Need Help projecting same image in two rooms. - AVS Forum
HDMI Q&A - The One Connector World > Need Help projecting same image in two rooms.
sisserman's Avatar sisserman 07:07 PM 07-10-2013
I am trying to send the same signal from my Blue-ray to both my dedicated movie theater as well as the flat panel TV over the bar. The images are fine, but when I turn on the TV, my theater surround mode drops from True Dolby HD to a lesser mode. When the TV is shut off, it bumps right back to Dolby HD.

Here's the setup:
Oppo 95
Marantz AV7005 pre-pro
McIntosh mc205 amp
Epson Pro Cinema 6020UB
Bar TV is a basic Toshiba LCD connected to a small amp via optical preceded by a simple 2 channel DAC (TV is fed via HDMI)
HS HDMIs all around (from Blue Jeans cables)

Here is how I have it wired:
Oppo 95 HDMI out to the Marantz HDMI3 in
HDMI Zone 1 from the Marantz to the projector
HDMI Zone 2 from the Marantz to the TV

Seems simple enough, just can't figure out why the sound is degraded when the TV is on. I know that HDMI will drop to the lowest common denominator resolution, but why would this matter if I am using zone 2.

I got creative and tried a few tricks, all failed!!!
Oppo HDMI1 out to Marantz
Oppo HDMI2 out directly to TV Same problem!
cool that the OPPO 95 has 2 HDMI outs... didn't help!

I then ordered a component to HDMI converter thinking I could outsmart the HDMI handshake (if that is indeed the problem)
so OPPO HDMI1 to Marantz and OPPO component to HDMI converter and then to TV via HDMI. Also tried Marantz Zone2 component out... same deal!

I am really confused now, any suggestions?

This is my dream project for which I have saved for 8 years, hate for it not to be perfect. Interestingly, if I set zone 2 to a different source, say Roku or DirectTV, no problem. Just makes me think it's an HDMI issue?

thanks in advance everyone! - Steve






I did the ceiling with glow in the dark paint surrounded by black lights, very cool effect, way nicer than fiber-optics.

alk3997's Avatar alk3997 09:05 AM 07-11-2013
It's good that you already understand the Lowest Common Denominator principle. That helps. But, this isn't an HDMI issue - HDMI is working per spec.

You still have to remember that your source, the OPPO BDP-95 in this case, can only send one audio and one video signal over an HDMI cable at any time. And, it has to send a compatible signal with *all* sinks, including the projector (as modified by the AVR) and the TV.

The ability to send HDMI to Zone 2 is relatively new. So the implementations make a bunch of assuptions. The one that is getting you is that the Zone 2 TV is assumed to be in a different room than the AVR. Since it is in a different room, the audio must be compatible with the sink (the TV in this case) that is in that room. So, stereo it is.

That information gets back to the BDP-95 over the EDID and the BDP-95 changes its audio to stereo.

Luckily you have the OPPO BDP-95 (or any other recent OPPO). There are two (pretty much) completely independent HDMI outputs on the BDP-95. You'll need to hook both outputs to the AVR. Then use HDMI #1 BDP-95 output for the projector and HDMI #2 BDP-95 output for the TV in Zone #2. BDP-95 HDMI Output #1 will be multichannel and BDP-95 HDMI Output #2 will generate stereo. Problem solved. Remember to setup your HDMI Output #2 correctly in the OPPO menu - see the owners manual for help.

I use close to tthe same setup for theater room multichannel with HDMI #1 and whole home distribution in stereo using HDMI #2. So, it works.

I'm assuming you want to send other things beside Blu-Ray to Zone #2 which is why you should run both through the AVR. If you just want to send Blu-Ray to the TV, then just wire BDP-95 HDMI #2 directly to the TV.
sisserman's Avatar sisserman 10:22 AM 07-11-2013
Andy

Thanks for the advice.

Already tried those things. When I send the oppo hdmi2 directly to the TV, same problem (going through the AVP or directly)

I even tried the oppo component + optical and converted it to HDMI with a nice little converter from monoprice.com, same issue.

