Official Panasonic PX75U / PX77U Owners Thread *NO PRICE TALK* - Page 5 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #121 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 06:32 AM
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Anyone try XBOX 360/PS3/Wii yet on either display? I am considering getting the 42" 77u but wanted to know how it looked with games. How is burn-in on these sets? Thanks in advance!
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post #122 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 11:50 AM
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Can the 77u do 1:1 pixel mapping?
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post #123 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 12:04 PM
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Just pulled the trigger on a 5075U! Got it for $2700 CAN including delivery and that price I just couldn't say no.
My wife is happy too! We are getting rid of our 51" Hitachi CRT RPTV (great pic, but a real behemoth! She has always hated it. )
Are there any break-in settings posted anywhere and is anyone using DVE or Avia to calibrate their sets?
I'm a happy camper!
Rob
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post #124 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mackiefan View Post

Just pulled the trigger on a 5075U! Got it for $2700 CAN including delivery and that price I just couldn't say no.
My wife is happy too! We are getting rid of our 51" Hitachi CRT RPTV (great pic, but a real behemoth! She has always hated it. )
Are there any break-in settings posted anywhere and is anyone using DVE or Avia to calibrate their sets?
I'm a happy camper!
Rob


Here is the forum (a link to the dvd download is on the first post, click on the blue "Here" - I used the ISO file for 7 days straight with Picture and Brightness at -10:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=583089

take a look at this too:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=608677
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post #125 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 01:00 PM
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Some worrisome thoughts

I heard that the 75U and possibly the 77U were downgrades from last years 60U models. Is there any truth to these rumors?

Specifically I heard that:

1) the fans were removed from the 75U sets that were in the 60U sets. If that is true, there would be a possibility of the plasma overheating which would lower the lifespan of the TV set.

2) smaller speakers were put into the 75U sets compared to the 60U sets. Because of these smaller speakers, I was told that there was noticeable decrease in the quality of the speakers and the speakers were not as loud.

I dont want to cast doubt on anyone who purchased the 75U sets, I just want to confirm or deny these rumors. It seems Panasonic's goal is to keep the picture quality high while lowering both the price and the weight. The longevity and internal speaker quality is important to me though.
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post #126 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 01:01 PM
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Thanks to this thread, I'm now back to trying to decide on my second plasma!
I was all set to pull the trigger on a 50" 600U when I stumbled upon this thread. I have a bright room and get glare on my existing Phillips 42" plasma. I'll be replacing that one with a 50" but it sounds like the 77U is the way to go. Can anyone give me advise on a wall mount that works well with the 77U?
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post #127 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisdab View Post

Some worrisome thoughts

I heard that the 75U and possibly the 77U were downgrades from last years 60U models. Is there any truth to these rumors?

Specifically I heard that:

1) the fans were removed from the 75U sets that were in the 60U sets. If that is true, there would be a possibility of the plasma overheating which would lower the lifespan of the TV set.

2) smaller speakers were put into the 75U sets compared to the 60U sets. Because of these smaller speakers, I was told that there was noticeable decrease in the quality of the speakers and the speakers were not as loud.

I dont want to cast doubt on anyone who purchased the 75U sets, I just want to confirm or deny these rumors. It seems Panasonic's goal is to keep the picture quality high while lowering both the price and the weight. The longevity and internal speaker quality is important to me though.


Also in this regard, can anyone definitively answer a question that has been asked many times on this thread, but never answered. Besides Anti-Glare, what is the difference between the 75u and 77u?
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post #128 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danfiveoh View Post

Thanks to this thread, I'm now back to trying to decide on my second plasma!
I was all set to pull the trigger on a 50" 600U when I stumbled upon this thread. I have a bright room and get glare on my existing Phillips 42" plasma. I'll be replacing that one with a 50" but it sounds like the 77U is the way to go. Can anyone give me advise on a wall mount that works well with the 77U?


