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Laserdisc the format maybe will return...

18K views 123 replies 46 participants last post by  skriefal 
#1 ·
Like LP's returned, Laserdiscs also can return, and sooner then we expect.

Pioneer was approched by a company to sell the rights of their Laserdisc production rights (movies and players) and they said NO.

This means they intend in a near future to continue with Laserdisc production.

Well....according to them they stop, but maybe strategy....

According to an un-oficial source Pioneer intends to keep the X0 and the X9 on the market as special orders.

Any orders?
I think there will be plenty...
 
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#3 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by zrdb /forum/post/16518902


And the moon is made of green cheese.............!

Long live your green cheese
I have close to 500 LD's and three High End players. I don't have any of the "supreme" players like the XO or the X9. My point-the point is that I continue to be just like a few of us our loyalty to the big optical disk. Let me share this incident with you. A more knowledgeable audio/videophile than I am came to house and I showed him my humble Home Theater. I played MIB LD(CLD-97) one of the best transfers ever, then the MIB Superbit DVD and finally the MIB BD. Call me ignorant, naive, untrained eyes, etc. My humble untrained eyes see/saw a small margin advantage to the BD. I also took my 704 to his house and he played my Aladdin and Armageddon(DTS) LD's on his 106" projected screen. Yes his Lumagen video processor helped a lot. The point again is that he was impressed by the big optical disk. He is also a member of this forum. PM me if you care to know.

Thank you
 
#4 ·
As a 25-year devotee of laserdisc and, even longer, the best of Pioneer's audio and video products, I stand second to very few in my affection for LD technology. (One of my X0's was used last night.
)


The "green cheese" comment WAS funny.


I just don't see how any offense was intended.


As to the substance ... any rumors can be started by anyone with reverse-mirror logic at any time. Revival of consumer laserdisc - by any company - won't happen. And the concept of a handful of highest-end players being built on demand is even less likely. Well, maybe if someone had around $500,000.00 for startup, and had advance orders of a dozen players priced at around ... $50K apiece to recoup investment ...



And those customers would fanatically want a video experience that is the best that SD NTSC has to offer with discrete stereo - or lossy multichannel or lossless matrixed audio - as an alternative to HD video + full resolution multichannel. All based upon a software library whose last release was close to ten years ago.


uh ...... no.
 
#5 ·
Hey Guys, anything is possible....

By the way my Laserdisc taste is very high, so i will be an activist for shure.


But there is one thing we all have to agree....


It would be good to have some "collector's association" that could manufacture or at least "restore" parts so Laserdisc Players could last for life...


How many people in this world can repair a player properly? Not many....


Kurtis, Duncan.... Who more? I believe that might be a few more, but very few...


Just a thinking guys...
 
#7 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by cararte /forum/post/16518862


Like LP's returned, Laserdiscs also can return, and sooner then we expect.

Pioneer was approched by a company to sell the rights of their Laserdisc production rights (movies and players) and they said NO.

This means they intend in a near future to continue with Laserdisc production.

Well....according to them they stop, but maybe strategy....

According to an un-oficial source Pioneer intends to keep the X0 and the X9 on the market as special orders.

Any orders?
I think there will be plenty...

I think there will be 12, 10 of which read this forum.
 
#8 ·
That's right.... I agree that Pioneer ended the format too early... pure bad strategy.

Market for X9 and X0 was still there for many years to come...

I was one of those that paid $5000 USD for a New 2002 X9. And i'm glad.


And Pioneer continue the production of the R5 and DVL 919 until 2008, when the real market was not in those "average" players, but in the best ones.


Well who understands this...
 
#10 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by cararte /forum/post/16529323


That's right.... I agree that Pioneer ended the format too early... pure bad strategy.

Market for X9 and X0 was still there for many years to come...

I was one of those that paid $5000 USD for a New 2002 X9. And i'm glad.


And Pioneer continue the production of the R5 and DVL 919 until 2008, when the real market was not in those "average" players, but in the best ones.


Well who understands this...

Pioneer did obviously. I'm sure they looked at the profit potential from DVD compared to Laserdisc, and sided in favor of the new technology that was going to provide them the best profit. For the consumer, by 2002, DVD had blown laserdisc out of the water. You could buy a $180DVD player in 2002 that had much better picture quality than any laserdisc player at a fraction of the proce, and you could get the DVD's for half the price of a laserdisc, and they and the player didn't need their own zip code to store them. From the viewpoint of the average consumer, DVD was not only more afordable, but much more practical. DVD was the future, and laserdisc was a dying, overpriced format, and pioneer made their decision.
 
#11 ·
That's right gtaylor, but sometimes in life people have to understand, it's just not about size, because since when the "practical matter" applies to every cinema collector?

Ok, i understand and respect people that prefer "all in theater in one box", DVD's, and are waiting maybe for a smaller format... THere are tastes for everything.

But Laserdisc was something even more special than DVD, and that we can see in all the developments that have been done over the years (1978 to 2002).

