HP PL4260N and PL5060N Owners Thread - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 08:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobby_t1 View Post

At 9.5' viewing distance I'm still torn on 42" vs 50". I have a RPLCD right now and got a 50" because I watch all 4:3 content as 4:3 due to no fears of burn-in. With50" showing 4:3 contents, I'm getting about equivalent of 40" 4:3 image. I didn't want to get a TV at the tiem and watch it as a size smaller than my 32" CRT.

With a plasma, I woudl stretch everything to 16:9 (i also found out that Media Center's zoom modes are pretty good). So overall the picture is larger, so I'm thinking that a 42" might be better.

Anyone have regrets buying a 42"?

I think that most people on this forum say to go bigger then you think you need, that being said, I am still going with the 42" and I am 9 1/2 feet back in a room that is only 12'x 13', I just feel that a 50" would look too big in my little "dungeon"
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post #182 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 09:27 AM
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i just wet over 200 hrs this weekend i hav had my pl4260n for 30 days now and i still see alot of image ret. especially whn playn 360 i mostly play the nba2k6 and after one game 7min quarters i can see the xbox 360 sign in the corner it goes away after i watch tv for a couple hours is this bad tht i keep doin tht. why r theese tvs so suseptable to image ret. my last plasma wasnt at all. ( u hav to look real close to your set on a black scene and you can see the image ret. plz help am i just being paranoid
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post #183 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 09:35 AM
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Wow, seems like a lot of people are having trouble with this decision as well as myself. Good to know I'm not alone. I've found that this comparison site has helped me a lot.
http://www.cavecreations.com/tv2.cgi

While the 50" would be nice, I think a 42" will be fine and I'll use the extra money for other stuff. Besides, the next time I go to buy a TV a 50" (10+ years) it will probably cost about half of what it does today.
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post #184 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 09:39 AM
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I just brought the 5060 home from BB last Friday and installed it in place of a 50" Vizio on the wall.
I love the black and speakerless look of the 5060 and which looked perfect matching my spks on the side.

That said, the jury is still out regarding the PQ.
I'm now starting to thing there's a reason why manufacturers just don't go listening to their customers and just make TVs with a nice black finish all around.
Its because comparisons with the black frame to the depth of its black level will be very obvious.
With the silver Pany's, the black level, which I'm sure is already quite good, will look even better in contrast.

I first saw the 5060 in Ken Cranes next to the Pioneer Elite.
Subsequently, BB has the 5060 next to a Pioneer as well!!
I'll say its tough to compare the 5060 next to the almighty Pios at > $2k more.
I guess HP don't have enough clout yet in the TV dept. to avoid sitting next to the obvious.
Try as I may but understandly so, I just could not match the PQs.

In short, there are at least three major drawbacks to the 5060:

1 - The black levels are just not, eh, black enough and no amount of tuning can get you there. Some scenes are better than others and obviously its dependent on the scene. One may not missed it if you no other frame of reference.
2 - As mentioned by someone else here, I have that tiny scan? line at the top of the display as well. This appears in some situations, both hd and non-hd. The HD source I recall was a 720p, 4:3, so that might have something to do with it.
3 - Also as mentioned here, the tv is just not as 'smooth' as the better ones. There is an element of edginess that may be toned down quite a bit with the sharpness settings. I finally settled on ~20 but still not quite what I'm used to. The up side is that it did seem more detailed than the others including the 50" Pioneer Elite which I though missed details in the darker portions of the scene. Again, it could be an adjustment thing.

I have mine hooked up via HDMI to a Sony DVR and via comp to a Sony DVD at 480p.

Hint #1:
The set comes defaulted to energy saving. Change that in the system menu and startup will be instantaneous.

Hint #2:
Only use the User Mode. The other settings are horrendous. Once mine was adjusted in User Mode, the black levels as well as PQ were much, much better. The big ones are brightness, contrast and sharpness. This is very evident when you use the Screen button to toggle through the different Modes.

