Official Samsung PNxxF8500 Owners Thread (No Street Price Talk) - Page 361 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #10801 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by merccrazy View Post
It's pulling the hot air out. My thinking is a negative pressure is better for dust.
One fan in the right place is perfect.
See Official Samsung PNxxF8500 Owners Thread (No Street Price Talk)

If you are worried about dust, cover the intakes with foam. I use Frost King F1524 (15 x 24 x .25" sheets. The foam can be either cleaned or replaced as needed.

DO NOT cut any holes in the back cover!
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post #10802 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post
Excessive heat over a prolonged duration usually does degrade delicate electronics. There has just started to be more than a few reports of burned out boards resulting in 8500 failure....I think we will see more as time goes on. I believe, as a few others have already expressed, that Samsung, along with other AV companies no longer build tv's that last 10-15 years. They want you to buy a new tv every few years to increase their sales/profits. It's working too....everyone speaks highly of the 8500 with regards to picture....but I bet 10 years from now, we will be saying not only did the 8500 have a short production span, it also had a shortened life span.
It will be interesting to see how it plays out. If you think about it the F8500's 'bright panel' design was in it's first model year and they never really had a chance to work the kinks out. So while you can use the reliability of their other sets as a baseline it might work out quite a bit different in practice. Either way I guess it is what it is unless we all start hand making out own TVs.
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post #10803 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 02:25 PM
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Hey guys,

I have a 60" F8500 on hold at the moment (last one in the city!) and will likely be picking it up tonight.

I wanted to get your opinions on whether or not I should purchase IPR/extended warranty.

My initial thoughts are to skip out on the warranty simply because if an issue does occur down the road, they wouldn't be able to give me a new one anyways.

If it makes any difference, the TV itself will be $1700 and the IPR/warranty prices are $300, $400, $500.
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post #10804 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Kg810 View Post
Hey guys,

I have a 60" F8500 on hold at the moment (last one in the city!) and will likely be picking it up tonight.

I wanted to get your opinions on whether or not I should purchase IPR/extended warranty.

My initial thoughts are to skip out on the warranty simply because if an issue does occur down the road, they wouldn't be able to give me a new one anyways.

If it makes any difference, the TV itself will be $1700 and the IPR/warranty prices are $300, $400, $500.
I would skip it. Or a lot of folks mention SquareTrade. They certainly seem cheaper.
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post #10805 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by asere View Post
Is it necessary to install cooling fans on the F8500? I notice it gets hot but I don't know if that shortens the tv life or not.
Necessary? That depends on your personal definition of the term, as well as the conditions the set is subjected to (ambient temperatures, available airflow, continuous runtimes etc.). Simple fact is, electronic components tend to last longer if they don't get too hot, so keeping things cooler so they never get more than warm (the individual components, not merely the exterior of the equipment) potentially increases their MTBF.

How long the resultant potential lifespan increases due to added cooling will depend on how well the original equipment was designed to keep its components within optimal temperature ranges vs how much cooling the add-on setup provides. Personally, for a set that cost me almost $3k, 2-3% of that cost in added ventilation seems like cheap insurance to me.

I also have an Onkyo 5008. Had a small vent fan on it from the 2nd week after buying it. Had a heat related component failure ~18 months in (see the threads for HDMI board failure in the Onkyo xx07, xx08 and xx09 series). Got it fixed and put bigger, higher CFM fans on it and luckily, haven't had any further problems over the past 2+ years. Other folks haven't been so lucky, with their units being sent in for repair numerous times for the same failure reoccurring several months after the last repair.

Are the larger vent fans on the 5008 the reason mine has been problem free since the repair? I can't say for sure, but what I CAN say for sure is that the unit has a hidden menu that pulls up an internal temperature sensor. The vent fans I have on the unit now keep the internal temp sensor about 20 celsius lower than with the smaller fan I had before and up to 30c cooler than without any fans at all (the internal temp sensor reads in celsius only). At $30-$35 for the fans + controller, it was cheap insurance for another $2k+ piece of equipment.


Max
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post #10806 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 02:31 PM
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Originally Posted by DanF8500 View Post
No electronic cooling fans I'm aware of installed by the factory "ever" blow air inside the electronics....they're always blowing hot air out.
I agree with you. However being a computer builder and overclocker air cooling can be tricky. Manufacturers that include fans in their products typically plot the air flow. For example fans on top exhaust out and cooler air passively enters the bottom. However on the back panel of my tv there are a lot of vents, who's to say the fans aren't just blowing out the air that's coming in from the adjacent vent. Which is why I was asking if the fans are actually working in that configuration or if it would be better to cut proper holes for the fans directly over the boards.
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post #10807 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 02:35 PM
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I would skip it. Or a lot of folks mention SquareTrade. They certainly seem cheaper.
Thanks for the quick response.