Read the entire thread - I did
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post #129 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisdab View Post

Some worrisome thoughts

I heard that the 75U and possibly the 77U were downgrades from last years 60U models. Is there any truth to these rumors?

Specifically I heard that:

1) the fans were removed from the 75U sets that were in the 60U sets. If that is true, there would be a possibility of the plasma overheating which would lower the lifespan of the TV set.

2) smaller speakers were put into the 75U sets compared to the 60U sets. Because of these smaller speakers, I was told that there was noticeable decrease in the quality of the speakers and the speakers were not as loud.

I dont want to cast doubt on anyone who purchased the 75U sets, I just want to confirm or deny these rumors. It seems Panasonic's goal is to keep the picture quality high while lowering both the price and the weight. The longevity and internal speaker quality is important to me though.

I was a little concerned about the fan deletions too. The 77U runs amazingly cool, and makes zero noise...fans are not needed, IMHO. The back is very well ventilated and generates less heat than my old 40inch XBR800. As long as you have it on a wall or stand and not tucked away in a tight wall unit, you should have no worries.
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post #130 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dya View Post

Also in this regard, can anyone definitively answer a question that has been asked many times on this thread, but never answered. Besides Anti-Glare, what is the difference between the 75u and 77u?

The primary differences are the 77U's Anti-glare coating, and side-firing speakers, the 75U speakers are not side firing.

OK, here it goes. According to the Panasonic website...
77U has the following - the 75U Does NOT:

Anti-glare coating

Color Purity Optimizer (3D Color Management)

Photo Viewer

CableCARD Ready
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post #131 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 02:07 PM
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The info that I have seen says that the 77U is not cable card ready.
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post #132 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 02:59 PM
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Panasonic's website says: CableCARD Ready - No. AFAIK none of the 2007 models are CableCard ready - looks like they've completely dropped them from their lineup.

Randy
Sony 55W800B, Panasonic TC-P55ST60, TiVo Roamio Pro, TWC Arris DCX3600-M 6-Tuner DVR, Onkyo TX-SR333 AVR, URC MX-890, MX-780, MX-450, MX-500 Remotes.
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post #133 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blding_THX View Post

I was a little concerned about the fan deletions too. The 77U runs amazingly cool, and makes zero noise...fans are not needed, IMHO. The back is very well ventilated and generates less heat than my old 40inch XBR800. As long as you have it on a wall or stand and not tucked away in a tight wall unit, you should have no worries.

So you can verify that the 77 does not have fans like the 75? I have been wondering. I was able to look at a pz700 and it DOES have fans.
So how is the sound?
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post #134 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 03:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisdab View Post

Some worrisome thoughts

I heard that the 75U and possibly the 77U were downgrades from last years 60U models. Is there any truth to these rumors?

Specifically I heard that:

1) the fans were removed from the 75U sets that were in the 60U sets. If that is true, there would be a possibility of the plasma overheating which would lower the lifespan of the TV set.

2) smaller speakers were put into the 75U sets compared to the 60U sets. Because of these smaller speakers, I was told that there was noticeable decrease in the quality of the speakers and the speakers were not as loud.

I dont want to cast doubt on anyone who purchased the 75U sets, I just want to confirm or deny these rumors. It seems Panasonic's goal is to keep the picture quality high while lowering both the price and the weight. The longevity and internal speaker quality is important to me though.

No they are definitly not downgrades They did change some features to lower the cost but added a lot more so I feel they are much better sets overall.

They do not have PIP if they did before since that would require two tuners and most people buying these sets get their programming from Satellite or cable
The fans were removed as they are not really needed with the redesign of the circuit boards and better ventilated back and they were a source of noise to some.
I can't speak for the speakers on the 75's but on the 77 series they are on the side and are said to have good sound. The specs though seem to indicate they are the same but I think the side positioning can't help but let them sound better. You can always add your own
I see also in the specs that the 77 has a Color Purity Optimizer (3D Color Management and the 75 only has a Digital comb filter.
with the antiglare and the decreased spread in cost between the two I think the 77 is a slam dunk choice.
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post #135 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 03:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zelig2 View Post

Can the 77u do 1:1 pixel mapping?


