TEST REPORTS | HDMI CABLES WHICH PROPERLY AND RELIABLY SUPPORT 18GBPS & HDMI 2.0b - Page 10 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #271 of 414 Old 08-15-2017, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by GooMan2 View Post
I got an email ad from monoprice about some new cables:
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=14131

They claim 4K@60Hz 4:4:4, 50ft for $65. No reviews yet, but could be a good option if it works.
Full disclosure, I'm on the Monoprice development team. The new lines of active HDMI cables use the Spectra 7 HT8181 chipset, specifically designed around HDMI 2.0 compliance. Monoprice was one of the first vendors to get the ball rolling with the HT8181 and it's difficult being first sometimes. We should see other manufactures launching their HT8181 cables in the next several months in time for the holidays.

Monoprice has worked closely with Spectra7, whom is formerly known as Redmere, for many years and Monoprice helped make the Redmere name synonymous with high speed active HDMI cables. We were very early adopters of the technology and in turn one of the first cables out there. The existing Luxe and Cabernet Series Cables share a now legacy chipset that was optimized to 18Gbps of bandwidth but were designed well before HDMI 2.0 was a thing, this is the next evolution of the same tech.

More information on the HT8181 chipset can be found on Spectra 7s website.

With that said, we've ran these new series of cables through the same paces as the SlimRunAV HDR cables and have the added benefit of ARC compatibility.

I don't mean for this to be a /r/hailcorporate type post. Please reach out to me via PM if you have any questions. i don't want to lead the thread off topic.
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post #272 of 414 Old 08-15-2017, 03:25 PM
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^^^^ thanks for the post. We've been waiting for more info on the newest HDMI chipsets so this is welcome news. I would imagine that they will be backward compatible with the older versions but if all HDMI chipsets in the chain are not the same, then the communication falls back to common denominator which could cause issues? Hopefully the device mfrs will start to incorporate the new chipsets soon.
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post #273 of 414 Old 08-16-2017, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Otto Pylot View Post
^^^^ thanks for the post. We've been waiting for more info on the newest HDMI chipsets so this is welcome news. I would imagine that they will be backward compatible with the older versions but if all HDMI chipsets in the chain are not the same, then the communication falls back to common denominator which could cause issues? Hopefully the device mfrs will start to incorporate the new chipsets soon.
You are right on the money. Unfortunately what it came down to is that some hardware would recognize the HT7180 chipset as an HDMI 1.4/HDCP1.4 device, though it's supposed to be completely transparent.

This is what is causing legacy "18Gbps" rated cables to fail. This isn't an issue just the older redmere chipset but rather all legacy chipsets designed before HDMI 2.0/2.1.

Just to put into context, the HT8181 was originally supposed to launch at Q1 2015, but HDMI spec changes and finicky consumer hardware kept pushing the date back. HDCP and HDMI 2.0 are so sensitive that noise was introduced into the signal because a perfect signal would trigger content protections.
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post #274 of 414 Old 08-16-2017, 04:02 PM
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^^^^^ that's what I was hearing from other sources but was reluctant to post anything because I just wasn't sure how accurate that was. Thanks for confirming that. Can't wait to see what happens with HDMI 2.1
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post #275 of 414 Old 08-21-2017, 05:10 AM
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Hey again guys,

Had everything (i thought) working good. My set up is Marantz 7702mk11 as my processor. I have a 55 inch Sony LCD and a Epson 5040UBE, please don't mention the wireless.

I have XBOX, PS4, Optimum cable box and Oppo 203 bluray. Originally had HDMI output 1 to my Sony 55 inch with a 9 foot Audioquest cable. HDMI output 2 to my Epson with a 30 foot Celerity cable. This did NOT work. I kept losing picture and sound while watching movies off of the Oppo. I decided to run the Celerity directly out of Oppo right to the PJ. Works great. I then ran a BJC series 1 (fire hose) from my HDMI output 2 to the 1.4 input on the Epson for all my other viewing. Seemed to work good.

I ran it about 15 mins as I don't watch much TV, just blurays and the Celerity out of the Oppo into the Epson is working great. Watched about 100 hours so far on the Epson without a problem.

A few weeks ago, decided to watch Game of Thrones. After 20 mins, picture and sound started dropping out. I don't get it. It is NOT 4K, just a cable box. Being a wits end yet again. I ordered the Ruipro 10 meter cable. Installed it today, picture and sound dropping out, same as the BJC series 1. I don't get it. This is my 3rd upgrade in less than 5 years. This is my 3rd Marantz prepro. Not sure why I stay with Marantz. This is killing me again. I spent along time before I iwas able to get to watch movies off my Oppo 203. It seems nothing more than 10 feet will pass out of my Marantz.