I'll definitely do some reading on SquareTrade.
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post #10808 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
So long as we're talking about filters, does anyone have a source for reticulated foam sheets to make our own? Also, does anyone know the density spec for proper dust filtration?
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Originally Posted by WantsNWarrants View Post
One fan in the right place is perfect.
See Official Samsung PNxxF8500 Owners Thread (No Street Price Talk)

If you are worried about dust, cover the intakes with foam. I use Frost King F1524 (15 x 24 x .25" sheets. The foam can be either cleaned or replaced as needed.

DO NOT cut any holes in the back cover!
One important thing to consider, ESPECIALLY if you are ONLY using fans for hot air extraction, vs blowers that blow air INTO the equipment:
adding foam or any other form of air filtration over the vent holes will severely restrict the airflow into and through the equipment. Using foam or pleated fiber or any other kind of filters over the intake vent holes while ONLY using heat extraction fans can potentially cause increased heat in components vs without any add-ons at all.

Using a blower that blows filtered air INTO the equipment guarantees that you're generating positive pressure and airflow. Doing it the other way round with filters on air vents and heat extraction fans only does NOT guarantee increased airflow and can very well result in less.


Max
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post #10809 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 02:55 PM
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What's everybody's thoughts on screen uniformity? I've got about 1400 hours on mine and checked it yesterday. Looks OK but I wouldnt say uniformity is perfect. Some areas on screen aren't as uniform as others. I tested using solid black and solid white screen. Slightly blotchy in areas... On black screen appears slightly hazy on far right and left edges of screen and a corner or two. How does this compare to yours? I'm viewing in dark room.
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post #10810 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 02:55 PM
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We as many holes as this thing has in the back I'm not convinced that you will manage air pressure all that well without major modifications. Prior to that point it would probably be just as good to have a room fan blowing on the back of it....
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post #10811 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post
One important thing to consider, ESPECIALLY if you are ONLY using fans for hot air extraction, vs blowers that blow air INTO the equipment:
adding foam or any other form of air filtration over the vent holes will severely restrict the airflow into and through the equipment. Using foam or pleated fiber or any other kind of filters over the intake vent holes while ONLY using heat extraction fans can potentially cause increased heat in components vs without any add-ons at all.

Using a blower that blows filtered air INTO the equipment guarantees that you're generating positive pressure and airflow. Doing it the other way round with filters on air vents and heat extraction fans only does NOT guarantee increased airflow and can very well result in less.


Max
true
I believe the best solution is to remove the back cover and cut 2 holes directly over the heat sinks for the x and y boards and then mount filtered intake fans on the outside of the cover
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post #10812 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 03:03 PM
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Hey guys,

I have a 60" F8500 on hold at the moment (last one in the city!) and will likely be picking it up tonight.
Which city is this?
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post #10813 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 03:20 PM
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I have the 64F8500 and the operating temp after 2 to 3+ hours of viewing is 44c. The display is not wall mounted (12" from wall), have good airflow in room (ceiling fans) with ambient room temp from 74f to 76f.

I've read that 40c is the high water mark for this display so I'm a little concerned, or is this somewhat normal due the brightness of this model. Should I install fan(s) on the back panel or could it be that my display is defective?
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post #10814 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by hove131 View Post
What's everybody's thoughts on screen uniformity? I've got about 1400 hours on mine and checked it yesterday. Looks OK but I wouldnt say uniformity is perfect. Some areas on screen aren't as uniform as others. I tested using solid black and solid white screen. Slightly blotchy in areas... On black screen appears slightly hazy on far right and left edges of screen and a corner or two. How does this compare to yours? I'm viewing in dark room.
I have had my tv for a year now. The far left side of screen is not as dark as rest of screen on a totally black screen. (Only about 1 inch of the left side) Never notice when watching any programming, even in dark scenes. My guess is the BO does not kick in uniformly on a a blank screen. Again, no issues watching movies, tv, etc, as BO seems to work correctly and blacks are uniform.
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Last edited by wxman; 01-28-2015 at 03:36 PM.
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post #10815 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by fiddler11 View Post
I believe the best solution is to remove the back cover and cut 2 holes directly over the heat sinks for the x and y boards and then mount filtered intake fans on the outside of the cover
I considered many options before installing my fans. My design goals were 1) to remove the heat by the shortest path 2) not change the air flow pattern of the original design and 3) create a silent solution. The air flow cools not only the electronics but the back of the display screen. These goals lead me to the number and placement of my fans and achieved all three goals. Forcing air into new openings will have unpredictable results and could create new hot spots.
Forcing air in as suggested will definitely change the convection flow of the entire unit. Blocking convection below the fans.