I'd like to know this as well, any answers?
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post #136 of 5991 Old 05-22-2007, 07:31 PM
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Two questions:

Quote:


Color Purity Optimizer (3D Color Management)

What does this do, is it a big improvement over previous models?

Quote:


Photo Viewer

The normal SD slot allows us to view photo's already right?
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post #137 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 03:08 AM
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The info I posted was from their EPP site - on the external site - it says the 77U is NOT CableCard Ready.

The 77U does not have a single fan on it - No Fans.

I think the 3D Color Management replaces the Comb Filter...just a hunch, I really don't know.

Not sure about the mapping - should I be concerned about that - is that a way to locate a dead pixel?
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post #138 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 06:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YOTR View Post

Anyone try XBOX 360/PS3/Wii yet on either display? I am considering getting the 42" 77u but wanted to know how it looked with games. How is burn-in on these sets? Thanks in advance!


I have a 50" 77u and the Xbox 360 looks great. The difference between my 32 inch tube and this set is unbelievable. Since the set is new we haven't done more than a few minutes with games but the picture quality is great.

jerry
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post #139 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 06:26 AM
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Head's up for all the Canadians. I spotted the 50PX77 in a Future Shop last night. Looks like they just set it up as there was no signal going to the TV but that anti-glare finish works great.
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post #140 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 06:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WLSINWI View Post

So you can verify that the 77 does not have fans like the 75? I have been wondering. I was able to look at a pz700 and it DOES have fans.
So how is the sound?

No fans on the 77u. And other than a little transformer whine you can hear a 6 inches or so, no noise. The screen is warm when you are running a bright image like the burn in cd for a long time (10+ hours). But the electronics in the back are cool.

jerry
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post #141 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 08:30 AM
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Since the cable card question has come up, my advise is don't let the lack of a cable card influence your buying decision. I have a Philips with a cable card and after 18 months, took it out and connected a STB. I can tell no difference in PQ but it sure is nice to have the guide and on demand functions back. I had comcast out several times dealing with cable card issues and every tech told me that they have continual problems, no matter what make or model of plasma.
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post #142 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 09:14 AM
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Does anyone have their 77U hooked up to the DirecTV HR20-700?

The picture on my local HD is just incredible over HDMI. Sometimes there is a sync issue, but if there is - it's very hard to notice. My wife can't tell if it's there or not. For listening with the Sony ES, I tweaked the center channel delay to 14ms.

Also, what video settings are you using with the HR20?
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post #143 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 09:37 AM
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So is there a consensus opinion on how to burn-in on the Panny's? I've seen a burn-in DVD mentioned, but some suggest watching TV as normal just without any black bars.
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post #144 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dya View Post

Also in this regard, can anyone definitively answer a question that has been asked many times on this thread, but never answered. Besides Anti-Glare, what is the difference between the 75u and 77u?

with the new panny msrp price drops on the 75/77 only $100 diff now, cool. congrats to panny on dropping prices on new models out only a month. now start cutting the pz too .

HD HD HD I Need more HD, Yes I am a HD Addict :)
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post #145 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 11:10 AM
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Yes, there is, this is the infamous 'White Paper' by Panasonic back in 2004. It still applies today even though the technology has greatly improved. Weather or not your using the burn-in / break-in dvd, you should turn your picture & brightness down (-10 or so) for the first 200 hours and aviod stationary logos such as score boards, and station logos.

Sorry for the monster post, but this is after all a Panny thread.

Panasonic Presents Advice from The Video Purist Perspective
Commissioned by Panasonic
November 2004

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY

The 21st Century display technology called plasma TV looks, operates and performs unlike any previous device. No other television today offers the form factor, screen size and performance of plasma. The purpose of this report is to provide in-depth information about plasma technology. You will learn how plasma operates, the truth about plasma life span, the so-called uneven aging phenomenon, and maintenance. Performance criteria will also be examined so you can determine if a plasma panel is right for you.


