Samsung FPT5084, 50", 1080p, 15000:1 Contrast ratio. - Page 9 - AVS Forum
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post #241 of 4325 Old 07-29-2007, 04:32 PM
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EArkHog,
This a great article that discusses that numbers are not the prime indication of performance. Its to lure the consumer into a marketing ploy. The bigger the contrast ratio numbers the more people believe they have a better picture.

The most important aspect that I got out of the article was:
"You won't be able to discern more than a 100:1 difference between the darkest and lightest objects. Of course, the instant your eye moves, its built-in auto iris function raises and lowers the grayscale boundaries. That's what allows you to perceive shadow detail and also pick out a white cat scurrying along in a field of snow."

This shows us that a 10,000:1 or 15,000:1 contrast ratio is meaningless to picture quality. We as humans can only discern 100:1 from dark to light objects. When I mention shadow detail contrast ratio is a direct reflection to obtaining a great picture. However, not 10,000:1 will indicate that it has great shadow detail.

So to answer your question, contrast, contrast ratio, grayscale, whatever you want to call it, qualifies my reasoning that it is important. Now the huge numbers, for example, 10,000:1 I don't agree with, but are not important or inaccurate reflection of measurement. My signature that I have below qualifies and supports the article that we have read.

That article was a good find...!

Chris
mountavision.com


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Originally Posted by EArkHog View Post

Chris - I recently read this article about gray scale and contrast and their importantance to PQ. And now I notice your sig seems to cast some doubt on the author's credibility. Check it out and see what you think...
http://www.hdtvexpert.com/pages/shmontrast.htm

P.S. If that Onky gets as "warm" as mine, he'll be smelling burning fur before too long.

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post #242 of 4325 Old 07-29-2007, 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted by creemail View Post

EArkHog,

That article was a good find...!

Chris
mountavision.com

Thanks. I get lucky every now and then.

Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool
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post #243 of 4325 Old 07-30-2007, 05:07 PM
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Did I read correctly in the hdtvtest review that the 5084 supported 24p input from the PS3? I thought someone else in this thread looked into it and the answer was "no". Thanks! - Erik
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post #244 of 4325 Old 07-30-2007, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErikJ999 View Post

Did I read correctly in the hdtvtest review that the 5084 supported 24p input from the PS3?

Yes, it does.

How it is displayed however (@72hz like Pioneer or @60hz with 3:2 pulldown) isn't known. Ultimately it doesn't matter how it is displayed, the reviewer noticed that judder was significantly reduced, he had no complaints regarding that. And that's what count imo.
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post #245 of 4325 Old 07-31-2007, 08:15 AM
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any other reviews of this tv? people who own it do you like it?
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post #246 of 4325 Old 07-31-2007, 04:03 PM
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I have one . I bought this one after trying a few xbr3 lcds and two sharps. The colors are great, the style is beutiful. The only thing I have noticed that i dont like is when text is scroling verticaly across the screen, there is a streaking efect. I only notice it when bright text move across a black or dark screen. Other than that i realy like it so far. One thing that scares me is samsung states on the first page of the manual, damage due to burn in is not covered under waranty. Yikes! That statement alone may be enough for me to return it before my 30 day return window closes. Thus far, I do like it beter than any lcd I have tried so far but I am intrested to hear what the reviewers at cnet think, although I did buy an xbr because of their recomendation. Note after a break in period the streaking is gone ! Goes to show I may have jumped the gun on that one. I am actualy realy enjoying this set.
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post #247 of 4325 Old 07-31-2007, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daf365 View Post

I have one . I bought this one after trying a few xbr3 lcds and two sharps. The colors are great, the style is beutiful. The only thing I have noticed that i dont like is when text is scroling verticaly across the screen, there is a streaking efect. I only notice it when bright text move across a black or dark screen. Other than that i realy like it so far. One thing that scares me is samsung states on the first page of the manual, damage due to burn in is not covered under waranty. Yikes! That statement alone may be enough for me to return it before my 30 day return window closes. Thus far, I do like it beter than any lcd I have tried so far but I am intrested to hear what the reviewers at cnet think, although I did buy an xbr because of their recomendation.

