signla loss with 50ft cable hdmi - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 08:10 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
i,m trying to connect oppo95 with my infocus in83.
so far after hours of testing i have the follow issues.
hdmi 1 (qdeo) and in83 losses signal some times.
hdmi2 (non qdeo) and in 83 does not losses signal
i tried 3 difernet cables
1.wireworld croma 6 12m
2.kyedigital 50ft
3. atlas 50ft

nr 2 does not locks at hdmi2 at all and at hdmi 1 locks but losses signla some times
nr1 and nr 3 locks at hdmi2 without signal loss but it losses signla sime times at hdmi1

so what it might be the problem? handshakes between qdeo and in83? because that is the conclusion for me. a booster or a repeater will fix that problem? unfortunately my pg is too far away from oppo and i have to use a 50ft cable.
klamia71 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 08:50 AM
 
alk3997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,722
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 87
Unfortunately you're well outside of the spec at 50 feet for sending an HDMI high speed signal over that cable. As a test, try setting the OPPO's resolution output to 1080i and see if that works.

Assuming 1080i works, there are some potential solutions to your problem but I want to rule out a bad HDMI port first.
alk3997 is offline  
post #3 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 09:21 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by alk3997 View Post

Unfortunately you're well outside of the spec at 50 feet for sending an HDMI high speed signal over that cable. As a test, try setting the OPPO's resolution output to 1080i and see if that works.

Assuming 1080i works, there are some potential solutions to your problem but I want to rule out a bad HDMI port first.

at lower resolution ti works at 720p
i didnt try out at 180 i but i will,
klamia71 is offline  
post #4 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 09:37 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by alk3997 View Post

Unfortunately you're well outside of the spec at 50 feet for sending an HDMI high speed signal over that cable. As a test, try setting the OPPO's resolution output to 1080i and see if that works.

Assuming 1080i works, there are some potential solutions to your problem but I want to rule out a bad HDMI port first.

on the other hand,,i try out to feed my panasonic 42" tv and had no problem..so i dont think that the hdmi has any problem...
klamia71 is offline  
post #5 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 09:42 AM
 
alk3997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,722
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by klamia71 View Post

on the other hand,,i try out to feed my panasonic 42" tv and had no problem..so i dont think that the hdmi has any problem...

Incorrect. You're dealing with line equalization and other issues that are very source and sink dependent since you are outside of the spec. However, that 720p works rules out an HDMI port problem (only).

By any chance do you have deep color set to off for the OPPO and the projector? It should be set to 'off'.
alk3997 is offline  
post #6 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 10:07 AM
 
alk3997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,722
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 87
I have a few seconds right now so let me just cut to the chase...

Assuming 1080i works and 1080p still doesn't work with deep color disabled, then your 50' standard speed HDMI cable is likely the problem. 25' is roughtly the maximum length of a certified high speed cable that can send an HDMI high speed signal.

Now standard speed cables have the same pin-outs as their high speed equivalents. What the high speed cables have is certification that they work at the speeds that allow 1080p (and 3D and with deep color) to work.

Your cable is a standard speed cable and it obviously doesn't work at high speeds consistently.

So, your choices are:

1) Try a better standard speed cable (remember there are no high speed cables at 50').

2) Try an active HDMI cable

3) Try a converter that converts HDMI to Cat 6 and then back to HDMI

4) Go fibre.

Those are roughly in the order of cost (lower to higher). Try Monoprice or Blue Jeans Cable if you try another standard speed cable. Higher gauge cables seem (at least to us) to have a better success rate for what you are trying to do and they don't cost too much (around $40 - $50 for 50 feet).

I didn't answer your earlier question - a booster or repeater (except for those used by active cables) would likely just cause your distortion in a passive HDMI cable to be amplied. You might get lucky with one but I'd say the odds are against it.
alk3997 is offline  
post #7 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 10:19 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by alk3997 View Post

Incorrect. You're dealing with line equalization and other issues that are very source and sink dependent since you are outside of the spec. However, that 720p works rules out an HDMI port problem (only).

By any chance do you have deep color set to off for the OPPO and the projector? It should be set to 'off'.

if understand right...an hdmi port problem at oppo doesn't effect that at pani works fine.

with deep colour on or of the result its the same. at hdmi i have signal loss at hdmi2 i don't
klamia71 is offline  
post #8 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 10:26 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by alk3997 View Post

I have a few seconds right now so let me just cut to the chase...

Assuming 1080i works and 1080p still doesn't work with deep color disabled, then your 50' standard speed HDMI cable is likely the problem. 25' is roughtly the maximum length of a certified high speed cable that can send an HDMI high speed signal.

Now standard speed cables have the same pin-outs as their high speed equivalents. What the high speed cables have is certification that they work at the speeds that allow 1080p (and 3D and with deep color) to work.

Your cable is a standard speed cable and it obviously doesn't work at high speeds consistently.

So, your choices are:

1) Try a better standard speed cable (remember there are no high speed cables at 50').

