The Official Pioneer 8G KURO 'Professional Review' Discussion Thread - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 318 Old 08-05-2007, 10:49 AM - Thread Starter
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This thread is for the discussion of professional reviews of the exciting new 8th generation Pioneer KURO Plasmas. I am hoping this will become a valuable resource for those of us making a decision to purchase what appears to be a very significant breakthrough in flat panel technology.

I will post all professional reviews here - good and bad!

Please let me know if you find one, I will keep this first post updated with all professional reviews as they become known...

***Pioneer PRO-110FD
http://www.hdtvexpert.com/pages_b/PioneerPRO-110FD.html
"Pioneer’s new KURO technology takes plasma to another level. No, wait — make that another universe."

***Pioneer PDP-5010FD 50 inch Plasma TV
http://canadahifi.com/review81.php
"Most TV manufacturers make modest advances with each new generation of products. But Pioneer's Kuro generation has taken an exceptional leap in plasma TV performance. For producing the most spectacular picture performance any of us have seen at CANADA HiFi to date, we present the Pioneer PDP-5010FD plasma TV with our first ever Editor's Choice recognition."

***Pioneer Elite KURO PRO-110FD Plasma HDTV
http://www.hometheatermag.com/plasmadisplays/907kuro/
"Forgive my dipping into hyperbole for the caption, but there really wasn't another way to go. It's not just the fact that the PRO-110FD creates a beautiful image. It's that the image it creates is such a step above every other flat panel on the market that it is not even comparable."
Build Quality 96 (Excellent)
• Feels like a $6,000 product should
• Good luck finding burn-in
Value 91 (Good)
• It sure is crazy expensive
• But for this level of performance. . .
Features 98 (Excellent)
• 72-hertz mode is great
• Four HDMI inputs
Performance 98 (Excellent)
• You have to see it to believe it
• Near-perfect processing
Ergonomics 96 (Excellent)
• Backlit remote
• Direct input access
Overall 96 (Excellent)
It is, without a doubt, one of the greatest flat-screen TVs ever made. It really is that much better than everything else out there. How's that for hyperbole?

***Pioneer PDP-5080HD review
http://www.ultimateavmag.com/flatpan...ys/907piokuro/
HIGHLIGHTS: "This KURO plasma has exceptional blacks, the best contrast ratio we've yet measured on a flat panel display, and the picture looks as good or better than the measurements suggest. There are less expensive 50" plasmas around, but not with a picture like this!"

***Pioneer PDP-5080HD
http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-a...ml?tag=nl.e722
CNET Editor's' Review: 8.7 / 10.0
GOOD:
This 50-inch plasma TV displays an exceedingly deep shade of black with excellent shadow detail; clean image with little noise; "smooth" video-processing mode removes most judder; excellent antireflective screen; sleek, minimalist styling; removable speaker; superb connectivity with four HDMI inputs and one PC input; CableCard compatible with TV Guide EPG.
BAD:
Expensive; inaccurate primary color of green; no user-menu fine color temperature controls.
BOTTOM LINE:
The Pioneer PDP-5080HD produces the deepest shade of black--and thus one of the best pictures--we've ever tested.

***Pioneer PDP-508XD
http://reviews.cnet.co.uk/television...9291826,00.htm
RATING: 9.2 - Spectacular
"Top-class design and peerless picture quality puts this TV right at the top of the pile"
CONCLUSION:
In terms of picture quality, design and features, this is one of the best televisions we've ever reviewed. The picture in particular is of a totally different class to most flat-screen televisions, and has us looking forward to the September launch of Pioneer's "premium" 'Full HD' screens -- with even higher contrast ratios, according to the manufacturer. As it stands, this 50-inch screen is a fantastic performer that makes hi-def movies and games look utterly spectacular -- if you're in the market for a high-end screen and are serious about picture quality, this should be right at the top of your shopping list.

