Master Burn-In/IR/Break In Thread Part II: All Posts Here Only - Page 31 - AVS Forum
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post #901 of 5406 Old 10-14-2008, 05:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaselai View Post

So let me get it straight... you basically used it out of the box with reduced contrast and on "off time" you ran "break in" methods like for you HD theater etc.? You recall how long it was for a week in hours>?

Exactly. I do not know how many hours I put on the set in the first week, didn't keep track. Probably between 50-75.

My set doesn't have any "wiper" feature. Even if it did I've never had a reason to use it.

jeff
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post #902 of 5406 Old 10-14-2008, 06:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaselai View Post

So let me get it straight... you basically used it out of the box with reduced contrast and on "off time" you ran "break in" methods like for you HD theater etc.? You recall how long it was for a week in hours>?

You could also just use the break-in images disc/SD card, run it 24/day and hit your 100 in 4 days.

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post #903 of 5406 Old 10-14-2008, 10:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks to Fr. John, first post updated with a good link to some break in information in the Panny thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...6#post14472276

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post #904 of 5406 Old 10-14-2008, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by WilliamR View Post

Thanks to Fr. John, first post updated with a good link to some break in information in the Panny thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...6#post14472276

Thanks for the update William.

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post #905 of 5406 Old 10-16-2008, 05:37 PM
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ok this is prob a stupid question but anyway...
If i use the break-in DVD... can i display it on the Tv through the computer? As in the computer plays the dvd and I "full screen" it and show it on the tv. It seems to be ok but i want to make sure...
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post #906 of 5406 Old 10-16-2008, 10:58 PM
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Originally Posted by shaselai View Post

ok this is prob a stupid question but anyway...
If i use the break-in DVD... can i display it on the Tv through the computer? As in the computer plays the dvd and I "full screen" it and show it on the tv. It seems to be ok but i want to make sure...

Yeah make sure the tv is really getting full screen and the computer is displaying the solid color. Inspect the border of your screen to make sure it's full screen. ( note - before you ask the green vertical line on the right of the set 1 pixel wide is completely normal) That's assuming you have that.. and i'm under the impression that every plasma does.
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post #907 of 5406 Old 10-17-2008, 08:05 AM
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hi all

first post here - i'm seriously contemplating purchasing a recently released lg plasma (the 32pg6000), and have a few general plasma questions. ok, so, i know about the run-in process - set the brightness and contrast, to fifty, or below, for the first two hundred hours, to allow the phosphors to settle, and watch stuffwith as little static images as possible. so, right after the break-in period, i intend to hook up my 360, via hdmi. now, here is where my questions come in (remember, this is after the break-in period, of two hundred hours):
  • generally, how long can i pay a game, with huds on for, at a time? i've read you should game for x amount of hours, then switch over to a tv channel, with no static logos, but how long should i switch over to a tv channel for, and, how often?
    how long is it advisable to watch a dvd with a static logo/tv broadcast, per session, with static logo, before switching to a channel with no logo, for x amount of minutes?

i think that just about covers everything - thanks for any help you guys can give

Panasonic: ideas for life =)
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post #908 of 5406 Old 10-17-2008, 08:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Aidan. View Post

hi all

first post here - i'm seriously contemplating purchasing a recently released lg plasma (the 32pg6000), and have a few general plasma questions. ok, so, i know about the run-in process - set the brightness and contrast, to fifty, or below, for the first two hundred hours, to allow the phosphors to settle, and watch stuffwith as little static images as possible. so, right after the break-in period, i intend to hook up my 360, via hdmi. now, here is where my questions come in (remember, this is after the break-in period, of two hundred hours):
  • generally, how long can i pay a game, with huds on for, at a time? i've read you should game for x amount of hours, then switch over to a tv channel, with no static logos, but how long should i switch over to a tv channel for, and, how often?
    how long is it advisable to watch a dvd with a static logo/tv broadcast, per session, with static logo, before switching to a channel with no logo, for x amount of minutes?

i think that just about covers everything - thanks for any help you guys can give

Every set seems to be different- even with the same model line. I'd start small (15 minute sessions with the HUD on) and then check for IR. If there isn't any, try 30 minutes, then 45, then an hour.

At 70 hours into break in, I haven't seen a single piece of IR, and my wife plays her current RPG on it for a few hours at a time, and I've been playing some 45 minute Halo sessions with no ill effects.

