I want a 42-inch 1080p Plasma - Where can I find one? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 20 Old 11-20-2013, 08:49 PM - Thread Starter
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I am hooked on Plasma ever since I bought a 55" Panasonic ST60 for my Living Room. I had no idea what great quality TV/Movies I was missing.
Of course having Chad 'drop by' and calibrate it was the absolute BEST idea!

Now, I really want to replace a 40-inch LED Samsung in my bedroom with a nice 42-inch Plasma. 42-inch is really the only answer, as this room is way too small for anything larger (and the wife is adamant about how much space I can takeover). Viewing distance is only about 8-feet, so yes I WILL notice the difference from 720p.
BUT, it seems that is IMPOSSIBLE to procure these in the US! At least it's impossible to find a 42-inch 1080p Plasma.
Both Panasonic and LG make these things. I've found the Panasonic S60 series in 42-inch 1080p is available overseas...but nowhere to be found in the US!
Why?
If anyone has any idea about where I might find such a rare bird, I would be forever in your debt.
I'm hooked on Plasma...help me with my addiction.wink.gif

TANSTAAFL!
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post #2 of 20 Old 11-20-2013, 10:00 PM
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http://pds27.egloos.com/pmf/201305/19/45/b0066645_5198bd457806a.jpg

Yeah, they were easy to find back then but it looks like they've run dry. (Note that the 42 inch one is more expenive than the 50 inch one lol)

Still, don't dismiss 720p plasmas. I had an LG one and detail wise, they were very close to the Panasonic S64 I own now. Could I tell the resolution difference between the two? Yes. Did I care? No. Plasmas are very lenient on downscaling.
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post #3 of 20 Old 11-20-2013, 11:38 PM
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You must have eagle eyes if you can clearly see the difference between 720p/1080p at 8ft. Hell my 60 inch is in my bedroom about 8 feet away from the dge of my bed. 42" 720p plasma is fine.

I'm owned various sinzes of 720p and 1080p sets. Unless you're sitting like 6 feet from your TV, 1080p is completely unnecessary from so far away.
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post #4 of 20 Old 11-21-2013, 04:37 AM
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http://www.searsoutlet.com/42-Class-1080p-600Hz-Plasma-Smart-HDTV-TC-P42S60/d/product_details.jsp?pid=112871&mode=seeAll

It's going to be nearly impossible to find a 42"1080 panel since they only made then for a few months this year.

You could still get an X60 720p.

The screen door effect is pretty bad to my eyes at your 8' distance but I thought the other aspects are good.
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post #5 of 20 Old 11-21-2013, 07:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raven Crimson View Post

You must have eagle eyes if you can clearly see the difference between 720p/1080p at 8ft. Hell my 60 inch is in my bedroom about 8 feet away from the dge of my bed. 42" 720p plasma is fine. I'm owned various sizes of 720p and 1080p sets. Unless you're sitting like 6 feet from your TV, 1080p is completely unnecessary from so far away.

Apparently your vision isn't as acute as some other people's vision. One doesn't have to have eagle eyes to see the Screen Door Effect on a 42" PX50U 720p Plasma at 8 feet - that's exactly the setup we have in the den and i see the SDE clearly, and when that TV was in my man-room i could see it even at 10 feet. When i had my 42" 1080p PZ700U in my man-room and in the den it was a profound improvement - no SDE at all. In the various 720p vs 1080p threads some years back there were tons of people that could clearly see SDE at 10 feet and tons of em that could not. I did the SDE test at home with several friends and family members and roughly half of them could detect the SDE at 8 feet, and only a few could detect it at 10 feet.

SDE was the sole reason why i cancelled an order for a 720p Pioneer Kuro 4280HD and chose the 42PZ700U instead. I hate SDE wink.gif



@ the OP:

If you really want a 42" 1080p Plasma and cannot find a leftover 42S60 anywhere (they were discontinued back around May) then maybe consider buying a used Panny off Craigslist. The 2008 42PZ80U and PZ85U were very good and pretty much issue-free, then there's the 2009 42S1 and 42G10 (which had the rising black issue but otherwise are good), 2011 42G25 and 42GT25, and the 2012 42ST30 was pretty good too. The 2007 42PZ700U that i have is way dimmer than all the models above so i don't recommend it (wife won't let me put it in her den because it's so dim, so it's in a bedroom instead).

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post #6 of 20 Old 11-21-2013, 01:32 PM - Thread Starter
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I really appreciate everyone who has 'weighed in' on this!

Yes, even the "you can't possibly see the difference" folks. I understand the point you're making and I do understand the physical limitations. I am an Aeronautics Engineer and understand the science pretty well.

But I AM an engineer, so I am overly picky anyway, plus the downscaling artifacts from high quality source material, of which I own a lot, is obvious to me.
I should have said that I did actually try a 720p plasma, but the SDE drove me nuts so I returned it.
Picture quality was still a step or two above an LCD/LED though.