Last edited by JRWalker; 01-28-2015 at 03:38 PM.
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post #10816 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 03:55 PM
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I considered many options before installing my fans. My design goals were 1) to remove the heat by the shortest path 2) not change the air flow pattern of the original design and 3) create a silent solution. The air flow cools not only the electronics but the back of the display screen. These goals lead me to the number and placement of my fans and achieved all three goals. Forcing air into new openings will have unpredictable results and could create new hot spots. Forcing air in as suggested will definitely change the convection flow of the entire unit. Blocking convection below the fans.
OK first I live in northern Alberta and I keep my place at around 19-21deg Celsius year round. After 18 months of use my y board died. The tv is on a bench and the back is at least 12" from the wall. Obviously samsung didn't put any thought at all in to the cooling of this set. When cooling computer parts you want air blowing on heat sinks. It apears the cooling scheme was to use the back cover as a heat sink. You may be correct that it may create additional hot spots which is common with positive preasure systems I guess the only way to find out is to dig out the Dremel and find out. Wish me luck
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post #10817 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 04:24 PM
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Originally Posted by hove131 View Post
What's everybody's thoughts on screen uniformity? I've got about 1400 hours on mine and checked it yesterday. Looks OK but I wouldnt say uniformity is perfect. Some areas on screen aren't as uniform as others. I tested using solid black and solid white screen. Slightly blotchy in areas... On black screen appears slightly hazy on far right and left edges of screen and a corner or two. How does this compare to yours? I'm viewing in dark room.
I've had a number of these sets in my home. I think the perfect uniformity mentioned in reviews is rare enough to be near total BS. I'm not saying reviewers are lying but based upon my experience Samsung must have hand picked those review copies. Which is to say your set is probably pretty normal for a F8500. I won't worry too much about it.
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post #10818 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 04:28 PM
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Having a hard time playing surround sound with Roku 3, Netflix and PN60F8500.

Here is the setup I have:

HDMI cable to HDMI ARC on my Samsung PN60F8500

then from the TV to Vizio 5.1 soundbar thru Optical TOSLINK

If I go to Roku 3 Audio Settings, I don't see the Surround option but rather DD, DD+, DD+ DTS.

Any of those options give me the 5.1 surround option in Netflix, but no sound comes out.

Any ideas?
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post #10819 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 04:43 PM
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Originally Posted by blue2007 View Post
Having a hard time playing surround sound with Roku 3, Netflix and PN60F8500.

Here is the setup I have:

HDMI cable to HDMI ARC on my Samsung PN60F8500

then from the TV to Vizio 5.1 soundbar thru Optical TOSLINK

If I go to Roku 3 Audio Settings, I don't see the Surround option but rather DD, DD+, DD+ DTS.

Any of those options give me the 5.1 surround option in Netflix, but no sound comes out.

Any ideas?
You won't get 5.1 using optical from tv to soundbar. Only PCM. Set Netflix to stereo instead of 5.1. Set your Roku to stereo if that doesn't work.

Last edited by wxman; 01-28-2015 at 04:49 PM.
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post #10820 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 04:47 PM
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@fiddler11 Of course I wish you luck. But, my advice is to make a plan and sleep on it before your get out the Dremel. Remember that doing nothing is always an option. This project could become like shortening the legs on a wobbly chair.
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post #10821 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 05:03 PM
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@fiddler11 Of course I wish you luck. But, my advice is to make a plan and sleep on it before your get out the Dremel. Remember that doing nothing is always an option. This project could become like shortening the legs on a wobbly chair.
It's good advice. On the way home from work i was thinking about it and I have already changed my mind. My previous solution only covers the x and y boards and knowing my luck i will end up creating a hot spot near the main board or the psu and there is still the x and y buffers which are located at the edge of the panel. Edges and corners are notorious places for hot spots. I am now considering taping/blocking off all the vents and installing an intake fan in each of the bottom corners and an exhaust in each of the top corners. May even be able to utilize existing vents. Meh, 2 weeks delivery on the Ebay fans i ordered anyway.
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post #10822 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 05:13 PM
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@fiddler11 Fan failure or loss of power to the fan(s) is always possible and could become catastrophic if convection cooling is blocked.
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post #10823 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 05:18 PM
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I have had my tv for a year now. The far left side of screen is not as dark as rest of screen on a totally black screen. (Only about 1 inch of the left side) Never notice when watching any programming, even in dark scenes. My guess is the BO does not kick in uniformly on a a blank screen. Again, no issues watching movies, tv, etc, as BO seems to work correctly and blacks are uniform.
I think you nailed it, the uniformity on my PN51F8500 appears near perfect when watching content - even when there are instances of a mono background. Perhaps I'm not sensitive to picking up on unevenness but I sure notice it on LCD panels.

