My thoughts on the 60" Pentile F5300 Samsung Plasma - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 131 Old 07-24-2014, 11:49 AM
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I have my Colormunki Display coming in the mail tomorrow, so I can let you know my measured black levels and how things go with the calibrations over the weekend.
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post #62 of 131 Old 07-24-2014, 03:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanHomsey View Post
I had absolutely no idea CinemaSmooth increased red levels, that's weird! I'll have to check that out, thanks for the tip.
Sure you did:

Samsung PN60F5300B Settings And What They Do

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post #63 of 131 Old 07-24-2014, 04:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post
lol, forgot all about that. Good call.

I'm running into an odd issue that has me perplexed. I posted about it elsewhere but maybe you guys could have some insight:

I cannot get my Xbox One to display white levels properly, and it is only with the new plasma. I had been using my PS3 w/the plasma. Both the XB1 and PS3, of course, are set to RGB limited.

I hooked up both my XB1 and PS3 to a different TV (Vizio FALD LED-LCD) to see if there was any difference in white level readings. They were exactly the same, the patterns turned white at the reference white level (bar #235 ).

Why can I not get a white level with the XB1/Plasma while I can with the PS3/Plasma? Doesnt make any sense to me.

(all settings left the same)
PS3/LCD - Works Great!
XB1/LCD - Works Great!
PS3/Plasma - Works Great!
XB1/Plasma - Whacked out grey scale and severely crippled white output!??!?

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post #64 of 131 Old 07-24-2014, 05:11 PM
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Is the B model of the 5300 less likely to have the pink problem than the A model? Or is it found on both?
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post #65 of 131 Old 07-24-2014, 05:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post
Is the B model of the 5300 less likely to have the pink problem than the A model? Or is it found on both?

Supposedly more likely on the b model but I believe still found on both
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post #66 of 131 Old 07-24-2014, 10:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post
Is the B model of the 5300 less likely to have the pink problem than the A model? Or is it found on both?
I'm also inclined to believe those saying they don't see the pink tint just aren't putting up a full white screen or looking hard enough. The issue seems to be so far widespread, I'd have a hard time believing it doesn't affect all sets to some degree.

Hey, at least we don't suffer from the rising black level problem of the Panasonics of old. After a few years my 50S1 has black levels worse than almost every lcd out today.
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post #67 of 131 Old 07-25-2014, 12:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanHomsey View Post
The issue I was running into was taking continuous measurements (in HCFR) vs the gamma graph - they did not correlate exactly. By that I mean, I would take a continuous reading then adjust RGB to match target Y value then I'd do a full run on the grey scale... and it would not match up. Not sure why. I decided to trust the graph over the continuous read, did another run and it was close so I left it there. Soon I'll tackle color accuracy and I'll pass back over gamma to get it just right.

You're probably right about taking Color Space off of auto. I read somewhere that suggested leaving it on the default auto setting (don't remember the reasoning). Either way - a non issue for me when I tackle the colors with my next calibration.
Not sure if this'll help, but you may need to turn the Black Optimizer Off, and set Cell Light to 20, at least temporarily to get stable enough readings to set your Gamma with the 10-point controls.

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post #68 of 131 Old 07-25-2014, 05:42 AM
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It won't help. Colorimeters are not particularly accurate at low light levels. That's why the pros use spectometers. But it's "close enogh for jazz."

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post #69 of 131 Old 07-25-2014, 11:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Completed my calibration today. I was pleasantly surprised at how easy it was to nail down the primary/secondary colors @ 100 saturation. It may be better to calibrate @ 75% saturation but I'm leaving it here for the time being. I left cinema smooth on for the calibration.











Picture Mode: Movie
Cell Light: 20
Contrast: 95
Brightness: 48
Sharpness: 10
Color: 50
Tint: G50 / R50

Under "Advanced Settings"

Dynamic Contrast: Off
Black Tone: Off
Flesh Tone: 0
RGB Only Mode: Off
Color Space: Custom-
Red 42, 7 , 5
Green 24, 52, 11
Blue 7, 0, 56
Yellow 50, 52, 14
Cyan 27, 49, 51
Magenta 41, 7, 54
Gamma: -1

Under "Picture Options"

Color Tone: Warm2
Digital Clean View: Off
MPEG Noise Filter: Off
HDMI Black Level (greyed out): Low
Film Mode (greyed out): Off (I use Cinema Smooth, which is available when viewing 24p, turn on when available)
Black Optimizer: Dark Room