Why would it not pass a signal out of my cable box???

The Marantz and Epson are less than a year old. HELP.

Thanks. I don't know what else to try at this point.

Brian
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post #276 of 414 Old 08-21-2017, 06:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianlvi3 View Post
Hey again guys,

Had everything (i thought) working good. My set up is Marantz 7702mk11 as my processor. I have a 55 inch Sony LCD and a Epson 5040UBE, please don't mention the wireless.

I have XBOX, PS4, Optimum cable box and Oppo 203 bluray. Originally had HDMI output 1 to my Sony 55 inch with a 9 foot Audioquest cable. HDMI output 2 to my Epson with a 30 foot Celerity cable. This did NOT work. I kept losing picture and sound while watching movies off of the Oppo. I decided to run the Celerity directly out of Oppo right to the PJ. Works great. I then ran a BJC series 1 (fire hose) from my HDMI output 2 to the 1.4 input on the Epson for all my other viewing. Seemed to work good.

I ran it about 15 mins as I don't watch much TV, just blurays and the Celerity out of the Oppo into the Epson is working great. Watched about 100 hours so far on the Epson without a problem.

A few weeks ago, decided to watch Game of Thrones. After 20 mins, picture and sound started dropping out. I don't get it. It is NOT 4K, just a cable box. Being a wits end yet again. I ordered the Ruipro 10 meter cable. Installed it today, picture and sound dropping out, same as the BJC series 1. I don't get it. This is my 3rd upgrade in less than 5 years. This is my 3rd Marantz prepro. Not sure why I stay with Marantz. This is killing me again. I spent along time before I iwas able to get to watch movies off my Oppo 203. It seems nothing more than 10 feet will pass out of my Marantz.

Why would it not pass a signal out of my cable box???

The Marantz and Epson are less than a year old. HELP.

Thanks. I don't know what else to try at this point.
Since I was not at your house watching you, I think I would do a couple of things to troubleshoot your problem.

1. You need to verify which components work with your hdmi cable connected directly to either your TV or your projector. Test 4K and 1080P.

2. Once you finish step 1, you now have a baseline for comparison.

3. Repeat step 1, but this time route the signal through your receiver.

4. If you finish step 3, you'll know what works through your receiver.

5. If a component does not work, just chalk it up to an HDMI handshake compatibility issue. Maybe the issue can be fixed with a firmware update, or something like that.

For reference, I have a Sewell passive 40 ft cable rated at 18 gigabit per second. Cost 40 bucks. It failed a test in this thread, but a YouTube video showed the cable passing a similar test. And it seemed to pass for me. Works fine with 4K@60hz content from my Xbox One S.

-T
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post #277 of 414 Old 08-21-2017, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by ARROW-AV View Post


TEST REPORTS | LONG HDMI CABLES WHICH PROPERLY AND RELIABLY SUPPORT 18GBPS & HDMI 2.0b


HDMI version 2.0b, which is the currently industry standard, requires 18 Gbps video bandwidth support.

But a great many medium to long length HDMI cables that claim to fully support this in reality do not.

The purpose of this thread is to provide a resource database, including lookup tables, with the results of comprehensive evaluation and testing of HDMI cables to reveal which cables will actually reliably and consistently pass 18 Gbps bandwidth video signals and hence properly support HDMI 2.0b video content. Where you can rest assured that these will every time fully and properly support HDMI 2.0b / 18 Gbps video signals; and hence if you use these cables you can kiss goodbye to all of your HDMI headaches and problems, for good.

Please find attached to this post:

(1) HDMI Cables Performance Evaluation & Testing Report # 1; this relates to 50ft/15m+ length cables; and is self-explanatory.

(2) HDMI Cables Performance Evaluation & Testing Report # 2; this relates to the longer length Monoprice cables product codes 21568-21570 (75ft/23m, 100ft/30m, and 150ft/45m).

(N.B. Report #3 will focus on HDMI cables with lengths 20ft/6m - 30ft/9m; which will be added here as and when it is completed.)


Enjoy!

ADDITIONAL NOTES:

(1) Out of the 35 cables tested only 2 require external power, namely the CELERITY TEK and CHROMIS cables;
(2) MONOPRICE cables 21566-21570 do not support ARC. But they do support Ethernet over HDMI.
(3) RUIPRO cables do support ARC.
4k 60hz HDMI Long Run - Capabilities Issues Issue:
Trying to run source -> 35' active HDMI -> 4k receiver -> 35' active HDMI -> 4k TV - This current setup isn't working at all.


