hdmi only, distance, and clarification on devices? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 9 Old 09-07-2010, 04:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi,

I have three primary questions:

1. If I'm buying all components (tv, receiver, blu ray player, ps3, etc) new in 2010, does it make sense to have analog wires, or can I just go 100% HDMI?

2. I'm a little confused on distance specifications for cat 2 HDMI cabling (the "high speed"); I found numerous posts and the wikipedia article which explain the limitations/specifications of cat 1 / standard on small-mid sized screens. Currently, I will need less than 20ft between receiver and TV for a 65" screen. I may hook up a projector to do about 120" in a few months, but the distance will need to be about 35ft. Are both these distances feasible without real-world loss in quality? What is a good rule of thumb for HDMI on 65"+ screens in terms of distance at high speed spec?

3. The whole, "one cable" brings much confusion as I'm used to "input" and "output" I would like to make sure I get the appropriate number of HDMI cables under such a setup: TV, receiver, game console (e.g. ps3/wii/xbox), computer, amp.

Would number three need hdmi cabling like so:
receiver <-> TV (1 HDMI)
receiver <-> game console (1 HDMI)
receiver <-> computer (1 HDMI)
receiver <-> amp (1 HDMI)

Assuming, of course, all the above are hdmi compatible.

Thank you for your time!
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post #2 of 9 Old 09-08-2010, 12:27 PM
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1. Going all HDMI is best, if you can.

2. One of the best cables for distance is the Series 1 Beldon bonded-pair wire from Blue Jeans Cable. It's rated to 25' for Category 2 but likely will work longer than that.
The size of the TV screen has no effect on the allowed cable length. Since HDMI is digital, it either works perfectly or very badly (sparkles, dropouts, etc.). There's no subtle degradation of picture quality.

3. It requires one cable for each unit, as you showed.

Carl
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post #3 of 9 Old 09-08-2010, 02:57 PM
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If you are running lines, you might look into running some Cat 6 wires. I ran 4 of them across my room in addition to the two (2) 45' hdmi wires. Trying to protect myself from the future since I currently have open ceilings.
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post #4 of 9 Old 09-09-2010, 09:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Great, appreciate the input Carl.

Coytee - duh, I forgot about the cat6, yes, I want to do that. Also, looks like I'll need one digital out from the TV and one coax in, as I plan on getting an antenna in the attic for local HD tv, and I'd like the sound to come from speakers as opposed to the tv itself.
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post #5 of 9 Old 09-10-2010, 01:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jedovaty View Post

Hi,

I have three primary questions:

1. If I'm buying all components (tv, receiver, blu ray player, ps3, etc) new in 2010, does it make sense to have analog wires, or can I just go 100% HDMI?

2. I'm a little confused on distance specifications for cat 2 HDMI cabling (the "high speed"); I found numerous posts and the wikipedia article which explain the limitations/specifications of cat 1 / standard on small-mid sized screens. Currently, I will need less than 20ft between receiver and TV for a 65" screen. I may hook up a projector to do about 120" in a few months, but the distance will need to be about 35ft. Are both these distances feasible without real-world loss in quality? What is a good rule of thumb for HDMI on 65"+ screens in terms of distance at high speed spec?

3. The whole, "one cable" brings much confusion as I'm used to "input" and "output" I would like to make sure I get the appropriate number of HDMI cables under such a setup: TV, receiver, game console (e.g. ps3/wii/xbox), computer, amp.

Would number three need hdmi cabling like so:
receiver <-> TV (1 HDMI)
receiver <-> game console (1 HDMI)
receiver <-> computer (1 HDMI)
receiver <-> amp (1 HDMI)

Assuming, of course, all the above are hdmi compatible.

Thank you for your time!

1. Analog? What's analog? I joke of course. In 2010, I think there is no reason why you wouldn't use HDMI at this stage. I still think the industry should make all connections ethernet though, can carry all types of data, I think? And over long distances. HELLO? Anyway yes I would say go with HDMI.

2. For long distrance runs of HDMI I would suggest just using a HDMI via Cat5/Cat6 extender. These can be very expensive and they can be cheap as chips. I can't tell you where to find one because I only know where to find them in the UK, and not America.

3.(And question underneath 3) This all depends on a sole receiver where the speakers are powered the receiver. Or a pre-amp or processor where all your connections from your sources go into but you have a seperate amp to power your speakers? By the look of it you want a pre-amp/processor where you have a seperate amp. But I haven't seen anyone be able to use hdmi for wiring between a processor and an amp before.

Could be wrong though :S Can't keep up with technology these days.

Any fool can make something complex. It takes more to make something simple.
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post #6 of 9 Old 09-10-2010, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 123Easy View Post

I still think the industry should make all connections ethernet...

Even gigabit ethernet does not have the bandwidth to handle the fastest bit rates permitted by HDMI

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For long distrance runs of HDMI I would suggest just using a HDMI via Cat5/Cat6 extender.

Passive Cat5/Cat6 solutions will give a worse result than HDMI. Most active Cat5/Cat6 solutions will give no better results than active HDMI solutions. Usually, the only advantages to Cat5/Cat6 are cable cost and ability to field terminate cables.
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post #7 of 9 Old 09-24-2010, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Colm View Post

Even gigabit ethernet does not have the bandwidth to handle the fastest bit rates permitted by HDMI

True...but you could run several gigE cables for much less than the cost of a long HDMI cable. And Cat6A is rated to support 10-gigabit ethernet for distances up to 100 meters.

Make it all digital and packet-based. This would have some advantages--you could use multicast to send the same stream to multiple devices, and you could separate the audio and video streams so that you could send the video to the projector and the audio to the receiver. You could use point-to-point links (like with HDMI) or you could stick a 10G switch in the rack and have ultimate flexibility, with everything able to talk to everything else simultaneously.
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post #8 of 9 Old 09-24-2010, 05:02 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Friesen View Post

True...but you could run several gigE cables for much less than the cost of a long HDMI cable. And Cat6A is rated to support 10-gigabit ethernet for distances up to 100 meters.

Make it all digital and packet-based. This would have some advantages--you could use multicast to send the same stream to multiple devices, and you could separate the audio and video streams so that you could send the video to the projector and the audio to the receiver. You could use point-to-point links (like with HDMI) or you could stick a 10G switch in the rack and have ultimate flexibility, with everything able to talk to everything else simultaneously.

It's called SDI. Been around for years, and is the professional standard.
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post #9 of 9 Old 09-24-2010, 06:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Friesen View Post

...but you could run several gigE cables for much less than the cost of a long HDMI cable.

And you still wouldn't be able to run uncompressed HDMI at high bit rates over any of them. What is the point?

You could do it with 10Gb technology, although probably not as easily or cheaply as you may believe. But that wasn't an option when HDMI was developed.

FWIW there are already devices available purportedly capable of running HDMI over cat 5/6 cable 100 meters using the Valens chips. Valens and some big names in CE have started the HDBaseT Alliance to promote this kind of technology. Supposedly the first CE products incorporating it are to hit by the end of the year or early next year.
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