10pt White Balance

10% -16, +2, +15
20% +22, +23, +35
30% +34, +18, +34
40% +33, +8, +29
50% +19, +7, +34
60% +20, -8, +14
70% +29, -3, +25
80% +11, -10, +16
90% +29, -14, +17
100% +28, -6, +15

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADU View Post
Not sure if this'll help, but you may need to turn the Black Optimizer Off, and set Cell Light to 20, at least temporarily to get stable enough readings to set your Gamma with the 10-point controls.
It's odd, I was getting stable readings in continous mode. I also got stable readings when doing the grey scale run ... they just didn't align exactly. I recall reading about someone else having the same issue over in the calibration forum section.

Last edited by RyanHomsey; 07-25-2014 at 11:22 AM.
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post #70 of 131 Old 07-25-2014, 11:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post
It won't help. Colorimeters are not particularly accurate at low light levels. That's why the pros use spectometers. But it's "close enogh for jazz."
Pros use very expensive spectroradiometers because generally speaking a colorimeter is more accurate than a spectroradiometers at low light levels. To get a spectroradiometer that's accurate at low light levels you pay a lot. There's a reason why people use a i1 Pro to profile their iD3. The iD3, a colorimeter, is more accurate than the i1 Pro, a specroradiometer, at low light levels.
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post #71 of 131 Old 07-25-2014, 02:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Anyone here with an F5300 (or F5350) own an Xbox One ???

I've just about convinced myself that the F5300 and Xbox One are incompatible (refresh rate issues?). Maybe it could even have something to do with the pentile sub-pixel layout that is specific to the 60 inch.

See here for more info: AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray & MP4 Calibration

If anyone has successfully set white levels with their XB1 / F5300 combo (particularly the 60" pentile) please let me know. I can't figure out what is going on. I'd really like to use my XB1 with this TV.

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post #72 of 131 Old 07-25-2014, 04:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanHomsey View Post
Completed my calibration today. I was pleasantly surprised at how easy it was to nail down the primary/secondary colors @ 100 saturation.
Told you.
Nice job.
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post #73 of 131 Old 07-25-2014, 08:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanHomsey View Post
Anyone here with an F5300 (or F5350) own an Xbox One ???

I've just about convinced myself that the F5300 and Xbox One are incompatible (refresh rate issues?). Maybe it could even have something to do with the pentile sub-pixel layout that is specific to the 60 inch.

See here for more info: AVS HD 709 - Blu-ray & MP4 Calibration

If anyone has successfully set white levels with their XB1 / F5300 combo (particularly the 60" pentile) please let me know. I can't figure out what is going on. I'd really like to use my XB1 with this TV.
Not sure I can really help on this since I don't own a PS4 or XB1. First question though would be-- why are you using RGB rather than YCbCr?

Also is the XB1 clipping above 16 and below 235, or is it just clipping the BTB (blacker-than-black) and WTW (whiter-than-white) info, which is quite common for consumer devices?

I also read your comments in the AVS 709 thread btw.

If you're using both devices on the same input, and one is clipping above 16 and below 235, and the other is not, then there's obviously some type of discrepancy between either the levels (0-255 vs. 16-235) or color spaces (RGB vs. YCbCr), that the two devices are outputting. You could try switching the HDMI Black Level setting in the Picture Options to see if that fixes the issue.

The red tint in 24 Hz mode makes sense though. As several others have already pointed out, the white balance may calibrate differently for 24 Hz (which is probably pulled-down to 96 Hz by the TV with Cinema Smooth), and 60Hz signals.

Not all devices output video content at reference levels or with reference colors though. (Not by a long shot.) The inputs, color spaces, resolutions, levels, and color decoding on the video input devices can all potentially influence calibration to a degree. You might have better luck getting the players to output similar levels in the YCbCr color mode though.

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post #74 of 131 Old 07-25-2014, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanHomsey View Post


Color: 50
Tint: G50 / R50

Color Space: Custom-
Red 42, 7 , 5
Green 24, 52, 11
Blue 7, 0, 56
Yellow 50, 52, 14
Cyan 27, 49, 51
Magenta 41, 7, 54
Very nice job on the color calibration btw! I'm glad you were able to get the primaries set so precisely without tinkering with the default Color and Tint settings in Movie Mode, because the color decoding looks quite good to me at those default settings with Color Space set to Auto/Custom. (The "Native" Color Space setting pushs too much green btw.)