2) Try an active HDMI cable

3) Try a converter that converts HDMI to Cat 6 and then back to HDMI

4) Go fibre.

Those are roughly in the order of cost (lower to higher). Try Monoprice or Blue Jeans Cable if you try another standard speed cable. Higher gauge cables seem (at least to us) to have a better success rate for what you are trying to do and they don't cost too much (around $40 - $50 for 50 feet).

I didn't answer your earlier question - a booster or repeater (except for those used by active cables) would likely just cause your distortion in a passive HDMI cable to be amplied. You might get lucky with one but I'd say the odds are against it.

what about fibres? i dont know anything about that method. unfortunately i,m at greece so i don't have th luxury to try out cables that are sould at us. if i buy it and not working i want do anything else..but i will keep it in mind

you tthink a converter that converts HDMI to Cat 6 and then back to HDMI it will be a good solution? any store that sells something like that?
klamia71 is offline  
post #9 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 10:37 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by klamia71 View Post

what about fibres? i dont know anything about that method. unfortunately i,m at greece so i don't have th luxury to try out cables that are sould at us. if i buy it and not working i want do anything else..but i will keep it in mind

you tthink a converter that converts HDMI to Cat 6 and then back to HDMI it will be a good solution? any store that sells something like that?

right now i,m running hdmi1 with deep colour to off at 1080i.....waiting to see what happens


no problem so far....
klamia71 is offline  
post #10 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 11:04 AM
 
alk3997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,722
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by klamia71 View Post

what about fibres? i dont know anything about that method. unfortunately i,m at greece so i don't have th luxury to try out cables that are sould at us. if i buy it and not working i want do anything else..but i will keep it in mind

you tthink a converter that converts HDMI to Cat 6 and then back to HDMI it will be a good solution? any store that sells something like that?

Plenty of people have had a good results with all of the methods listed. Just make sure if you want 3D to be available that any converter has been tested for 3D usage.

Also try 1080p with deep color off and see if that works.
alk3997 is offline  
post #11 of 23 Old 11-12-2011, 01:34 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by alk3997 View Post

Plenty of people have had a good results with all of the methods listed. Just make sure if you want 3D to be available that any converter has been tested for 3D usage.

Also try 1080p with deep color off and see if that works.

in83 doesnt support 3d...so for the time i ,m not interstied for 3d
klamia71 is offline  
post #12 of 23 Old 11-13-2011, 12:54 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
at the bottom line after many hours of testing so far....... hdmi1 (with or without deep color enable it) and with any cable (50ft-10ft) losses signal
hdmi 2 hdmi1 (with or without deep color enable it) and with any cable (50ft-10ft) doesn't losses signal

i,m too close to believe that the hdmi1 has a significant problem
klamia71 is offline  
post #13 of 23 Old 11-13-2011, 02:41 PM
 
alk3997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,722
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 87
Was that true at 1080i or just 1080p?

Also could you please rephrase your last sentence since I couldn't understand it.

When you write HDMI1 or HDMI2, do you mean on the BDP-95 or the TV? Please try all 4 combinations of HDMI ports to narrow down the problem.
alk3997 is offline  
post #14 of 23 Old 11-13-2011, 11:46 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by alk3997 View Post

Was that true at 1080i or just 1080p?

Also could you please rephrase your last sentence since I couldn't understand it.

When you write HDMI1 or HDMI2, do you mean on the BDP-95 or the TV? Please try all 4 combinations of HDMI ports to narrow down the problem.


when i connect in83 with oppo's hdmi1 (with deep color on or off) i have signla loss
when i connect in83 with oppo's hdmi2 (with deep color on or off) i dont have signal loss

when i'm saying hdmi1 or hdmi2 i'm refering to oppo's hdmi's. in83 has only one hdmi.

my last phrase: after all these tests i wondering if oppo's hdmi1 has any problem.
klamia71 is offline  
post #15 of 23 Old 11-14-2011, 06:55 AM
AVS Special Member
 
budwich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Kanata, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,321
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by klamia71 View Post

...

my last phrase: after all these tests i wondering if oppo's hdmi1 has any problem.

YES.... IF your "newer statements" about "50ft -10FT" cable testing are accurate COMPARED with your initial post which made NO mention of the "shorter length" cable tests.
budwich is offline  
post #16 of 23 Old 11-14-2011, 07:01 AM
 
alk3997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,722
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 87
OK, I understand now. If you are having a signal loss on BDP-95 HDMI-1 and you are using a good 10-foot cable (and certified for high speed), then HDMI-1 likely has an issue. The 50-foot cable results aren't very useful since 50-feet is officially outside of the high speed cable range but the 10 foot cable should provide solid communications (again assuming the cable is good).

Try rebooting the BDP-95 and make sure you have the latest firmware. One additional thing you could try is to use your in83's DVI port (I believe it has one). You'll need an HDMI-->DVI converter or a cable with HDMI on one end and DVI on the other.