I'm sure if I ran some test pattern screens I would detect some unevenness. I'm guessing most reviewers when they opined the F8500 has perfect uniformity have less of a threshold than some AVS members.

Samsung PN51F8500
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post #10824 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 05:37 PM
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I think you nailed it, the uniformity on my PN51F8500 appears near perfect when watching content - even when there are instances of a mono background. Perhaps I'm not sensitive to picking up on unevenness but I sure notice it on LCD panels.

I'm sure if I ran some test pattern screens I would detect some unevenness. I'm guessing most reviewers when they opined the F8500 has perfect uniformity have less of a threshold than some AVS members.
I also notice it really easily on LCD panels. I had a 70 inch Sharp LCD and the clouding and uniformity was horrible compared to the F8500.
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post #10825 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 06:17 PM
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I'm guessing most reviewers when they opined the F8500 has perfect uniformity have less of a threshold than some AVS members.
That would be a bit disappointing considering the weight their opinions carry with consumers. But I have noticed some of them moving away from loaded words like 'perfect'.
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post #10826 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 06:27 PM
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So the only option is to get a sounder with HDMI input? Trying to figure out what options I have. Can the TV decoded DD+ to DD and then pass it thru optical?

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You won't get 5.1 using optical from tv to soundbar. Only PCM. Set Netflix to stereo instead of 5.1. Set your Roku to stereo if that doesn't work.
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post #10827 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 08:22 PM
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So the only option is to get a sounder with HDMI input? Trying to figure out what options I have. Can the TV decoded DD+ to DD and then pass it thru optical?
You are limited to PCM or DTS Neo with optical. Under the sound setting on the tv, you can go to Digital Audio Out and select one or the other when connected via Optical. The only time optical will send a 5.1 signal is through OTA channels. DTS Neo does sound better.
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post #10828 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 08:28 PM
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Thanks for the quick response.

I'll definitely do some reading on SquareTrade.


Even better, get it through Costco.

You don't need to have bought it from Costco.

Assuming you bought from any authorized retailer, with a credit card that doubles warranty, then you'll end up with this (for less than most 3 year warranties)-

Year 1- Samsung warranty
Year 2- Credit card warranty
Years 3,4, and 5- Square Trade warranty.


I think it was like $99 on my 64" 8500 and like $60 on my 51" 8500.
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post #10829 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 10:32 PM
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Hello,

I just bought the PN51F8500 TV and started using it, but I'm having a few problems with the TV. So I'd like to hear the experiences of other owners on these issues. I don't know if the TV is faulty or if there is a way to fix them. Samsung support has not been very helpful, and I only have until Saturday to return the TV if needed. So any help will be very appreciated.

The first thing is that whenever I enable Game Mode to use the ps4, the image looks grainy (like a noisy image). If I turn off Game Mode the image looks fine. I tried reducing the Sharpness but it doesn't help much. It's noticeable in games when there are bright scenes, and it's extremely evident on Netflix series such as Breaking Bad (via ps4).

The second thing is that I have read that renaming HDMI input to "PC" and using "Screen Fit'' reduces lag and avoids screen tearing when gaming. However, when I rename the input to "PC," "Screen Fit" becomes disabled. Is this supposed to happen? It seems that everyone suggests having both options enabled, but I can't have them at the same time. Also, PC deteriorates the picture quality really bad, it looks washed out.

Finally, the volume from SmartHub's apps is really low and the voices are kind of muffled. When watching Netflix I have to crank up the volume to 30 in order to more or less hear. When watching movies through Amazon, voices are very low compared to background sound (e.g. Inception). I've tried "Clear Sound" and other options but they don't change much.

Again, any advice/suggestions will be very helpful.
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post #10830 of 11230 Old 01-28-2015, 10:39 PM
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Everything you stated is normal. When in game node mode its very grainy... Game mode turns off all processing. Netflix is same for me too...usually I use volume 12 when viewing TV... On Netflix I use 20
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