Samsung F8500 Gaming Screen Tearing /Input Lag - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 38 Old 12-27-2013, 10:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Hello,

 

I thought I would start this thread as I am seeing others all over the web having similar problems but not getting any solutions, or at least what I can find.

 

I purchased this tv in Sept 2013 and yes it's great for everything except gaming, IMO. I was told by numerous sales people at numerous stores that this tv would be the "bomb" for gaming. Even spent 30 minutes at BB talking with a Samsung Rep. about this tv and he assured me that it would be the best tv ever for gaming.

 

First the input lag:

It's noticeable and yeshave heard the fix, rename to pc, but seriously the picture quality is crap in this mode. Why do I want to game with nex gen PS4  on pc mode with a dim/washed out picture.  I understand the game mode lag has been improved and now seems acceptable. Still not my old sony tv but playable at this point.

 

Screen Tearing:

I experienced screen tearing on multiple games on my ps3. Now that I have a PS4, I was hoping it would not happen, but it is. This drives me nuts as I have gamed for years and never had "screen tearing" on any tv.

 

My question is... are others having the screen tearing and if so have you found a fix??

 

Thanks

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post #2 of 38 Old 12-27-2013, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by johnschwei View Post

Hello,

I thought I would start this thread as I am seeing others all over the web having similar problems but not getting any solutions, or at least what I can find.

I purchased this tv in Sept 2013 and yes it's great for everything except gaming, IMO. I was told by numerous sales people at numerous stores that this tv would be the "bomb" for gaming. Even spent 30 minutes at BB talking with a Samsung Rep. about this tv and he assured me that it would be the best tv ever for gaming.

First the input lag:
It's noticeable and yeshave heard the fix, rename to pc, but seriously the picture quality is crap in this mode. Why do I want to game with nex gen PS4  on pc mode with a dim/washed out picture.  I understand the game mode lag has been improved and now seems acceptable. Still not my old sony tv but playable at this point.

Screen Tearing:
I experienced screen tearing on multiple games on my ps3. Now that I have a PS4, I was hoping it would not happen, but it is. This drives me nuts as I have gamed for years and never had "screen tearing" on any tv.

My question is... are others having the screen tearing and if so have you found a fix??

Thanks

I have had screen tearing issues and the fix is to set the picture size to screen fit instead of 16:9. Only downfall is you lose pixal shift which means you're more susceptible to IR. I am starting to haste this f8500, input lag is noticeable and when using game mode it degrades quality and the fact that it screen tears unless u use screen fix is not acceptable for a $3000-$4000 tv.
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post #3 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 10:57 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Inseconds99 View Post


I have had screen tearing issues and the fix is to set the picture size to screen fit instead of 16:9. Only downfall is you lose pixal shift which means you're more susceptible to IR. I am starting to haste this f8500, input lag is noticeable and when using game mode it degrades quality and the fact that it screen tears unless u use screen fix is not acceptable for a $3000-$4000 tv.

Have you contacted Samsung and threw a fit? I emailed them about this issue and haven't heard back, but next is a phone call.  Also, have you left it in 16:9 and tried adjusting the settings on pixel shift?  I surely wouldn't want to play 6 hours with "screen fit" and no IR protection as hud would most likely burn in.

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post #4 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by johnschwei View Post

Have you contacted Samsung and threw a fit? I emailed them about this issue and haven't heard back, but next is a phone call.  Also, have you left it in 16:9 and tried adjusting the settings on pixel shift?  I surely wouldn't want to play 6 hours with "screen fit" and no IR protection as hud would most likely burn in.

Returning the tv for a 4k f9000 actually, I've tried calling samsung and they are useless. I will tell you this though, I have had extended gameplay sessions with screen fit on and have not seen almost any ir. Samsung plasmas are amazing at not suffering from bad ir.
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post #5 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 11:31 AM
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I game on this set on my PS4 without any of the issues mentioned here. My set is set to screen fit, and input renamed to PC. I also turn game mode on as well. Best TV I've ever owned. Oh yes and FW 1116.

