Master Burn-In/IR/Break In Thread Part II: All Posts Here Only - Page 157 - AVS Forum
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post #4681 of 5245 Old 09-16-2013, 07:50 AM
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What is the break in on this year( i.e. new plasmas) now.
I never did anything special to my first plasma that just died after 12 years of use.
as I didn't know better, but I never had burn in or any other issues either..
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post #4682 of 5245 Old 09-16-2013, 09:25 AM
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thanks everyone
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post #4683 of 5245 Old 09-16-2013, 11:15 AM
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Monicajae, I have just over 1,200 hours.
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post #4684 of 5245 Old 09-16-2013, 11:53 AM
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I'm looking to purchase the Samsung PN64F8500 64-Inch 1080p 600Hz 3D Smart Plasma HDTV, mainly for daily TV viewing for my kids, wife and I, with some Xbox game play, and BluRays.

I've read the 100 hour break in standard, is that the same with this 2013 model?

Anyone own(ed) this model and had any issues with IR or Burn In?

My video game play will be really kind of low, not a heavy gamer anymore, 3-4 hours once a week maybe every other week.
Mainly my kids watch Netflix, and I watch sports on TV and and my wife watches some shows.

I'm just kind of nervous to buy plasma with IR or Burn In possibilities, ever since I had a Sony RPTV get serious burn in from Halo, but I was a heavy gamer, single, no kids, back then. Now days I'm lucky to get a few hours a week in.

I went went with LED, Samsung UN60ES8000, and was happy with it and my gaming there, but the off angle viewing was horrid. Then it got stolen, so now is my chance to really rethink my TV purchase.
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post #4685 of 5245 Old 09-16-2013, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by chrisjmccord View Post

I'm looking to purchase the Samsung PN64F8500 64-Inch 1080p 600Hz 3D Smart Plasma HDTV, mainly for daily TV viewing for my kids, wife and I, with some Xbox game play, and BluRays.

I've read the 100 hour break in standard, is that the same with this 2013 model?

Anyone own(ed) this model and had any issues with IR or Burn In?

My video game play will be really kind of low, not a heavy gamer anymore, 3-4 hours once a week maybe every other week.
Mainly my kids watch Netflix, and I watch sports on TV and and my wife watches some shows.

I'm just kind of nervous to buy plasma with IR or Burn In possibilities, ever since I had a Sony RPTV get serious burn in from Halo, but I was a heavy gamer, single, no kids, back then. Now days I'm lucky to get a few hours a week in.

I went went with LED, Samsung UN60ES8000, and was happy with it and my gaming there, but the off angle viewing was horrid. Then it got stolen, so now is my chance to really rethink my TV purchase.
CNET gave the panel high marks.
http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-tvs/samsung-pn64f8500/4505-6482_7-35731513.html

Sammys have been fairly IR resistant from what I have read. You could do some research in the PNF8500 thread as well. For the first 100 hours I always recommend watching fullscreen programming only with limited logos and bright banners.
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post #4686 of 5245 Old 09-16-2013, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Cuda1169 View Post

CNET gave the panel high marks.
http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-tvs/samsung-pn64f8500/4505-6482_7-35731513.html

Sammys have been fairly IR resistant from what I have read. You could do some research in the PNF8500 thread as well. For the first 100 hours I always recommend watching fullscreen programming only with limited logos and bright banners.

Yeah I've been over in that thread for a few weeks now. I was just hoping to read about any potential IR/Burn In issues here. I'm pretty sure when I settle with my insurance company, this will be the set I'll get, I've just always been weary of plasma, but it seems they've fixed some of these IR/Burn In hazards that used to keep me away.
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post #4687 of 5245 Old 09-16-2013, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisjmccord View Post

Yeah I've been over in that thread for a few weeks now. I was just hoping to read about any potential IR/Burn In issues here. I'm pretty sure when I settle with my insurance company, this will be the set I'll get, I've just always been weary of plasma, but it seems they've fixed some of these IR/Burn In hazards that used to keep me away.

I don't own this TV, but have a Panasonic VT30, which Panasonics reportedly have worse IR than Samsungs. My wife and kids use the set throughout the day to watch Netflix, the news and several other programs with black bars or logos and I watch football all day on Saturday and Sunday. I also game some, but not often. Any IR that the unit gets throughout the day is gone shortly after switching to different programming. The only advice I can give, don't check the set for IR constantly - you will find it. It isn't anything to worry about and goes away quickly, on most occasions. I've had some IR that lasts a while, but it always goes away.

