Official ZT60 Owners Thread - Page 460 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #13771 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by ntculenuf View Post
3779 hours and I am finally getting my TV calibrated today. Pretty excited to finally get this done. I have been using the settings from sound and vision and was pretty happy with them. My only concern (which I will talk with him more about when he arrives) is he will be calibrating the THX modes. He explained (a little as we were on the phone) about the THX processing side of things. I'm not sure how concerned I should be about not having the pixel orbiter option.


Anybody want to weigh in on this?
The THX modes do not allow access to the Pro settings any good calibrator will want to use (white balance, gamma, CMS). I'd have no objection to him calibrating the THX modes (which should not take very long at all given the limited controls available) IN ADDITION to at least one Pro mode (ideally two, a Day mode and a Night mode), but THX only? That would be unacceptable to me and I wouldn't consider it a professional calibration.

If the THX modes have any "processing benefits" at all, which I doubt, they're offset by the loss of numerous calibration controls.
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post #13772 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by fmalczewski View Post
I'm no expert, far from it, but if he's calibrating the THX modes, a good number of adjustments won't be available unless maybe he digs into the service menu, which I'm fairly sure is frowned upon for these sets (as being unnecessary). Not sure that's the right approach, or if that really qualifies as a full (or proper) calibration. Me, if I was going to be paying for a calibration, I'd sure want to get the real deal.

(That said, I recall a post or two where something similar was done, could end up being fine.)
Agreed. Why would you want to calibrate the THX mode ? You are going to end up with some inherent compromises, with the lack of pixel orbiter just one of them.

Why not just calibrate the Pro settings, and do a proper job ?

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post #13773 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by fmalczewski View Post
I'm no expert, far from it, but if he's calibrating the THX modes, a good number of adjustments won't be available unless maybe he digs into the service menu, which I'm fairly sure is frowned upon for these sets (as being unnecessary). Not sure that's the right approach, or if that really qualifies as a full (or proper) calibration. Me, if I was going to be paying for a calibration, I'd sure want to get the real deal.

(That said, I recall a post or two where something similar was done, could end up being fine.)
I would agree. I had Chad do my calibration and he used the Professional mode. He also calibrated for 3D but since I never watch 3D content, I'm not sure how to access the settings without pulling out my paperwork. I may even have a Day and Night setting as well. But I use Professional 1 for everything I watch.

Last edited by eaayoung; 06-02-2015 at 07:47 PM.
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post #13774 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by X-RaVer View Post
They also have an outlet in the UK as they told me. The items to Europe are shipped from the UK so that you don't have to pay customs charges...
However the built version of the ZT is an early one, May 2013, probably doesn't have the fan fix pre-applied, that's a risk i'm not willing to take, do not want a set that may need to be serviced in the first hours by noise generated by the fans
If I though for one minute I could buy a BNIB UK ZT for 2300 Euro from them, I'd be ordering up their entire stock and turning them over for at least 500 quid profit per set on e bay.
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post #13775 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 10:53 AM
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If I though for one minute I could buy a BNIB UK ZT for 2300 Euro from them, I'd be ordering up their entire stock and turning them over for at least 500 quid profit per set on e bay.
That would be a smart ( a profitable ) move... if everything goes well with the buying like you said
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post #13776 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by fmalczewski View Post
I'm no expert, far from it, but if he's calibrating the THX modes, a good number of adjustments won't be available unless maybe he digs into the service menu, which I'm fairly sure is frowned upon for these sets (as being unnecessary). Not sure that's the right approach, or if that really qualifies as a full (or proper) calibration. Me, if I was going to be paying for a calibration, I'd sure want to get the real deal.

(That said, I recall a post or two where something similar was done, could end up being fine.)
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Originally Posted by cockatiel View Post
The THX modes do not allow access to the Pro settings any good calibrator will want to use (white balance, gamma, CMS). I'd have no objection to him calibrating the THX modes (which should not take very long at all given the limited controls available) IN ADDITION to at least one Pro mode (ideally two, a Day mode and a Night mode), but THX only? That would be unacceptable to me and I wouldn't consider it a professional calibration.

If the THX modes have any "processing benefits" at all, which I doubt, they're offset by the loss of numerous calibration controls.
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Originally Posted by Cloverleaf View Post
Agreed. Why would you want to calibrate the THX mode ? You are going to end up with some inherent compromises, with the lack of pixel orbiter just one of them.