TV - Samsung PN51F8500
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post #6 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 12:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by SacredENA View Post

I game on this set on my PS4 without any of the issues mentioned here. My set is set to screen fit, and input renamed to PC. I also turn game mode on as well. Best TV I've ever owned. Oh yes and FW 1116.

 

You are saying that gaming in PC mode gives you the same exact quality picture that you get in game mode?   I noticed a huge reduction in quality with the renaming trick.....

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post #7 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by SacredENA View Post

I game on this set on my PS4 without any of the issues mentioned here. My set is set to screen fit, and input renamed to PC. I also turn game mode on as well. Best TV I've ever owned. Oh yes and FW 1116.

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Originally Posted by johnschwei View Post

You are saying that gaming in PC mode gives you the same exact quality picture that you get in game mode?   I noticed a huge reduction in quality with the renaming trick.....

I think the point is setting the tv to screen fit disables pixal shift which in turn makes gaming on it more susceptible to IR. Plus setting the input to PC or game with game mode takes this beautiful tv and turns it into any other normal $1000 tv's picture quality.
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post #8 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 04:00 PM
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I think the point is setting the tv to screen fit disables pixal shift which in turn makes gaming on it more susceptible to IR. Plus setting the input to PC or game with game mode takes this beautiful tv and turns it into any other normal $1000 tv's picture quality.

Haven't noticed any image retention whatsoever. Then again I broke in my set for about 100 hours before gaming on it.

Saying that turning game mode on turns the TV to a $1000 set is totally false IMO. With some image settings like pieandchips, the set looks amazing to me when gaming. Maybe a little TLC and break in is what you need? What FW are you using? If you've recently updated your set to 1116 and didn't do a reset from within the service menu, I would highly recommend it. Many users, myself included, experienced horrible image quality after a FW update. Upon resetting within the service menu and tweaking the set, image quality returned back to amazing...

TV - Samsung PN51F8500
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post #9 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by SacredENA View Post

Haven't noticed any image retention whatsoever. Then again I broke in my set for about 100 hours before gaming on it.

Saying that turning game mode on turns the TV to a $1000 set is totally false IMO. With some image settings like pieandchips, the set looks amazing to me when gaming. Maybe a little TLC and break in is what you need? What FW are you using? If you've recently updated your set to 1116 and didn't do a reset from within the service menu, I would highly recommend it. Many users, myself included, experienced horrible image quality after a FW update. Upon resetting within the service menu and tweaking the set, image quality returned back to amazing...

Anyway you can post those game mode settings that make the pq look amazing?
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post #10 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 04:16 PM
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Anyway you can post those game mode settings that make the pq look amazing?

Sure. Sorry for the pics, quickest way to get them to you... Of course all sets are different and YMMV. Hope it helps.

4asybete.jpg

da4udeze.jpg

eqy4a5e6.jpg

va9egapy.jpg

TV - Samsung PN51F8500
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post #11 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 04:31 PM
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I don't see game mode settings in these photos, unless my phone isn't displaying them correctly.
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post #12 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 08:32 PM
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Don't set it to PC. Set the input to "Game" then go into settings and turn on "Game Mode". Do both. Btw... I don't think u can do both when set to PC. But by using Game instead of PC, you'll get access to quite a few more picture settings that PC disables. I have no perceptibly bad input lag & it looks gorgeous. Be sure to set it to Warm 2, Screen Fit, etc.

I game on PS3, PS4, Xbox 360, Wii & Wii U with no issues.

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post #13 of 38 Old 12-28-2013, 10:12 PM
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Originally Posted by shpankey View Post

Don't set it to PC. Set the input to "Game" then go into settings and turn on "Game Mode". Do both. Btw... I don't think u can do both when set to PC. But by using Game instead of PC, you'll get access to quite a few more picture settings that PC disables. I have no perceptibly bad input lag & it looks gorgeous. Be sure to set it to Warm 2, Screen Fit, etc.