I'd be curious to know if LastButNotLeast was able to do the same thing (ie leave Color at 50 and Tint at 50/50), and whether his Color Space adjustments were similar to yours... if he's willin to share that info with us.

ADU

Last edited by ADU; 07-25-2014 at 08:51 PM.
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post #75 of 131 Old 07-26-2014, 02:14 AM
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RyanHomsey, I tried your settings and colors look a lot different from default Movie mode. More saturated I guess, with an emphasis towards purple/pink. AVSForums background used to have a blue hue to it, now it is more purple. Is that correct? It actually seems to have made the pink tint slightly less noticeable on certain areas of the screen because of the shift in color. Is this how it looks to you? Colors do seem to look more like my old Panasonic now, for what it's worth.

One question though. If I change cell/contrast from 20/95 to 20/80 does that change everything? 20/95 is too bright for me, and I don't like adjusting cell light as it's behavior with dimming is unpredictable.

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post #76 of 131 Old 07-26-2014, 05:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ADU View Post
Not sure I can really help on this since I don't own a PS4 or XB1. First question though would be-- why are you using RGB rather than YCbCr?
I'm using YCbCR - or it's equivalent (I'm not real keen on the terminology) - XB1 calls it RGB limited. There are only two options RGB limited or RGB full.



Quote:
Originally Posted by ADU View Post
Also is the XB1 clipping above 16 and below 235, or is it just clipping the BTB (blacker-than-black) and WTW (whiter-than-white) info, which is quite common for consumer devices?
When I disable 24p output (forcing 60hz output) in the XB1 all black bars in the black clipping pattern are crushed (solid black / no flashing) and all the white bars in the white clipping pattern are blown out (solid white / no flashing. No additional red shows up in the greys cale.

With 24p enabled the black clipping pattern is perecct, I get my reference black level @ 16 (17 - 25 flash). But the white clipping pattern (230 - 255) is entirely blown out (no flashing bars).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADU View Post
If you're using both devices on the same input, and one is clipping above 16 and below 235, and the other is not, then there's obviously some type of discrepancy between either the levels (0-255 vs. 16-235) or color spaces (RGB vs. YCbCr), that the two devices are outputting. You could try switching the HDMI Black Level setting in the Picture Options to see if that fixes the issue.
I tried changing literally every setting on the TV, including HDMI black level. No change.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADU View Post
The red tint in 24 Hz mode makes sense though. As several others have already pointed out, the white balance may calibrate differently for 24 Hz (which is probably pulled-down to 96 Hz by the TV with Cinema Smooth), and 60Hz signals.
I feel like it is more than a subtle increase in red that has been described with activating cinema smooth. It is way way heavy in red. Coupled with the blown out contrast in either one (24p) or both (60p) directions, It seems like there's something going on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ADU View Post
Very nice job on the color calibration btw! I'm glad you were able to get the primaries set so precisely without tinkering with the default Color and Tint settings in Movie Mode, because the color decoding looks quite good to me at those default settings with Color Space set to Auto/Custom. (The "Native" Color Space setting pushs too much green btw.)

I'd be curious to know if LastButNotLeast was able to do the same thing (ie leave Color at 50 and Tint at 50/50), and whether his Color Space adjustments were similar to yours... if he's willin to share that info with us.
Thanks!

My new approach with color/tint is to leave them alone if the set has a viable CMS. I got the idea from, I think it was ChadB (respectable pro calibrator), who suggested that color/tint and blue filter approach is unnecessary.

This color calibration literally took me 15 minutes. I used to spend hours upon hours with my LCD's and couldnt get it this accurate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post
RyanHomsey, I tried your settings and colors look a lot different from default Movie mode. More saturated I guess, with an emphasis towards purple/pink. AVSForums background used to have a blue hue to it, now it is more purple. Is that correct? It actually seems to have made the pink tint slightly less noticeable on certain areas of the screen because of the shift in color. Is this how it looks to you? Colors do seem to look more like my old Panasonic now, for what it's worth.

One question though. If I change cell/contrast from 20/95 to 20/80 does that change everything? 20/95 is too bright for me, and I don't like adjusting cell light as it's behavior with dimming is unpredictable.
Isnt the AVS forums background white? It may differ from person to person. Not sure. You may have just been used to the stock movie mode, which pushed too much green in both the 60F5300 sets I owned.