Why not just calibrate the Pro settings, and do a proper job ?
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Originally Posted by eaayoung View Post
I would agree. I had Chad do my calibration and he used the Professional mode. He also calibrated for 3D but since I never watch 3D content, I not sure how to access the settings without pulling out my paperwork. I may even have a Day and Night setting as well. But I use Professional 1 for everything I watch.
He did a great job the picture looks great. He did both THX modes and both look better than the sound and vision ones I was using. He did get into the service menu to make some adjustments. I felt confident with him and his knowledge he is certified both with ISF and THX, Also very familiar with the ZT60. Not only did he run through the TV he went through my OPPO settings and made adjustments if needed so that the picture and color were still adjusted correctly. Also Made sure I didn't have any processing in my reciever going on. All in all really happy, even my neighbor who didn't think the picture could get any better was impressed.
My red was higher than the other colors. My blue was lacking, grey, whites and blacks were dialed in. I had my format on "just" and he explained and showed the distortion it was causing (quite crazy actually). Watched a few scenes from a movie that I had watched yesterday on the new settings and WOW. The dark scenes and coloring look so much better.
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post #13777 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 01:31 PM
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How much time did he spend on each THX mode?
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post #13778 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 02:09 PM
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How much time did he spend on each THX mode?
Close to an hour I reckon, he was here almost 3 hours. I think that because I had everything else in the system setup for the most part saved him some time. He did explain what he usually does at most peoples places with their system and such. After he made adjustments in the main menu he would make some tweaks in the service menu and take a snapshot with his system. Kept doing this until everything lined up as it was supposed to.

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post #13779 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by ntculenuf View Post
He did a great job the picture looks great. He did both THX modes and both look better than the sound and vision ones I was using. He did get into the service menu to make some adjustments. I felt confident with him and his knowledge he is certified both with ISF and THX, Also very familiar with the ZT60. Not only did he run through the TV he went through my OPPO settings and made adjustments if needed so that the picture and color were still adjusted correctly. Also Made sure I didn't have any processing in my reciever going on. All in all really happy, even my neighbor who didn't think the picture could get any better was impressed.
My red was higher than the other colors. My blue was lacking, grey, whites and blacks were dialed in. I had my format on "just" and he explained and showed the distortion it was causing (quite crazy actually). Watched a few scenes from a movie that I had watched yesterday on the new settings and WOW. The dark scenes and coloring look so much better.
And how does the calibrated THX mode compare to the calibrated Pro mode ?

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post #13780 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 06:02 PM
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And how does the calibrated THX mode compare to the calibrated Pro mode ?
I like the THX better now, really looks good. I am actually watching an older movie (Ghost Dog) right now on standard DVD and it looks great best I have seen it look. The dark shadow detail is not blacked or washed out.

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post #13781 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 07:15 PM
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And how does the calibrated THX mode compare to the calibrated Pro mode ?
If I understand this correctly, he didn't have the Pro mode calibrated, only THX.
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post #13782 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 07:20 PM
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Originally Posted by ntculenuf View Post
I like the THX better now, really looks good. I am actually watching an older movie (Ghost Dog) right now on standard DVD and it looks great best I have seen it look. The dark shadow detail is not blacked or washed out.
Glad to see you satisfied! It sometimes takes a few days/weeks to get used to a calibrated image, but you were already using a pretty good mode (THX) with good settings, which helps since you were already in the ballpark.

Thanks for the feedback!
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post #13783 of 14665 Old 06-02-2015, 11:09 PM
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If I understand this correctly, he didn't have the Pro mode calibrated, only THX.

Which was my point.

While I'm sure the THX mode has been improved, and I'm pleased the poster likes it, how does he know if actually has the best PQ his TV is capable of ? I would put money on a properly calibrated Pro mode being an improvement on a calibrated THX mode.
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post #13784 of 14665 Old 06-03-2015, 05:14 AM
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Which was my point.

While I'm sure the THX mode has been improved, and I'm pleased the poster likes it, how does he know if actually has the best PQ his TV is capable of ? I would put money on a properly calibrated Pro mode being an improvement on a calibrated THX mode.
I agree. Calibrating THX mode is basically calibrating Pro mode without using 10-point white balance and gamma, and no CMS, so with tied hands. The simple fact that known great calibrators all end up making adjustments in 10-point/CMS is an indication that it is useful.

That being said, a good job on THX mode, using the service menu to at least get 2-point white balance right, may get some people far enough to be satisfied.
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post #13787 of 14665 Old 06-03-2015, 02:17 PM
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They also have an outlet in the UK as they told me. The items to Europe are shipped from the UK so that you don't have to pay customs charges...
However the built version of the ZT is an early one, May 2013, probably doesn't have the fan fix pre-applied, that's a risk i'm not willing to take, do not want a set that may need to be serviced in the first hours by noise generated by the fans
You're willing to risk buying a discontinued TV from an international seller at a price that's too good to be true but you aren't willing to take the chance that the fan noise won't even bother you?