Every night and every day while I'm at work I run the break in images off an SD card.
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post #909 of 5406 Old 10-17-2008, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by shidarin View Post

Every set seems to be different- even with the same model line. I'd start small (15 minute sessions with the HUD on) and then check for IR. If there isn't any, try 30 minutes, then 45, then an hour.

At 70 hours into break in, I haven't seen a single piece of IR, and my wife plays her current RPG on it for a few hours at a time, and I've been playing some 45 minute Halo sessions with no ill effects.

Every night and every day while I'm at work I run the break in images off an SD card.

Word of caution with Halo. If you are playing splitscreen with a friend beware of the Big white matchmaking words. The reason being is splitscreen does not take up the whole screen and where it stays black up in the top right corner it will burn in the matchmaking text.(Happened to mine)
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post #910 of 5406 Old 10-17-2008, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Finalheaven View Post

Last night I passed out while watching Cast Away (I love the movie, just seen it too many times) and woke up in the morning to the DVD menu. I have no idea how long the DVD Menu was up there for, but I've been running scrolling black bars since and can see the white letters of the Menu have left their marks.

My question is: Is running scrolling Black bars better or worse than watching full screen content for removing IR?

Ouch! How did this turn out?
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post #911 of 5406 Old 10-17-2008, 09:18 PM
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well i have made about 136 hrs on hd card breakin and now i am done. with watching tv it should be now over 150+ hrs.. i kept track of how long the sd card played for.. now i can enjoy my panasonic TH-58PZ800U.

now just to find the perfect settings

thanks for the break in cd.SD card images
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post #912 of 5406 Old 10-18-2008, 06:12 PM
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Ok, heres a question that I'm quite sure has been answered, probably a 1000 times-- but please humor me and save me the hours it would take to find an answer on this incredibly large forum.

As I read more about newer plasma technology (wife and I are shopping mode, leaning toward a plasma Panasonic), even here on this forum, I see the use of generalities as common practice. For example, when reading about Image Retention and Burn-In issues, I often see answers given in general terms such as "don't leave the black bars or network logos on the screen for extended periods of time". Well, the word "extended" will mean vastly different things to different people, and unless your opinion just so happens to align with that of the TV's manufacturer, there could be a problem.

So to ask my question, when I see the phrase "extended periods of time", what does this typically mean? Can I watch the length of a television program with the semi-transparent network logo in the corner, even when that logo may remain for up to 15-20 minutes without interruption? Can I watch a normal length movie (2 hours-ish) in 2.35 ratio? Can I watch 4.3 programming long enough to finish the latest episode of House? Are any of these situations severe enough to merit any real concern? From what I have gathered so far, I'd think not. But we are 95% sold on a plasma panel TV, this issue being our only stumbling block. Thanks for any clarification.
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post #913 of 5406 Old 10-18-2008, 06:30 PM
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I am new enough to plasma to not be able to give specific recommendations (just finished my 100 hour breakin on our first plasma), but I do know that as time goes on the danger gets less and less.

You shouldn't have to worry about super ghosted logos (CBS has a faint ghost bug in the corner.. History Channel HD does not know the definition of faint), and for everything else I wouldn't leave it on...

The word on the street seems to be don't watch a 2.35 movie with bars (zoom in to remove bars) for the first 100 hours, but after that you can do so in moderation (Thank you thank you thank you for wanting to watch it in 2.35 , I watched half of Iron Man last night at 90 hours, ran the break in card for another 8, and finished it this morning.

You won't have to worry about 4:3 programming to watch House- it's broadcast in HD and looks fantastic I've been stretching my 4:3 to fullscreen.
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post #914 of 5406 Old 10-18-2008, 07:17 PM
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Originally Posted by shidarin View Post

You won't have to worry about 4:3 programming to watch House- it's broadcast in HD and looks fantastic I've been stretching my 4:3 to fullscreen.

I only used "House" as a fecetious example, but I absolutely REFUSE to use stretch-o-vision...... I'd much rather leave the TV off than to watch things out of ratio. Everytime I walk into my father-in-law's house and look at the TV, I'm instantly irritated and have to leave the room. His TV seems to be stuck in stretch-o-vision mode, and since he lost the remote long ago, we can't figure out how to change it. And he's too cheap to buy a new remote because his cable remote operates the basic functions on the TV. On-screen people with heads shaped like footballs doesn't seem to bother him a bit.

I dunno, I think I see more networks using brighter, more solid logo images these days than the ghosted ones. Right now, my wife is watching "Reign of Fire" on AMC, and although the logo is small (white block AMC with yellow box outline), the image is rather bright and not so transparent..... certainly not "ghosted".