Regarding the contrast setting: I would keep it at around 90 or 95. I haven't tested it to confirm but it is my understanding that the grey scale will no longer track properly when you crank it down.

I personally have had good results from lowering cell light when needed. I like it bright. My set measured peak white at 39ftl @ that setting. Which is a little bright for a very dark room but I like it .

Last edited by RyanHomsey; 07-26-2014 at 07:37 AM.
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post #77 of 131 Old 07-26-2014, 07:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanHomsey View Post
Completed my calibration today. I was pleasantly surprised at how easy it was to nail down the primary/secondary colors @ 100 saturation. It may be better to calibrate @ 75% saturation but I'm leaving it here for the time being. I left cinema smooth on for the calibration.











Picture Mode: Movie
Cell Light: 20
Contrast: 95
Brightness: 48
Sharpness: 10
Color: 50
Tint: G50 / R50

Under "Advanced Settings"

Dynamic Contrast: Off
Black Tone: Off
Flesh Tone: 0
RGB Only Mode: Off
Color Space: Custom-
Red 42, 7 , 5
Green 24, 52, 11
Blue 7, 0, 56
Yellow 50, 52, 14
Cyan 27, 49, 51
Magenta 41, 7, 54
Gamma: -1

Under "Picture Options"

Color Tone: Warm2
Digital Clean View: Off
MPEG Noise Filter: Off
HDMI Black Level (greyed out): Low
Film Mode (greyed out): Off (I use Cinema Smooth, which is available when viewing 24p, turn on when available)
Black Optimizer: Dark Room

10pt White Balance

10% -16, +2, +15
20% +22, +23, +35
30% +34, +18, +34
40% +33, +8, +29
50% +19, +7, +34
60% +20, -8, +14
70% +29, -3, +25
80% +11, -10, +16
90% +29, -14, +17
100% +28, -6, +15



It's odd, I was getting stable readings in continous mode. I also got stable readings when doing the grey scale run ... they just didn't align exactly. I recall reading about someone else having the same issue over in the calibration forum section.

Nice job !
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post #78 of 131 Old 07-26-2014, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by chunon View Post
Nice job !
Please see my sig.

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post #79 of 131 Old 07-26-2014, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ADU View Post
I'd be curious to know if LastButNotLeast was able to do the same thing (ie leave Color at 50 and Tint at 50/50), and whether his Color Space adjustments were similar to yours... if he's willing to share that info with us.
It seems AVS or my computer or internet space lost my first reply, so I will try (patiently) to answer this again.
Yes, color and tint are at default. You can start from anywhere and calibrate to spec, it just doesn't make any sense.
I wouldn't mind sharing the info but 1. I'm not home, 2. next weekend I plan to reset the picture and start over since I'm well over the 200 hour mark and I'd like to see what settings would likely help those without a meter (though I still suspect Warm2 and gamma = -1 will be the best), and 3. I continue to maintain that there is enough set-to-set variation that fine adjustments like grayscale and color space are not transferable and should only be done with a meter.
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post #80 of 131 Old 07-26-2014, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post
RyanHomsey, I tried your settings and colors look a lot different from default Movie mode.
Yup. See above.

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post #81 of 131 Old 07-26-2014, 05:33 PM
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I am strongly considering this unit. It would replace a 9 year old Toshiba DLP rear projection so I know it will look much better.

A little concerned about pentile, magenta tint, etc, but I am sure the blacks will be so much better than my DLP.

I would sit 8.5 feet from 60", I am hoping that will be sufficient, CNET seems to think so. I do have 20/15 "fighter pilot vision" thanks to LASIK so possible screen door effect will be an issue? I hope not.

I could increase viewing distance if I mount but not planning to as I have a nice entertainment stand it would fit well on. Is the TV stand that it comes with sturdy enough? I have young kids and don't want it to fall and crush them of course.

Current pricing shows $799 from Best Buy, Sears etc and $849 from Costco minus a $100 rebate (5350 model). Very good value it seems for the TV. Anyone know if Costco ever does sales? Would prefer to purchase from them.

I will be hooking up a ps3/ps4 to it. IIRC in my research, it did only ok in input lag for gaming. Any issues for gaming folks here?

Lastly, is the recommendation to let it "burn-in" for a period of time before calibrating and using one of the settings recommended here?

Any help MUCH appreciated, to any of the above.
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post #82 of 131 Old 07-26-2014, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by djb5f View Post
I am strongly considering this unit. It would replace a 9 year old Toshiba DLP rear projection so I know it will look much better.