I appreciate the suggestion to try Craigslist. I have given that a look and unfortunately nothing popped up in my area. I'm a bit leery of that 'service' frankly and would only trust a local seller.

I really don't understand why there isn't a market here. This will be my fourth TV for the house and I could see replacing one other 'small room' LED with this size/model of plasma.
If anyone sees some old stock still out there somewhere, please let me know.
I'll keep looking. Gotta have more plasma!

TANSTAAFL!
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post #7 of 20 Old 11-21-2013, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THEGM View Post


I really don't understand why there isn't a market here. This will be my fourth TV for the house and I could see replacing one other 'small room' LED with this size/model of plasma.
If anyone sees some old stock still out there somewhere, please let me know.
I'll keep looking. Gotta have more plasma!

The plasma market is sadly dying out, Panasonic is leaving and they're the only ones who did a 42" 1080p Plasma in the past (or else I think). The 50" is still available but that's up to you to decide if you can fit it or not.

If you can find a 42" S60 go for that. Haven't seen any pop up on eBay in the past few months..

Sears might have one on clearance but it's very unlikely, someone posted the link earlier. Most of those were display models.
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post #8 of 20 Old 11-21-2013, 02:13 PM
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I love my 42" PZ80. They have very high reliability, with only a few minor issues. G10, G20, etc onwards have lots of reliability issues for 42 inch sets.
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post #9 of 20 Old 11-22-2013, 01:03 AM
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I have better than 20/20 vision (Lasik), and my vision is quite acute, from pixels, to seeing a difference between pentile and rgb displays, whenever motion reoslution isn't maxed out, 96hz flickering, framerate dipping below 60fps, etc. I'm sure those complaining about SDE are getting closer to the TV to see it. If you put a 42" 720p and 1080p side by side from 8 feet, I'm fairly certain this SDE is just you trying to justify getting 1080p. It's only going to be noticeable when looking at small text, not normal viewing content.

Basically the same as people swearing they can see a huge difference between 4k and 1080p from a logical viewing distance. Get close enough, and the brain will start telling you that 4k is sooo much better, when in reality, you sit too far to gain any real world benefit.

Anyways, enjoy the hunt for discontinued, small 1080p plasmas.
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post #10 of 20 Old 11-22-2013, 08:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THEGM View Post

I am hooked on Plasma ever since I bought a 55" Panasonic ST60 for my Living Room. I had no idea what great quality TV/Movies I was missing.
Of course having Chad 'drop by' and calibrate it was the absolute BEST idea!

Now, I really want to replace a 40-inch LED Samsung in my bedroom with a nice 42-inch Plasma. 42-inch is really the only answer, as this room is way too small for anything larger (and the wife is adamant about how much space I can takeover). Viewing distance is only about 8-feet, so yes I WILL notice the difference from 720p.
BUT, it seems that is IMPOSSIBLE to procure these in the US! At least it's impossible to find a 42-inch 1080p Plasma.
Both Panasonic and LG make these things. I've found the Panasonic S60 series in 42-inch 1080p is available overseas...but nowhere to be found in the US!
Why?
If anyone has any idea about where I might find such a rare bird, I would be forever in your debt.
I'm hooked on Plasma...help me with my addiction.wink.gif

Try Sears Outlet. They have many, may be reconditioned, but price is right.

http://www.searsoutlet.com/d/thematic_page.jsp?pgNm=42-inch-tv
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post #11 of 20 Old 11-22-2013, 08:20 AM
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lol biggrin.gif
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post #12 of 20 Old 11-22-2013, 10:04 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colonel7 View Post

Try Sears Outlet. They have many, may be reconditioned, but price is right.

http://www.searsoutlet.com/d/thematic_page.jsp?pgNm=42-inch-tv

Yeah, thanks I had indeed just found the Sears Outlet listings in my searches. They do have several, but I found out that they are all floor models at individual stores. Which I'm ok with, prices were quite good ($300-400 US).
When I called several of the stores listed, they did have one P42S60 on the floor. Unfortunately, they refuse to ship these. They are for in-store purchase only! That's unfortunate. None of the Sears in my state had any of these, so I'm out of luck there.
I'll keep lookin'. They have to be out there somewhere.
Cheers!

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post #13 of 20 Old 11-24-2013, 03:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOF View Post

http://pds27.egloos.com/pmf/201305/19/45/b0066645_5198bd457806a.jpg

Yeah, they were easy to find back then but it looks like they've run dry. (Note that the 42 inch one is more expenive than the 50 inch one lol)

Still, don't dismiss 720p plasmas. I had an LG one and detail wise, they were very close to the Panasonic S64 I own now. Could I tell the resolution difference between the two? Yes. Did I care? No. Plasmas are very lenient on downscaling.


KOF: Do you believe 720p content would look worse on a 1080p Plasma than on 720 plasma due to 720p content been stretched  to 1080p? 

 

Thanks!!

