All you 1080p fans beware! Hail to the 768p Plasma King Baby! - Page 11 - AVS Forum
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post #301 of 319 Old 01-28-2008, 06:09 AM
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Originally Posted by rousemc View Post

OK, so I know I will annoy people who read this thread as people hate repeating information..etc....but I just need a few brief comments about the Pioneer 5080 and hope I don't get rude responses. Any of you feel bummed that you do not have 1080p display? What are the most important PROs and CONS of this TV? Any worries about burn-in? Lastly, any issues with gaming or lag with this TV? THANKS for your time.

Yes but not willing to compromise picture quality for it. Pros=Great PQ, Cablecard, sleek design with detachable speaker, 2-tuner PIP, relatively light for 50" plasma, can be had under $2k, Cons=Mediocre Remote, no input/channel labeling, no linear zoom to fit 2.35:1 content to screen, screen may be less resilient to smudges and abuse. No. Never tried.
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post #302 of 319 Old 01-28-2008, 06:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rousemc View Post

OK, so I know I will annoy people who read this thread as people hate repeating information..etc....but I just need a few brief comments about the Pioneer 5080 and hope I don't get rude responses. Any of you feel bummed that you do not have 1080p display? What are the most important PROs and CONS of this TV? Any worries about burn-in? Lastly, any issues with gaming or lag with this TV? THANKS for your time.

1. Lack of 1080p is a complete non-issue to me, as my viewing distances are beyond the point where I can detect any screen door effect.

2. Pros are superb picture quality, excellent reproduction of motion (critical to quality sports viewing), and connectivity. Cons are non-backlit remote (a truly silly place to scrimp with a display many will use in darkened environments) and lack of red-green-blue adjustability (not such a big issue for those adventuresome souls willing to dip their toes into the Service Menu, which could result in voiding the warranty if you screw up the display).

3. No particular worries about burn-in and haven't yet seen any image retention after over 500 hours. I usually stretch 4:3 images to full screen and run the orbiter all the time.

I don't game, so I can't address those issues.
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post #303 of 319 Old 01-28-2008, 07:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rousemc View Post

OK, so I know I will annoy people who read this thread as people hate repeating information..etc....but I just need a few brief comments about the Pioneer 5080 and hope I don't get rude responses. Any of you feel bummed that you do not have 1080p display? What are the most important PROs and CONS of this TV? Any worries about burn-in? Lastly, any issues with gaming or lag with this TV? THANKS for your time.

As another poster mentioned. Do I wished I had a Pioneer 5010? Yes...Why not! But not @ it's current price tag. For sub $2,000 the 5080 is "the" best value period! I'm glad I was shopping around for a new 50"

I'll keep the 5080 for 3 years or so & pick up the latest & greatest then. I hope I can get a few dollars for my 5080 when I'm ready to sell itdown theroad.
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post #304 of 319 Old 01-28-2008, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by BOSTON-HD View Post

I'll keep the 5080 for 3 years or so & pick up the latest & greatest then. I hope I can get a few dollars for my 5080 when I'm ready to sell itdown theroad.

Think of it this way:

Suppose your goal is to own a zero black 1080p kuro in a few years. At that time suppose you can sell your 5080 kuro for (say) $500. If you picked it up today for $1999 then (ignoring taxes) thats $1500 cost over three years. A new 1080p kuro with zero black would probably be at least a year old in three years...hopefully with competition it can be had for $2500 (50").

Over three years then you have spent $4K and ended up with a new 1080p kuro with zero black. That set would be a keeper for the long term in terms of PQ.

On the other hand, suppose you buy a 5010 for $4K now. In 3 years it sells for $1000. Then you buy a new Kuro for $2500. Now you have spent $5500 and ended up with the same new kuro in 3 years....an extra cost of $1500. This $1500 gets you little improvement in available media today at normal viewing distances....and is enough to get you a second 5080 over the same three year period.
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post #305 of 319 Old 01-28-2008, 12:24 PM
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The angular resolution of the fovea of the human eye is one arc minute. Having an angular resolution of your display panel higher than one arc minute thus very quickly yields diminishing return (and only because of lack of proper filtering in the image processing parts).

This means that for any given diagonal size/resolution you have a viewing distance, beyond which you're basically wasting money if you opt for the higher resolution panel.

For 50" 1366x768 panel this distance is:

dist= 50"*(16/sqrt(16*16+9*9)) / (1366 * tan (1/60)) = 109,6" = 9,1'

Cheers
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post #306 of 319 Old 01-28-2008, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOSTON-HD View Post

As another poster mentioned. Do I wished I had a Pioneer 5010? Yes...Why not! But not @ it's current price tag. For sub $2,000 the 5080 is "the" best value period! I'm glad I was shopping around for a new 50"

I'll keep the 5080 for 3 years or so & pick up the latest & greatest then. I hope I can get a few dollars for my 5080 when I'm ready to sell itdown theroad.

When they start doing 1080p broadcast count me in.. Blu-Ray at the viewing distance I am at 11-12 feet this set will do just fine in our bedroom. I have a FP 1080p system 92" and a 60" XBR2 1080p so I guess I am set for a while. The Pioneer was just hard to pass up at it's price point and quality of picture.
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post #307 of 319 Old 01-29-2008, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gubbi View Post

The angular resolution of the fovea of the human eye is one arc minute.