Now, with all of this said, I'd like to also refer to the many times I've read recently that the new plasma TV's are no more/less susceptible to burn-in or image retention than were the CRT televisions we've been using for years. (I believe I read that on Panasonic's website info as well.) If this claim is absolutely true, then I don't think any of us have a darn thing to worry about and these "BI/IR" discussions could be put to rest.
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post #915 of 5406 Old 10-18-2008, 08:39 PM
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Originally Posted by VolksKing View Post

Now, with all of this said, I'd like to also refer to the many times I've read recently that the new plasma TV's are no more/less susceptible to burn-in or image retention than were the CRT televisions we've been using for years. (I believe I read that on Panasonic's website info as well.) If this claim is absolutely true, then I don't think any of us have a darn thing to worry about and these "BI/IR" discussions could be put to rest.

I'll chime in with a little perspective.

I bought my Panny 85u about 4 months ago. Until that time I had been shopping for a new set for 3-4 years. IR and Burn-in were major issues for me and I wasn't unaware of the pitfalls as plasma had been my preferred choice during these years of searching. To be honest I had almost given up on plasma because of these factors. Why? It wasnt so much beacuse I feared the problems, I knew I could manage these indisyncrasies (though admittedely it put me off a bit to have to). My biggest fear stemmed from my kids. I was seriously worried that a plasma and kids were a bad mix. Would it really be fair to expect them to follow the "rules" that seemd necessary?

Long story short, after reading through the forum quite a bit, educating myself quite a bit (my membership is 5 years old but my post count was well under 50 four months ago) and the reports that Panasonic especially had really licked the burn-in IR problems, I'm somewhere around 600 hrs now and haven't had a single case of burn-in or IR. I follow the rules set out in the break-in FAQ, as do the kids.

One last word, as indicated in the FAQ, unless what I'm watching is HD, if it is 4:3 content, I typically watch it in JUST mode. I agree completely with your sentiments regarding stretch-o-vision, can't stand it. That said, the Panny scales such content extremely well. Though I dislike stretched images, I have to admit that if the signal is crud to begin with do I really care if the aspect is perfect?

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post #916 of 5406 Old 10-20-2008, 10:08 AM
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OK! I picked upa 42" pz85!

for burn in, Can I run the DVD on my tv for 100 hours straight? or should it be in small bursts?
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post #917 of 5406 Old 10-20-2008, 10:23 AM
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Just watch full screen/widescreen material with no logos. Something like 24 on DVD, same ratio as the TV

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post #918 of 5406 Old 10-20-2008, 10:36 AM
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Just watch full screen/widescreen material with no logos. Something like 24 on DVD, same ratio as the TV

I meant the Burn in DVD :P when I watch it's mostly the same ratio as the TV(HD TV Shows) so I'm ok there, but for the burn in process
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post #919 of 5406 Old 10-20-2008, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by VolksKing View Post

Ok, heres a question that I'm quite sure has been answered, probably a 1000 times-- but please humor me and save me the hours it would take to find an answer on this incredibly large forum.

As I read more about newer plasma technology (wife and I are shopping mode, leaning toward a plasma Panasonic), even here on this forum, I see the use of generalities as common practice. For example, when reading about Image Retention and Burn-In issues, I often see answers given in general terms such as "don't leave the black bars or network logos on the screen for extended periods of time". Well, the word "extended" will mean vastly different things to different people, and unless your opinion just so happens to align with that of the TV's manufacturer, there could be a problem.

So to ask my question, when I see the phrase "extended periods of time", what does this typically mean? Can I watch the length of a television program with the semi-transparent network logo in the corner, even when that logo may remain for up to 15-20 minutes without interruption? Can I watch a normal length movie (2 hours-ish) in 2.35 ratio? Can I watch 4.3 programming long enough to finish the latest episode of House? Are any of these situations severe enough to merit any real concern? From what I have gathered so far, I'd think not. But we are 95% sold on a plasma panel TV, this issue being our only stumbling block. Thanks for any clarification.

The first weekend I had my Panasonic plasma in 2005, I watched about 12 hours of NFL Sunday ticket. I had no problems with the score bars or logos.

The first 100-200 hours, I would avoid watching programs in 4:3 mode, channels like CNN with lots of static images, and 2.35 ratio movies. A half hour of Headline News is probably not going to cause any problems, but I wouldn't watch a couple hours worth. Follow the break-in guidelines, especially in terms of lowering brightness.