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10114&cs_id=1011412&p_id=10251&seq=1&format=2


Very frustrating!
alk3997's Avatar alk3997 12:38 PM 07-11-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by sisserman View Post

Andy

Thanks for the advice.

Already tried those things. When I send the oppo hdmi2 directly to the TV, same problem (going through the AVP or directly)

I even tried the oppo component + optical and converted it to HDMI with a nice little converter from monoprice.com, same issue.

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10114&cs_id=1011412&p_id=10251&seq=1&format=2


Very frustrating!

You have a wrong option set then. The HDMI1 and HDMI2 ports on the OPPO are designed to do this.

So, for a test - Run the OPPO port 1 directly to your AVR. Disconnect all video outputs from the AVR.
- Run the OPPO port 2 directly to the TV.
- Do not use any switchers or any other devices besides the OPPO, the AVR, the TV and two HDMI cables.

Try and see if this setup works. If it does not, then this is a menu setting issue in the OPPO. If it works, then we can troubleshoot from there. Definitely do-able without any additional boxes.
AV_Integrated's Avatar AV_Integrated 08:14 PM 07-12-2013
If you are still having issues, why not try the new Monoprice HDMI audio extractor? It has a EDID audio minder on it (from what it is advertised as) which will force audio to the highest level regardless of what comes after it.

This should mean that the TV will not get any audio when it is on and getting the Oppo audio and the projector is on. But, the surround receiver should still receive HD audio without any problems.

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10114&cs_id=1011412&p_id=10251&seq=1&format=2
alk3997's Avatar alk3997 07:42 AM 07-13-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV_Integrated View Post

If you are still having issues, why not try the new Monoprice HDMI audio extractor? It has a EDID audio minder on it (from what it is advertised as) which will force audio to the highest level regardless of what comes after it.

This should mean that the TV will not get any audio when it is on and getting the Oppo audio and the projector is on. But, the surround receiver should still receive HD audio without any problems.

http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=101&cp_id=10114&cs_id=1011412&p_id=10251&seq=1&format=2

That doesn't actually help the OP, does it? He wants to have both the AVR and TV working with sound at the same time. The later OPPO models (including the BDP-95) are designed to do exactly what he wants.

So, I don't see why, after spending a ton of money, that his setup shouldn't work without adding numerous small boxes. Actually I think some of the OP's problems are the small boxes he has tried to add. Adding another small box is only going to make it more difficult to find the original problem.
AV_Integrated's Avatar AV_Integrated 10:28 AM 07-13-2013
I haven't owned a BD-95 and I am concerned that the Oppo may not include two audio processing chips which will allow for both HD audio and stereo audio over the dual HDMI outputs. Not going to argue this at all - as I said, I don't know. But, from what I've heard the Oppo will output HD audio on one output while just playing HD video on the other output. If it can't deal with two different embedded audio streams, then this would definitely be an issue that can't be overcome directly from the Oppo.

I'm guessing the TV itself can handle different surround sound formats but not HD audio, so that would explain why HD audio doesn't work. But, it would seem that the highest common audio format would be Dolby Digital or something similar, not standard two channel.

The Monoprice box may get HD audio to everything, but won't fix that the TV doesn't know how to deal with HD audio.

So, if the Oppo does not have a fix for this, then I'm not aware of a solution that is reasonably priced. But, perhaps the Monoprice audio extractor with DSP will pull out a two channel down converted mix which can then be sent to the TV separately while maintaining HD audio to the theater.

Stupid EDID.

There are solutions which are pricey to do all of this, but it would make more sense to just get a second Blu-ray Disc player and hook it up.

Actually, when I did this recently, I just bought an inexpensive surround receiver for the second zone to maintain HD audio between two receivers. Seemed to work pretty well.

That is, as I said, if the Oppo can't handle two separate audio streams embedded in the two separate HDMI outputs at the same time.
alk3997's Avatar alk3997 01:25 PM 07-13-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV_Integrated View Post

I haven't owned a BD-95 and I am concerned that the Oppo may not include two audio processing chips which will allow for both HD audio and stereo audio over the dual HDMI outputs...