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post #14 of 20 Old 11-24-2013, 03:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raven Crimson View Post



You must have eagle eyes if you can clearly see the difference between 720p/1080p at 8ft. Hell my 60 inch is in my bedroom about 8 feet away from the dge of my bed. 42" 720p plasma is fine.

I'm owned various sinzes of 720p and 1080p sets. Unless you're sitting like 6 feet from your TV, 1080p is completely unnecessary from so far away.

 

Raven, do you know if for gaming related usages a 42" Plasma 1080p would be better than a 720p Plasma at 9 feet away, not sure if I would notice the difference or not. Gaming would be at 1080p natively.

 

Also do you believe that 720p content would look  worse on a 1080p 42" Plasma vs a 42" 720p plasma, due that 720p content would need to be stretched to 1080p native resolution?

 

Thanks!

 

Thanks!

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post #15 of 20 Old 11-24-2013, 04:53 PM
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You can input a 1080 signal into a 720 panel, it would just rescale the image to full screen and it would be 60hz. With gaming you get either 30 or 60fps from a console that's outputting 1080p. So certain titles may look good while others not so good.

720p content should look much better on a 1080 tv. The 720p tv has 1024x768 (786,432 pixels) vs 1920x1080(2,073,600 pixels) so approx 3 times the density. A 720p signal is 1280x720 so that would be downscaled on the horizontal axis and slightly unscaled on the vertical axis.
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post #16 of 20 Old 11-24-2013, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted by whipit View Post

You can input a 1080 signal into a 720 panel, it would just rescale the image to full screen and it would be 60hz. With gaming you get either 30 or 60fps from a console that's outputting 1080p. So certain titles may look good while others not so good.

720p content should look much better on a 1080 tv. The 720p tv has 1024x768 (786,432 pixels) vs 1920x1080(2,073,600 pixels) so approx 3 times the density. A 720p signal is 1280x720 so that would be downscaled on the horizontal axis and slightly unscaled on the vertical axis.

 

Thanks whipit, but 720p content on a 1080p tv should be upscaled not downscaled right?  A 1080p TV has better resolution but if you throw a a 720p picture, the 1080p content is simply not there, right?

 

Thanks!

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post #17 of 20 Old 11-24-2013, 05:29 PM
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Correct on both. 720 content should fill the whole screen on a 1080 panel. On a 1080 PC screen 720p will show up as a window then you just stretch the window to "upscale" it to full screen. The tv calculates how to upscale it to fill all pixels. If I set my DVR to 720p or 1080i it will look almost the same. Slight edge towards 1080 with still images and maybe better at 720 with fast movement.
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post #18 of 20 Old 11-24-2013, 05:30 PM
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I am currently using the Panasonic S64 (1080p), and my previous plasma was an LG 720p TV, so I can give you a comparison. For 720p gaming contents, yes, it would be best to use true 720p display to minimize scaling. However, today's 720p displays are not. They have lower horizontal resolution. (1024x768 instead of 1366x768) For movies, this is not a big deal, but for games, the loss of detail coming from lower than native resolution was painfully obvious. Yes, I don't like upscaling, but lower resolution blown up in widescreen aspect ratio didn't look too good either. Still, I would have to say the LG plasma handled 360 games better, but only barely. Wii games looked FAR better on a nerfed 720 plasmas though, since Wii supports anamorphic aspect ratio, blowing up a 4:3 resolution on 16:9 display is a perfect match for Wii.

If you want a perfect plasma for Xbox 360 and PS3, a 720p Pioneer Kuro still reigns supreme, not because of black levels, but because it can handle true 720p resolution.
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post #19 of 20 Old 11-24-2013, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KOF View Post

I am currently using the Panasonic S64 (1080p), and my previous plasma was an LG 720p TV, so I can give you a comparison. For 720p gaming contents, yes, it would be best to use true 720p display to minimize scaling. However, today's 720p displays are not. They have lower horizontal resolution. (1024x768 instead of 1366x768) For movies, this is not a big deal, but for games, the loss of detail coming from lower than native resolution was painfully obvious. Yes, I don't like upscaling, but lower resolution blown up in widescreen aspect ratio didn't look too good either. Still, I would have to say the LG plasma handled 360 games better, but only barely. Wii games looked FAR better on a nerfed 720 plasmas though, since Wii supports anamorphic aspect ratio, blowing up a 4:3 resolution on 16:9 display is a perfect match for Wii.

If you want a perfect plasma for Xbox 360 and PS3, a 720p Pioneer Kuro still reigns supreme, not because of black levels, but because it can handle true 720p resolution.


Thanks KOF!

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post #20 of 20 Old 11-24-2013, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whipit View Post

Correct on both. 720 content should fill the whole screen on a 1080 panel. On a 1080 PC screen 720p will show up as a window then you just stretch the window to "upscale" it to full screen. The tv calculates how to upscale it to fill all pixels. If I set my DVR to 720p or 1080i it will look almost the same. Slight edge towards 1080 with still images and maybe better at 720 with fast movement.

 

Thanks whipit !

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