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post #4688 of 5245 Old 09-16-2013, 02:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Riddle View Post

I don't own this TV, but have a Panasonic VT30, which Panasonics reportedly have worse IR than Samsungs. My wife and kids use the set throughout the day to watch Netflix, the news and several other programs with black bars or logos and I watch football all day on Saturday and Sunday. I also game some, but not often. Any IR that the unit gets throughout the day is gone shortly after switching to different programming. The only advice I can give, don't check the set for IR constantly - you will find it. It isn't anything to worry about and goes away quickly, on most occasions. I've had some IR that lasts a while, but it always goes away.

I'm ok with IR, have it on my Apple Cinema Display 30" that is on my MacPro, it always goes away, not that big a deal. Guess I'm really more concerned with Burn In, and I know I don't play but a 1/4th of what I used to play in Xbox/Halo from 10 years ago, times have changed, kids, wife, family, etc...I shouldn't be worried about burn in.
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post #4689 of 5245 Old 09-16-2013, 08:05 PM
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I owned a few plasmas over the years but did not have burn-in until now. Maybe that was the reason I underestimate plasma burn-in. I recently bought a new panasonic 65ST60, little over two months. I have a burn-in caused by closed caption watching TV shows. I searched on google and found someone else has this exact situation. I quote his post below. I ran screen wipe for hours and also turned off CC on my Apple TV for weeks now but the reddish/pink burn-in still shows iwhen the background is white or gray. Is this permanent? I can't even watch foreign movies now since it requires CC.


"...
I've had the Panasonic TC-P60VT60 for a few months now, and have just noticed what appear to be little reddish squares towards the bottom of the screen. After investigating, I'm pretty convinced it's come from the fact I watch a lot of Apple TV with closed captioning turned on. The little red "squares" are actually where the closed captioning letters have been appearing - and it's more pronounced in center and gradually clears up towards the edges (most closed captioning is centered). Two lines of the little red squares, too...."
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post #4690 of 5245 Old 09-17-2013, 08:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Iain- View Post

Wise choice, considering your choice of viewing material.

It would be a tragedy to send a VT60 to an early grave by continually bombarding it with that type of viewing content.

BTW, have you considered the new Samsung LED sets? I purchased one as a secondary system monitor in July; has great PQ. 1080P content is stunning on a 22 inch monitor. wink.gif

I'm leaning towards the W900 from Sony, though they have a 65" version (W850) releasing early next month.
Yeah, I still want a plasma though, but it'd be for a movie room only for full screen TV and film content only. That or a projector... oh, so many gadgets so little time.
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post #4691 of 5245 Old 09-17-2013, 09:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisjmccord View Post

I'm ok with IR, have it on my Apple Cinema Display 30" that is on my MacPro, it always goes away, not that big a deal. Guess I'm really more concerned with Burn In, and I know I don't play but a 1/4th of what I used to play in Xbox/Halo from 10 years ago, times have changed, kids, wife, family, etc...I shouldn't be worried about burn in.
I have the ST50 which I bought earlier this year. The panel, so far, has been very good with regard to IR. Any IR I have goes away shortly after watching something else. I now use my panel for TV-55%, BluRay-15%, Gaming-15%, NFL Games-15%. I also use a pixel flipper, but to be honest, watching full screen HBO shows seems to have the same effect.

I think you will be pleased with that Samsung and don’t stress about IR.
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post #4692 of 5245 Old 09-17-2013, 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by foxnews View Post

I owned a few plasmas over the years but did not have burn-in until now. Maybe that was the reason I underestimate plasma burn-in. I recently bought a new panasonic 65ST60, little over two months. I have a burn-in caused by closed caption watching TV shows. I searched on google and found someone else has this exact situation. I quote his post below. I ran screen wipe for hours and also turned off CC on my Apple TV for weeks now but the reddish/pink burn-in still shows iwhen the background is white or gray. Is this permanent? I can't even watch foreign movies now since it requires CC.


"...
I've had the Panasonic TC-P60VT60 for a few months now, and have just noticed what appear to be little reddish squares towards the bottom of the screen. After investigating, I'm pretty convinced it's come from the fact I watch a lot of Apple TV with closed captioning turned on. The little red "squares" are actually where the closed captioning letters have been appearing - and it's more pronounced in center and gradually clears up towards the edges (most closed captioning is centered). Two lines of the little red squares, too...."