***Pioneer PDP-4280XD
http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/Pioneer-PDP4280XD/
SUMMARY:
Pioneer's 8th-generation plasma is no hype... the PDP4280XD offers the best post-calibration picture quality I've seen to date.
PROS:
Deepest blacks among all the HDTVs we've tested
Gorgeous colour reproduction with accurate decoding
Excellent video processing including 1080p/24 handling
CONS:
Slightly indistinct shadow detail
Noisier picture with certain settings
High price tag

***Pioneer PDP-508XD
http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/Pioneer-PDP508XD/
SUMMARY
Pioneer PDP508XD is the cream of a bunch of 8G Kuro plasmas that delivers class-leading picture quality.
PROS
Deepest blacks with full preservation of shadow detail
Glorious colours with accurate decoding
Top-notch video processing & 1080p/24 handling
CONS
Need to know when to apply certain settings with different source material to avoid introducing artifacts
Premium price

***Pioneer PDP-428XD
http://www.hdtvorg.co.uk/reviews/pla..._pdp-428xd.htm
SUMMARY:
42in Plasma
Picture *****
Features *****
Usability ****
Value ****
Offers the best combination of standard and high definition performance of any flat panel.
HD Ready: yes
Resolution: 1,024 x 768
Rating: 96%

***Pioneer PDP-508XD
http://www.tech.co.uk/home-entertain...neer-pdp-508xd
Summary:
FOR:
Revolutionary black levels
Excellent colour fidelity
Design
AGAINST:
Not a Full HD resolution panel
Verdict
CONCLUSION:
It's time to start believing the hype - Pioneer's latest-generation plasmas really do take image quality to a whole new level

***Pioneer PDP-428XD
http://www.tech.co.uk/home-entertain...p-428xd?page=1
FOR
The best flat TV picture ever
Lovely design
Great features
Fulsome 1080p/24Hz support
AGAINST
Premium price
No stand or wall bracket supplied
VERDICT
Not just the best 42-inch screen ever, it's the best flat screen yet by some margin

***Pioneer PDP-50XD
http://www.trustedreviews.com/tvs/re...n-Plasma-TV/p1
Design & Features 10/10
Image Quality 10/10
Value 8/10
Overall 10/10
VERDICT
Normally we like to counterbalance our praise of even the very finest TVs with a negative point or two. But try as we might, we simply can’t think of anything bad to say about the Pioneer’s pictures at all. In fact, if it wasn’t for the fact that Pioneer is flogging the screen at what has to be considered quite a premium price point, the only problem the brand might have with the 508XD is making enough of them.

***Pioneer PDP-428XD
http://www.tech.co.uk/home-entertain...eer-pdp-428xd-
FOR
Excellent features list and connections
Unparalleled picture performance
Great audio
AGAINST
Quite pricey
VERDICT
If the price isn't a problem, this should be one of the easiest buying decisions you'll ever have to make

***Prestigious European EISA Best Plasma award goes to Pioneer Kuro.
http://www.eisa-awards.eu/eisa_awards/history
http://www.eisa-awards.eu/eisa_awards/node/718

***Pioneer PDP-508XD Web Review:
http://blog.homecinemachoice.com/pag..._web_exclusive

The following is not technically a review but a "side-by-side" comparison of the Pio 5080 - Panny 50PZ700U - Sammy T5054 - Sony 46 XBR3 - Sharp 46D92U :
http://www.canadahifi.com/comments.php?id_entry=161

AVGUIDE 'Best Plasma Ever' award goes to the Pioneer PRO-1150HD ( begins on page 47 ):
http://mag1.olivesoftware.com/am/get...&OnePageMode=1

 

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post #2 of 318 Old 08-05-2007, 10:50 AM - Thread Starter
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- Home Media Gallery - networking functionality
- ISFccc
- New Independent Gamma Control for heightened color calibration
- Remote Control - Illuminated / Present Mode / Learning Mode
- AV Selection Memory - PURE, ISF-Day, ISF-Night
- Advanced Picture-in-Picture (4 positions), Picture-side-Picture for use with Home Media Gallery & Broadcast (3 positions) and Still Picture capability
- Intelligent Mode (off/on)
- Color Temperature Adjustment - 5 settings (High / Mid-High / Mid / Mid-Low / Low)
- Color Temperature Manual Adjustment
- Color Management
- Color Space (1 / 2)
- MPEG Noise Reduction
- Block Noise Reduction Activation (off/on)
- Mosquito Noise Effect
- Mosquito Noise Reduction (off/on)
- 3 DYC (1/2/3)
- I-P Mode
- IR Repeater
- 2 year warranty
- First Color Pro Filter versus First Color Pro Plus Filter (added 08-11-07)

( the above differences were originally posted by russwong but I will keep above current if anyone has any updates ).

 

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post #3 of 318 Old 08-05-2007, 11:27 AM
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post #4 of 318 Old 08-05-2007, 11:41 AM
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Good idea Tony, thanks!