Equipment:
Receiver - Denon AVR-X3300
Sources - PS4 Pro / Nvidia 1080ti
HDMI cable - Monoprice Luxe 35' active HDMI
TV - Samsung UN65KS8000


In depth explanation of issues and attempts for solution:
My overall goal is to have a 4k capable office and centralize the networking/av equipment in my server room. I wanted to utilize a closet space for the 4k Blu-ray player and the PS4 pro and other components i would directly interface with while the receiver would be controlled via my Logitech Harmony Hub. I purchased the 35' active HDMI cables from monoprice as they stated they were capable to handle what my objective was... they were not. Hooking the PS4 Pro up to the receiver using the 35' HDMI and the receiver output to the TV as the zone 1 source the TV showed it recognized something was on the ARC input but nothing showed. I tried to then remove the receiver from the loop and run just the source PS4 Pro directly to the TV using the 35' HDMI cable, still no joy. I then attempted to run a 35' cable from my 1080ti to the TV directly and it did detect it on the TV but the image was very distorted. Looking online I then bought an Monoprice Blackbird HDMI repeater... with that in the loop at any point nothing worked. I have thought of potentially running 4k 60hz 4:4:4 capable HDMI over Ethernet as the solution but am unsure of the success. So here I am stressed and out of options that I can rely on. Please help!! If you need any additional information please let me know and I will answer. Thank you for any assistance provided.
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post #278 of 414 Old 08-21-2017, 09:43 AM
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The ethernet channel on current HDMI cables is a non-issue because there are no consumer devices that take advantage of that useless (so far) HDMI spec. Rumor has it that once HDMI 2.1 is released, the ethernet channel may be used for eARC but that is only a best guess at this point in time. You might want to consider solid core CAT-6 (non-CCS and not an ethernet patch cable) but you will still run into distance and HDMI chipset problems if you actively terminate the connector ends (HDBT for example).
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post #279 of 414 Old 08-21-2017, 09:53 AM
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brianlvi3 - as per T-Bones' suggestion you need a more methodical test regime with and without the AVP in the system.

I would also ensure that CEC is disabled on all devices - I would test initially with a single Sink (Display) connected to the AVP and test both Outputs of the AVP.

Check the settings on the HDMI Input in the TV to ensure all of the Features and Formats you wish to support are covered.

spaceghostroce - Fibre or Hybrid Fibre is the way to go, UHD over LAN would require some compression at present.

Have you run a test with shorter (less than 8m) High Speed cables to ensure the system will work as required?

That said what you are aiming to achieve ought to be relatively straightforward with a Hybrid Fibre HDMI (Ruipro being our preferred solution).

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post #280 of 414 Old 08-21-2017, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Joe Fernand View Post
brianlvi3 - as per T-Bones' suggestion you need a more methodical test regime with and without the AVP in the system.

I would also ensure that CEC is disabled on all devices - I would test initially with a single Sink (Display) connected to the AVP and test both Outputs of the AVP.

Check the settings on the HDMI Input in the TV to ensure all of the Features and Formats you wish to support are covered.

spaceghostroce - Fibre or Hybrid Fibre is the way to go, UHD over LAN would require some compression at present.

Have you run a test with shorter (less than 8m) High Speed cables to ensure the system will work as required?

That said what you are aiming to achieve ought to be relatively straightforward with a Hybrid Fibre HDMI (Ruipro being our preferred solution).

Joe
Everything works from Marantz (9 foot Audioquest cable) to the Sony TV.

Nothing will work from the Marantz to the Epson (10 meter cable, no matter which brand) Celerity, Ruipro, BJC series 1 all did not work. They will all work if I don't run out of the Marantz.

I know the Marantz is causing the problem, just not sure why.

From the Oppo directly to the Epson, works perfect with the Celerty.

Brian
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post #281 of 414 Old 08-21-2017, 02:19 PM
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What happens if you replace the Audioquest cable with the Ruipro to the Sony TV?

Joe

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The Media Factory. Residential and Commercial system Design, Consultancy, Installation, Supply and Integration.
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post #282 of 414 Old 08-23-2017, 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Joe Fernand View Post
What happens if you replace the Audioquest cable with the Ruipro to the Sony TV?

Joe
I will give that a try when I get home.