Unfortunately, unless anyone else can think of another thing to try, I think your next step if the above doesn't help is to contact OPPO support. Luckily they provide some of the best support I've found. The few times I've had questions, they have always responded within a few hours by email (even on the weekends). Very impressive support!
alk3997 is offline  
post #17 of 23 Old 11-14-2011, 09:36 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
something like that : http://www.avenview.com/hdmi-13-exte...rt-p-1500.html it would be a solution to my problem?
i assume that is working with a common cat5 cable(that allready have )
klamia71 is offline  
post #18 of 23 Old 11-14-2011, 02:54 PM
 
alk3997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,722
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by klamia71 View Post

something like that : http://www.avenview.com/hdmi-13-exte...rt-p-1500.html it would be a solution to my problem?
i assume that is working with a common cat5 cable(that allready have )

Yes, but...If you are having an HDMI port problem, then you'll still have the exact same problem with this converter unit. If it is a cable problem then something like this should solve the problem.

However, note that the specs say,
"Pure unaltered uncompressed 7.1ch digital HDMI over Cat.5/5e/6 cable transmission"

This is great for audio but I could not find an equivalent statement for video other than the bandwidth. You might want to check with the manufacturer first and make sure that the video is not compressed by the conversion.
alk3997 is offline  
post #19 of 23 Old 11-15-2011, 01:47 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
i think the problem is the long hdmi cable . with the inbox oppo cable ( 3ft long ) i have no signal loss...so i assume that if i want to use a long hdmi cable im forced to use a booster because Since the digital output signal strength of these types of devices have no standard, each HDMI output may have different circuitry that affects the output amplitude of each output. The drop-out problem seems to correspond to a low signal strength output, where the device is not correctly “handshaking” with the input device combing with the long distance cable.
klamia71 is offline  
post #20 of 23 Old 11-15-2011, 06:10 AM
AVS Special Member
 
budwich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Kanata, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,321
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 21
I guess his "newer statements" about "50ft-10FT" weren't accurate... :-(
budwich is offline  
post #21 of 23 Old 11-15-2011, 06:35 AM
 
alk3997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,722
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by klamia71 View Post

i think the problem is the long hdmi cable . with the inbox oppo cable ( 3ft long ) i have no signal loss...so i assume that if i want to use a long hdmi cable im forced to use a booster because Since the digital output signal strength of these types of devices have no standard, each HDMI output may have different circuitry that affects the output amplitude of each output. The drop-out problem seems to correspond to a low signal strength output, where the device is not correctly “handshaking” with the input device combing with the long distance cable.

Or it could be a bad BDP-95 port. I can't tell you anything else from here since I don't have the data.

I can tell you that at 10 feet every certified high speed HDMI cable should work at 1080p. No exceptions. So, if you are using a good 10' certified high speed HDMI cable and you continue to get drop-outs, then something else is going on with HDMI port #1 on the BDP-95.

At 3', I would expect that every HDMI cable, whether high speed or standard speed, would work.

Have you checked to make sure the 10' HDMI cable you are using is a certified high speed HDMI cable? If it wasn't then that testing was invalid.


Also, these are high speed digital cables. Increasing the amplitude of a digital cable signal can just cause more 1s and 0s to not make it across the cable. You can amplify just as much noise as you do signal. That's why I provided you a list of options above which did not include a signal booster.
alk3997 is offline  
post #22 of 23 Old 11-15-2011, 09:23 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
klamia71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
i,m still testing cables and hdmi port's.
i.ll be synoptic

3ft cable (no name ) : hdmi1 ----> ok
hdmi2-----> ok
15ft cable (cliptronik ): hdmi1-----> ok
hdmi2-----> ok
50ft cable ( expensive ) : hdmi1 ----> x
hdmi2-----> ok

all connection where with deep colour and "on " and "off" ..no difference
klamia71 is offline  
post #23 of 23 Old 11-15-2011, 09:34 AM
 
alk3997's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 3,722
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by klamia71 View Post

i,m still testing cables and hdmi port's.
i.ll be synoptic

3ft cable (no name ) : hdmi1 ----> ok
hdmi2-----> ok
15ft cable (cliptronik ): hdmi1-----> ok
hdmi2-----> ok
50ft cable ( expensive ) : hdmi1 ----> x
hdmi2-----> ok

all connection where with deep colour and "on " and "off" ..no difference

Now this is starting to make sense. Given no additional testing results, you have a cable issue. The best thing to do would be to try one of the items I listed earlier.

BTW, I'm using a Monoprice 50' and it works for high speed (including a BDP-85 HDMI port #1) but I suspect it can't do more than the 3D bandwidth requirement, which means it is on the hairy edge of not working.

If you want to be sure things will work use an actual active HDMI cable (not an amplified passive cable) or convert to Cat 6 as you mentioned earlier.
alk3997 is offline  
Reply HDMI Q&A - The One Connector World

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off