Assuming the optics are perfect. So this is an upper limit.

Quote:


For 50" 1366x768 panel this distance is:

dist= 50"*(16/sqrt(16*16+9*9)) / (1366 * tan (1/60)) = 109,6" = 9,1'

Or LESS, depending on the optics. Optical considerations are really the key here since there would be relatively little variance in retinal resolution from person to person.

Thats why I would suggest that at ~8ft 1080p would make little difference for most eyeballs in terms of pixel grid visibility (scaling is another issue).
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post #308 of 319 Old 01-29-2008, 01:41 PM
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I can't believe this thread is still alive.
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post #309 of 319 Old 01-29-2008, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flood222 View Post

I can't believe this thread is still alive.

It must be thanks to contributions like these.
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post #310 of 319 Old 02-17-2008, 04:26 AM
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Hello all,

Would someone be kind enough to direct me (PM if needed) to as good a deal as possible for this wonderful Pioneer. I need a new hd tv seeing that I own both HD-DVD and BLU-RAY DVD platers. Sad that HD may be going bye, bye. Thank you in advance.
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post #311 of 319 Old 02-17-2008, 06:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rousemc View Post

I was thinking for returning my 4671F Samsung and picking up a 5080 Pioneer. Comments? THANKS GUYS AND GALS!

My suggestion is gonna be different from most.
I would recommend keeping the 71F. The 71F is an awesome TV and you might regret the stepdown in resolution (depending on how close you watch your TV and if you do alot of viewing of text). SDE was an issue for me with the 5080. of course i had a 1080p display for a while before picking up the 5080 so I really noticed SDE and the less sharp picture more than most would.
Blacks are a little better on the 5080 but not by far.
I would get the 5010 (if you can afford it) or wait until the 9G's come out. Pioneer is completly doing away with lower resolution models next generation. Which means price might not be that bad on the 5020 (but as of right now who knows?).
Everything is going 1080p now and to enjoy Bluray/HD-DVD the way it was intended you need a 1080p TV no matter how nice the blacks and contrast is on the 5080. And the 71F is no slouch in those categories. 720/768p displays throw away a significant amount of the 1080i/p picture information before displaying the image. The image may still look good but is less detailed and sharp.
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post #312 of 319 Old 02-17-2008, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rousemc View Post

I was thinking for returning my 4671F Samsung and picking up a 5080 Pioneer. Comments? THANKS GUYS AND GALS!

according to this poster ovr on the LCD side, you possibly should keep your '71; it, supposedly has greater brightness, though that appears to be its only 'bright' point:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=995363
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post #313 of 319 Old 02-17-2008, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chadmak09 View Post

720/768p displays throw away a significant amount of the 1080i/p picture information before displaying the image. The image may still look good but is less detailed and sharp.

if you're sitting more than 6ft away and your eyes can't resolve the extra detail, does it really make any difference at all?

"That's right Mr. Martini...there is an Easter Bunny".
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post #314 of 319 Old 03-04-2008, 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by G-star View Post

if you're sitting more than 6ft away and your eyes can't resolve the extra detail, does it really make any difference at all?

My eyes can resolve the extra detail on the 1080 at beyond 12 feet.
Some folks have better vision than others
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post #315 of 319 Old 03-04-2008, 09:37 AM
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Originally Posted by G-star View Post

if you're sitting more than 6ft away and your eyes can't resolve the extra detail, does it really make any difference at all?

Blind people dont watch TV so none of it makes a difference to them.

Obviously if you can't tell a difference then who cares.
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post #316 of 319 Old 03-05-2008, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by burnsalkire View Post

My eyes can resolve the extra detail on the 1080 at beyond 12 feet.
Some folks have better vision than others

And some people don't know the difference between scaling artifacts and pixel resolution in regards to human vision.
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post #317 of 319 Old 03-05-2008, 11:51 AM
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Interestingly, from what I've read in earlier reviews, the NON-LED sammies have always done better.
I think LED was rushed on the scene to deter the criticism of having to replace lamps as a sales pump.
So in that respect, it may not be a fair comparison but have doubts any of their DLPs would outdo a properly setup SXRD.
At the same, not surprised to see it on the bottom for providing a 'better technology' that is NOT better with regards to PQ, and costs more besides.
Best to stick with what you are best at, and keep improving. This is exemplified by both Pioneer and Panasonic in the plasma world, as well as Sony who leaves the RP scene at least with a valiant effort the last time around. (And it's not easy for me to conjure up a lot of praise for anything Sony).
This article seems to imply LCD is far from the chopping block though. Just another opinion.
http://www.audioholics.com/news/indu...sma-tv-is-dead
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post #318 of 319 Old 03-05-2008, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by mike infinity View Post

And some people don't know the difference between scaling artifacts and pixel resolution in regards to human vision.

And some people believe more in what they're told than what they can see with their own eyes
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post #319 of 319 Old 03-05-2008, 12:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burnsalkire View Post

And some people believe more in what they're told than what they can see with their own eyes

This is shortest and best post I have seen in a long time and so true. And to top it off they expect everyone else to believe what they have been told rather than let us decide with our own eyes.
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