HOW IT WORKS

Plasma displays use three types of phosphors (red, green, and blue). Like a standard cathode ray tube (CRT) TV the phosphors glow to create an image. The difference lies in the way the phosphors glow. In a CRT, electrons strike the phosphors causing them to glow. A plasma display contains a combination of inert gases. Electrodes inside the glass panel charge the gas, resulting in the production of invisible ultra violet (UV) light. When the UV light strikes the phosphors, they glow, producing a brilliant picture.


ADVANTAGES OF PLASMA

Plasma TVs offer excellent color saturation, very wide viewing angles in both horizontal and vertical planes, and are equaled only by the bulky flat-faced direct-view sets based on traditional CRT technology. Their rapid response times assure crisp images even when fast motion is present, such as when viewing football or other fast-moving sporting events. Plasma televisions provide image brightness at a level far higher than large-screen projection displays, allowing for viewing in areas of high ambient light without washing out picture detail. (There are no direct-view CRT sets with comparable screen sizes to plasmas that are 42 inches or larger.) Panasonic black levels are close to direct view CRT levels, permitting superb deep blacks and outstanding viewing in dark environments. Panasonic contrast ratios are rated as high as 4000:1. Current LCD flat panels cannot achieve the dark black levels or contrast ratios of plasma in a home theater environment. Panasonic makes plasma panels in widescreen (16:9 aspect ratio) with enhanced-definition, commonly known as 480p, (37 & 42 have 852 pixels measured horizontally (H) by 480 pixels measured vertically (V)) and high definition resolutions (37=1024 H x 720 V; 42= 1024 H x 768 V; 50 and 65 1366 H x 768 V).


LIFESPAN

There has been much misinformation about the longevity of today's plasma TVs. Like all other display devices, there are two parts to a television. The first is the internal electronics. Modern circuit designs are extremely reliable and all televisions, including plasma's circuits, are designed to provide extremely long life. The second part is the section of the television that produces light.

In plasma, it is the phosphors within the glass panel. Phosphors are used to produce an image in standard picture tube (CRT) televisions as well, and in three-CRT rear projectors.

Television manufacturers base the projected life of all TVs on half brightness, meaning the time it takes for the display to create an image that's only half as bright as when the TV was new. The three-CRT rear projector is generally rated at 15,000 hours until half-brightness. Direct-view CRTs are generally rated to 30,000 hours. Panasonic plasmas have a half brightness rating of 60,000 hours - four times the life of CRT rear projection. This equates to more than twenty-three years at seven hours a day viewing, around the average daily TV viewing time per U.S. household. With its inherent high brightness, a Panasonic plasma will likely retain its image quality for many years.


MYTHS REGARDING PLASMAS

While a CRT direct-view television is an analog device that uses a picture tube and the plasma is a digital device, there are many similarities between the two technologies. As noted, each display uses phosphors to create light. While a direct-view picture tube operates in a vacuum, and the plasma screen uses inert gases, both are completely sealed. There is no possibility of the gas leaking out (barring physically breaking the panel), and there is never a need to recharge or refill the plasma panel. Conversely, there is no possibility of moisture leaking in, it can never fog up like a car windshield and, unlike an incandescent light bulb, a plasma panel doesn't suddenly burn out.


POWER CONSUMPTION

All Panasonic plasmas are Energy Star® compliant insuring low power consumption in standby mode (a mere 18 watts), when compared with non-Energy Star® models. The maximum power consumption during use depends on screen size; the 37-inch diagonal models, for example, are rated at 345 watts maximum. However, typical power consumption is much lower and varies depending on picture content and display settings such as brightness and contrast. With typical content and display settings, Panasonic plasmas have virtually the same power consumption as similar-sized LCD TVs.