Once you get past 100 hours, I'd say you're fine with logos and watching movies in 2.35. I'd still be careful with 4:3 content with the black bars, but watching a show in 4:3 here and there won't be a problem. I also agree that the Panasonic Just mode is pretty good -- I was amazed at how quickly I got used to the image.

I was really concerned about burn-in because of all the things I read, and I've never had an issue with it. It's even less of an issue now than it was three years ago. Unless you plan on watching CNN all day or watching things mostly in 4:3, I don't think you have much to worry about.
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post #920 of 5406 Old 10-21-2008, 03:44 PM
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i'm a bit confused about the break-in period, should we be breaking the set in with a high contrast setting or a lower one, in the pioneer thread they talk about using sport setting and contrast of 50 (out of 60 i believe) but in the panasonic thread i see settings listed with cinema setting and contrast of 50 or less ( out of 100), they seem to contradict each other, could someone clarify this for me, should i use higher contrast for breakin or lower, thanks.
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post #921 of 5406 Old 10-21-2008, 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by teevman View Post

i'm a bit confused about the break-in period, should we be breaking the set in with a high contrast setting or a lower one, in the pioneer thread they talk about using sport setting and contrast of 50 (out of 60 i believe) but in the panasonic thread i see settings listed with cinema setting and contrast of 50 or less ( out of 100), they seem to contradict each other, could someone clarify this for me, should i use higher contrast for breakin or lower, thanks.

The way that I understand it it, high contrast is fine when running the break-in dvd since every pixel is being run at the exact same color value. Conversely, you have to worry about contrast when watching viewing material (tv, movies, etc..) since everything is not being baked uniformly. TVs that have contrast values 1-100 should be run around 50 and TVs that have 1-50 should be run at 0 when viewing regular content (not the break-in dvd).
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post #922 of 5406 Old 10-21-2008, 07:54 PM
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Originally Posted by teevman View Post

i'm a bit confused about the break-in period, should we be breaking the set in with a high contrast setting or a lower one, in the pioneer thread they talk about using sport setting and contrast of 50 (out of 60 i believe) but in the panasonic thread i see settings listed with cinema setting and contrast of 50 or less ( out of 100), they seem to contradict each other, could someone clarify this for me, should i use higher contrast for breakin or lower, thanks.

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Originally Posted by dauger View Post

The way that I understand it it, high contrast is fine when running the break-in dvd since every pixel is being run at the exact same color value. Conversely, you have to worry about contrast when watching viewing material (tv, movies, etc..) since everything is not being baked uniformly. TVs that have contrast values 1-100 should be run around 50 and TVs that have 1-50 should be run at 0 when viewing regular content (not the break-in dvd).

To quote Mr. Tyrell "The light that burns twice as bright, burns half as long...."

Though it won't really matter in the long run, the Pio method achieves the same thing as the Panny method at the expense of some of the phosphor longevity. Splitting hairs though.

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post #923 of 5406 Old 10-23-2008, 09:24 AM
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ok thanks for the replys
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post #924 of 5406 Old 10-24-2008, 07:47 AM
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After reading countless posts on the above mentioned subject and seeing how much of a concern it is to countless members I need to state my facts on what we have experienced.

I own the Samsung PN50A450. (BTW - I love this TV )

I joined the AVS forum in fear of the horror stories I have read/heard (true or not ) from many people who have owned plasmas and in hopes that any information I came across on this forum would either put my mind at ease or find a way to reduce the chances of aquiring those famous words 'BURN IN'.

Well, it's been a month since we've had this TV and we tend to watch our content full screen. HD programming is awesome! From time to time we will have the occasional grey/black bars but they have proven themselves harmless in every way. I was so paranoid from the start that I ventured into downloading the Break In DVD. I wanted to pass those crucial 100 or so hours that everyone was talking about. It turns out that I never had to use it. I was SOOOOO paranoid about burn in, yet I've never even used it once! I simply used my common sense along with many other suggestions from other AVS members. The Break In DVD is not needed at all.

We've only had a mild case of IR from the CNN news channel. It wasn't the CNN logo it was the 'LIVE' word displayed in white that caused the IR for a day or two but went away with normal TV viewing. I've only used the scrolling feature for that instance only and never used it again (about 15 minutes worth and realistically it was not even needed). I do have the pixel shifting feature on but that is all.

It's been almost a week since I've tweaked my settings to aquire a better picture and we have not noticed any type of IR at all since. CNN or any other stationary logos are no longer of a concern, if anything they may create some mild IR.