Has the issue become less pronounced since you originally noticed it? I would suggest putting on a fullscreen blu-ray - Avatar works great - and putting it on Vivid (torch mode) and running in a loop for 24 hours. This should help evenly wear everything. If it begins to fade, which it should, you just have very persistent IR. Also, you could run break-in slides at full contrast in a loop. I'm not a fan of the screen wipe; in my experience normal viewing takes away any IR with time, but in extreme stiuations, throwing a little torch mode at it fixes it every time. What you and the other user described are side effects of uneven wear; if you watch too much of the same content that causes uneven wear without variation, this will continue to happen. One of the worst parts of closed captioning is the use of white lettering which is like Kryptonite to Plasmas. I would be extremely surprised if it is true burn-in

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post #4693 of 5245 Old 09-17-2013, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Riddle View Post

Has the issue become less pronounced since you originally noticed it? I would suggest putting on a fullscreen blu-ray - Avatar works great - and putting it on Vivid (torch mode) and running in a loop for 24 hours. This should help evenly wear everything. If it begins to fade, which it should, you just have very persistent IR. Also, you could run break-in slides at full contrast in a loop. I'm not a fan of the screen wipe; in my experience normal viewing takes away any IR with time, but in extreme stiuations, throwing a little torch mode at it fixes it every time. What you and the other user described are side effects of uneven wear; if you watch too much of the same content that causes uneven wear without variation, this will continue to happen. One of the worst parts of closed captioning is the use of white lettering which is like Kryptonite to Plasmas. I would be extremely surprised if it is true burn-in

Thanks for the recommendation. I am afraid that I would never buy plasma again since I love foreign movies that require CC, if this IR is permanent.

I am playing the Avatar movie on Vivid mode with default settings except CATS is off( color temp.=cool2, Motion smoother=Mid). At the end of the movie, it displays credits, actors in white on black background. is this going to cause more IR? since it is similar to closed caption. Or I have to babysit this replay and avoid playing the credit at the end of the movie?

One note: under Avatar movie, I don't see those reddish/pink IR at all. I am not sure if this is because of the Vivid mode. I normally use Standard mode since the TV is still new. Does Vivide mode torture the new TV more than the Standard mode?
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post #4694 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 05:46 AM
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Yes, Vivid Mode is generally frowned upon as an actual regular viewing mode; the high contrast leads to IR quicker than regular settings. I'm not sure why it would be present on one mode and not the other; it should be more predominant on Vivid, I would think. I would suggest downloading some color slides and checking for IR against them - should be very noticeable against the light green slides. You can find them on this site or google plasma color slides, save them to a flash drive and insert them in the USB port on your television and use the media player under viera tools to view them. One note, I have the Panasonic VT30 and the Standard Mode has some strange issues that prevent me from using it at all; I'm not sure if the ST60 has the same issues, but you might want to check the forums. If you have a Custom mode, I would suggest using that. Did you do any kind of break-in for you television and how many hours do you have? Plasmas are most susceptible to IR during their beginning life - they aren't as stable as they are once aged. It is recommended that you do a 100 hour color slide break-in - run color slides in a continuous loop for the first 100 hours. Many people also follow this by using low contrast settings for the next 100-200 hours or so and then changing to a more comfortable setting. I personally ran the break-in slides then followed that with 300 hours of low contrast viewing on anything with logos and high contrast on anything fullscreen with no IR catalysts. I now watch anything without hesitation and any IR I do get, quickly fades.

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post #4695 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 06:12 AM
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What does IR look like? Specifically, if you had a black screen with a bright white logo in the corner that caused IR, what would the IR look like?

a) Would it show up as a faint logo on an all BLACK screen, sort of a ghost image of the logo that used to be there?

b) Or would it show up as a dark area on an all WHITE screen?

Reason I ask, I'm seeing something on my plasma and want to figure out if it is IR or uneven phosphor wear. I'm new to plasmas so pretty uninformed on this subject. My cable box guide screen has a bright white "TV" in the lower right corner. I notice I can see this "TV" on an all WHITE screen as a faint darkening. I'm assuming this is uneven phosphor wear since it shows up as dark on white, when the actual "TV" is bright white. I'm assuming IR would show up as a ghost of the "TV" on a DARK background. But maybe my assumption is wrong.