Good luck.
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post #185 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 09:46 AM
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cool xsn0 wht do u hav your settings at my brite and contrast r at 36 and sharpness 50 i think it looks great but if you could help me i would appreciate it hav u also noticed the bad image ret.
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post #186 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 09:54 AM
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i read in the manuel the first couple of pages it says whn a static image is left on the screen for an extended period it darkens the image or sumthn like tht i will let u know the exact page # whn i get home but i asked hp and they didnt kno wht i was talkn about. yesterday i was playn nba2k6 and the whole screen got alot darker just all of a sudden it was the 4th quarter so the ticker had been ther for like 35 mins or so but the ticker disappears whn replays are shown and i always let the replays play. can anyone help me or has anyone experianced the same thing
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post #187 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 10:13 AM
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XSN0 - - - Could you post your user settings please? The edginess of DVD's(even progressive scan) is driving me crazy. I must say that HDTV looks pretty awesome, but 480P dvd sources look average at best.
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post #188 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 10:18 AM
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xsn0, how does the 5060 compare to the Vizio 50'' set?
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post #189 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 10:31 AM
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I'll post my current settings when I get home tonight.
After numerous tries, I think my brightness is around 30 while brightness is at 50 or even more. This is to counter the lack of contrast I perceive with this screen.

I haven't noticed any image retention or at least enough to bother me.

I thought the Vizio was pretty good PQ-wise but left a whole lot to be desired. There was noise from the two fans, osd kinda sucks and if you complain about the HP's remote, well ... Overall, the product design is not there and the immaturity shows. In the end, I didn't want to end up with a no name brand unit without any history. Especially since I've heard the return rate is quite high and there are now other offerings for a few hundy more.
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post #190 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 10:47 AM
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is the image ret. tht i am seeing normal am i worrying to much
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post #191 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 10:55 AM
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can anyone answer my #186 post
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post #192 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 11:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikejb4 View Post

i read in the manuel the first couple of pages it says whn a static image is left on the screen for an extended period it darkens the image or sumthn like tht i will let u know the exact page # whn i get home but i asked hp and they didnt kno wht i was talkn about. yesterday i was playn nba2k6 and the whole screen got alot darker just all of a sudden it was the 4th quarter so the ticker had been ther for like 35 mins or so but the ticker disappears whn replays are shown and i always let the replays play. can anyone help me or has anyone experianced the same thing

I too saw something about that in the owners manual. It's some form of protection against burn-in. I haven't experienced it though. I'm pretty careful about not leaving an image on the screen. I do remember wondering exactly how the technology works when I read that. I guess the system must know if a certain pixel or field of pixels is/are displaying the same exact color/brightness (i.e. a menu bar) for more than a specified period of time.
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post #193 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 12:57 PM
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Within the last hour or so, I've decided to return the HP.
The decision was made pretty easy when I found out one of the sponsors here is selling the Pany 8uk *less* than the HP. Add the much delayed hdmi board and shipping cost but save on the sales tax and it even cost less than the HP and shipped as well.

Sight unseen and sure its last years model but it will be tough to not be happy with a commercial Pany. Besides I don't need the spks nor tuner.

This is definitely the end of my hauling 50" screens back and forth.

Good luck.
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post #194 of 2219 Old 05-01-2006, 04:22 PM
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[quote=flyjar]Wow, seems like a lot of people are having trouble with this decision as well as myself. Good to know I'm not alone. I've found that this comparison site has helped me a lot.

Thanks for the reference. I've been trying to figure out how a new 42" plasma would compare in size to my old 36" crt. This told me exactly what I needed to know.

lowbar
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post #195 of 2219 Old 05-02-2006, 08:40 AM - Thread Starter
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[quote=lowbar]
Quote:
Originally Posted by flyjar View Post

Wow, seems like a lot of people are having trouble with this decision as well as myself. Good to know I'm not alone. I've found that this comparison site has helped me a lot.

Thanks for the reference. I've been trying to figure out how a new 42" plasma would compare in size to my old 36" crt. This told me exactly what I needed to know.

lowbar

If you're coming from a 4:3 36" CRT, keep in mind that a 42" TV will display 4:3 content (with black bars on the side) in a 34" box. This would of course only be the case when NOT using any of the HP's zoom features. I'm talking strictly about displaying 4:3 content with side bars.

A 50" plasma would display 4:3 content in a 41" block. So, the 50" would make 4:3 content larger than what you're used to with that 36" CRT. The 42", on the other hand, would be a step backwards and cause you to loose a couple of inches when displaying 4:3 content. Just something to keep in mind
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post #196 of 2219 Old 05-02-2006, 09:10 AM
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XSNO - Where are you finding that panny? I'd love to get into a 42" in that model.
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post #197 of 2219 Old 05-02-2006, 09:23 AM
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[EDIT] Visual Apex.
I see they have the 42" 8uk also.

Good luck.
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post #198 of 2219 Old 05-02-2006, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobby_t1 View Post

At 9.5' viewing distance I'm still torn on 42" vs 50". I have a RPLCD right now and got a 50" because I watch all 4:3 content as 4:3 due to no fears of burn-in. With50" showing 4:3 contents, I'm getting about equivalent of 40" 4:3 image. I didn't want to get a TV at the tiem and watch it as a size smaller than my 32" CRT.