I had a 52XBR2 that I returned for a Sammy 5054 Plasma (720p). As long as you let the set break in for a little before you subject it to bars or static images you'll be OK. I watch stuff in in 4:3, and movies with the bars on the top & bottom, cable channels with static logos & tickers, and my son and I game a lot also. We've had no problems with burn-in. Sometimes there is mild IR, but that goes away after you watch something else for a couple of minutes. I'm thinking of returning the 5054 due to a judder issue with tickers & horizontal panning. Otherwise the PQ, IMO blows away the 52XBR. I'm probably going to get a Sammy 5265 because I like the 52" screen vs. the 50" screen, but I know the 5265 won't have the PQ of the 5084. I'm planning to get another Plasma, perhaps in a year, maybe a 58", and move the 5265 to another room for mainly gaming. I think if you're happy with the 50" screen size you made a good choice with the 5084. You get 1080p & 2.2 side mounted speakers, plus way more colors then the 5265 or XBR can display. If I wasn't planning to use the 5265 in another room and I could only have one TV for now, I'd pick the 5084 over the 5265, FWIW.

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post #248 of 4325 Old 07-31-2007, 07:35 PM
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Thanks for chiming in on the burn in. I read today burn in is a problem that is greatly exagerated. Seems that EADGBE is confirming that . Samsung employs several features to protect their sets any way. Honestly, I have already decided to keep this one. I watched The Break up on this T.V. in H.D. and as bad as the movie was, I was stuned by the pq so much so, that I watched every dull minute of it. I agree, the pq blows the xbr away. The xbr looked oustanding when viewed at CC on sonys special 1080p promo but after purchasing it, it failed to awe me in my home. With the samsung, every H.D. movie I watch awes me. Besides , I switched to plasma because xbr lcds pixilate when watching fast movie sports even after adjusting the reality feature. Last thought, I like the set and I will be keeping it.
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post #249 of 4325 Old 07-31-2007, 07:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daf365 View Post

Thanks for chiming in on the burn in. I read today burn in is a problem that is greatly exagerated. Seems that EADGBE is confirming that . Samsung employs several features to protect their sets any way. Honestly, I have already decided to keep this one. I watched The Break up on this T.V. in H.D. and as bad as the movie was, I was stuned by the pq so much so, that I watched every dull minute of it. I agree, the pq blows the xbr away. The xbr looked oustanding when viewed at CC on sonys special 1080p promo but after purchasing it, it failed to awe me in my home. With the samsung, every H.D. movie I watch awes me. Besides , I switched to plasma because xbr lcds pixilate when watching fast movie sports even after adjusting the reality feature. Last thought, I like the set and I will be keeping it.

I was very worried about burn in before I got the 5054, now I wouldn't even worry about it. You really have to abuse a set to suffer from burn in. Just to reiterate, I'm replacing the 5054 with a 5265, but I will eventually get a 58 - 60 PDP as my "main TV" because Plasma has a much better picture then LCD (unless the new LCD's will change this, but somehow I doubt it).

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post #250 of 4325 Old 08-01-2007, 11:46 AM
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FYI - I called up Samsung to get to the bottom of the 1080p via component issue and, while she had no idea what I was talking about, she went over and asked a tech guy and the answer was YES it does support 1080p via component. That verifies an earlier post.

Also, as a plasma newbie with a 5084 on it's way (yay!), can anyone offer me any advice on how I should break my 5084 in? I'm scared of burn-in because I'm adverse to stretching 4:3 signals to 16:9.

Thanks!
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post #251 of 4325 Old 08-01-2007, 09:56 PM
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Good points in this thread. I think the Samsung FP-T5084 is the best thing money can buy currently. I have a Samsung DLP 1080p that I got a while ago and it's great, 0 problems, excellent picture quality, and tons of inputs. Going the plasma route now and definetly want the same picture quality and realibility - it's a no brainer.
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post #252 of 4325 Old 08-02-2007, 05:31 PM
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i saw this tv today at a local circuit city. i got them to come down 10% off the $2699 price tag also. im most likely getting it this week. as for the picture it clearly wasnt set up right and that sucked.

