5.1 dolby digital and DTS system via optical - BD-UP5000 or BH200? - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 23 Old 09-09-2008, 05:57 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
sl@cker's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 539
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Guys - I'm wondering which player will be better for my 5.1 system that does dolby digital and DTS, via optical cable. I think I've read that both of these players can convert all audio for blu-ray and hd dvd movies to DTS for these type of sound systems? Is this true?
sl@cker is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 05:30 AM
Member
 
marshallmedia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 58
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
True HD (on the Dolby side) and DTS HD-MA (on the DTS) side are high-end audio codecs showing up more and more on Blu-Ray discs. But at their "core", you will find the tried-and-true Dolby digital 5.1 and DTS 5.1. True HD and DTS HD-MA are "wrapped around" this core. Either player will dig down to the "core" audio and send it out via bitstream (through its optical or coax connector) to your 5.1 receiver. Your current receiver can't decode the "outer wrapper" of these formats, but since it has DD 5.1 and DTS 5.1, it will decode the the basic 5.1 "core" of either audio format. In short, either player will do the job for you.
marshallmedia is offline  
post #3 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 05:44 AM
Advanced Member
 
billbillw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Atlanta metro
Posts: 757
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
The BH200 has a feature called DTS Re-Code, which takes all the lossless formats and converts them to full bitrate DTS, which I think is 1.5Mbps. In most cases, this will give you the best sound over optical. I don't know if the Sammy has a feature like that.

If it ain't in HD, it ain't worth watching!
billbillw is offline  
post #4 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 08:03 AM
Member
 
marshallmedia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 58
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
The BG200's DTS Re-code feature does NOT, however, take a lossless DTS stream and convert it to Dolby Digital. In other words, if you have a DTS-only Blu-Ray disc (i.e. - "Hairspray"),the player will not convert it to a Dolby Digital 5.1 signal. It will convert it to two-channel stereo, but that's all you'll get if you have a Dolby Digital-only receiver.
marshallmedia is offline  
post #5 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 08:10 AM
Member
 
AlfaGT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 91
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by marshallmedia View Post

The BG200's DTS Re-code feature does NOT, however, take a lossless DTS stream and convert it to Dolby Digital. In other words, if you have a DTS-only Blu-Ray disc (i.e. - "Hairspray"),the player will not convert it to a Dolby Digital 5.1 signal. It will convert it to two-channel stereo, but that's all you'll get if you have a Dolby Digital-only receiver.

The BH200 (perhaps only with newer firmware than november/january) does convert every audio-track (incl. DD+, DTrueHD, DTS HR and DTS HD Masteraudio) into a DTS-Bitstream with 1.5 Mbps and a max. of 5.1 channels (via SPIDF/optical and set to DTS Re-Encode).

I've hooked up mine with HDMI, but last week I tested the Re-Encode with an optical cable. So, It really works with up to 5.1 channels for every audio-codec. I think this was the question of sl@acker.

Greetings
AlfaGT is offline  
post #6 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 08:15 AM
Senior Member
 
ICBM99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: West Texas
Posts: 488
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Dolby True HD does not have a "Core" of DD, only DTS HD has a "core" of DTS. I believe that the UP5000 (and possibly the LG) WILL reencode the Lossless formats to DTS @ 1.5 mbs. Which should be better than regular DD.

Really the re encode only effects the Dolby THD and DD+ soundtracks, because DTS HD (both HR and MA), have the DTS core all ready. So as long as your receiver can decode DTS, that would be your best solution.


I think most movies that only list a Dolby THD track, still have a "hidden" DD track, but it is not part of the THD track. Which in any case would be better to re encode the THD track to DTS.
ICBM99 is offline  
post #7 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 11:52 AM
AVS Special Member
 
bradavon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: South West, England
Posts: 1,896
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Both convert all formats to 1.5Mbps DTS. There's no difference in this respect.
bradavon is offline  
post #8 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 12:21 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tripleM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,052
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 12
My HDMI AVR is only capable of decoding upto DD+ & can accept PCM but doesn't bitstream process the DTHD or DTS-MA.
Currently, I set my BH200 to Mutichannel PCM resulting in my AVR showing it as PCM.

On my old Tosh A30, it used to show DD+ which tells me the AVR was decoding the DD+.

Now I am not sure with the BH200 - even though PCM doesn't sound perceptibly any different than the original source audio from what I've read.