Thanks.

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post #4696 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 07:04 AM
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Originally Posted by sooke View Post

What does IR look like? Specifically, if you had a black screen with a bright white logo in the corner that caused IR, what would the IR look like?

a) Would it show up as a faint logo on an all BLACK screen, sort of a ghost image of the logo that used to be there?

b) Or would it show up as a dark area on an all WHITE screen?

Reason I ask, I'm seeing something on my plasma and want to figure out if it is IR or uneven phosphor wear. I'm new to plasmas so pretty uninformed on this subject. My cable box guide screen has a bright white "TV" in the lower right corner. I notice I can see this "TV" on an all WHITE screen as a faint darkening. I'm assuming this is uneven phosphor wear since it shows up as dark on white, when the actual "TV" is bright white. I'm assuming IR would show up as a ghost of the "TV" on a DARK background. But maybe my assumption is wrong.

Thanks.

Item b.

To qualify that, IR would be slightly darker than ambient screen colour. It would not be black; think shades of grey.
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post #4697 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 12:05 PM
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So, does that mean IR and phosphor wear look the same? But they are different issues?

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post #4698 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 01:24 PM
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So, does that mean IR and phosphor wear look the same? But they are different issues?
Uneven phosphor wear causes IR. So, to me, they are both one and the same.
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post #4699 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 02:13 PM
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As Cuda stated, they are one in the same. Regular IR is quick to go away; for example, you watch the Discovery channel for a few hours and the logo leaves a slight impression that is gone in a short time. Now, if you continue to watch the Discovery channel for multiple hours on end day-in and day-out, without much content variation, you will get uneven phospher wear. Now, what only took hours to remove, could take days, weeks or months to completely rid. The key is just to vary your content and enjoy the set. I watch an inordinate amount of Football; Thursday night (Friday if it's on), all day Saturday, all day Sunday and Monday night. I have little IR each day and the morning hours of watching the kid's cartoons quickly erases the remnants, sometimes bad if my team losees, of any IR.

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post #4700 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Riddle View Post

Yes, Vivid Mode is generally frowned upon as an actual regular viewing mode; the high contrast leads to IR quicker than regular settings. I'm not sure why it would be present on one mode and not the other; it should be more predominant on Vivid, I would think. I would suggest downloading some color slides and checking for IR against them - should be very noticeable against the light green slides. You can find them on this site or google plasma color slides, save them to a flash drive and insert them in the USB port on your television and use the media player under viera tools to view them. One note, I have the Panasonic VT30 and the Standard Mode has some strange issues that prevent me from using it at all; I'm not sure if the ST60 has the same issues, but you might want to check the forums. If you have a Custom mode, I would suggest using that. Did you do any kind of break-in for you television and how many hours do you have? Plasmas are most susceptible to IR during their beginning life - they aren't as stable as they are once aged. It is recommended that you do a 100 hour color slide break-in - run color slides in a continuous loop for the first 100 hours. Many people also follow this by using low contrast settings for the next 100-200 hours or so and then changing to a more comfortable setting. I personally ran the break-in slides then followed that with 300 hours of low contrast viewing on anything with logos and high contrast on anything fullscreen with no IR catalysts. I now watch anything without hesitation and any IR I do get, quickly fades.


I did not do any break-in since people said it is not meant to prevend IR/BI. it was meant to prepare the panel for D-nice settings, plus I thought it would shorten plasma life. with previous plamas I that I owned, I usually watched varieties of content without any static images for a few months to 6 months. with this new ST60, I was a litte over confident and watched netflix shows with CC on for the first 2 months. I thought CC is not static image and should be safe. now I understand that CC is like laser etch on metal.
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post #4701 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 05:28 PM
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HI, I just bought a ZT60 and I plan to break it in. I downloaded the slides http://www.avsforum.com/t/1466472/2013-panasonic-settings-issues-thread but I still dont know what to do. Help! I dont know what settings to use. What to turn on/off?
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post #4702 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 05:32 PM
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The color slides help to prepare the panel for D-Nice's settings, but it it also ages the phosphors which helps against IR. IR is always worse the newer the phosphors are. I wouldn't worry about aging the panel too fast - I believe it is rated for 100,000 hours - equivalent to 11 years of 24/7 viewing. I'm sure your problem will fade with time and you can go back to watching Netflix with close captioning without worry.