Pioneer 5010FD, Sony 60A3000, Panny 42PZ85U, Yamaha RX-V3800, Denon 4308, B&W 600's, HSU VTF-3 MK3, Def. Tech. bp7004, 2002, 1.2x, 2x, TivoHD, Samsung 1200, harmony 1000, ps3, xbox360, Sony BDP S350
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post #253 of 4325 Old 08-02-2007, 07:04 PM
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I have been noticing jittering on tickers on sd feeds. I don't have hd service as time warner is out of hd boxes, but I haven't noticed it on movies. Man I hope it doesn't jitter while watching sports. I wonder if samsung uses the same proccesor as there 64 series. Every one seems to complain about jitter on that set. Guess Ill check into it.
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post #254 of 4325 Old 08-02-2007, 07:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daf365 View Post

I have been noticing jittering on tickers on sd feeds. I don't have hd service as time warner is out of hd boxes, but I haven't noticed it on movies. Man I hope it doesn't jitter while watching sports. During an explosion frame while playing Ghost Recon 2 I noticed it then too. I wonder if samsung uses the same proccesor as there 64 series. Every one seems to complain about jitter on that set. Guess Ill check into it.

I saw both the 5084 and 5064 side by side in a store and getting the same feed. Had the sales guy put on MSNBC for the ticker. The 5064 clearly showed the jutter, but the 5084 did not. Even went back a second time to look closely and verify it wasn't there.
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post #255 of 4325 Old 08-02-2007, 07:58 PM
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Maybe i am mistaken as to what jutter is. I think Ill hook up another set to see if what I think is jutter is actually a part of the broadcast itself.
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post #256 of 4325 Old 08-02-2007, 08:08 PM
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Here is everything about jitter
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Originally Posted by daf365 View Post

Maybe i am mistaken as to what jutter is. I think Ill hook up another set to see if what I think is jutter is actually a part of the broadcast itself.

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post #257 of 4325 Old 08-03-2007, 09:31 AM
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Ok, so I'm new to HDTV but I have been looking online and just about every brick and mortar place known to man for 2 weeks to decide on my first HDTV. I have narrowed the decisions down to the Sammy LN-T4665F or 61F and the Pio Elite Pro-1140HD and was going to pull the trigger on the 61F until BB put this 5084 on sale and in the same price range as the other models. I had just about ruled out the pio because my room has a lot of ambient light and glare could be a major problem, however I deal with it currently with my old CRT, but spending $2.5K I would like to eliminate this issue...also the reason why I was leaning towards the 61F over the 65F(shiny screen). I have read this entire thread and have yet to see any speak of the "new and improved" version of sammy's anti-reflective screen PLEASE HELP!! Also, any input on the other models would be greatly appreciated!!

Thanks in advance from the newbie
Hook-Em

It all started with the need to watch football in HD.....$$$$'s later, here I am
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post #258 of 4325 Old 08-03-2007, 10:09 AM
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Its anti glare properties(5084) are ok. I know that the 4665 doesn't have anti-glare. Panasonics anti glare is very effective but I chose the 5084 because the picture is a bit better(slightly) imo and the design is more to my liking. For the record , this set does have a slight jitter when displaying tickers. I confirmed this after hooking up a crt to the same feed. One thing I had forgoten is just how crapy sd looks even on the best crt.
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post #259 of 4325 Old 08-03-2007, 11:16 AM
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I compared the 5054 and the 5084 in CC the other day, and clearly saw the stutter/judder/skip on the 5054, but not on the 5084. It looked plenty smooth to me. I don't know the source.

daf365, which input are you using when you see the jitter? Does it happen with all input sources like hdmi, component, vga, s-video etc? The 5054 had it on all of these, but not the RF cable input.

Quote:
Originally Posted by daf365 View Post

Its anti glare properties(5084) are ok. I know that the 4665 doesn't have anti-glare. Panasonics anti glare is very effective but I chose the 5084 because the picture is a bit better(slightly) imo and the design is more to my liking. For the record , this set does have a slight jitter when displaying tickers. I confirmed this after hooking up a crt to the same feed. One thing I had forgoten is just how crapy sd looks even on the best crt.

