Stand alone DAC vs OPPO 105 - Page 7 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 4Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #181 of 204 Old 06-23-2014, 06:40 PM
AVS Special Member
 
A9X-308's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Australia; now run by adults.
Posts: 5,539
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 212 Post(s)
Liked: 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by db cookster View Post
when discover that you have to convince yourself that a) your hearing something different and b) your not completely sure that what your hearing is better, then i'd recommend that you keep your wife happy, by not adding more hardware and interconnection cables to your system. She will probably also like that fact you haven't spent anymore money on audio, either.
ftfy
A9X-308 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #182 of 204 Old 11-26-2014, 08:49 AM
Member
 
Flo2984's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 42
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Hi folks,

My separate DAC sounds much better than the Oppo 105, that is the reason why I have 2 sources connected to the AVR. Oppo for movies via bitstream and the streamer/dac for music via analog cinch.

I originally wanted to have only one source, but the oppo unfortunately wasnt good enough.

The only possible solution could be an tuning for the oppo called G-Oppo, making it sounding as good as the best Linn players accoring to the scientist/developer, but I had no possibility to proof this up to now...

BR
Flo
Flo2984 is offline  
post #183 of 204 Old 11-26-2014, 11:44 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Smarty-pants's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 16,488
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 261 Post(s)
Liked: 199
^So does this mystery DAC have a name and a price?

~Dave

...Theater Room Setup...
JVC DLA-RS40-U... Oppo BDP-105D... Toshiba HD-XA2... Uverse VIP-2250... Roku Streaming Stick... Emotiva XPA-3... Onkyo TX-SR805
JBL LC2 (x3) ... JBL L820 (x6) ... SVS PB10-ISD (x2) ... SVS 20-39-PCI
Smarty-pants is offline  
post #184 of 204 Old 11-26-2014, 01:32 PM
AVS Special Member
 
RayDunzl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 1,512
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 518 Post(s)
Liked: 733
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post
^So does this mystery DAC have a name and a price?
I bet it's a Linn...

I'll be back later...


links::: 1.5RQ > digits > 1177a > OpenDRC-DI > DEQ2496 > DAC2 > KCT > FPB 350mcx > reQuest > Sweetspot
RayDunzl is offline  
post #185 of 204 Old 11-28-2014, 11:39 AM
Member
 
Flo2984's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 42
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 11
No but its a very special one called LeAudiophil. It is a tuned airport express and was developed by Hartmut Alt from the german open end forum. This DAC/Streamer is comparable to the big LaRosita from France (probably you will find more information concerning that one in the internet) but costs less. It plays in the league up to 10.000€ but costs only 10% of its rivals. I dont want to make advertisement but it really beats a lot of linn streamers, high end cd players and highest end dacs. If you need further infos I could send you the contact data or more info via pn.

So although it is no fair play comparing with the oppo but I wanted to highlight, that the oppo is not the highest possible end nor an all in one equipment for serious stereo enthusiasts! Unfortunately...

Anyone tested the Arcam UDP411 or the Electrocompaniet EMP 3?

BR
Flo
Flo2984 is offline  
post #186 of 204 Old 12-27-2014, 11:07 PM
AVS Special Member
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada - West Island: Vancouver, South Direction: Go East
Posts: 6,880
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2824 Post(s)
Liked: 931
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flo2984 View Post
No but its a very special one called LeAudiophil. It is a tuned airport express and was developed by Hartmut Alt from the german open end forum. This DAC/Streamer is comparable to the big LaRosita from France (probably you will find more information concerning that one in the internet) but costs less. It plays in the league up to 10.000€ but costs only 10% of its rivals. I dont want to make advertisement but it really beats a lot of linn streamers, high end cd players and highest end dacs. If you need further infos I could send you the contact data or more info via pn.

So although it is no fair play comparing with the oppo but I wanted to highlight, that the oppo is not the highest possible end nor an all in one equipment for serious stereo enthusiasts! Unfortunately...

Anyone tested the Arcam UDP411 or the Electrocompaniet EMP 3?