It does. I have a BDP-93 which has the same capabilities. Guessing doesn't help anyone.
sisserman's Avatar sisserman 05:40 PM 07-15-2013
hey Andy
sry so long in responding as I've not had time to escape the family

I've tried running the OPPO HDMI2 directly into the TV and still I lose surround sound in the theater even though both HDMIs seem to be independent of each other. There must be some odd algorithm in the OPPO.

I got real fancy by moving my old Onkyo receiver into to bar and running HDMI2 into it, then the TV. Since the Onkyo can handle the latest surround modes I figured the Oppo wouldn't need to drop down the sound quality. No luck again.

Starting to wonder if there is something odd about the LCD TV.

I was also thinking of trying a sound bar with and HDMI in/out preceding the TV?

what settings in the oppo might I try? didn't seem to be any that made a difference.

thanks- steve
sisserman's Avatar sisserman 05:41 PM 07-15-2013
cool
will check it out
alk3997's Avatar alk3997 08:31 PM 07-15-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by sisserman View Post

hey Andy
sry so long in responding as I've not had time to escape the family

I've tried running the OPPO HDMI2 directly into the TV and still I lose surround sound in the theater even though both HDMIs seem to be independent of each other. There must be some odd algorithm in the OPPO.

I got real fancy by moving my old Onkyo receiver into to bar and running HDMI2 into it, then the TV. Since the Onkyo can handle the latest surround modes I figured the Oppo wouldn't need to drop down the sound quality. No luck again.

Starting to wonder if there is something odd about the LCD TV.

I was also thinking of trying a sound bar with and HDMI in/out preceding the TV?

what settings in the oppo might I try? didn't seem to be any that made a difference.

thanks- steve

Steve, the BDP-95 owner's manual can be found at:http://download.oppodigital.com/BDP95/BDP-95_English_Manual_v1.2.pdf

Page 27 has the audio setup information. I suggest you run the audio wizard and select compatibility mode first. Only if that doesn't work try the advanced mode.

Also check page 65 but remember you are setting up for two independent HDMI outputs.

OPPO recommends setting HDMI 1 to the TV and HDMI 2 to the AVR.
sisserman's Avatar sisserman 03:28 PM 07-16-2013
thanks for info
will try it out
the manual says to favor hdmi1, but i will try it both ways


"• Either of the HDMI output terminals (HDMI 1 and/or HDMI 2) on the rear panel of the BDP-95
can be connected to your receiver. Preference should be given to HDMI 1 for video since it’s the
only output on the machine to benefit from the superior Marvell QDEO video processing solution,
and set the “Primary Output” option in the setup menu to “HDMI 1” (please refer to page 53)"
sisserman's Avatar sisserman 03:30 PM 07-16-2013
now I'm confused

"• BDP-95 provides a Dual HDMI connection to make sure you can enjoy the highest possible
video quality and resolution, in addition to the high bit rate audio content. You can use the
included HDMI cable to connect the HDMI 1 output to your HDTV and use another HDMI cable
(not included) to connect the HDMI 2 output to your receiver, also set the “Primary Output”
option in the Video Setup section of the Setup menu to “HDMI 1” (see page 53 for details). In
this way you can utilize the dedicated video processor available for HDMI 1 output, and allow
your receiver which has no HDMI 1.4 inputs to work without any loss on the digital audio signals"

will try it both ways . smile.gif
alk3997's Avatar alk3997 06:21 PM 07-16-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by sisserman View Post

now I'm confused

"• BDP-95 provides a Dual HDMI connection to make sure you can enjoy the highest possible
video quality and resolution, in addition to the high bit rate audio content. You can use the
included HDMI cable to connect the HDMI 1 output to your HDTV and use another HDMI cable
(not included) to connect the HDMI 2 output to your receiver, also set the “Primary Output”
option in the Video Setup section of the Setup menu to “HDMI 1” (see page 53 for details). In
this way you can utilize the dedicated video processor available for HDMI 1 output, and allow
your receiver which has no HDMI 1.4 inputs to work without any loss on the digital audio signals"

will try it both ways . smile.gif

It's mostly about which HDMI output has the greater amount of video processing available. Both outputs, if configured properly can do multichannel audio.
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