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post #260 of 4325 Old 08-03-2007, 12:05 PM
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Its a cable source that I notice it on. I wont say for sure I have seen it with video games over hdmi because I think the games themselves are to inconsistent to use when rating a tv. The home theater guy at cnet will be out till aug 6th acording to his auto email but I am sure we can expect a review sometime after that. I really doubt he will notice it though. To be clear, I have only noticed the jitter on tickers over a sd coaxial cable. I would have not noticed it if someone had not complained about it on the 5054. I believe the problem is subtle on all the affected sets because the person who brought it to my attention needed the help of his friends to verify that his set in fact jitters during fast moving sports. Btw, I am still keeping this one. Is it the best set that will ever be made? NO. But it is damn nice.
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post #261 of 4325 Old 08-05-2007, 06:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scsnospam View Post

I compared the 5054 and the 5084 in CC the other day, and clearly saw the stutter/judder/skip on the 5054, but not on the 5084. It looked plenty smooth to me. I don't know the source.

daf365, which input are you using when you see the jitter? Does it happen with all input sources like hdmi, component, vga, s-video etc? The 5054 had it on all of these, but not the RF cable input.

I can't believe some are saying that the 5084 has the judder also. The judder is the main reason I'm returning the 5054, I've had a 5265 on order from CC for a month now and it's still not in stock! I'm getting tired of waiting and am considering the 5084 instead, but if I return the 5054 and get the 5084 and it has the same judder I'm going to be so mad, it seriously won't be funny.

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post #262 of 4325 Old 08-05-2007, 08:34 AM
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I like 5084. I was watching the departed last night and I just could not stop admiring just how good its blacks are and how sharp the picture is. Every one goes on about deep blacks . This set is able to display deep blacks with out loosing detail. Btw way just for comparison, I went to CC to see the 5054. I can see why people are upset. The 84 does not have jitter like the 54.
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post #263 of 4325 Old 08-05-2007, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EADGBE View Post

I can't believe some are saying that the 5084 has the judder also. The judder is the main reason I'm returning the 5054, I've had a 5265 on order from CC for a month now and it's still not in stock! I'm getting tired of waiting and am considering the 5084 instead, but if I return the 5054 and get the 5084 and it has the same judder I'm going to be so mad, it seriously won't be funny.

It has been said many times in this thread the "ticker stutter" issue seen on the 5054 and 5064 are not on the 5084. Judder from 24 fps sources being displayed on a 60 Hz screen will be visible on all TVs that can't do a 3:3 or 5:5.
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post #264 of 4325 Old 08-05-2007, 12:35 PM
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Well I checked at BB today and I got to see the 5084 right next to the 1080p pany. I am sticking with the 5084. However , the 60in pio was near buy and I have to say I would definately love to have that one. It has deep rich color. I think a little down the road I may pick one of those up to use as my main tv.
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post #265 of 4325 Old 08-05-2007, 09:41 PM
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Does anyone know if this is HDMI 1.3? Thanks.
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post #266 of 4325 Old 08-05-2007, 10:25 PM
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Does anyone know if this is HDMI 1.3? Thanks.

Yes the FPT5084 supports HDMI 1.3
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post #267 of 4325 Old 08-05-2007, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
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Yes the FPT5084 supports HDMI 1.3


Kool, thanks! So if I were to connect my PS3, should I buy an HDMI cable that states that it is for 1.3? I'm looking at monoprice and they have a separate section for "HDMI 1.3a Category 2 Certified" cables. Should I get something like these or just go for regular HDMI cables.
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post #268 of 4325 Old 08-06-2007, 06:45 AM
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Thanks to everyone posting on this thread for their insights. I am purchasing my first Plasma / LCD and I think I've landed on the 5084 due to the 1080p and pricing. I am still not convinced that I need the 1080p since my living room is 13' and the viewing distance will be probably be 11', but I figure the 1080p will be useful down the road.

My one question is: will standard TV, 720p and 1080i view better on a 720p model, say the Pioneer 5080? Additionally, I understand 720p v 1080p - but how does 1080i marry up between the two. Any articles or insights would be extremely helpful.

I feel that the more I read and become informed the harder the decision has become. The one thing I can take away; however, is that the 5084 does not have any ticker judder - for all those curious.
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post #269 of 4325 Old 08-06-2007, 07:49 AM
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Hi guys, pulling trigger today after work. FPT5084 plasma or 5265F LCD ? $1k is a difference, will LCD last me longer then plasma? Paramaters are almost identical, except weight and 2" screen size. If you eliminate the price factor, which one would you REALLY choose? I am leaning toward FPT5084, should I change my mind last minute?
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post #270 of 4325 Old 08-06-2007, 08:07 AM
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Well, I hope you don't let a few anonymous posters make up your mind for you but since you asked....

The Samsung plasma.
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