2 Power Amplifiers 1 set of Speakers - Amp switch? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 50 Old 10-18-2007, 01:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Here is the set up. I have two amplifiers and one set of speakers. One amp is my AV receiver and the other is a vintage tube amp I use for audio.

In the past I just ran two sets of speaker connects to each speaker and manually swapped them out when I changed the amp source.

I'm looking for some type of switch that I can run each amp to on my AV rack, and then have one set of speaker connects out. So when I want to listen to the tube amp I just turn the receiver speakers to off, and switch to the tube amp without having to change speaker wires on the speakers.

Any ideas would be helpful. Currently I contemplating building some kind of double pole double throw knife switch, but if there is something out there a little more "modern", I would prefer that.

Thanks,
Bill
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post #2 of 50 Old 10-18-2007, 02:02 PM
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Switches to do this are readily available pretty inexpensively. I don't know how transparent they may be.

"All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it."
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post #3 of 50 Old 10-18-2007, 02:39 PM
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Humm, I am assuming you are trying to only use your Tube amp when running 2 channel audio, thus lowering the amount of time on your tubes?

I was going to suggest a Pre-amp with a HT bypass option, and then just running your tube amp to always power your left and rights, leaving the receiver to power your center and rears.

Otherwise, I think you are left with sivadselim's option of a switching box.
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post #4 of 50 Old 10-18-2007, 05:48 PM
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A pre-amp with HT bypass is the way to go to integrate a HT receiver with a 2ch sys. however if that's not feasible Niles makes this:

http://www.nilesaudio.com/product.ph...rdcdID=FG00003

I can speak for it firsthand but it may fit your needs.
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post #5 of 50 Old 10-19-2007, 10:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve. View Post

A pre-amp with HT bypass is the way to go to integrate a HT receiver with a 2ch sys.


Correct ! I Concur, but possibly your receiver has pre-outs for L/R mains that can be routed to your two channel tube amp ???
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post #6 of 50 Old 10-19-2007, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twitch54 View Post

Correct ! I Concur, but possibly your receiver has pre-outs for L/R mains that can be routed to your two channel tube amp ???

I think that is how he has his tube amp connected already.

"All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it."
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post #7 of 50 Old 10-19-2007, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sivadselim View Post

I think that is how he has his tube amp connected already.


Not really, assuming he is using the pre-amp section of the receiver, he then would have one pair from the tube amp to the L/R pair.

I think he is looking to be able to run the L/R off either amp section (tube seperate or receiver). Not sure why though ??? if you like you tube amp , why would you want such a sonic difference with the receiver running your L/R speakers ??
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post #8 of 50 Old 10-19-2007, 01:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twitch54 View Post

....................he then would have one pair from the tube amp to the L/R pair.

Huh?


Quote:
Originally Posted by twitch54 View Post

I think he is looking to be able to run the L/R off either amp section (tube seperate or receiver). Not sure why though ??? if you like you tube amp , why would you want such a sonic difference with the receiver running your L/R speakers ??

He has his tube amp connected to his receiver's front L/R pre-outs. He wants to be able to utilize the front L/R speaker outputs of his receiver for multichannel use but the receiver's front L/R pre-outs and the speaker outputs of his tube amp for 2-channel use, to drive the same pair of front speakers, individually, without having to switch out the wiring to the speakers. He can't have 2 separate sets of speaker cables running from both his receiver's speaker outputs and his tube amps speaker outputs to the front speakers simultaneously.

Why? Probably so that their IS no sonic difference between the sound of all his different speakers during multichannel use; so that they're at least equivalent in terms of the amplification being used. And probably, as Amnizu said, to reduce the time on his tubes.

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post #9 of 50 Old 10-19-2007, 02:05 PM
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Seems to me that people who are picky about fairly esoteric things, like tube sound over ss sound (or $800 speaker cables over Radio Shack wires for that matter) ought to be horrified by the idea of sticking an "A-B switch" in their speaker connections. You sure it's too much trouble to just keep doing this manually?
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post #10 of 50 Old 10-19-2007, 08:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCarls View Post

ought to be horrified by the idea of sticking an "A-B switch" in their speaker connections.

I agree completely. Where are the $10,000 speaker cable guys in this discussion?

.