BR
Flo
Florent, I could not find it.
NorthSky is online now  
post #187 of 204 Old 12-28-2014, 03:46 AM
Member
 
Flo2984's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 42
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Flo2984 is offline  
post #188 of 204 Old 12-28-2014, 06:20 PM
AVS Special Member
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada - West Island: Vancouver, South Direction: Go East
Posts: 6,880
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2824 Post(s)
Liked: 931
A big thank you for that. - Un gros merci pour cela.
NorthSky is online now  
post #189 of 204 Old 12-28-2014, 08:51 PM
Senior Member
 
kate*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 300
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 32 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Hello everyone,

I hope you guys don't mind me sharing my experiences, actually this thread is of great interest to me...

A few weeks ago, I was also deciding between a few DACs to hook my Mac mini to my Cambridge 840A S2, I ended up buying it's 840C companion, just because I found it for a very good price.

See... My stereo setup is very humble, and also I do not have the proper lingo to describe it, so please, remember Im a novice at this audio thingy..

For me ears, when I hooked the Mac Mini to the integrated at the first time, using a P2 to RCA cheap cable, the sound was very good, and in a hope to make it sound even better especially because I have some FLACs from HDTracks and B&W Sound of Society I wanted to try a DAC... (So in a search for a hero Bellaraphon, we created a monster, Chimera...)... LOL sorry for the joke... And yes I really liked the movie...

Anyways, I tried a few DACs hooked to my Mac Mini:

- Cambridge 840C (which I ended up buying);
- Dac Magic Plus;
- Oppo 105D;
- Electrocompaniet ECD-1 (used);
- Benchmark Dac-1 (used);

Comparing the mac mini onboard dac with the dedicated ones, rendered a very little difference, at least for my ears. Of course some of the tracks, especially the ones recorded at a higher volume showed some distortion when played thru mac mini and no distortion when played thru a Dac.

I was very disappointed because I could not really pin point the difference between DACs, they all sounded very nice, some sounded exactly the same, while some sounded a bit different and the difference was not even perceptible, I had to really stress my ears and hear the same music several times to notice a very subtle difference.

At some point I thought it was a Mac Mini limitation so I decided to hook a cheap and old 300 CD Pioneer Magazine CD player to the Dacs, and listened it again, all Dacs, one by one, and also the CD Player internal dac.. I found it very difficult to find the best souring DAC, it sounded almost the same.. Again the analog out from Pioneer sounded worse, as it had less definition, but.. It was very hard to notice...

Since I was comparing CD players, I decided to compare the 840C and the PD-F1007, the 840C sounded better, the audio is a bit more clear, I could hear the instruments with better accuracy, especially the higher tones. But again its very subtle...

Then I decided to bring my old Denon 2930ci and test its audio as a CD Player, didn't test SACD... Honestly, not sure if I am deaf but it is impossible for me to tell which sounded better the 840C and 2930ci, it does sound a bit different, but I am incapable for telling which one is better..

I also tested with a different kind of speakers, with the B&W 686, the B&W CM8 and a B&W 803D. The better the speaker the more apparent the diference between internal dac from the Mac Mini and the external DACs. But between the external DACs itself, well, I couldn't detect any difference.

Since the idea is to classify and tell my point of view using as a CD player:

- Oppo 105, sounded as it has better separation between instruments, as in.. The difference in sound from low to high is better;
- 840C, has more clarity, like... The violin sounded closer the violin;
- 2930ci sounded a lot more flat, not necessarily better;

As a DAC, using the Mac Mini as player.... well:

- The electrocompaniet is the best looking, with its transparent panel;
- The Oppo is the coolest one, and looked a bit more "techy";
- The Cambridge 840C matched better with my 840A;
- The Dac Magic Pro, lacks a remote control, so changing between sources is not really good;
- The Benchmark Dac-1 is the ugliest of all...

Seriously?