A little concerned about pentile, magenta tint, etc, but I am sure the blacks will be so much better than my DLP.

I would sit 8.5 feet from 60", I am hoping that will be sufficient, CNET seems to think so. I do have 20/15 "fighter pilot vision" thanks to LASIK so possible screen door effect will be an issue? I hope not.

I could increase viewing distance if I mount but not planning to as I have a nice entertainment stand it would fit well on. Is the TV stand that it comes with sturdy enough? I have young kids and don't want it to fall and crush them of course.

Current pricing shows $799 from Best Buy, Sears etc and $849 from Costco minus a $100 rebate (5350 model). Very good value it seems for the TV. Anyone know if Costco ever does sales? Would prefer to purchase from them.

I will be hooking up a ps3/ps4 to it. IIRC in my research, it did only ok in input lag for gaming. Any issues for gaming folks here?

Lastly, is the recommendation to let it "burn-in" for a period of time before calibrating and using one of the settings recommended here?

Any help MUCH appreciated, to any of the above.
Speaking for the 51" version, which should have similar lag to the 60", you wont notice any lag. My tests show a 33 to 50 ms lag vs. a CRT when fed the same analog signal using a Y splitter, testing 240p and 480i. I've been gaming since the early 80's and find its not enough to even notice on any game Ive tried thus far.

See my lag test images and video at the bottom of the thread here.

Last edited by Josh128; 07-26-2014 at 07:03 PM.
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post #83 of 131 Old 07-26-2014, 07:09 PM
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The biggest thing that throws off the calibration for me is the 90% and 100% white balance settings- Red at +29 and +28 gives a very noticeable red/pink push. Your color space settings look fine, but I think I am just going to reset the white balance to defaults (since I don't have a meter and can't measure myself.

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post #84 of 131 Old 07-27-2014, 02:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by djb5f View Post
I would sit 8.5 feet from 60", I am hoping that will be sufficient, CNET seems to think so. I do have 20/15 "fighter pilot vision" thanks to LASIK so possible screen door effect will be an issue? I hope not.

I could increase viewing distance if I mount but not planning to as I have a nice entertainment stand it would fit well on. Is the TV stand that it comes with sturdy enough? I have young kids and don't want it to fall and crush them of course.

Current pricing shows $799 from Best Buy, Sears etc and $849 from Costco minus a $100 rebate (5350 model). Very good value it seems for the TV. Anyone know if Costco ever does sales? Would prefer to purchase from them.

I will be hooking up a ps3/ps4 to it. IIRC in my research, it did only ok in input lag for gaming. Any issues for gaming folks here?

Lastly, is the recommendation to let it "burn-in" for a period of time before calibrating and using one of the settings recommended here?

Any help MUCH appreciated, to any of the above.
Regarding pentile pixel arrangement. If you have very good eyes you may be able to see it from 8.5ft away.

The stand is very sturdy. The very wide base does a good job IMO.

Keep in mind the costco rebate is an instant rebate (this is where I got my set), $749 + tax out the door (but it is taxed on the $849 price). Costco also has a 90 day no questions asked return policy and excellent/cheap additional warranty options should you be interested.

Gaming is outstanding. Input lag is low. My TV appears to be incompatible with the XB1, however. See this thread: Xbox One INCOMPATIBLE with PN60F5300/F5350!!??

You'll find differing opinions regarding burn in from respected calibrators/technicians. Some believe a 150-200hr break in period is beneficial - during which period the set may be more susceptible to burn in. Some don't think it helps a thing and is unnecessary wear on your set and unnecessary power usage.
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post #85 of 131 Old 07-27-2014, 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Josh128 View Post
Speaking for the 51" version, which should have similar lag to the 60", you wont notice any lag. My tests show a 33 to 50 ms lag vs. a CRT when fed the same analog signal using a Y splitter, testing 240p and 480i. I've been gaming since the early 80's and find its not enough to even notice on any game Ive tried thus far.

See my lag test images and video at the bottom of the thread here.
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Originally Posted by RyanHomsey View Post
Regarding pentile pixel arrangement. If you have very good eyes you may be able to see it from 8.5ft away.

The stand is very sturdy. The very wide base does a good job IMO.

Keep in mind the costco rebate is an instant rebate (this is where I got my set), $749 + tax out the door (but it is taxed on the $849 price). Costco also has a 90 day no questions asked return policy and excellent/cheap additional warranty options should you be interested.

