HDbaseT: Multiple receiver types - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 11 Old 04-27-2014, 12:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Hello,

 

Recent reading tells me that HDbaseT may be the monitor connection solution I've been wishing for for years, and AVS came up at the top of my Google search for "HDbaseT Forum."  I joined, have put in my vote for the creation of an HDbaseT forum here on AVS, and if you're interested I suggest that you do likewise. 

 

My question is this, for anyone who is familiar with HDbaseT converter units: Can I mix and match my destination receivers?  That is, can I start with a DVI to HDbaseT converter box and run it to an HDbaseT to HDMI, DVI or VGA converter box for whatever type of monitor I may encounter?

 

I set up temporary multi-monitor displays, and have to work with existing equipment, which currently have all three of these types of inputs.  Finding a single cable solution would be a dream.

 

Thanks.

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post #2 of 11 Old 04-27-2014, 03:26 PM
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HDBaseT doesn't do any transcoding. You get out what you put in. Put in HDMI, you get HDMI out. Put in VGA, you get VGA out. That said, HDMI and DVI are interoperable. You just need a cable with a HDMI plug on one end and a DVI plug on the other.
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post #3 of 11 Old 04-28-2014, 03:28 AM
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HDMI to VGA is potentially a problem as any content which is Copy Protected can’t be ‘legally’ converted to VGA – so whilst you may find an HDBaseT Receiver which offers a VGA Output port it can only work with non-copy protected content.

More likely you would have to seek out a 'special' HDMI to VGA ‘Converter’ as a stand-alone unit and keep that in the toolkit as an ‘add-on’ to the Output side of the HDBaseT receiver.

Additionally you may find the VGA Input on your Display doesn’t support HDTV signal formats (1080p24 from a Blu-ray for example) so your HDMI to VGA converter is also going to have to provide some form of format conversion or add in a third box in the signal path!

What are the set-ups you are installing?

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post #4 of 11 Old 04-28-2014, 07:31 AM
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Yeah, I think some additional information is needed.

I have not seen any HDBT solutions which offers VGA on the output stage from a national product. Extron, Crestron, and AMX don't offer this option. Plenty of HDMI to VGA converters, but no direct HDBT outputs.

On the input side, any analog to HDBT solution does a digital conversion. HDBT follows HDMI standards for the pathway, so the VGA solutions actually go through a analog to digital conversion, and the receiver box is HDBT standard.

All HDBT standard receivers should work with any transmitter that uses HDBT as the transmission method. So, a Monoprice HDBT transmitter, can send to a Panasonic projector with integrated HDBT.

The Aurora Multimedia HDBT receiver can be the receiving unit for a Crestron DM matrix switch.

My worries for your setup would exist entirely on any displays/receivers which need a VGA output as that really isn't what HDBT is designed for.


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post #5 of 11 Old 04-28-2014, 10:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, first of all, I am not dealing with any copyrighted content.  So that isn't an issue.

 

Additional information:  I can only be sure of this:  I'll be sending from a laptop, which will have either a VGA or DVI output, or maybe HDMI.  And my external media player might be bluray, or maybe a DVD player with composite.  I definitely have a VGA out on my Elmo, unless I have to use someone else's.  The monitors and projector are a variety of inputs, including VGA and DVI, and some HDMI.  Then again, maybe not. 

 

This is my dilemma.  Multiple source types, multiple destination types, and I don't know what I'm going to have to deal with on the next job until I get there.

 

I was hoping that the conversion to HDBT was a signal type conversion, like converting VGA to DVI or HDMI.  That once it goes out from the input box it would be an HDBT signal.  But learning that this isn't the case obviously upsets my dreams.  But that's why I'm asking.

 

But I've also learned here that the DVI signal is (exactly?) the same as the HDMI signal, minus the audio.  This is very helpful.  I'll be focusing on that when I purchase my own equipment in the future.  And for those times I'll need to deal with VGA, I'll either get a VGA to DVI (to HDBT) converter, or split my signal and/or use my VGA equipment that I already have.  It seems like there will be less and less of that as we go along, though.

 

Just to give you an idea: My next trial I will have a laptop with DVI and HDMI outputs, but the backup laptop is VGA only, and I'm not going to be getting a new one soon, so I gotta be ready to use it.  I also have to accommodate someone else's computer, which is an unknown.  My big monitor, which is really a TV, has only an HDMI input, so I may not be able to rely on that for this run.

 

Plus, there's the fun of connecting to the courtroom's existing system, which is usually VGA, and will be for several years, probably.  Government don't buy new equipment just because its a few years out of date.

 

Still, I've learned a lot here that will help me pick out a few essential adaptors and converters, and I can plan for the future.  Thanks a lot for all the info.

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post #6 of 11 Old 04-29-2014, 07:55 AM
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I think you may be picking up some incorrect info from the different responses.

When things are converted to HDBT, they are HDBT. HDBT is based on HDMI standards and almost all of the HDBT end points I have seen have been HDMI.

