I mostly watch stuff with 96hz on. would have expected it to wash out during the day like my Elite kind of does. I dunno very weird and I don't have anyone in my area that owns one to go check out at night. And getting a tech out won't do much good..would love Chad B or Dnice to check it out but that costs 400$ lol...

I will do my best to post pics of what I'm seeing. But even last night watching the Croods via Netflix (same with BD) the letterbox looks black with bright scenes but once the sun goes down as they are stuck in the cave those blacks seem ashy black gray. If this is normal then i will just get some Bias Lighting for 65$.

Last edited by Iamtheonewhoknocks99; 08-15-2014 at 08:08 AM.
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