Should I set my BH200 to some other setting to let the AVR actually do the DD+ decoding?
I wonder if

Panasonic TC-P60ST60 + Sony STR-DG810 + LG BH200 + JBL L830's x2 + JBL LC1 + JBL Loft40 x 2 + Polk PSW10 + Harmony One
tripleM is offline  
post #9 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 12:55 PM
AVS Special Member
 
allargon's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 3,335
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by tripleM View Post

On my old Tosh A30, it used to show DD+ which tells me the AVR was decoding the DD+.

Now I am not sure with the BH200 - even though PCM doesn't sound perceptibly any different than the original source audio from what I've read.

Should I set my BH200 to some other setting to let the AVR actually do the DD+ decoding?
I wonder if

Your Tosh A30 can't bitstream DD+, it can only decode it to PCM. An A35? Yes. However, an A30 can only decode high res audio formats. An A30 can bitstream DD and DTS.

Personally I think the player should do any and all decoding and re-mixing, but many people's AVR's will only perform processing on decoding audio rather than PCM. So they prefer that.
allargon is offline  
post #10 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 02:44 PM
Senior Member
 
ICBM99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: West Texas
Posts: 488
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by tripleM View Post

My HDMI AVR is only capable of decoding upto DD+ & can accept PCM but doesn't bitstream process the DTHD or DTS-MA.
Currently, I set my BH200 to Mutichannel PCM resulting in my AVR showing it as PCM.

On my old Tosh A30, it used to show DD+ which tells me the AVR was decoding the DD+.

Now I am not sure with the BH200 - even though PCM doesn't sound perceptibly any different than the original source audio from what I've read.

Should I set my BH200 to some other setting to let the AVR actually do the DD+ decoding?
I wonder if

What AVR are you using, I've never heard of one that can decode DD+ but not Dolby THD. I wonder if you are actually bitstreaming DD EX.
ICBM99 is offline  
post #11 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 03:40 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tripleM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,052
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBM99 View Post

What AVR are you using, I've never heard of one that can decode DD+ but not Dolby THD. I wonder if you are actually bitstreaming DD EX.

Sony DG810.
Sorry I should have just said DD not DD+.
Maybe that's the problem. I might have only seen DD on the AVR not DD+.


http://esupport.sony.com/US/perl/mod...l?mdl=STRDG810

Panasonic TC-P60ST60 + Sony STR-DG810 + LG BH200 + JBL L830's x2 + JBL LC1 + JBL Loft40 x 2 + Polk PSW10 + Harmony One
tripleM is offline  
post #12 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 06:32 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
sl@cker's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 539
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradavon View Post

Both convert all formats to 1.5Mbps DTS. There's no difference in this respect.

Thanks for the responses guys. Just to confirm, this is the definitive answer? Both players decode all HD audio formats to 1.5mbps DTS?
sl@cker is offline  
post #13 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 06:47 PM
AVS Special Member
 
allargon's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 3,335
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by tripleM View Post

Sony DG810.
Sorry I should have just said DD not DD+.
Maybe that's the problem. I might have only seen DD on the AVR not DD+.

Last year's DG810 can't decode the new high res audio formats. This year's DG820 can. The A30 recodes Dolby TrueHD and DD+ to DD over optical whereas the A2 recodes DolbyTrueHD and DD+ to DTS.
allargon is offline  
post #14 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 07:33 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
sl@cker's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 539
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by allargon View Post

Last year's DG810 can't decode the new high res audio formats. This year's DG820 can. The A30 recodes Dolby TrueHD and DD+ to DD over optical whereas the A2 recodes DolbyTrueHD and DD+ to DTS.

I'm talking only about the players in my original question - The LG BH200 and Sammy BD-UP5000
sl@cker is offline  
post #15 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 10:47 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tripleM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,052
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by allargon View Post

Last year's DG810 can't decode the new high res audio formats. This year's DG820 can. The A30 recodes Dolby TrueHD and DD+ to DD over optical whereas the A2 recodes DolbyTrueHD and DD+ to DTS.

Thanks allargon. I think the OP wants his thread back.

Panasonic TC-P60ST60 + Sony STR-DG810 + LG BH200 + JBL L830's x2 + JBL LC1 + JBL Loft40 x 2 + Polk PSW10 + Harmony One
tripleM is offline  
post #16 of 23 Old 09-10-2008, 11:42 PM
Member
 
AlfaGT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 91
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradavon View Post

Both convert all formats to 1.5Mbps DTS. There's no difference in this respect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sl@cker View Post

Thanks for the responses guys. Just to confirm, this is the definitive answer? Both players decode all HD audio formats to 1.5mbps DTS?