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post #11 of 50 Old 10-20-2007, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sivadselim View Post

Why? Probably so that their IS no sonic difference between the sound of all his different speakers during multichannel use; so that they're at least equivalent in terms of the amplification being used. And probably, as Amnizu said, to reduce the time on his tubes.


I understand what he is trying to do , I just don't understand why ??

Normal HT bypass hookup is for the L/R to be driven off a seperate amp not only for 5.1 and 7.1 but to realize the superior sonics of such amp when enjoying good two-channel. I can see no reason why you would want to listen to two channel through a multi channel receiver.
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post #12 of 50 Old 10-29-2007, 04:09 PM
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I realize I'm late to the discussion here but I ended up building my own DPDT switch box to fix the 2-amps-1-pair problem. Why? I use the 38w tube amp for 2ch music and the 200w solid state amp for home theater.

I didn't buy a pre-made one because all of the inexpensive models had cheap spring clips, so I bought some high-quality binding posts off ebay, a couple high-current throw switches from radioshack, and assembled it into a project box.

Jeremy Gillow
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post #13 of 50 Old 07-31-2010, 12:44 PM
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Obv, a few years later on this. But can someone, hopefully jvgillow respond,

I would like some specs or part numbers of what you bought to make the switch.

Even better if you have some diagrams or such.

Thx
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post #14 of 50 Old 08-08-2010, 04:44 PM
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I started a similar thread a few weeks ago.. I had been using a Niles Audio DPS-1 for a longtime, but always hated the small speaker connectors. Based on the responses from the thread I started a few weeks ago, I was recommended to try the OSD ATM-7..and that is what I have now.. takes normal banana plugs NICE! I can use my expensive cables again.

Johnny
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post #15 of 50 Old 08-28-2010, 11:15 AM
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Anybody know about this product? Any thoughts?

http://www.ambery.com/6stspseamsws.html

Seems a lot less expensive and more flexible than the Niles option. (I'm looking at a two receiver, one speaker pair setup myself!)
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post #16 of 50 Old 08-30-2010, 12:45 PM
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I am looking to do the same as original poster. I saw this:
http://www.monoprice.com/products/se...ector&x=25&y=5

It's +/- $20 but my speakers are 200W and the specs for the item say
· 140Watts Max Power per Channel
· 70Watts RMS per Channel

So I don't know how much will I be loosing vs. manually switching... but 4PDT switch is probably the way to go. Any particular 4PDT switch specs or will they all do?
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post #17 of 50 Old 08-31-2010, 12:09 PM
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I'd be hesitant to use a product like that in "reverse".

Not sure if these single amp to several speakers things will work in reverse.
I called Monster Products to see if there amp to multiple speakers product is "reversable" by reverse connecting the inputs, outputs (putting the two amps in two speaker output areas, and the one speaker pair wires in the amp input) and they said, emphatically, "No!".

http://www.amazon.com/Monster-Cable-...3281742&sr=8-1
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post #18 of 50 Old 09-01-2010, 08:25 PM
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So 4PDT switch then?

Any particular 4PDT switch specs?
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post #19 of 50 Old 09-01-2010, 08:34 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c627627 View Post

So 4PDT switch then?

Any particular 4PDT switch specs?

If you know what your doing, you should have no problems, any 10 amp rated switch or better, will work just fine. To play it safe only change connectons with the amps in the off mode.
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post #20 of 50 Old 09-01-2010, 09:01 PM
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It shouldn't be difficult connecting the speaker cable on one end and then cable amps on the other, how is the performance different with a 10 amp switch vs. 15 amp switch? Is 15 amps better for more powerful speakers?


If both amps are ON, why is that a problem, you take the switch away from one end, thereby disconnecting the link, and connecting the other link to the other amp?

Obviously I'm not going to do this if there's reasonable danger of fubaring the amps assuming the switch is set up correctly.
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post #21 of 50 Old 09-01-2010, 09:07 PM
 
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With the amp powered on there could be "arcing" when the switch is thrown. Performance should be the same, there are 30 amp auto/car switchs, but it wouldn't make it any better. Get what you like or cost less.
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post #22 of 50 Old 09-01-2010, 10:01 PM
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Thank you.