I game on PS3, PS4, Xbox 360, Wii & Wii U with no issues.

I understand that, what I was saying is, those calibration settings all have movie mode which isn't available with game mode on. Only standard is available.
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post #14 of 38 Old 01-06-2014, 06:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Don't set it to PC. Set the input to "Game" then go into settings and turn on "Game Mode". Do both. Btw... I don't think u can do both when set to PC. But by using Game instead of PC, you'll get access to quite a few more picture settings that PC disables. I have no perceptibly bad input lag & it looks gorgeous. Be sure to set it to Warm 2, Screen Fit, etc.

I game on PS3, PS4, Xbox 360, Wii & Wii U with no issues.

Are you also setting picture size to "screen fit" which disables the pixel shift?  I am curious if everyone gaming on this tv has experienced "screen tear" in 16:9 picture size or did I get a dud??  Samsung had no fix for my screen tearing issue except to say it was my console causing the problem which I know isn't true as it is happening with both my ps3 and  new ps4, with multiple cables etc...   Thanks for any input!

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I am also having this issue. I will check my settings when I get home.

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post #16 of 38 Old 01-15-2014, 08:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I am also having this issue. I will check my settings when I get home.

What did you find out???  Someone said screen tear only occuring on hdmi 3 input....not 1, 2, or 4? Any input, is there anyway to keep pixel shift on and not have screen tear???

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post #17 of 38 Old 01-20-2014, 06:19 PM
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What did you find out???  Someone said screen tear only occuring on hdmi 3 input....not 1, 2, or 4? Any input, is there anyway to keep pixel shift on and not have screen tear???

John,

So on the first 8500 i bought I only noticed it on HDMI 3 ... and not 1,2,4 ... My wife made the case that she was concerned that the hdmi input had gone "bad" and what the effect on the others would be ... She basically talked me into an exchange. Unfortunately for me that was a very bad idea. Now I get the screen tearing on all my hdmi inputs.

So I tried a lot testing. I turned the pixel shift on/off. Messed with the timing, messed with not having it do vertical shifts or horizontal shifts to no avail. The only thing that works is turning the set to "Screen Fit." Once you do that it works just fine.

Since when I game I change it to game mode for my gaming settings it's not that difficult for me to go change it to screen fit as well and when I'm done I turn it back. A minor annoyance, but at least I know its not just my TV and it's probably fixable by firm ware.

In terms of IR, unless you keep pixel shift off completely all the time (I don't recommend that) or in screen fit all the time (which disables pixel shift - again don't recommend that) i'd be hard-pressed to see you having much image retention. I played for about 4-6 hours the other night with game mode on (higher contrast, brightness and sharpness) with screen fit on and I saw no image retention. I have about 88 hours on my set ... There's a lot you can do to take care of your set in terms of image retention, there's a lot on google with some articles from some people much smarter than I.

Bottomline, is IR still possible yes... Do I think you'd have to try really hard to get IR? Yes.
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post #18 of 38 Old 01-21-2014, 12:55 PM - Thread Starter
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John,

So on the first 8500 i bought I only noticed it on HDMI 3 ... and not 1,2,4 ... My wife made the case that she was concerned that the hdmi input had gone "bad" and what the effect on the others would be ... She basically talked me into an exchange. Unfortunately for me that was a very bad idea. Now I get the screen tearing on all my hdmi inputs.

So I tried a lot testing. I turned the pixel shift on/off. Messed with the timing, messed with not having it do vertical shifts or horizontal shifts to no avail. The only thing that works is turning the set to "Screen Fit." Once you do that it works just fine.

Since when I game I change it to game mode for my gaming settings it's not that difficult for me to go change it to screen fit as well and when I'm done I turn it back. A minor annoyance, but at least I know its not just my TV and it's probably fixable by firm ware.