In the early days some people were bothered by the fan noise and some weren't. I've been active on this thread since day one and I was never able to tell if there was variance in the unit itself or if the level of perceived noise was due to room acoustics, hearing acuity, personality, etc. Furthermore, my unit was an early build that had some minor fan noise. The fan fix only offered a minor improvement. Now I don't notice it at all.

The bigger risk here is giving thousands to a stranger who's selling a unit that's been out of production for over a year and which sells at a premium on the used market.

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post #13788 of 14665 Old 06-03-2015, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by ntculenuf View Post
He did a great job the picture looks great. He did both THX modes and both look better than the sound and vision ones I was using. He did get into the service menu to make some adjustments. I felt confident with him and his knowledge he is certified both with ISF and THX, Also very familiar with the ZT60. Not only did he run through the TV he went through my OPPO settings and made adjustments if needed so that the picture and color were still adjusted correctly. Also Made sure I didn't have any processing in my reciever going on. All in all really happy, even my neighbor who didn't think the picture could get any better was impressed.
My red was higher than the other colors. My blue was lacking, grey, whites and blacks were dialed in. I had my format on "just" and he explained and showed the distortion it was causing (quite crazy actually). Watched a few scenes from a movie that I had watched yesterday on the new settings and WOW. The dark scenes and coloring look so much better.
Any ISF calibrator should know what the Pro modes are for and how to access them. Calibrating only the THX modes is not a full and proper calibration, so I hope you didn't pay full price.
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post #13789 of 14665 Old 06-04-2015, 01:48 AM
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You're willing to risk buying a discontinued TV from an international seller at a price that's too good to be true but you aren't willing to take the chance that the fan noise won't even bother you?

In the early days some people were bothered by the fan noise and some weren't. I've been active on this thread since day one and I was never able to tell if there was variance in the unit itself or if the level of perceived noise was due to room acoustics, hearing acuity, personality, etc. Furthermore, my unit was an early build that had some minor fan noise. The fan fix only offered a minor improvement. Now I don't notice it at all.

The bigger risk here is giving thousands to a stranger who's selling a unit that's been out of production for over a year and which sells at a premium on the used market.
The "risk" itself of buying is not that high as they accept Paypal, if you know the terms and conditions of Paypal, then you know that's easy to ask for for a "refund" if there's something wrong with the deal or with the item.
However ... no, i'm not willing to take any chances with a unit without the fan fix pre-applied! I would not want Panasonic servicing the TV ever!
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post #13790 of 14665 Old 06-04-2015, 03:06 AM
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Any ISF calibrator should know what the Pro modes are for and how to access them. Calibrating only the THX modes is not a full and proper calibration, so I hope you didn't pay full price.
Full Calibration can only happen in the Professional, Custom and Cinema. Most recommend using the Pro 1 & 2.

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The "risk" itself of buying is not that high as they accept Paypal, if you know the terms and conditions of Paypal, then you know that's easy to ask for for a "refund" if there's something wrong with the deal or with the item.
However ... no, i'm not willing to take any chances with a unit without the fan fix pre-applied! I would not want Panasonic servicing the TV ever!

I Have Panel A8576, 65ZT - July 2013 build - has slight fan noisy if you really listen, friend also has ZT without "fan fix", also a "little noise".

99% of the time can't hear anything yet on thread small number of owners found the noise a total distraction and they could not fully enjoy the ZT, Possibly they have exceptional hearing?

Would Panasonic honor their one year warranty on a TV they stop making in January 2014?????
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post #13792 of 14665 Old 06-04-2015, 03:30 AM
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I Have Panel A8576, 65ZT - July 2013 build - has slight fan noisy if you really listen, friend also has ZT without "fan fix", also a "little noise".

99% of the time can't hear anything yet on thread small number of owners found the noise a total distraction and they could not fully enjoy the ZT, Possibly they have exceptional hearing?

Would Panasonic honor their one year warranty on a TV they stop making in January 2014?????
July 2013 - Already has the fan fix pre-aplied right?
My previous ZT also had the fan fix pre-aplied and i could hear the fans at low volume levels, i'm a bit sensitive to those "noises".
About the warranty... An item has warranty since the date it's sold , even if it's already discontinued... however, only electronics will have warranty since the ZT panels are no longer produced, that has obvious no chance of being replaced :|
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post #13793 of 14665 Old 06-04-2015, 03:43 AM
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July 2013 - Already has the fan fix pre-aplied right?
My previous ZT also had the fan fix pre-aplied and i could hear the fans at low volume levels, i'm a bit sensitive to those "noises".
About the warranty... An item has warranty since the date it's sold , even if it's already discontinued... however, only electronics will have warranty since the ZT panels are no longer produced, that has obvious no chance of being replaced :|
No fan fix - most say the "fix' started in August 2013? Agree about the warranty but must ask "when is the cut-off point, 1 year, 2year, 5years??"