BURN-IN

Much has been written about the possibility of permanently marking a plasma screen by viewing a static image on the screen for too long. This is often referred to as static image burn in, which is a misnomer. The phosphors are never burnt, rather they are unevenly aged. While the possibility of uneven aging exists, it can also occur with any other phosphor-based display such as a direct-view CRT television or CRT rear projection TV. Panasonic has developed new phosphors that are resistant to image burn-in and has added other features that minimize its occurrence. One such feature imperceptibly moves the image around the screen to eliminate sharp delineations between dark and light areas.

There are several simple steps to take to further prevent the possibility of image burn-in which should be performed during the break-in period.


PLASMA BREAK-IN

Like a fine new automobile, the performance of a plasma TV can be optimized by allowing a break-in period. By properly following these simple break-in instructions, you should be rewarded with long-term enjoyment of your plasma TV.

Plasma phosphors are most susceptible to image retention in the first hundred hours of use. The panel becomes considerably less sensitive to burn-in after this period.

Very often, televisions, including plasma, are shipped from the factory with the contrast control at a high setting to provide a bright picture under typical dealer showroom lighting conditions. In your home, the room light levels are usually one half or less than that in retail showrooms. The contrast control may need to be lowered in your home for comfortable contrast levels that do not induce eye strain.

When the plasma is initially installed, videophiles say it is best to do the following:

* Make sure the display is in a viewing mode (aspect ratio) that completely fills the screen (there are often three or more settings from which to choose). The panel is shipped in this condition, in what is called the Just mode.

* Turn down the picture control (contrast) to 50% or less.

* Briefly engage the 4:3 mode to confirm the side bars are set to mid-gray (there is usually an adjustment in the Set Up menu that takes the sidebars from black to gray) to minimize the chance of burn-in.

* Return the set to a full screen (Just, Zoom, Full) position during the first hundred hours of use.

* During the first hundred hours of use it is best not to view the same channel for extended periods. This should prevent channel logos and other fixed images found on some channels from being retained.

* Avoid any static images (video games, computer images, DVD title screens, etc.) during the hundred-hour break-in.


After the hundred-hour break-in period, during the next nine-hundred hours:

* Continue to retain the picture setting at 50% or less.

* Limit the use of 4:3 aspect ratio mode (traditional picture size that does not fill the entire screen) to 15% of viewing time.

* Limit the use of static images (computer, video games, etc.) to less than 10% of viewing time.


After one-thousand viewing hours, panels are much less likely to experience image burn-in.


WHAT TO DO IF YOU SEE A GHOST IMAGE ON THE SCREEN

In the rare event you begin to see a ghost image on the display, Panasonic has incorporated a built-in white-bar scroll feature to assist you. When enabled, the scroll will (in many cases) reduce or eliminate image retention. Consult Panasonic customer service for any technical support issues (800-211-7262 or http://www.panasonic.com/support/).


PANASONIC PLASMA PICTURE QUALITY

Panasonic has included several exclusive features to provide the best picture of any plasma television available. Here are the performance features that best separate Panasonic plasma from the competition, as well as other technologies.


CONTRAST RATIO AND DIGITAL ARTIFACTS

Earlier generations of plasma displays lacked true blacks and dark area clarity, causing washed-out low-level detail and requiring viewing only in rooms with relatively high levels of ambient light. Panasonic has developed the exclusive Real Black Drive system that allows the shut off of individual picture elements (pixels) within the panel, to produce a true deep black. Panasonic's Gamma Enhancement System allows near-black image information to be reproduced accurately. In addition, the Gamma Enhancement System increases the number of gradient steps, eliminating unnatural dithering artifacts that may degrade image quality. Dithering artifacts are often noticed in programs with gradual brightness transitions, such as wide blue-sky scenes. A dithered sky breaks up into tile-like areas of varying brightness levels, instead of a smooth, uniform, natural expanse. The combination of these Panasonic breakthroughs increases rated contrast ratios, up to 4000:1, and allows Panasonic plasmas to reproduce 1536 different shades from black to white. Many competitors' designs are limited to only 256 steps, resulting in disturbing picture artifacts.