Gaming is outstanding. Input lag is low. My TV appears to be incompatible with the XB1, however. See this thread: Xbox One INCOMPATIBLE with PN60F5300/F5350!!??

You'll find differing opinions regarding burn in from respected calibrators/technicians. Some believe a 150-200hr break in period is beneficial - during which period the set may be more susceptible to burn in. Some don't think it helps a thing and is unnecessary wear on your set and unnecessary power usage.
Thanks for the info! Great news on the gaming front re: lag. Sorry about the xb1 incompatibility, that seems bizarre.

And I didn't realize that the Costco rebate was at purchase, that is great. I did know about the 90 day no hassle return which is why I was leaning towards them. It is my father-in-law who is a member so I would purchase through him.
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post #86 of 131 Old 07-28-2014, 08:27 AM
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Completed my calibration today. I was pleasantly surprised at how easy it was to nail down the primary/secondary colors @ 100 saturation. It may be better to calibrate @ 75% saturation but I'm leaving it here for the time being. I left cinema smooth on for the calibration.

Ryan, I'd recommend doing a full Saturation sweep and color checker (Select Measures->All Colors) to see how this calibration performs at lower saturation levels. You may be able to get a better overall picture that way. See my recent posts on the deficiencies of only matching 100% saturation targets without checking performance at lower saturation levels:
Samsung PN60F5300 calibration settings?
Samsung PN60F5300 calibration settings?
Samsung PN60F5300 calibration settings?
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post #87 of 131 Old 07-28-2014, 03:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Ryan, I'd recommend doing a full Saturation sweep and color checker (Select Measures->All Colors) to see how this calibration performs at lower saturation levels. You may be able to get a better overall picture that way. See my recent posts on the deficiencies of only matching 100% saturation targets without checking performance at lower saturation levels:
Samsung PN60F5300 calibration settings?
Samsung PN60F5300 calibration settings?
Samsung PN60F5300 calibration settings?
Well done targeting those lower saturation points!

I had such a bad experience with a faulty CMS on an LCD I calibrated 4 years ago for lower saturation points:



Clearly though, with such a viable CMS system, targeting those points is the way to go. I'll give it a go soon!
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post #88 of 131 Old 07-28-2014, 03:53 PM
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Clearly though, with such a viable CMS system, targeting those points is the way to go. I'll give it a go soon!
Lol, yeah the CMS on this TV is very nice and the 10 point gamma as well as the color space settings seem to work independently and don't have unanticipated impact on the behavior elsewhere.

For targeting lower saturations, keep in mind that Free Measures don't work at <100% saturations with the internal pattern generator of HCFR. You have to run Saturation sweeps for each color at a time. Then look at the dE, xy co-ordinates and delta Luminance in the table. Also switching to the CIE chart helps figure out how the saturation sweep results line up. Then tweak that color in the CMS a bit more and repeat the sweep. I also found stereomandan's Excel file very handy as it gives you the target xy coordinates and Y levels if you input your 100% White luminance value and your target gamma.

When tweaking colors to line up, I find it is easiest to look at the CIE chart. If you need to move your color point vertically down, you either subtract green, or add in roughly equal amounts of red and blue. Similarly if you have to go right, you can subtract some blue and green, or add some red and green. The chart makes it easy to visualize since you know the axis for each primary color. Whether you use an additive combination or subtractive one to get to your color target will depend on whether you are over or under your luminance target.

All the best!
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post #89 of 131 Old 07-28-2014, 09:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post
The iD3, a colorimeter, is more accurate than the i1 Pro, a specroradiometer, at low light levels.
This has confused me all along.
From x-rite's website:
"i1DISPLAY PRO INCLUDES
i1Display colorimeter"
and there's no mention of a D3.
From the box:
"i1Display is the world's first spectrally calibrated colorimeter!"
Until now, I thought the names Pro and D3 were interchangeable.

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post #90 of 131 Old 07-28-2014, 10:04 PM
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While I have you here - from what I recall you calibrate with an i1d3 (which accurately measures black levels). What did your black level (Y) measure in at? You may have it posted up somewhere but I dug around a bit and couldn't find it. It should help me get my BT 1886 curve set correctly when I decide to try it.
I calibrate with an i1 Display Pro (see above), whatever that means.
Anyway, at some point, probably when I posted the "settings" thread, Y = 0.052 @ 0.015 ftL.
Now, Y = 0.026 @ 0.008 ftL.
Tomorrow, who knows?

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