No difference, ZERO difference between DACS, so i ended up buying the 840C as my vendor was offering it cheaper than the Magic Plus... And I have to say that the Magic Pro and the USB input makes it a lovely combo for a mac mini.



Thanks!

Listening is the best experience.
kate* is offline  
post #190 of 204 Old 12-31-2014, 10:52 AM
FMW
AVS Special Member
 
FMW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,682
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 622 Post(s)
Liked: 912
Flo, it is time to look into doing a bias controlled comparison. It isn't particularly difficult with DACs or input sources. If you want to bring them here, I will prove to you that there is no difference at all in the way they sound, assuming neither one is defective.
FMW is offline  
post #191 of 204 Old 12-31-2014, 10:56 AM
FMW
AVS Special Member
 
FMW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,682
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 622 Post(s)
Liked: 912
Quote:
Originally Posted by kate* View Post
Hello everyone,

I hope you guys don't mind me sharing my experiences, actually this thread is of great interest to me...

A few weeks ago, I was also deciding between a few DACs to hook my Mac mini to my Cambridge 840A S2, I ended up buying it's 840C companion, just because I found it for a very good price.

See... My stereo setup is very humble, and also I do not have the proper lingo to describe it, so please, remember Im a novice at this audio thingy..

For me ears, when I hooked the Mac Mini to the integrated at the first time, using a P2 to RCA cheap cable, the sound was very good, and in a hope to make it sound even better especially because I have some FLACs from HDTracks and B&W Sound of Society I wanted to try a DAC... (So in a search for a hero Bellaraphon, we created a monster, Chimera...)... LOL sorry for the joke... And yes I really liked the movie...

Anyways, I tried a few DACs hooked to my Mac Mini:

- Cambridge 840C (which I ended up buying);
- Dac Magic Plus;
- Oppo 105D;
- Electrocompaniet ECD-1 (used);
- Benchmark Dac-1 (used);

Comparing the mac mini onboard dac with the dedicated ones, rendered a very little difference, at least for my ears. Of course some of the tracks, especially the ones recorded at a higher volume showed some distortion when played thru mac mini and no distortion when played thru a Dac.

I was very disappointed because I could not really pin point the difference between DACs, they all sounded very nice, some sounded exactly the same, while some sounded a bit different and the difference was not even perceptible, I had to really stress my ears and hear the same music several times to notice a very subtle difference.

At some point I thought it was a Mac Mini limitation so I decided to hook a cheap and old 300 CD Pioneer Magazine CD player to the Dacs, and listened it again, all Dacs, one by one, and also the CD Player internal dac.. I found it very difficult to find the best souring DAC, it sounded almost the same.. Again the analog out from Pioneer sounded worse, as it had less definition, but.. It was very hard to notice...

Since I was comparing CD players, I decided to compare the 840C and the PD-F1007, the 840C sounded better, the audio is a bit more clear, I could hear the instruments with better accuracy, especially the higher tones. But again its very subtle...

Then I decided to bring my old Denon 2930ci and test its audio as a CD Player, didn't test SACD... Honestly, not sure if I am deaf but it is impossible for me to tell which sounded better the 840C and 2930ci, it does sound a bit different, but I am incapable for telling which one is better..

I also tested with a different kind of speakers, with the B&W 686, the B&W CM8 and a B&W 803D. The better the speaker the more apparent the diference between internal dac from the Mac Mini and the external DACs. But between the external DACs itself, well, I couldn't detect any difference.

Since the idea is to classify and tell my point of view using as a CD player:

- Oppo 105, sounded as it has better separation between instruments, as in.. The difference in sound from low to high is better;
- 840C, has more clarity, like... The violin sounded closer the violin;
- 2930ci sounded a lot more flat, not necessarily better;

As a DAC, using the Mac Mini as player.... well:

- The electrocompaniet is the best looking, with its transparent panel;
- The Oppo is the coolest one, and looked a bit more "techy";
- The Cambridge 840C matched better with my 840A;
- The Dac Magic Pro, lacks a remote control, so changing between sources is not really good;
- The Benchmark Dac-1 is the ugliest of all...