I have had nothing but problems with the Marantz processors not being able to pass a signal at 30 feet. My last Marantz did the same thing. I purchased the mk11 to be able to pass a 4K signal. I will not.

Anything run directly out of source, PS4, Xbox, cable box etc to the Epson using the Celerity cable will work just fine. Anything out of the Marantz to the PJ using a 30 foot cable will have a problem.

Oppo 203 with Celerity 30 footer on it to the Epson. Flawless.

Thanks.

Brian
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post #283 of 414 Old 08-23-2017, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by GooMan2 View Post
I got an email ad from monoprice about some new cables:
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=14131

They claim 4K@60Hz 4:4:4, 50ft for $65. No reviews yet, but could be a good option if it works.
I just bought a 35' version of this DynamicView active HDMI cable and can confirm that it works at 4k, 60 Hz, 4:4:4 8-bit/channel (18 Gb/s). The only 4k source I have is Planet Earth 2 from Dish Network via a Hopper 3. I could not test other formats (4:2:0, more than 8 bits/channel, lower frame rates).

The DynamicView cable replaced my 11 year old 35' Blue Jeans Cables Series-2 cable. Surprisingly, it also worked at the above mentioned 4k rate! The Series-2 cable is very large and stiff, and uses silver-plated 24 AWG pairs.

I had picture breakup and random black screens with my previous setup, but it turned out to be the result of 6' cables between my devices and A/V receiver, not the long run to my TV.

The 6' runs were the same vintage BJC but a different series. Replacing these with Monoprice "Certified Premium High Speed HDMI Cable, HDR" solved the picture breakup issue even before I replaced the Series-2!

System:
Dish Network Hopper 3
Apple TV 4
Opportunity BDP-83
Pioneer Elite SC-LX701
LG OLED65B6p

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post #284 of 414 Old 08-24-2017, 01:23 PM
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'I have had nothing but problems with the Marantz processors' - I have arranged to borrow an AVP-8802a on Sunday to have a play with the Ruipro cables.

Joe

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post #285 of 414 Old 08-25-2017, 01:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Joe Fernand View Post
'I have had nothing but problems with the Marantz processors' - I have arranged to borrow an AVP-8802a on Sunday to have a play with the Ruipro cables.

Joe
Unfortunately I too have problems with the Marantz 8802A in between my Panny 900B and my Sony ES 5000 projector using the 15 m Celerity to connect the Marantz to the projector. No problem connecting the Panny direct to the projector using the same 15m Celerity. So looking forward to the reports from your tests with the Ruipro!
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post #286 of 414 Old 08-27-2017, 03:23 AM
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AVP-8802a connected to my LG EF950 OLED Display - Sources I have include SKY Q, DMP-UB900, PS4 Pro, XB1S, ATV4.

Installed Ruipro Hybrid Fibre HDMI from AVP to Display at 10m and 50m.

No problems so far - fast glitch free start up, fast source switching, immediate enable/disable of HDR, 2160p at 60Hz, 50Hz and 24p.

Have been running each Source for an hour or more with no glitches.

Joe


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post #287 of 414 Old 08-29-2017, 10:34 PM
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Just joined the this fantastic forum (and see a few Aussies here too), a forum that I find so interesting and informative about HDMi Fiber (we spell it Fibre) Optic cables, a rather new item here in Australia, the testing in particular is really excellent and I look forward to reading more reviews from users.
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post #288 of 414 Old 09-03-2017, 07:51 AM
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I'm so glad I stumbled upon this thread. We're currently building a home (projected completion is April 2018), and I'm having to figure out where the AV Rack needs to go. Where I want it, would basically force me to run a 35 to 40 foot HDMI cable to the main display.

I was beginning to think I'd have to relocate everything to the front of the room after reading all of the doom and gloom about pushing 4K over HDMI at that length. It seems like people are doing ok in here at greater lengths than that. Are we saying the Ruipro Hybrid Fibre is the best cable for HDMI 2.0b 4K at 60hz at 50 feet?


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post #289 of 414 Old 09-03-2017, 09:18 AM
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I'm so glad I stumbled upon this thread. We're currently building a home (projected completion is April 2018), and I'm having to figure out where the AV Rack needs to go. Where I want it, would basically force me to run a 35 to 40 foot HDMI cable to the main display.

I was beginning to think I'd have to relocate everything to the front of the room after reading all of the doom and gloom about pushing 4K over HDMI at that length. It seems like people are doing ok in here at greater lengths than that. Are we saying the Ruipro Hybrid Fibre is the best cable for HDMI 2.0b 4K at 60hz at 50 feet?