In terms of IR, unless you keep pixel shift off completely all the time (I don't recommend that) or in screen fit all the time (which disables pixel shift - again don't recommend that) i'd be hard-pressed to see you having much image retention. I played for about 4-6 hours the other night with game mode on (higher contrast, brightness and sharpness) with screen fit on and I saw no image retention. I have about 88 hours on my set ... There's a lot you can do to take care of your set in terms of image retention, there's a lot on google with some articles from some people much smarter than I.

Bottomline, is IR still possible yes... Do I think you'd have to try really hard to get IR? Yes.


Ok, I am trying screen fit and no tearing so far on my ps4 but still noticing on my ps3, gonna try another hdmi cable and/or input.  Thanks!  For the cost of this tv it should be set up better for gaming, I am considering setting up a separate gaming area in my basement with a sony w series, but would rather not.

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post #19 of 38 Old 01-21-2014, 03:12 PM
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In terms of IR, unless you keep pixel shift off completely all the time (I don't recommend that) or in screen fit all the time (which disables pixel shift - again don't recommend that) i'd be hard-pressed to see you having much image retention. I played for about 4-6 hours the other night with game mode on (higher contrast, brightness and sharpness) with screen fit on and I saw no image retention. I have about 88 hours on my set ... There's a lot you can do to take care of your set in terms of image retention, there's a lot on google with some articles from some people much smarter than I.

Bottomline, is IR still possible yes... Do I think you'd have to try really hard to get IR? Yes.

I use screen fit all the time, for all my TV viewing,  never have a problem with IR.  I game a lot too, use game mode, have not changed the HDMI to GAME, and have not had a problem with IR.

I dont think its an issue with this TV.  I did break it in about 200 hours before doing any long gaming on it.

You say that you think that there will be IR if I view my TV with screen fit on all the time?  Ive not noticed any, have you heard somewhere from someone as you say "smarter" that one shouldnt use screen fit?  All the "settings" Ive seen listed always say to use screen fit, otherwise its not true HD, and you lose image.

Just wondering,  I hear so many different things all the time.  Wondering if every once and awhile I should run pixel shift just to keep the pixels happy.

As for gaming, I dont usually go over 2 hours at a time.

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What settings is everyone using for the best picture quality on the PS4?
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post #21 of 38 Old 01-22-2014, 06:23 PM
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I use screen fit all the time, for all my TV viewing,  never have a problem with IR.  I game a lot too, use game mode, have not changed the HDMI to GAME, and have not had a problem with IR.


I dont think its an issue with this TV.  I did break it in about 200 hours before doing any long gaming on it.


You say that you think that there will be IR if I view my TV with screen fit on all the time?  Ive not noticed any, have you heard somewhere from someone as you say "smarter" that one shouldnt use screen fit?  All the "settings" Ive seen listed always say to use screen fit, otherwise its not true HD, and you lose image.


Just wondering,  I hear so many different things all the time.  Wondering if every once and awhile I should run pixel shift just to keep the pixels happy.


As for gaming, I dont usually go over 2 hours at a time.

Stu - from what I had read (looking for the article) the "fear"/"worry" was mainly that with screen fit it disables all the auto-protection features to PREVENT IR ... Not that those have been exactly proven either ... I'm in the middle with IR to be honest ... I think it can happen, but at the same time I can't really see how it could happen purely by accident.

In terms of the screen tearing, I convinced Samsung to send out a tech ... so we'll see what he says ... at the very least it sounds like they are going to be replacing my display and motherboard (on a 2 week old tv! ha!) and I'll pick his brain about the image retentioness...
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post #22 of 38 Old 01-23-2014, 11:38 AM
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don't kid yourself, shifting pixels only makes the IR blurry.

fortunately, the f8500 is very good at resisting IR. i use mine for a computer monitor regularly(always on screen fit, which i DO recommend smile.gif ) and i haven't had anything offensive yet. after several hours, i will sometimes see the outline of my web browser or text document ghosted on solid color screens for a couple mins, but that's as bad as it's ever been for me.

