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post #1 of 12 Old 04-18-2012, 07:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Reading various articles recently about Magnepans work with "Tri-Center" and Vandersteens use of 3 speakers (L / R + Center) for stereo recordings - as well as the well documented vintage material on the original Blumlein setups which were also 3 speaker....

This leads to asking the question - what is the best way to produce this effect in a standard home setup configured for home theatre?

ie: can the front three speakers be used to produce an improved stereo (stereo being I believe the greek term for "solid" as in 3D... so at its origin it does not imply 2 channels)

How should an AV processor be configured to achieve this type of processing - is this possible? - Does it require specific types/brands of processor?

bye for now

David
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post #2 of 12 Old 04-18-2012, 08:18 AM
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Wouldn't the appropriate configuration of an AVR be determined by the encoding format of the recorded music?

For example, if the three music channels are appropriately matrixed in a two-channel sound track, I would expect that Dolby ProLogic could be used. Some AVRs include non-Dolby matrixed audio decoders which should work too. If only three channels (L, R, C) are encoded , there'd be no sound emitted by the surround-sound speakers.

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post #3 of 12 Old 04-18-2012, 08:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlaloum View Post

How should an AV processor be configured to achieve this type of processing.......?

Configure the AVR as only having 3 speakers connected and use PLIIx.

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post #4 of 12 Old 04-18-2012, 08:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Wouldn't the appropriate configuration of an AVR be determined by the encoding format of the recorded music?

For example, if the three music channels are appropriately matrixed in a two-channel sound track, I would expect that Dolby ProLogic could be used. Some AVRs include non-Dolby matrixed audio decoders which should work too. If only three channels (L, R, C) are encoded , there'd be no sound emitted by the surround-sound speakers.

The assumption is that the media being played is not encoded multi-channel but two channel stereo.

And that decoding the center channel will achieve a better result than a summed (mono) center method....

Referring back to Bell Labs seminal work on stereo more than 70 years ago... stereo was always meant to have 3 speakers!
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post #5 of 12 Old 04-18-2012, 08:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by sivadselim View Post

Configure the AVR as only having 3 speakers connected and use PLIIx.

Thanks - that was my own conclusion too...

For ease of use and to avoid having to reconfigure the speaker setup continually I am looking at keeping all channels connected (multi purpose setup) but messing with the panorama, width, etc... settings.

Was hoping that others had been down this path and might be able to provide tips/pointers...
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post #6 of 12 Old 04-18-2012, 08:54 AM
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sdurani should have some insight

And you would probably won't to use PLIIx-Music although I would experiment. Neo6 (or other) might proved good results, too.

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post #7 of 12 Old 04-18-2012, 08:54 AM
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I believe that Dolby VS can be configured independently from the general AVR settings (just like Dolby HP can), and set for 3 channel. At least, on my only AVR with Dolby VS this is the case (Dolby VS Wide can be set to 3ch with the AVR set to 7.1 in general, and it just ignores all of the surrounds).

Some processors can actually have multiple speaker layouts programed into them that you can switch between, just like DSP modes, so that might also be a consideration (many of them are relatively expensive though).

Finally, a second decoder/processor could accomplish what you want (may or may not need a switch).

What equipment do you have right now? And how much do you have to spend on this?


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post #8 of 12 Old 04-18-2012, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlaloum View Post

How should an AV processor be configured to achieve this type of processing - is this possible? - Does it require specific types/brands of processor?

bye for now

David

At the Maggie demo at THE Show in conjunction with CES this year they used an older Bryston SP2 pre/pro with just DPL. Very spacious sounding though with an interesting speaker set-up that consisted of an expensive center and two cheap L/R panels, all fed the center channel signal...

John

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post #9 of 12 Old 04-18-2012, 05:40 PM - Thread Starter
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The Maggie demo's and the articles describing it are what generated my initial posting.

They have not posted the setup they were using for the SP2... although it has been mentioend that the 3 center speakers were fed the same (center) signal, and that results were 90% as good with the two smaller left/right speakers and dropping the center speaker - possibly due to closer tonal match between those and the mains, as opposed to the center and the mains.

Your mentioning that they were using Dolby DPL is the first time I have seen any mention of the actual SP2 setup parameters.

thanks

David
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post #10 of 12 Old 04-23-2012, 04:41 AM
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Conversation usually dries up quickly when subject of 3 channel stereo is initiated - demand for such product is lacking - for the inquisitive non- audiophile a 'summed' center channel will suffice.

For audiophools such as I with dedicated 2 channel space with Maggie's the subject as always been interesting - mainly to broaden the size of sweet spot - sans the artificial solutions.

The one that holds interest in link.

http://www.ampzilla2000.com/trinaural.html

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post #11 of 12 Old 04-23-2012, 05:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlaloum View Post

Reading various articles recently about Magnepans work with "Tri-Center" and Vandersteens use of 3 speakers (L / R + Center) for stereo recordings - as well as the well documented vintage material on the original Blumlein setups which were also 3 speaker....

This leads to asking the question - what is the best way to produce this effect in a standard home setup configured for home theatre?

ie: can the front three speakers be used to produce an improved stereo (stereo being I believe the greek term for "solid" as in 3D... so at its origin it does not imply 2 channels)

How should an AV processor be configured to achieve this type of processing - is this possible? - Does it require specific types/brands of processor?

bye for now

David

An effective center channel signal can be obtained using a simple resistive summer and a power amp. I did this and ran it for years back in the 1980s. Loved it.

My system was composed of 3 Ohm Fs, and an 18" subwoofer in a 14 cubic foot box. The woofer driver was a Cerwin Vega custom design for the "Earthquake" and subsequent Sensurround movies. F(3) = 20 Hz and lots of efficiency.
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post #12 of 12 Old 06-16-2013, 04:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinyl View Post

Conversation usually dries up quickly when subject of 3 channel stereo is initiated - demand for such product is lacking - for the inquisitive non- audiophile a 'summed' center channel will suffice.


For audiophools such as I with dedicated 2 channel space with Maggie's the subject as always been interesting - mainly to broaden the size of sweet spot - sans the artificial solutions.


The one that holds interest in link.

http://www.ampzilla2000.com/trinaural.html

Thanks for the link.

Isn't this the same trinaural system that is used by Meridian in their processors?

thanks

David
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