Our conclusion on burn in: In order for burn in to occur, you must really have to abuse the plasma. Example being: Plasma being on torch mode from day one and leaving a static image displayed for days on end.

Our conclusion on IR: Although we've only ever experienced IR once, it did go away quite easily. Based on countless other posts I have read, IR gets reduced considerably as the set surpasses it's break in period. If you do experience IR, mild or severe it can go away, period.

I should also point out that up until a week ago I kept my contrast and brightness at around 50, I've now upped my contrast to 75 and lowered my brightness to 47. IR has not appeared at all.

We are so happy with our plasma we would not hesitate to get another one if and when the time comes.

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post #925 of 5406 Old 10-28-2008, 08:18 PM
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Hi guys,

I saw a Kuro 428 for sale at $1700 USD and am sorely tempted to buy one. However, I'm concerned about the initial break-in period. Based on average expected usage, it will take about 4 months to reach 100 hrs of the break-in period. My wife is also not going to let me leave the TV on 24/7 on a break-in DVD.

The TV will be used by my kids as well as myself, and I can't guarantee that they will keep to the break-in settings, especially when I'm off travelling for business. They probably won't mess with the contrast/brightness settings, but they will be watching 4:3 programs for 2-3 hours at a stretch.

Is the initial break-in period that critical to avoid burn-in?
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post #926 of 5406 Old 10-29-2008, 05:20 AM
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Hi guys,

I saw a Kuro 428 for sale at $1700 USD and am sorely tempted to buy one. However, I'm concerned about the initial break-in period. Based on average expected usage, it will take about 4 months to reach 100 hrs of the break-in period. My wife is also not going to let me leave the TV on 24/7 on a break-in DVD.

The TV will be used by my kids as well as myself, and I can't guarantee that they will keep to the break-in settings, especially when I'm off travelling for business. They probably won't mess with the contrast/brightness settings, but they will be watching 4:3 programs for 2-3 hours at a stretch.

Is the initial break-in period that critical to avoid burn-in?

you dont have to run the break in images or dvd for 24/7 . just do when you g to bed at night and you will be fine..
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post #927 of 5406 Old 10-29-2008, 03:39 PM
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The technician claimed that they get calls every single day about burn-ins at their TVs. Today a woman who liked to watch FOX har the FOX logo when watching a dvd! In order to avoid it brightness and contrast should be lowered but thus also the picture quality according to the technician. So watching a soccer game 90 minutes is not possible with high contrast and high brightness since it has the score and the logo in one upper corner. And if done several times a week, chance is bigger that there will be a permanent burn-in! He said that during the break-in, which is 200 hours, one has to play some kind of movie three times the time that the previous show lasted to get the burn-in away! After the break-in twice! That means, always according to the Pioneer technician, that if I watch a 90 minute soccer game during the break-in period, I have to put on something else for 270 minutes right after to eliminate the risk of burn in. And after the break-in period for 90-180 minutes... If this is correct information, a plasma must be only for movie watching without network logos and not even to watch a political debate that lasts for 90 minutes or more. He told me to get an LCD if I was going to watch shows with logos that last for more than one half of soccer, that is 45 minutes... If it's that critical I think I might as well stay with my current CRT.
I hate this now that I had made a decision to get the Pio 5020!!!
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post #928 of 5406 Old 10-29-2008, 06:19 PM
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He also said that the max a logo can be on the TV is 15 minutes if it is white with black background. On the other hand he said that usually the newtwork logos are transparent and don't do much damage.
If you look at these images, you can see that the score at the top left is on a black background with white letters and orange numbers. Also the logo says LIVE in white with a black background. That's what I will be having 2X45 minutes twice or three times a week.





I am really confused about this burn in thing now... I mean, if one can only have a logo/scoreboard for 15 minutes at the time , it's time to get a new technology... I thought I would be able to watch my favorite sports on a plasma... ANd also, if you buy hockey games on PPV they will have the same scoreboard without interruptions for commercials. How on earth does that work?

Any ideas on this?
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post #929 of 5406 Old 10-29-2008, 07:39 PM
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You should have bought a Panny, they are reportedly much better than Pio for IR and burn-in.

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Screenshots Thread
Panasonic Plasma Break-in FAQ HERE
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post #930 of 5406 Old 10-29-2008, 08:27 PM
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I haven't bought it yet and my problem is which way to go... If LCD Samsung is my obvious choice. If I go with Plasma it's Pioneer. But I don't want to have burn ins from watching a couple of soccer games...
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