It's really amazing... And i honestly think that we all the Laserdisc collector's should make an association on-line, where we could put all database according to models search, and repairs specially so all collector's could have support for life.

And if we don't do anything slowly slowly people related to the format start to fade away, and the format really dies.

Cheers
 
#14 ·
I'm in that small group that yearns for a new, high-end laserdisc player, like what you can find for phonographs. Yes, LP records were around for almost a century, but laserdiscs were around for about 25 years with a large following in Asia and a sizeable minority in North America and Europe.


I would gladly purchase a new Pioneer LD player and have some assurance that I can enjoy my discs for some years to come with a player that has greater likelihood of parts and service than my aging players at home.
 
#16 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor Bergman /forum/post/16536331


I'm in that small group that yearns for a new, high-end laserdisc player, like what you can find for phonographs. Yes, LP records were around for almost a century, but laserdiscs were around for about 25 years with a large following in Asia and a sizeable minority in North America and Europe.


I would gladly purchase a new Pioneer LD player and have some assurance that I can enjoy my discs for some years to come with a player that has greater likelihood of parts and service than my aging players at home.

That is possible today. Pioneer still makes parts for many of their players, and you can still find brand new players. I think they are still supposed to supply all parts for the X9 through 2012 if I remember right. I bought an X9, had it refurbished by the best in the business, then bought some new parts for it to keep on hand plus an extra remote. This should provide years of service. Of course now I don't even use it that much, so if anyone is interested, make me an offer.
 
#18 ·

Quote:
IMHO, Pio pulled the plug too early on the high-end players. There was high demand and inflated prices for years after the format was discontinued
Quote:
Pioneer ended the format too early... pure bad strategy.

Market for X9 and X0 was still there for many years to come

There was virtually NO market for the X9 nor even its lower-priced cousins at the time the models were discontinued. That's why the players and technology were discontinued - there was little demand and thus no money to be made. A few people on AVS does not constitute "high" demand. And maybe not even "a little" ...


Ask those who have used and new X9's - how many have been sold during the past five years? And it's not just the relatively high prices. Listings on eBay for an $3,000.00 X9 in excellent condition went unanswered.


Personal example - I have two X9's, one in excellent condition and one new in box. I periodically field PM's and emails inquiring about a sale. Every inquiry fizzles out even though my offered price is $1,000.00 - $2,000.00 below the "market."


There is NO market for retail laserdisc players that would justify ANY production of ANY model by Pioneer.

Any idea to the contrary is a mixture of nostalgia, wishful thinking, and a misunderstanding of a "market."

Period.


Quote:
That is possible today. Pioneer still makes parts for many of their players.

Not as stated. Pioneer may have some odds and ends left - NOS inventory. But they are not "making" parts for LD models (the DVD-LD combo players are not in the same situation). And it is not possible to get most, let alone all, of the parts for laserdisc players.

You can't even get parts from Pioneer for Elite cassette players, which sold in far greater numbers.

Quote:
you can still find brand new players.

On the secondary/used market only, of course.

Quote:
I think they are still supposed to supply all parts for the X9 through 2012 if I remember right.

All of my research indicates that this is not correct. As far as I have been able to determine the last year of actual X9 manufacture was 1999. The Japanese "10-year rule" would ostensibly relieve Pioneer of service responsibility now.

BUT - I have never been able to nail down what the law or regulation is. Is it for maintaining a supply of all parts? Availability of whatever parts are on hand at the time manufacturing ceases? Providing a (similar) replacement in lieu of parts? etc.

I think that 2012 year expectation comes from the fact that a "new" X9 could be found retail, or NOS Pioneer in 2002. That was long after manufacturing ended.

Quote:
Parts are not an issue with the X9 at this time.

Yes parts ARE an issue. They are not available from Pioneer at this point (except for a few stragglers at the back of old inventory shelves).

You can't even get an Owner's Manual, let alone hardware.
 
#19 ·
Hi Hunter


Don't scare people... LOOOOL



Parts from Pioneer are not an issue, believe me... i was so worried before with a pickup for an X0, and i meet one company that restores the pickup and put it as it was new.

In fact Pioneer also does it. They refurbish pickup's, spindles, and rubber belts there will always be, so what do you need more besides these? Hopefully nothing else, and if you need you have a backup unit, so no problem.


Cheers
 
#20 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunter /forum/post/16540800


All of my research indicates that this is not correct. As far as I have been able to determine the last year of actual X9 manufacture was 1999. The Japanese "10-year rule" would ostensibly relieve Pioneer of service responsibility now.


The last year for X0 was 1999. Last year for the X9 was 2002, I know of this because big buyer like Daniel law was asked how many they wanted from the last batch, so Pioneer could have a clue how many they should make.
 
#22 ·
Hey, Nin -


How're things way over there????



Thanks for input. I obviously heard a different story - n$a said at one time he purchased what was left in 2002. The boxed new machines had been manufactured earlier.


I know my second - new - player came in the box color that preceded my first player. Go figure.