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I would NEVER recommend any equipment in the front of the room.

With a Projector you want to watch the screen and not the 300 red,
blue, or green lights.
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post #290 of 414 Old 09-03-2017, 09:36 AM
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I would NEVER recommend any equipment in the front of the room.



With a Projector you want to watch the screen and not the 300 red,

blue, or green lights.


Agreed, but I'm actually not going to be running a projector. I'll be running an old Panny Plasma from 2012.

Projector will be later. Much later. I mostly play video games and I haven't heard of any projector yet, that works well in that arena. My room is small enough based on the seating area that I'll run a 65-75 inch display before I go projector.

If I was running a projector, then my HDMI run would only be 15 feet or so.




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Agreed, but I'm actually not going to be running a projector. I'll be running an old Panny Plasma from 2012.
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I'm so glad I stumbled upon this thread. We're currently building a home (projected completion is April 2018),
^^^ that's probably where the misunderstanding came from, and a bit of skim-reading

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post #292 of 414 Old 09-03-2017, 10:49 AM
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^^^ that's probably where the misunderstanding came from, and a bit of skim-reading


No worries! I didn't specify there would be a plasma there anyway, so my mistake.

Regardless, you're right. Having stuff at the front can be a big "No-No". My issue is getting signal to the plasma if everything is at the back, and getting signal to the subs (in-wall XLR?).

What's good, is that right now my display won't even produce a 4K image, so I'm really working with future proofing when I do. I'm running conduit for sure.

This isn't an issue at all if I had a projector, as the run from the back to the projector is under 20 feet.

The run to the front is 40-50.


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post #293 of 414 Old 09-03-2017, 01:07 PM
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At 40' - 50' then you might want to just consider fiber (Celerity or Ruipro). Installing in-conduit is the only way to truly "future proof" so you're good there. The fiber may be better for the long term because you shouldn't have any difficulties with 1080p or 4k and possibly 4k HDR. Fiber is a bit expensive so you might want to consider laying it out on the floor first if possible to make sure it meets your needs before carefully fishing it thru the conduit and be mindful of bend radius.
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post #294 of 414 Old 09-03-2017, 01:23 PM
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At 40' - 50' then you might want to just consider fiber (Celerity or Ruipro). Installing in-conduit is the only way to truly "future proof" so you're good there. The fiber may be better for the long term because you shouldn't have any difficulties with 1080p or 4k and possibly 4k HDR. Fiber is a bit expensive so you might want to consider laying it out on the floor first if possible to make sure it meets your needs before carefully fishing it thru the conduit and be mindful of bend radius.


Yeah, I'm considering the Ruipro Hybrid Fibre, 50 foot. When you say bend radius....are you talking about actually bending the cable? What's the max on that Ruipro?


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post #295 of 414 Old 09-03-2017, 03:51 PM
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Yeah, I'm considering the Ruipro Hybrid Fibre, 50 foot. When you say bend radius....are you talking about actually bending the cable? What's the max on that Ruipro?


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Bend radius is the maximum bending degree you can do without damaging the cable or adversely affecting the signal. I don't know what the actual number of degrees it is but a gentle bend should be ok as opposed to a sharp 90 degree angle.
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post #296 of 414 Old 09-03-2017, 03:54 PM
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Bend radius is the maximum bending degree you can do without damaging the cable or adversely affecting the signal. I don't know what the actual number of degrees it is but a gentle bend should be ok as opposed to a sharp 90 degree angle.


Gotcha. That's what I figured. I knew what the BR referred to, but I wasn't sure what was acceptable and what wasn't.

So, if I picked up that Ruipro cable, would I need a gigabit accelerator with it? Or is that not necessary?


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post #297 of 414 Old 09-03-2017, 04:26 PM
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^^^^ I can't answer gigabit accelerator question. Maybe Joe can.
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post #298 of 414 Old 09-03-2017, 07:21 PM
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^^^^ I can't answer gigabit accelerator question. Maybe Joe can.


Gotcha. Joe, any help?


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post #299 of 414 Old 09-04-2017, 12:30 AM
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No need for any other devices - simply connect in the Ruipro cable and that is it.

Joe

Octava Inc. Multi-cast HD over LAN solutions.

Ruipro UK and EU Sales and Support

The Media Factory. Residential and Commercial system Design, Consultancy, Installation, Supply and Integration.
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post #300 of 414 Old 09-04-2017, 06:01 AM
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No need for any other devices - simply connect in the Ruipro cable and that is it.

Joe


Got it. Thanks!!


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