COLOR

Panasonic plasmas reproduce more than 1 billion colors, providing a rich natural palette for superb reproduction of movies, broadcasts and home videos. Many competing plasmas can only reproduce less than 17 million colors.


ANGLE OF VIEW

Plasma provides a bright, vivid high-contrast image with uniformity in both the horizontal and vertical viewing planes. Flat LCD panels lose contrast as viewing angle approaches the extreme. Only flat-faced direct-view CRT televisions have similar viewing angles, but without the slim form factor that plasma affords. Providing a remarkable picture at virtually any angle assures that everyone in the viewing room regardless if they are sitting, standing or even lying on the floor will see the same crisp clear images.


RISE/DECAY TIMES

Plasma displays react very quickly to picture changes insuring exceptional viewing of fast motion found in sports programs. Flat LCD panels often have slower response times causing blurring with action and sports material.


CONCLUSIONS

As a relatively new technology, plasma faces challenges in the form of misinformation; possible misuse by the consumer; and myths previously assigned to preceding technologies that are carried over to the new. Hopefully this report has met these challenges by reviewing plasma not in terms of strengths or weaknesses, but in terms of actual capabilities and well-researched practices to achieve the best consumer experience possible.

Plasma is a superior technology in its obvious display capabilities but also in its longevity potential. With your attention to a few important settings and practices, plasma will provide you with an exciting and reliable viewing experience for years to come
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post #146 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 11:18 AM
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post #147 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

I would think that you'd see the dreaded SDE big-time on a 58" 768p at your viewing distance. On my friend's 50" Panny i see SDE at 11 feet so i imagine a bigger screen would be even worse. I sit 8-9 feet from my 42" 768p set and if i lean forward in my chair SDE appears, but goes away when i sit back. You should go to some stores with a tapemeasure and look for SDE at 9 feet on the 58" model to be sure, but i don't see how you can't not see it at 9 feet.

I'd think the 50" 1080p set would be better at 9 feet despite being smaller, unless you really really need that immersive big-screen experience and aren't bothered by or can't see SDE on the 58 incher.

Important to note that these comments only make sense when comparing non-1080p sets. The 700 series sets will have less SDE across the board because they have smaller pixels, and a 58" 700 should have slightly less SDE than a 50" 75/77 even though it is bigger. SDE doesn't get annoying to me until about 8 feet on the 58" 600. I haven't seen a 58" 700 yet but I'm assuming I'll be safe down to 6' or less, which is closer than I will ever sit.
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post #148 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 12:04 PM
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Anyone know if the 77U is capable of 1:1 pixel mapping?
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post #149 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 12:19 PM
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I'd like to pull the trigger and get the TH-42PX77U over the TH-42PX75U based on the anti glare feature but I have two concerns:

1. I haven't seen one in person. All the stores in my area only have the PX75U. Call me old fashion but I'm reluctant to buy something if I haven't seen it in person.

2. The width of the PX77U is 44.7 inches wide. My entertainment center has a TV opening that is 45 ½ inches. Should I be concerned with the tight fit? Will this have a big impact on ventilation and unit heat?

Any thoughts?
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post #150 of 5991 Old 05-23-2007, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dssturbo1 View Post

with the new panny msrp price drops on the 75/77 only $100 diff now, cool. congrats to panny on dropping prices on new models out only a month. now start cutting the pz too .

I am gratefull for the px77 price cut too, that's why I bought one instead of waiting.
I don't expect them to drop the 1080p sets price yet however as they want to milk that set for a while - at least till the Pio sets come out. Its a stragterety game you know.
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Panasonic Th 50px75u 50 Inch 720p Plasma Hdtv , Panasonic Th 42px77u 42 Inch 720p Plasma Hdtv

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