I was going to look for a good deal on a 10 amp switch and make this thing work asap but now you got me spooked


What are we talking about here as far as % of chance of a blow up if both amps are on as I am sure they will be at one point or another and someone else in the house flips the switch to connect the speakers to it....
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post #23 of 50 Old 09-01-2010, 11:00 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c627627 View Post

Thank you.

I was going to look for a good deal on a 10 amp switch and make this thing work asap but now you got me spooked


What are we talking about here as far as % of chance of a blow up if both amps are on as I am sure they will be at one point or another and someone else in the house flips the switch to connect the speakers to it....

Yea, no doubt about it, if you got something like this in your setup, others won't know that the hell its all about, this is for only crazy people like you and me

It could damage the amps, burn the switch contacts and even blow a speaker ! All that is needed to avoid all those problems would be to power down the amps before throwing the switch !
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post #24 of 50 Old 09-02-2010, 06:38 AM
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That would not be a good deal.


Hey one of them has this, maybe I can just use some RCA audio cables to connect them through this:
LL
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post #25 of 50 Old 09-02-2010, 08:22 AM
 
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That a good way to connect the amps, but has nothing to do with running two amps with one set of speakers...
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post #26 of 50 Old 09-02-2010, 10:26 AM
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But you could connect Receiver1 to Receiver2 like that
Then connect Speakers to Receiver2
Then you can listen to output from Receiver1 through Receiver2, right?


I have unrelated questions for you

1. Do modern receivers have a setting where you could connect four speakers, then you listen to your music in stereo through all four of them and then you press a button and then two of them become fronts and the other two rears to complete a 7.1 configuration so you can watch a movie without physically disconnecting the speakers from the main outputs to the rear outputs? Is there a receiver that can fire up all speakers connected to it in stereo and then you press a button and it configures them all in a 7.1 config?


2. [Separate question] Let's say you have a 400W receiver, and four identical 100W speakers, can you connect two speakers to a single main output L and the other two to a single main output R? If not, what about a more powerful receiver?

3. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1273879


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post #27 of 50 Old 09-02-2010, 06:51 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c627627 View Post

But you could connect Receiver1 to Receiver2 like that
Then connect Speakers to Receiver2
Then you can listen to output from Receiver1 through Receiver2, right?


I have unrelated questions for you

1. Do modern receivers have a setting where you could connect four speakers, then you listen to your music in stereo through all four of them and then you press a button and then two of them become fronts and the other two rears to complete a 7.1 configuration so you can watch a movie without physically disconnecting the speakers from the main outputs to the rear outputs? Is there a receiver that can fire up all speakers connected to it in stereo and then you press a button and it configures them all in a 7.1 config?


2. [Separate question] Let's say you have a 400W receiver, and four identical 100W speakers, can you connect two speakers to a single main output L and the other two to a single main output R? If not, what about a more powerful receiver?

3. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1273879


Yes preamp out to ext.in or aux in.
Speaker A + B for stereo units and 5 or 7 channel stereo for AVRs
Yes you can if the amp can handle 4 ohms loading if your speakers are rated at 8 ohms each, if there 4ohms I wouldn't, but you could still try it if you keep the volume low.

You should read the manuals for more info.
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post #28 of 50 Old 10-18-2010, 08:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by googlegod View Post

If you know what your doing, you should have no problems, any 10 amp rated switch or better, will work just fine.


I tell you, I found out the hard way how wrong this advice was.

4PDT Toggle Switch # K402 (first pic attached) was a 20 AMP @ 125 VAC
and it did not work because of "an impedance mismatch (contact resistance) with the high current switch."

4PDT Toggle Switch # M402 (second pic attached) was a 6 AMP @ 125 VAC
and that one was miniature but *did work*.


How can I isolate the speaker cables so close to each other on the miniature switch? EDIT: Heat shrink tubing or liquid electrical tape or even hot glue.



LL
LL
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post #29 of 50 Old 07-22-2011, 11:25 AM
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The item was way too small, I've spent way too much time before finally discovering this:

Speaker - Amplifier Switch IW-101

http://www.oemsystems.com/iw_101.html
LL
LL
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post #30 of 50 Old 07-22-2011, 03:37 PM
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I bought a Niles DSP-1 to do two amps to one set of speakers and it works just fine .I use my tube amp for 2 channel sound and my solid state amp for ht.

Thomas DiCecco
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