With a plasma, I woudl stretch everything to 16:9 (i also found out that Media Center's zoom modes are pretty good). So overall the picture is larger, so I'm thinking that a 42" might be better.

Anyone have regrets buying a 42"?

I'm at 9' from my 50"; my first impression (coming from a 31" CRT) was ohmigod, it's huge when viewing "normal" TV. I'm getting used to it now, and anyway, I bought it for a future home theater and wanted the bigger set. For movies it's awesome. A friend has a 42" Pioneer, and at 12' viewing it looks way too small. Of course he also has a home theater with a 65" RPCRT for the big experience.

John
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post #199 of 2219 Old 05-02-2006, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikejb4 View Post

i just wet over 200 hrs this weekend i hav had my pl4260n for 30 days now and i still see alot of image ret. especially whn playn 360 i mostly play the nba2k6 and after one game 7min quarters i can see the xbox 360 sign in the corner it goes away after i watch tv for a couple hours is this bad tht i keep doin tht. why r theese tvs so suseptable to image ret. my last plasma wasnt at all. ( u hav to look real close to your set on a black scene and you can see the image ret. plz help am i just being paranoid

Have you tried the "white wash" in the menu?

John
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post #200 of 2219 Old 05-02-2006, 09:58 AM
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the white wash helps to remove image ret. not prevent it. I am askn why this panel is so suseptable to image ret. and is that normal i had a gateway plasma b4 the hp and i never noticed any image ret. but the contrast on the gateway was only 500:1 not 10000:1 does that make a differance? by the way thanx for tryn to help falsedown wht kind of plasma do u got
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post #201 of 2219 Old 05-02-2006, 01:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikejb4 View Post

the white wash helps to remove image ret. not prevent it. I am askn why this panel is so suseptable to image ret. and is that normal i had a gateway plasma b4 the hp and i never noticed any image ret. but the contrast on the gateway was only 500:1 not 10000:1 does that make a differance? by the way thanx for tryn to help falsedown wht kind of plasma do u got

Have you adjusted the brightness and contrast down for the first few hundred hours? Watching stuff in Vivid mode isn't necessarily a good idea early on. Playing video games early on might not be the best idea either.
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post #202 of 2219 Old 05-02-2006, 04:52 PM
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I definetly notice the image rention....I have probably put about 15 hours on this tv so far. I noticed that if the fox logo is even on the screen for about 2 min, there is rentention on the screen. And it takes a while to go away. For example I just turned on my tv and I noticed that the initializing HP logo was still there after the tv booted up. I also noticed text from the menu there after only 20 sec....wierd....I hope this problem gets better after a while, I am woried about burn in at this point.

-sm
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post #203 of 2219 Old 05-03-2006, 11:50 AM
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I haven't noticed any burn in yet on my 42 inch, but I also turned down the brightness and contrast levels before using it.
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post #204 of 2219 Old 05-03-2006, 12:10 PM
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my bite and contrast is at 35 so thts not it and im way over 200 hrs so thts not it either and redbandit i am way over breakin mode and it is the same ret. but it does seem to disappear faster than a month ago
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post #205 of 2219 Old 05-03-2006, 12:18 PM
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did anyone use avia or any other calib disk? if so can u plz let me know the right settings plz?
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post #206 of 2219 Old 05-03-2006, 12:34 PM
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thx we are talkn about image retention not burn in. But thanx for the help its not a huge deal im just wondern why some people notice it and others dont. i think its mostly people dont kno how to look for it. i guess most everyone who bought this set is a newbie to the ht world. dont get me wrong im no expert i just hoped to find one here
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post #207 of 2219 Old 05-03-2006, 01:01 PM
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the only reason why i am so interested is bcuz i had one of the worst looking plasmas of all time gateway/sampo the pq was just horrible compare to the hp or any other panel for tht matter. anyways, i never once seen any image ret. at all n i used to watch espn all day n 360 all nite. and i didnt even know about break in period or lower contrast in fact my gateway was always set to 100 contrast which was the max bcuz the pq was so dark. why is the hp so suseptable to image ret does it mean burn is easier to get on the hp?
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post #208 of 2219 Old 05-04-2006, 12:19 PM
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I just got my PL4260N yesterday from BB. I'll share my limited experience thus far before I ask for your advice on my tuner problem.