In terms of parts - "i meet one company that restores the pickup and put it as it was new" - I don't have any problem with that. But the "one company" is (probably) not Pioneer, but something like Kurtis with a stockpile of NOS and scavenged parts. All of my experience directly with Pioneer during the past three years - both here and Japan - has yielded no parts availability for all of my requests.


For refurbishment - please tell me when you were last able to get Pioneer to work on your players, and how. I would greatly appreciate it. And will pass it along to someone who needed such help several months ago and emailed me for help. Both of us ultimately reached a dead end.



This thread has had several people make claims of parts and service availability, but there has been NO details of any success - phone numbers, processes, dates, parts obtained, any contact information, etc. It would be invaluable for us to have this information. Especially as those of us who have made similar efforts have all been unsuccessful. TIA.

 
#23 ·

Quote:
This thread has had several people make claims of parts and service availability, but there has been NO details of any success - phone numbers, processes, dates, parts obtained, any contact information, etc.

I'll assume this was partially directed at me (several people), since I was one of the two people who made parts claims WRT the later Pioneer players. My "claim", as stated in my reply, is in regards to the X9. Please feel free to send a PM if you need more information - but I think you know who this source is. I can't vouch for the X0 - my (recent, 2/99) parts acquisition was for the X9.
 
#24 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunter /forum/post/16547358


Hey, Nin -


How're things way over there????



Thanks for input. I obviously heard a different story - n$a said at one time he purchased what was left in 2002. The boxed new machines had been manufactured earlier.


I know my second - new - player came in the box color that preceded my first player. Go figure.


In terms of parts - "i meet one company that restores the pickup and put it as it was new" - I don't have any problem with that. But the "one company" is (probably) not Pioneer, but something like Kurtis with a stockpile of NOS and scavenged parts. All of my experience directly with Pioneer during the past three years - both here and Japan - has yielded no parts availability for all of my requests.


For refurbishment - please tell me when you were last able to get Pioneer to work on your players, and how. I would greatly appreciate it. And will pass it along to someone who needed such help several months ago and emailed me for help. Both of us ultimately reached a dead end.



This thread has had several people make claims of parts and service availability, but there has been NO details of any success - phone numbers, processes, dates, parts obtained, any contact information, etc. It would be invaluable for us to have this information. Especially as those of us who have made similar efforts have all been unsuccessful. TIA.


I got a bunch of parts for my X9 when I bought it two years ago. Got a new spindle motor, laserhead, fuses, remote, belts, etc. All direct from Pioneer. If you do a search on their website for X9 it won't come up with anything. If you put in the part numbers you can get hits. Here are just a few that I know of:


http://parts.pioneerelectronics.com/...uctNum=VXM1066

spindle motor out now but estimated in on 6/26

http://parts.pioneerelectronics.com/...uctNum=VWT1138

laser head in stock

http://parts.pioneerelectronics.com/...Num=SMD96-258B

Service manual in stock


I would venture that you could get anything if you went through Nicolas over in Tokyo as he goes direct to Pioneer Tokyo. I know all of my new spare parts say made in Japan, so the US probably has to pull them over from Japan, and probaby doesn't do so often as demand isn't likely all that high. Again, X0 is a different beast, but that is the price of getting a player that was made for a very short time span and very limited quantity. X9 was made in greater quanity for more years.


As for working on players, you don't need Pioneer, at least in the states. I've know that Kurtis Bahr works on X9's and I've had Duncan Hunter work on mine before. I know either of those two are as good as probably anyone at Pioneer and are highly recommended. I'm sure that Nicolas would also take any player to Pioneer Tokyo as well for a price. But I agree you can't take these players down to your local authorized pioneer service center and expect them to work on them.
 
#25 ·
Part of the clue with getting parts from Pioneer is to have a actual part number you want. When you enter the model number on the Pioneer parts website it gives a small list of what is available. There are many items I've had to order for people that did not show up by model number, I then got the actual part number I wanted from the service manual and entered that and the website gave part data.
 
#26 ·
Thanks, gtaylor. And Kurtis.


Quote:
I bought it two years ago

That is my point and experience (see below). I have recently tried parts numbers for the X0 and been unsuccessful, including calling the same salesperson who spent over two months tracking down X0, X9, and S9 Service Manuals for me from Japan a few years ago (which became the source for dozens on this forum ...
)

Quote:
you could get anything if you went through Nicolas over in Tokyo

Well, again - that was some time ago. He USED to list some X9 parts on eBay, along with a description saying that they were about the last items available. And those listings ceased over a year ago.


All I am saying is that - again - there ARE still odds and ends available, but in terms of real parts "availability" I just don't see it. When you can't even get a copy of a Service Manual for an X0 I see that as a real issue. When Kurtis had to cannibalize a simple CLD-97 door hinge from a no longer repairable unit over three years ago, I see that as a problem.


I'm not trying to argue here, guys. I'm just saying that I do see parts as an issue, and it should be a consideration.
 
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