i will say though, i did notice some screen tearing while playing NHL14 the other day. oddly enough, this was the first time i EVER have, and i've played that game and others many times on the f8500 before. almost makes me wonder if there's something with the new FW's... honestly, i thought it was my tired old xbox 360 not being able to handle the latest crop of games

Displays: Samsung PN64F8500/JVC X35
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post #23 of 38 Old 01-23-2014, 01:11 PM
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I always use screen fit (1:1 pixel mapping). Tearing is an issue from your video output (PC video card, game console). They are turning vsync off on your video source from within their game to get a better (higher) framerate. Some games even allow you to toggle it on/off in the game options (the latest Bioshock). This is not a display issue at all, but a setting in your video card output. On a PC u can force it always on.

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post #24 of 38 Old 01-23-2014, 04:07 PM
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Now if I could just get a definitive answer on Samsungs HDMI Black Levels Id be a happy camper.  Ive read probably 20 different threads/articles about it, and my head is spinning.  I know its probably real simple, so here are my questions.

 

Should Xbox One be on PC or TV ?  (PC=extended,TV=limited)
If PC which HDMI level?  If TV which HDMI level?

 

Ive even read Samsung labels them backwards, which if true would mean you want Normal for limited and Low for Extended. 
Its all pretty confusing, especially if you throw watching Blu rays on Xbone into the mix.

What are your settings for Xbox One output, and 8500 HDMI?
What do you do when you watch Blu Ray on xboxone?

 

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post #25 of 38 Old 01-24-2014, 08:44 AM
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I think Extended on Xbox, Normal on TV. I'll check when I get back home.

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post #26 of 38 Old 01-24-2014, 09:07 AM
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Would you guys say this tv is worth getting if your a gamer? Seems like an awful lot to do just to make the game look right.
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post #27 of 38 Old 01-24-2014, 09:12 AM
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Yes, but I think there is a cheaper Panny that really excels at gaming. S60 or ST60 or something like that, I can't remember the model # for sure. If your main thing is gaming it is probably your best bet. But this tv still is good for gaming too.

26 What good will it be for a man if he gains the whole world, yet forfeits his soul? Or what can a man give in exchange for his soul?

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post #28 of 38 Old 01-24-2014, 09:34 AM
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I think Extended on Xbox, Normal on TV. I'll check when I get back home.


Thats what sounds correct, but the problem for me is that when I do that I cant run the calibration program, its way to bright.  To get the eye to dissapear I have to go to below 30 on brightness.

The way Im set up now is Xbone set to TV, and HDMI set to Low.   Brightness around 55.

Game mode on.

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post #29 of 38 Old 01-24-2014, 09:34 AM
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Yes, but I think there is a cheaper Panny that really excels at gaming. S60 or ST60 or something like that, I can't remember the model # for sure. If your main thing is gaming it is probably your best bet. But this tv still is good for gaming too.

The tv won't be solely for gaming. I'll be watching movies, and broadcast television on it. But gaming is also prevalent.
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post #30 of 38 Old 01-24-2014, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Lewshus View Post


The tv won't be solely for gaming. I'll be watching movies, and broadcast television on it. But gaming is also prevalent.


I game fine on mine, and its a fantastic picture.  I do play Bf4 online and would say that there isnt "noticeable" lag.  Sure I probably have more lag than the folks who have PC monitors or TVs who dont have the same lag this one does, but I also enjoy a lot of other types of games and Im not so hardcore (anymore) that I get hung up being super competitive on multiplayer.  Forza, AC4 looked fantastic on this TV.

By "noticible" I mean if I stand in front of a wall and shoot at it, when I pull the trigger there is no noticible lag.  When I do something on my controller, it happens on my TV.
I die a lot, but that could be lots of things, the people Im playing, do they have mod controllers, do they play all the time, are the playing as a team better.

The most important thing to do for BF4 is turn internet smoothing off.

With all that being said, I have fun.

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