Seriously?

No difference, ZERO difference between DACS, so i ended up buying the 840C as my vendor was offering it cheaper than the Magic Plus... And I have to say that the Magic Pro and the USB input makes it a lovely combo for a mac mini.



Thanks!

The trick is to level match them accurately. One that is slightly louder than the other will sound better to most people. As soon as you start trying to make out an audible difference between similar sounding products, your biases take over and steer you to the one you prefer for non-sonic reason. Same offer for you. Bring your units and I'll prove that they all sound the same.
FMW is offline  
post #192 of 204 Old 01-01-2015, 09:41 PM
Senior Member
 
kate*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 300
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 32 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by FMW View Post
The trick is to level match them accurately. One that is slightly louder than the other will sound better to most people. As soon as you start trying to make out an audible difference between similar sounding products, your biases take over and steer you to the one you prefer for non-sonic reason. Same offer for you. Bring your units and I'll prove that they all sound the same.
Yeah!

But thats what I just said...

my own words: "No difference, ZERO difference between DACS, so i ended up buying the 840C as my vendor was offering it cheaper than the Magic Plus... And I have to say that the Magic Pro and the USB input makes it a lovely combo for a mac mini."

Listening is the best experience.
kate* is offline  
post #193 of 204 Old 01-01-2015, 09:47 PM
AVS Special Member
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada - West Island: Vancouver, South Direction: Go East
Posts: 6,880
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2824 Post(s)
Liked: 931
Happy New Year Kate ♪ ♫
NorthSky is online now  
post #194 of 204 Old 01-02-2015, 06:49 AM
Senior Member
 
kate*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 300
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 32 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
Happy New Year Kate ♪ ♫
ty Robert!

Happy New Year for you too!!

Listening is the best experience.
kate* is offline  
post #195 of 204 Old 01-11-2015, 03:54 AM
Member
 
Flo2984's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 42
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by FMW View Post
Flo, it is time to look into doing a bias controlled comparison. It isn't particularly difficult with DACs or input sources. If you want to bring them here, I will prove to you that there is no difference at all in the way they sound, assuming neither one is defective.
You can believe me, there is a difference at any loudness.
The sound of the LeAudiophil is much more "smooth" or "analog" with less distrosion and better dynamic + resolution. The trick is that during daytime it fully runs on rechargeable battery so without any connection to the power supply and therefore without any distorsion in supply voltage.

BR
Flo
Flo2984 is offline  
post #196 of 204 Old 01-11-2015, 02:53 PM
AVS Special Member
 
A9X-308's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Australia; now run by adults.
Posts: 5,539
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 212 Post(s)
Liked: 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flo2984 View Post
You can believe me, there is a difference at any loudness.
No, I don't believe you and why should I? Show me the bias controlled tests you've performed that show you can even differentiate between a mains powered supply and a battery one.
A9X-308 is offline  
post #197 of 204 Old 01-12-2015, 09:02 AM
 
arnyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Grosse Pointe Woods, MI
Posts: 14,530
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 851 Post(s)
Liked: 1205
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flo2984 View Post
You can believe me, there is a difference at any loudness.
The sound of the LeAudiophil is much more "smooth" or "analog" with less distrosion and better dynamic + resolution. The trick is that during daytime it fully runs on rechargeable battery so without any connection to the power supply and therefore without any distorsion in supply voltage.
Please provide an explanation why this alleged improvement necessarily makes an audible difference.

I freely admit that I listen to one of my battery-powered digital music players a lot, but I always thought the battery was for my convenience, not any sound quality advantage. The battery gives me cord-free operation at the cost of the usual inconveniences related to batteries.
arnyk is offline  
post #198 of 204 Old 01-12-2015, 10:08 AM
FMW
AVS Special Member
 
FMW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 5,682
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 622 Post(s)
Liked: 912
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flo2984 View Post
You can believe me, there is a difference at any loudness.
The sound of the LeAudiophil is much more "smooth" or "analog" with less distrosion and better dynamic + resolution. The trick is that during daytime it fully runs on rechargeable battery so without any connection to the power supply and therefore without any distorsion in supply voltage.