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post #5 of 318 Old 08-05-2007, 11:46 AM
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Here's a review by CNET (UK) of the 508XD (corresponding to the ELITE 50"):
http://reviews.cnet.co.uk/television...9291826,00.htm
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post #6 of 318 Old 08-05-2007, 12:26 PM
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This is great! Thanks. I like the Elite vs. Non-Elite comparison quote as well as it should help folks decide whether it's worth it or not to go for the Elite.
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post #7 of 318 Old 08-05-2007, 05:39 PM
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You're the man Tony, great idea. This is going to be a very informative thread for those who are looking to buy.

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post #8 of 318 Old 08-05-2007, 09:26 PM
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Great idea Tony!
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post #9 of 318 Old 08-05-2007, 09:39 PM
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Nice post! Great info here!

Chris

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigmjh View Post

Here's an interesting article that I came across a while back. Not exactly a "review" as such.

Side-bySide Comparison of Pio 5080 > Panny 50PZ700U > Sammy T5054 > Sony 46 XBR3 > Sharp 46D92U.

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post #10 of 318 Old 08-06-2007, 10:41 AM - Thread Starter
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All of the professional reviews have been great so far - my only concern is that a couple of them mention 'shadow detail' as not being entirely up to par. Hopefully the Elites allow an ISF calibrator to address this. Shadow detail is one of the most important attributes of a display for me...

EDIT: After viewing my new PRO-150FD for a couple of days, I am "blown away" by the level of shadow detail...

 

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post #11 of 318 Old 08-06-2007, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonydeluce View Post

All of the professional reviews have been great so far - my only concern is that a couple of them mention 'shadow detail' as not being entirely up to par. Hopefully the Elites allow an ISF calibrator to address this. Shadow detail is one of the most important attributes of a display for me...

Parasites had his 5080 ISF calibrated and Jeff (umr) mentioned that shadow detail improved after he did his thing.

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post #12 of 318 Old 08-06-2007, 10:49 AM
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I have zero issues with shadow detail on my Elite 1150.
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post #13 of 318 Old 08-06-2007, 12:02 PM
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Same with my 950...better shadow detail than my Fujitsus.
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post #14 of 318 Old 08-06-2007, 12:04 PM
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I find it strange that only the 42 inch versions in the UK are getting any complaints about shadow detail. Even then, this is only relative compared to its amazing mininmum luminence.

I don't know what I am doing! AHHHHHHH!!!!
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post #15 of 318 Old 08-06-2007, 05:58 PM - Thread Starter
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You guys are probably right - just weird that more than one reveiwer has pointed it out - could be how they had it set up as well - thanks!

 

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post #16 of 318 Old 08-07-2007, 11:55 AM
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Well if you use DRE picture on your setup, you are gonna lose shadow detail.
Plus if you use DRE picture, and then turn gamma to 2 you are gonna lose alot of shadow detail.

I have found, most people complaining about shadow detail, always are using DRE. It is a dynamic setting that enhances contrast, AT THE COST OF LOW LEVEL SHADOW DETAIL! Jeez I mean how dumb would it sound if I said I cant see the road at night in my car, even tho I'm driving with the dims. I have said this many times, and JEFF "UMR" has said this as well. There is no issues with shadow details on a correctly set up 5080.
I think what is happening is the people who have other displays that are not kuros, and cant exchange, return, or call a do over, read a review were the person used the wrong settings, and complains about shadow detail, thinks its the chink in the armor they are looking for. Well guess what, Its bullet proof!
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post #17 of 318 Old 08-07-2007, 12:25 PM
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Parasite it correct. If you want to gain some sharpness at the expense of shadow detail, turn DRE to "Low," else leave it off and enjoy ZERO black crush, especially if the display is calibrated.

Speaking of DRE, did any of the reviews even say if they left it on or turned it off? I don't remember reading what setting was used in the hdtvtest one.

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I'm slightly confused (and behind the times). Are the reviews posted in this thread for TV's that haven't come out yet? Or is the PDP-508XD the "UK/European" version of the PDP-5080... I tried to check the (US) Pioneer site and all I could see were the Kuro PDP-5080 and the elite kuro PRO-1150.
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post #19 of 318 Old 08-08-2007, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Parasite it correct. If you want to gain some sharpness at the expense of shadow detail, turn DRE to "Low," else leave it off and enjoy ZERO black crush, especially if the display is calibrated.

Speaking of DRE, did any of the reviews even say if they left it on or turned it off? I don't remember reading what setting was used in the hdtvtest one.

He didn't say but it appears from his other comments that he had DRE on Low.

Go Duke !
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post #20 of 318 Old 08-08-2007, 01:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackman View Post

He didn't say but it appears from his other comments that he had DRE on Low.