And if NIB would warranty apply if it is sold with 10,000 hours on the panel? Don't know but would want something in writing from Panasonic before I bought an 18 month out of production TV.

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No fan fix - most say the "fix' started in August 2013? Agree about the warranty but must ask "when is the cut-off point, 1 year, 2year, 5years??"

And if NIB would warranty apply if it is sold with 10,000 hours on the panel? Don't know but would want something in writing from Panasonic before I bought an 18 month out of production TV.
Well, in Europe, the Law states that the Manufacturer is responsible for giving support and suplying parts to the product up to 10 Years after the same has been put on the market.
About the hours ... that's really something i doubt the store would answer to or even Panasonic. But for NIB it should be a unit with ZERO hours
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As I recall (and I've been wrong before) the fan fix factory installation was implemented in mid-August. And as was stated, many weren't bothered by the non-fixed units. Installation of the fix is really easy to do. I'd be more concerned that the fix kit isn't even being supplied by Panasonic anymore. Not that you couldn't do it yourself of course but, again, in my experience (and according to my dB meter) the fix didn't do much of anything to begin with. Regardless, it's a matter of personal preference. If you were sensitive to the noise before you'd be sensitive to it now too. Probably best just to find something else at this point. The Samsung 9500 is a pretty nice TV as far as LEDs go and LG's 65" OLED shows promise.
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Well, in Europe, the Law states that the Manufacturer is responsible for giving support and suplying parts to the product up to 10 Years after the same has been put on the market.
About the hours ... that's really something i doubt the store would answer to or even Panasonic. But for NIB it should be a unit with ZERO hours
Interesting - don't know what it is on this side of the pond - heard 3 to 5 years for parts but not sure.

Here "NIB" (not in box) usually/ frequently means it was a display model and may have several thousands hours on the panel - usually it also means it will have some IR.
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Originally Posted by bob brennan View Post
Interesting - don't know what it is on this side of the pond - heard 3 to 5 years for partsbut not sure.

Here "NIB" (not in box) usually/ frequently means it was a display model and may have several thousands hours on the panel - usually it also means it will have some IR.

NIB means "NEW IN BOX", a brand new product.

I was so happy without HDR...
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post #13798 of 14665 Old 06-04-2015, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by X-RaVer View Post
Well, in Europe, the Law states that the Manufacturer is responsible for giving support and suplying parts to the product up to 10 Years after the same has been put on the market.
About the hours ... that's really something i doubt the store would answer to or even Panasonic. But for NIB it should be a unit with ZERO hours
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Originally Posted by slimoli View Post
NIB means "NEW IN BOX", a brand new product.
Hey live and learn - thought I saw folks refer to the floor models as not in box - I would think if you found a new ZT you would get the Panasonic warranty. In the US it is just about impossible to find a new ZT - what I was referencing is that the few ZT's available are nearly always floor/display models with many hours on the panel & IR so I don't know if the panasonic warranty would apply - would be interesting if anyone knows?
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post #13799 of 14665 Old 06-04-2015, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by bob brennan View Post
Interesting - don't know what it is on this side of the pond - heard 3 to 5 years for parts but not sure.

Here "NIB" (not in box) usually/ frequently means it was a display model and may have several thousands hours on the panel - usually it also means it will have some IR.
To me NIB refers to "New In Box" or BNIB "Brand New In Box"
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post #13800 of 14665 Old 06-04-2015, 08:57 AM
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As I recall (and I've been wrong before) the fan fix factory installation was implemented in mid-August. Regardless, many weren't bothered by the non-fixed units. Installation of the fix is really easy to do. I'd be more concerned that the fix kit isn't even being supplied by Panasonic anymore. Not that you couldn't do it yourself of course but, again, in my experience (and according to my dB meter) the fix didn't do much of anything to begin with. Regardless, it's a matter of personal preference. If you were sensitive to the noise before you'd be sensitive to it now too. Probably best just to find something else at this point. The Samsung 9500 is a pretty nice TV as far as LEDs go and LG's 65" OLED shows promise.
I already have an LCD TV for the moment , Panasonic 65AX900 ... i'm just missing the ZT regarding it's uniformity, otherwise the AX900 is really GOOD
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