Want one input solution?

Put these in:
http://auroramultimedia.com/?section=products&id=274

That gives you an analog and a digital input. If you have HDMI or DVI with analog audio, it goes into the right connection. If you have VGA, component, s-video, or composite with analog audio it goes on the left connection.

Everything gets converted to HDBT, then the receiver goes on the other end and outputs HDMI. The HDMI connection can connect using a HDMI to DVI cable, a HDMI to HDMI cable, or HDMI to DIsplayPort adapter to any digital display. If you must have VGA on the output end, you will need a HDMI to VGA adapter and should not expect a Blu-ray player to work with it even with non-copyright material. Almost all displays from the last few years support DVI or HDMI digital connectivity and should be used.


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post #7 of 11 Old 04-29-2014, 12:54 PM
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HDBT is an extender add on technology for HDMI.

Once converted to HDMI any signal can run over a single CAT cable using HDBT and then be converted back to the native format.

Your options are either a box full of converters to suit the signal types you are going to be dealing with or add in a multi Input Video Processor (VP) at the Source End and then another VP or a range of adapters at the Display end.

Budget and how much kit you do/don't want to carry around will have a bearing on which way to go.

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post #8 of 11 Old 04-29-2014, 09:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
 
When things are converted to HDBT, they are HDBT. HDBT is based on HDMI standards and almost all of the HDBT end points I have seen have been HDMI.

 

Quote:
HDBT is an extender add on technology for HDMI.

Once converted to HDMI any signal can run over a single CAT cable using HDBT and then be converted back to the native format.

 

Okay, so this is a different story than I understood.  That is what I hoped for, so that I could simply find the appropriate converter for my VGA sources and integrate them into the system.  That is the ideal.  The destination monitors, now that I know that HDMI essentially equals DVI, is not as big an issue, but, again, an HDBT to VGA converter would solve it if I had to. 

 

As for the actual part, the item you linked to above is not suitable for what I do.  I am not building in.  I have to do temporary setups, and take it all away again when trial is over, so all the devices have to be a standalone box.  If I could design it myself, I'd have one box with a VGA and DVI input (with mini stereo audio also), with HDBT out.  Then another box at the other end that does the reverse.  Anyone seen one of those?  (It could be and HDMI instead of DVI, and I'd use an adaptor, but I'd rather it be the plug I see the most of.)

 

From here I can use my existing VGS splitters/DAs, and get a similar set of DVI splitters/DAs, and then some DVI to HDMI adaptors to cover all the permutations.  Oh, and perhaps some HDBT splitters.  Does this sound right?

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post #9 of 11 Old 04-30-2014, 08:05 AM
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HDBT runs over a single CAT cable and always 'hands back' to HDMI so very few of them will have a VGA Output socket.

You are going to be going : VGA2HDMI Converter > HDMI over HDBT Transmitter > HDBT to HDMI Receiver > HDMI2VGA converter - so three devices in your tool kit.

It is possible to introduce an HDMI or HDMI or HDBT Distribution Amp into the mix.

Another option you could consider is HD over LAN it's more cost effective and scalable than HDBT and whilst it gives away a bit of absolute image quality I can't see that being an issue in your scenario.

You would still require the VGA2HDMI and HDMI2VGA converters in the tool kit but now you have a very cost effective scaleable solution using a low cost Gigabit Switch as your hub - it's also easy to create a Matrix with this option.

http://www.octavainc.com/HDMI_extender_LAN_HDDSX.html

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post #10 of 11 Old 04-30-2014, 08:59 AM
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Something like this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Crestron-DM-TX-201-C-/121325212655?pt=Home_Automation_Modules&hash=item1c3f8bd3ef

HDMI input and VGA input + 1/8" mini audio jack.
Auto detects source as HDMI w/audio or HDMI without audio (uses 3.5mm jack then) or VGA.

Works with either HDMI, DVI + analog audio, or VGA + analog audio.

Converts it all to a HDBT output which then can go to any HDBT receiver.

Yeah, that's your one-box solution on the transmission end.

The receiving end will be a two box solution if you need VGA, but any projector with a digital input won't need it.


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post #11 of 11 Old 05-03-2014, 09:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Thank you all for the basic info and pointing out some equipment.  Some of the better devices are a bit pricey for me to get without a definite need (the full setups I've described are rare, usually its just my computer and my projector and maybe the house VGA system), so I'm going to wait until I see the absolute need coming on.  When I see that many converters and adaptors involved (Input adaptor --> Input converter --> Input switcher --> Input DA --> Display Converter(s) --> Receiver adaptor), its a sign that I should seek another way.  With any luck, we'll be seeing computers and monitors with HDBT hookups built-in, and I can save a grand or two.  If the HDBT converter box industrial complex doesn't conspire against us, that is. 

 

Thanks again, I could never have gleaned all this info from the manufacterer's product description pages.  Who writes those things, anyway?  Never mind.  I know who....

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