1 question about dac's and two on turntables. - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 17 Old 03-25-2012, 01:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Hey now.

Do any of you use a dac for your iPod's? I know iPod has one built in but I also know you can bypass it or something.

With turntables, if I'm using a Yamaha 500 or equivalent amp do I still need a phono preamp? And when using integrated amps under $500 price range, does it really matter if I go with a pioneer for $125 or a denon for $350. I have lots of vinyl and I listen to it 50 to 60% of the time.

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post #2 of 17 Old 03-25-2012, 01:50 PM
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With turntables, if I'm using a Yamaha 500 or equivalent amp do I still need a phono preamp?

Depends on the amp. If it has a phono input, then you're all set. If not, you will need a separate phono preamp. A decent one can be had for about $50 at www.phonopreamps.com.

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And when using integrated amps under $500 price range, does it really matter if I go with a pioneer for $125 or a denon for $350.

Are you asking about turntables? If so,the difference between a cheap table and a better one is significant. The first will track very heavy, causing record wear over time.

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post #3 of 17 Old 03-25-2012, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by mcnarus View Post

Are you asking about turntables? If so,the difference between a cheap table and a better one is significant. The first will track very heavy, causing record wear over time.

If setup properly (tracking force, balance, antiskating), there should be no difference in "record wear" between the two.
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post #4 of 17 Old 03-25-2012, 03:19 PM
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If setup properly (tracking force, balance, antiskating), there should be no difference in "record wear" between the two.

The cheap table probably tracks at 5 grams and cannot be adjusted.

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post #5 of 17 Old 03-25-2012, 03:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you so much for all the help

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post #6 of 17 Old 03-25-2012, 03:51 PM - Thread Starter
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What's a good price point to start looking?

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post #7 of 17 Old 03-25-2012, 04:10 PM
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What's a good price point to start looking?

For what?

And really, your question is unanswerable. For someone who can only afford $100, the right answer is $100.

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post #8 of 17 Old 03-25-2012, 05:05 PM - Thread Starter
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I did some research I'm either gonna go with pro ject debut 3 in white or music hall mm2 in white. I read that the mm2 and the debut is the same, made in same factory. So I guess whichever I can get for a better price

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post #9 of 17 Old 03-25-2012, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by outlawskinnyd View Post

What's a good price point to start looking?

$500, cartridge extra.
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post #10 of 17 Old 03-25-2012, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by outlawskinnyd View Post

I did some research I'm either gonna go with pro ject debut 3 in white or music hall mm2 in white. I read that the mm2 and the debut is the same, made in same factory. So I guess whichever I can get for a better price

If you're looking at the Pro-Ject Debut III, you should check out the Rega RP1 too, they're in the same ballpark ...
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post #11 of 17 Old 03-26-2012, 04:14 AM
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Originally Posted by mcnarus View Post

The cheap table probably tracks at 5 grams and cannot be adjusted.

Maybe I'm missing the "logic", but proper tracking force is not determined by the price of the turntable. It is determined by the recommeded tracking force/weight of the cartridge.

OTOH (IMHO), a "cheap" turntable is one that uses a ceramic cartridge and typically has no adjustments. Which no one should ever recommend or consider.

AFAIK, all turntables that utilize a MM or MC cartridge has balance, tracking and antiskating adjustments.
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post #12 of 17 Old 03-26-2012, 06:08 AM
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AFAIK, all turntables that utilize a MM or MC cartridge has balance, tracking and antiskating adjustments.

AFAIK this is not always a case.
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post #13 of 17 Old 03-26-2012, 06:47 AM
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Any examples?
I could provide many examples of turntables that include those adjustments. So... it's probably easier for you to provide examples where it's excluded.
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post #14 of 17 Old 03-26-2012, 07:00 AM
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Maybe I'm missing the "logic", but proper tracking force is not determined by the price of the turntable. It is determined by the recommeded tracking force/weight of the cartridge.

It's not logic you're missing, but knowledge of the market. Sub-$150 turntables almost always come with proprietary cartridges that cannot be upgraded. So there is no way (or reason) to make adjustments.

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OTOH (IMHO), a "cheap" turntable is one that uses a ceramic cartridge and typically has no adjustments. Which no one should ever recommend or consider.

Which is exactly the type of table he was referring to. Also, if that's the only table you can afford, and you have a stack of records you want to listen to, then you should consider it.

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AFAIK, all turntables that utilize a MM or MC cartridge has balance, tracking and antiskating adjustments.

Exceptions are out there. P-mounts, for starters. But I saw a Dual some years ago with a standard cartridge but no way to adjust tracking weight.

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post #15 of 17 Old 03-26-2012, 07:33 AM
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Well... as stated previously, ceramic cartridges are not recommended.
As for a (possible) few exceptions, in my experience, most TT's have adjustments. P-mounts can be replaced and adjusted on many turntables.

Anyway, get a decent TT with the suggested adjustment features and install the cartridge of your choice (properly) as best suits your budget.

There are plenty of used TT's on sale from eBay or Craigslist that may suit the budget/desires of the OP.
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post #16 of 17 Old 03-26-2012, 09:20 AM
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As for a (possible) few exceptions, in my experience, most TT's have adjustments.

Yes, but the exceptions are in the price range he was referring to ($125). And in that price range, the adjustable ones are the exceptions.

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P-mounts can be replaced and adjusted on many turntables.

Replaced yes, adjusted no. That was the whole point of p-mount—it was idiot-proof plug-and-play.

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Anyway, get a decent TT with the suggested adjustment features and install the cartridge of your choice (properly) as best suits your budget.

That seems to be the direction he's going now.

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post #17 of 17 Old 03-26-2012, 11:04 AM
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Great... hope it works out for the OP.
I can't believe how stupid I am. I guess being 58 years old takes a toll.
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