Do you mean Parasite or the reviewer? Parasite has DRE off, but I am still unsure of the reviewer. If the reviewer did have it on this could explain the so so shadow detail.

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post #21 of 318 Old 08-08-2007, 07:23 PM
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The reviewer. Remember that he didn't have Pure mode either and was mainly working with Cinema mode to get a proper gamma curve. Perhaps the impact of DRE on shadow detail is different in Movie v. Pure

Go Duke !
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post #22 of 318 Old 08-08-2007, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trackman View Post

The reviewer. Remember that he didn't have Pure mode either and was mainly working with Cinema mode to get a proper gamma curve. Perhaps the impact of DRE on shadow detail is different in Movie v. Pure

I bet it is. Also remember that the UK uses PAL thus the reviewer thought "Movie" mode was best for the color spectrum, however UMR (an AVS member who performs ISF calibrations in the US) preferred "User" mode and doesn't recommend "Movie" mode. YMMV.

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post #23 of 318 Old 08-08-2007, 08:34 PM
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I'm beginning to wonder if Pioneer maybe did not supply any 768p Kuro's to any U.S. review sites or magazines. Maybe they are waiting to only send them the 1080p versions. I expected to see a U.S. review of a 768p Kuro by now.

Here is a comment on cnet that I found:
http://forums.cnet.com/5208-12548_10...answer_2520290

HDGURU, can you tell us if you have a 768p Kuru under test?
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post #24 of 318 Old 08-10-2007, 02:49 AM
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http://www.tech.co.uk/home-entertain...p-428xd?page=1

Tech UK with another review, the smaller 428XD, and it's the same stuff. Friggin awesome.

Verdict sums it up nicely to what I've seen.

"Not just the best 42-inch screen ever, it's the best flat screen yet by some margin."

And in terms of US Reviews.. you gotta be patient. Usually C-net is the first to get to review TVs, and last year they didn't get their 5070 review out till September. Late this month or Sept would be an early guess.

I don't know what I am doing! AHHHHHHH!!!!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnybrulez View Post

http://www.tech.co.uk/home-entertain...p-428xd?page=1

Tech UK with another review, the smaller 428XD, and it's the same stuff. Friggin awesome.

Verdict sums it up nicely to what I've seen.

"Not just the best 42-inch screen ever, it's the best flat screen yet by some margin."

And in terms of US Reviews.. you gotta be patient. Usually C-net is the first to get to review TVs, and last year they didn't get their 5070 review out till September. Late this month or Sept would be an early guess.

One amazing review after another. Pretty impressive stuff...no dissenting votes from the pros.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

I bet it is. Also remember that the UK uses PAL thus the reviewer thought "Movie" mode was best for the color spectrum, however UMR (an AVS member who performs ISF calibrations in the US) preferred "User" mode and doesn't recommend "Movie" mode. YMMV.

Yes, good points and I am well acquainted with Jeff/umr. Do we know why he also preferred User over Pure?

Go Duke !
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I found movie mode to be very limited in its ability to pump out contrast & brightness for anything other than a dark room. I think you lose some of the 'goodness' of other settings such as 'pure' when using movie mode. This is just MO and others may have other preferences. My problem with the User mode was that it seemed to have some oddity in the gamma curve that was tough to correct.
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post #28 of 318 Old 08-10-2007, 03:18 PM
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No doubt Movie mode was not intended for use in a bright room, but, as a rank amateur here, I found it gave me the best readings I've ever managed using DVE. I only use it for watching movies though, and always in a dimly lighted room. I continuously marvel at how good a well mastered standard DVE looks on my 5080 using an Oppo 981 player. No black crush at all, BTW.
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post #29 of 318 Old 08-10-2007, 04:15 PM
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Oops... more crazy "biased" reviewers coming in.

VERDICT: Normally we like to counterbalance our praise of even the very finest TVs with a negative point or two. But try as we might, we simply can't think of anything bad to say about the Pioneer's pictures at all. In fact, if it wasn't for the fact that Pioneer is flogging the screen at what has to be considered quite a premium price point, the only problem the brand might have with the 508XD is making enough of them.

http://www.trustedreviews.com/tvs/re...n-Plasma-TV/p1

It's their Editor's Choice TV.

I don't know what I am doing! AHHHHHHH!!!!
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post #30 of 318 Old 08-10-2007, 05:21 PM
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All Aces thus far, thanks for keeping us in touch with the latest reviews Johnny. A '10' on picture quality...pretty amazing and living up to all the hype!
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