BR
Flo
Thanks but I know better. I have done the bias controlled tests.
FMW is offline  
post #199 of 204 Old 01-12-2015, 03:42 PM
AVS Special Member
 
beaveav's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,002
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 140 Post(s)
Liked: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flo2984 View Post
You can believe me, there is a difference at any loudness.
The sound of the LeAudiophil is much more "smooth" or "analog" with less distrosion and better dynamic + resolution. The trick is that during daytime it fully runs on rechargeable battery so without any connection to the power supply and therefore without any distorsion in supply voltage.

BR
Flo
Do you know what a voltage regulator is, or how it can be used in low-power audio circuits?

For every new thing I learn, I forget two things I used to know.
beaveav is offline  
post #200 of 204 Old 01-13-2015, 12:52 PM
Member
 
Flo2984's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 42
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Hi folks,

I was asked which gear I´m using that is so much better than the Oppo and I´ve told you. If you are interested please contact the appropriate developers.
I have no personal interest in convincing you about things you don´t want to believe. So believe what you want and be happy as you are, that makes you save a lot of money :-)

The idea is to eliminate any noise that an AC power supply can potentially introduce into the DAC supply voltage.
This can either be archieved by huge torodial power supplys and complex filters (LaRosita and other expensive stuff) or by battery (LeAudiophil). Additionally there are some other "tricks" inside...

Additionally you won´t have any GND issues due to different earth potentials (humming).

BR
Flo

Last edited by Flo2984; 01-14-2015 at 12:51 PM. Reason: Correction of some statements
Flo2984 is offline  
post #201 of 204 Old 01-13-2015, 04:00 PM
AVS Special Member
 
A9X-308's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Australia; now run by adults.
Posts: 5,539
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 212 Post(s)
Liked: 130
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flo2984 View Post
The idea is to eliminate any noise that an AC power supply can potentially introduce into the amp.
This can either be archieved by huge power supplys and complex filters (LaRosita and other expensive stuff) or by battery (LeAudiophil). The battery is also a lot of faster in providing huge power in dynamic situations,...
You obviously have no electronics training or qualifications.
A9X-308 is offline  
post #202 of 204 Old 01-13-2015, 04:33 PM
AVS Special Member
 
CruelInventions's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Chicago-ish
Posts: 4,613
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 79 Post(s)
Liked: 211
But appears to be very well-acquainted with audio boutique co. white papers and ad copy.


CruelInventions is offline  
post #203 of 204 Old 01-14-2015, 12:48 PM
Member
 
Flo2984's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 42
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 11
As I told before, I believe to my ears and they tell the truth no matter how it works!

As I bought the Oppo I wanted an all in one machine to replace also this DAC, there was no intention to stay with both of these machines as I believed like you all the commercials and tests saying oppo is the best also for serious stereo! But after some days I reconnected the LA and was astonished how much better it sounded. So you absolutely cant blame me to follow white papers lol! I also dont believe anything said by any audio boutique lol! The LA is an private project of some guy in the german open end board who knows what he is doing without cheating. It performs as good or even better as the biggest LaRosita but costs a lot less (no dealer, no import, no design, no commercials, more like an good old friend :-)

Right now I'm switching inbetween them and its an absolutely hearable difference: less distorsion and therefore a lot of more details and live feeling :-) not dependant of the loudness!

Oppo is like watching throug a window, LA like being right in front of the stage :-)

I will invite you for some testing if you are by accident nearby Stuttgart :-)

BR
Flo
Flo2984 is offline  
post #204 of 204 Old 01-14-2015, 12:53 PM
Member
 
Flo2984's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 42
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by A9X-308 View Post
You obviously have no electronics training or qualifications.
Omg yes, maybe I was too tired while writing this nonsense, sorry!
I mixed it with the batter pre amp and battery power amp :-)
Flo2984 is offline  
Reply 2-Channel Audio

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off