The LG can convert all audio formats to 1.5 Mbps DTS for sure (up to 5.1 channels).

The sammy I don't know. But usually bradavan knows of what he speaks
So, it seems that both will handle it.
AlfaGT is offline  
post #17 of 23 Old 09-11-2008, 06:19 AM
Advanced Member
 
J4yDubs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Jamison, PA
Posts: 603
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ICBM99 View Post

Which in any case would be better to re encode the THD track to DTS.

It's been discussed many times before, but I'll add to this statement that re-encoding isn't always the best option (I would actually never consider it the best option).

With the BH200, the DTS Re-Encode is the most convenient option (instead of changing settings all the time), but I will caveat that by saying I've noticed some clipping (popping) on some DD+ tracks re-encoded to DTS. The Clipping isn't present when using DD.

I haven't noticed any clipping on THD tracks re-encoded to DTS yet. I'm happy about this because the only way to get 5.1 from THD over optical is to re-encode to DTS (pass-through will give you stereo DD).

John
J4yDubs is offline  
post #18 of 23 Old 09-11-2008, 08:50 AM
 
vinnie97's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Nunya
Posts: 11,657
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 213 Post(s)
Liked: 1010
The 2 combos are now identical in the sound capabilities as far as I can tell...
vinnie97 is offline  
post #19 of 23 Old 09-11-2008, 09:25 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Foxbat121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: VA
Posts: 9,843
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 135 Post(s)
Liked: 210
Both are exactly same as Vinnie97 and Bradvon said.

Re-encode is the best option if your AVR only has SPDIF connection, no HDMI audio at all.

If your AVR has HDMI audio but only HDMI 1.1, use PCM is the best option.

Sammy 5k also has 7.1 analog out to offer you a 3rd option of connecting hi-def audio to old AVRs that doesn't have HDMI at all. It offeres same ouput as HDMI PCM mode with a rudimental bass management implementation.
Foxbat121 is offline  
post #20 of 23 Old 09-22-2008, 10:56 AM
Member
 
cpa98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Naperville, IL
Posts: 72
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by bradavon View Post

Both convert all formats to 1.5Mbps DTS. There's no difference in this respect.

I have the BD-UP5000 connected to a Denon AVR-3300 via co-axial cable. The Denon is 9 years old. Watching The Vantage Point, I was unable to pick up DD or DTS sound. I ended up watching the movie on 5-channel stereo.

I have had no issues with the Samsung other than this one (no audio or video dropouts on Blu-ray, HD-DVD or on regular DVD). As a result, I have been reluctant to update the firmware. Do I need to update the firmware or is this a settings issue? By the way, DTS lights up when I play movies encoded with DTS-HD. Thanks.

Roy
cpa98 is offline  
post #21 of 23 Old 09-22-2008, 11:05 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Foxbat121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: VA
Posts: 9,843
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 135 Post(s)
Liked: 210
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpa98 View Post

I have the BD-UP5000 connected to a Denon AVR-3300 via co-axial cable. The Denon is 9 years old. Watching The Vantage Point, I was unable to pick up DD or DTS sound. I ended up watching the movie on 5-channel stereo.

I have had no issues with the Samsung other than this one (no audio or video dropouts on Blu-ray, HD-DVD or on regular DVD). As a result, I have been reluctant to update the firmware. Do I need to update the firmware or is this a settings issue? By the way, DTS lights up when I play movies encoded with DTS-HD. Thanks.


You need to upgrade to latest 1.3 firmware which addressed many audio issues. I'm not sure what sound track is available on your particular BD. 1.3 added support of fully decoding Dolby TrueHD among other changes.

You may also didn't setup digital audio settings right.

Upgrade and set your digital audio settings to 'Bitstream Re-encode' for your setup.
Foxbat121 is offline  
post #22 of 23 Old 09-22-2008, 08:36 PM
Member
 
cpa98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Naperville, IL
Posts: 72
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Foxbat121, thanks for the quick response. I will update the firmware. With any luck, I will not end up with a new issue trying to fix this one.

If I remember correctly, The Vantage Point has a Dolby TrueHD track.

Thanks.

Roy
cpa98 is offline  
post #23 of 23 Old 09-23-2008, 04:00 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Foxbat121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: VA
Posts: 9,843
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 135 Post(s)
Liked: 210
That explains it. With old firmware, you will only get 2.0 from DTHD tracks.
Foxbat121 is offline  
Reply Dual Format Players

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off