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post #4703 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 05:34 PM
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HI, I just bought a ZT60 and I plan to break it in. I downloaded the slides http://www.avsforum.com/t/1466472/2013-panasonic-settings-issues-thread but I still dont know what to do. Help! I dont know what settings to use. What to turn on/off?

If you aren't professionally calibrating it, don't waist your time. Plasmas do not need to breaked in. Slides are used to age the panel to be professionally calibrated, otherwise just watch HD full screen content for the first 100 hrs, using Cinema or custom mode.

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post #4704 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 05:37 PM
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I will have it professionally calibrated at 200hrs. Whats is CATS and how do I turn it off?
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post #4705 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 06:07 PM
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The color slides help to prepare the panel for D-Nice's settings, but it it also ages the phosphors which helps against IR. IR is always worse the newer the phosphors are. I wouldn't worry about aging the panel too fast - I believe it is rated for 100,000 hours - equivalent to 11 years of 24/7 viewing. I'm sure your problem will fade with time and you can go back to watching Netflix with close captioning without worry.


in a white background in Avatar movie, I can see two pink lines in the bottom of the screen where CC is. the bottom line is worse that the top line and it is obvious in the middle bottom of the screen. I am running D-nice slides now. Is it too late to run slide to break-in now since i have been watching TV for over 2 months now?

I did not run these slides when I bought the tv because of this quote from D-nice
"...*****Note: This procedure is designed to prepare your display for the reference settings listed for each 2013 North American Panasonic model below by aging all pixels equally with the same content. This procedure is NOT designed nor recommended to be used as Break-in, Image Retention and/or Burn-in prevention.*****..."
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post #4706 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 06:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuco Salamanca View Post

I will have it professionally calibrated at 200hrs. Whats is CATS and how do I turn it off?

Go to menu, picture custom setting, turn CATS off. It is meant to save energy by dimming your picture to light environment. It sucks it dims the picture too much, not necessary.

TV - Panasonic 55GT50Main Speakers - Klipsch Gallery G28'sCenter Channel- Klipsch RC-52Sub - Klipsch Sub 12Surrounds - Klipsch RS-52 II (new)Bluray/Game - HTPC/PS3Receiver - Onkyo RC-360HTPC - Intel Core i3, HDMI,Windows 7,XBMC,Bluray,3 TB,wireless WMC keyboardVideo processor - Darbee
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post #4707 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 07:44 PM
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Guess I will skip the slides and go straight to netflix and not have any stationary images for 200 hrs. SOunds good?
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post #4708 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Tuco Salamanca View Post

Guess I will skip the slides and go straight to netflix and not have any stationary images for 200 hrs. SOunds good?

and no CC, I learned a hard lesson.
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post #4709 of 5245 Old 09-18-2013, 08:05 PM
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Guess I will skip the slides and go straight to netflix and not have any stationary images for 200 hrs. SOunds good?

HD Netflix, Pixar / full screen blurays movies are all fine. Show us a pic of your setup.
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TV - Panasonic 55GT50Main Speakers - Klipsch Gallery G28'sCenter Channel- Klipsch RC-52Sub - Klipsch Sub 12Surrounds - Klipsch RS-52 II (new)Bluray/Game - HTPC/PS3Receiver - Onkyo RC-360HTPC - Intel Core i3, HDMI,Windows 7,XBMC,Bluray,3 TB,wireless WMC keyboardVideo processor - Darbee
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post #4710 of 5245 Old 09-19-2013, 05:26 AM
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in a white background in Avatar movie, I can see two pink lines in the bottom of the screen where CC is. the bottom line is worse that the top line and it is obvious in the middle bottom of the screen. I am running D-nice slides now. Is it too late to run slide to break-in now since i have been watching TV for over 2 months now?

I did not run these slides when I bought the tv because of this quote from D-nice
"...*****Note: This procedure is designed to prepare your display for the reference settings listed for each 2013 North American Panasonic model below by aging all pixels equally with the same content. This procedure is NOT designed nor recommended to be used as Break-in, Image Retention and/or Burn-in prevention.*****..."

Right now, you would be better off sticking with fullscreen content and running at high contrast settings. It will take some time, but your issue should go away. Has it become any less pronounced?

fdsfds
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