I haven't satisfied myself with the DVD quality just yet. I used a non-progressive scan Sony via component cables with mixed results. I tried the only other player I have right now, a cheapo Cyberhome with progressive scan via component. Neither of them were spectacular. The edges are still a little to jaggy for my liking.

I don't really have an issue with the menus but it's my first plasma and I have nothing else to compare to.

The remote is very direction sensitive. If you're close to the TV like when you're adjusting the OTA antenna, and you try to hit the Info button to check the signal strength, it gets to be frustrating. You have to aim at the IR receiver. It may just be that the menu is trying to lock up on me. I'm not sure.

HD 720P and 1080i looks awesome! although I had a sound/picture sync issue on our local CBS affiliate. Would that be a local issue or a station issue most likely?

Now for my problems/questions:
I'm on analog cable for about three more weeks because I'm moving into a new house where I will use Dish HD (most likely). I'm currently using the built in tuner.

I know that the pic will be better after I move and I hope my switching issue I will describe will go away in the process.

First, for the equipment:
I bought an indoor UHF/VHF Philips antenna from Wallyworld:
Philips MANT410

Now, it has a pass through where you feed the cable TV signal into the back. There is a power switch to turn the signal booster on and off and another switch to toggle between the OTA or Cable TV signal.

Now, the antenna issues:
When it works OTA for HD, it's great. However, performance seemed to drop significantly when I connected the cable TV signal to it even though nothing else had changed (same position, switch still on "Antenna"). It also seems to degrade my CATV signal to almost no picture at all even when I've changed the built in TV tuner back to CATV and switched the antenna to the same. So, there most likely has to be something better out there that is UHF/VHF and near the same price. I heard good things about a Radio Shack antenna but the exact model doesn't appear to be in production anymore. I know I'm asking a lot from a $30 indoor antenna too.

When I get to the new crib, I plan to use an attic based antenna with a signal booster. Almost all of my OTA broadcasts will come from within 7 degrees of each other so a decent antenna should do the trick.

Now for my TV related issue:
When I decide to watch broadcast HD or DTV (SD), I have to move the signal source from cable to antenna. At that point, the set wants to scan all analog channels to update the channel list. I don't really have a problem with that on the first time I switch there. However, when I want to go back to cable, the TV has totally forgotten all of the cable channels and I have to go through another scan. I know when you switch between signal sources (antenna/vs CATV), you can cancel the channel scan and I wouldn't mind having to do that if it remembered my DTV OTA settings but it doesn't.

In a nutshell, is there some way to intertwine the channel lineup where the source for one channel is OTA and the source for the next is CATV? If it were possible, can it be done with an OTA antenna and CATV feed without having to buy additional electronics? I can handle the purchase of a splitter or switch if necessary but I hardly want to spend big bucks for a month of TV. I'll worry more about the solution after I move. As I said earlier, I hope it will go away.

Once I have a Dish (jury's still out on which HD setup I should get): when you pay $5 extra a month for locals (in HD if/when available I assUme), doesn't the provider squash the signal a little to free up some headroom for other channels? Or, do they just put that little worthless antenna on the top of your dish and pull it down OTA like you originally would anyway? Does the Dish box allow you to mix sources and still channel surf or do you have to switch manually between OTA and Sat?

Finally, is there any Dish hardware with DVR that's previous to the latest HD receivers that will receive HD and not incur a monthly DVR fee? If I buy my own DVR, could it be possible to record HD signals from my Dish HD receiver? I'm still torn on which receiver to get. Since the 4260 doesn't have PIP built in, if I get the dual tuner HD receiver, will it bring PIP or POP capability with it? If not, it would seem cheaper to buy the single tuner without the DVR and purchase my own DVR if I can still record the HD signals. I'm going to post the Dish related questions over in the Dish forum but I thought I'd ask here too since it's somewhat specific to my TV.

Thanks in advance if you made it this far in all of my rambling,
Jeff

Update! I've seen the light! Check out my later post. I got the reception and switching figured out and I tweaked the pic settins as well. Much much better.

I'm looking forward to a world without wires. The only time you should ever need a wire is to transfer power. Correction, now there's wireless power transfer.
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post #209 of 2219 Old 05-04-2006, 12:23 PM
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What are the titles of some of the calibration disks and can you pick them up locally in most cases? I saw one at Kmart the other day. I'm not sure if it's worth the $15 there or not.
Thanks again,
Jeff

I'm looking forward to a world without wires. The only time you should ever need a wire is to transfer power. Correction, now there's wireless power transfer.
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post #210 of 2219 Old 05-04-2006, 06:35 PM
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Get the Dish 622 DVR, you will have pip, but not pop.
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