Question on the HLD-XO, feedback welcome - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 03:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I took the leap and bought a Pioneer HLD-XO. Everyone kept on raving about it etc. While there are a lot of things I like about it, some things I'm not happy about. A little background. I own a CLD-D925 (pal/ntsc model). Yes, it's very good, but from what I understand, doesn't output a "pure" ntsc signal, instead a modified pal one. As a result, my biggest beef with it, the reds don't come out pure red. So, I figured, I better get an ntsc only machine. Since I was buying one, I figured, why not go the whole hog and get the top of the line. So I bought my XO. Apart from straining my lower back trying to put it on a bench :-P, my mine gripe with it is that it's not as sharp as my old player. Less noise, more accurate (and more saturated, maybe too saturated, color), all yes, but not as sharp. It seems, in reducing the noise, sharpness is sacrificed. I have heard it comes with DNR turned on by default. Anyway to turn it off and maybe get the picture sharper? Would an Entech SVSI-1 help? Or a detailer like the vidicraft detailer III? Opinions are welcome. Thanks.
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post #2 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:00 PM
 
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Something doesnt seem right.
What X0 did you bought? Did you bought the one at videogon from Sweden?

Something might be wrong with your player....
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post #3 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:12 PM
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post #4 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MV_Cinema View Post

Something doesnt seem right.
What X0 did you bought? Did you bought the one at videogon from Sweden?

Something might be wrong with your player....


Why do you US guys always mistake Switzerland with Sweden ????

the videogon player is sold by a very good friend of mine


Michael
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post #5 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by astro1 View Post

Well, I took the leap and bought a Pioneer HLD-XO. Everyone kept on raving about it etc. While there are a lot of things I like about it, some things I'm not happy about. A little background. I own a CLD-D95 (pal/ntsc model). Yes, it's very good, but from what I understand, doesn't output a "pure" ntsc signal, instead a modified pal one. As a result, my biggest beef with it, the reds don't come out pure red. So, I figured, I better get an ntsc only machine. Since I was buying one, I figured, why not go the whole hog and get the top of the line. So I bought my XO. Apart from straining my lower back trying to put it on a bench :-P, my mine gripe with it is that it's not as sharp as my old player. Less noise, more accurate (and more saturated, maybe too saturated, color), all yes, but not as sharp. It seems, in reducing the noise, sharpness is sacrificed. I have heard it comes with DNR turned on by default. Anyway to turn it off and maybe get the picture sharper? Would an Entech SVSI-1 help? Or a detailer like the vidicraft detailer III? Opinions are welcome. Thanks.


what output do you use? Composite , S-Video ?

the Composite output is the purest output of any LD player made.

Michael
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post #6 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:21 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nidi View Post

Why do you US guys always mistake Switzerland with Sweden ????

the videogon player is sold by a very good friend of mine


Michael


Didnt mean to offend.
The question here is not the fact that he his your friend or not, is about the condition of the player.
There are not many X0s for sale, i was just taking a doubt.
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post #7 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MV_Cinema View Post

Didnt mean to offend.
The question here is not the fact that he his your friend or not, is about the condition of the player.
There are not many X0s for sale, i was just taking a doubt.

none taken. all players do seems to have slight differences.
and it doesn't help that even the X0 is 16 years old by now.

he does not have the remote to access the video menu which has sharpness settings, so we
don't know on what setting it is.

Michael
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post #8 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:28 PM
 
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That is right Nidi, but with the right guy, the player can be calibrated to perform like new.

The X0 is very complex and sometimes a video circuit can be afected in some way, who knows.

I saw your friend player at Videogon, but it was too much scratched for my taste, but seemed ok according to him.
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post #9 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Sorry, a small correction, the other player is the CLD-D925. I used the BNC composite output. Also, one thing I found annoying, the black line on the bottom from the middle to the right. Apparently I'm led to believe, that's how the XO outputs. The last line is outputted halfway?
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post #10 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MV_Cinema View Post

That is right Nidi, but with the right guy, the player can be calibrated to perform like new.

The X0 is very complex and sometimes a video circuit can be afected in some way, who knows.

I saw your friend player at Videogon, but it was too much scratched for my taste, but seemed ok according to him.

do you know that right guy?

Michael
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post #11 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:33 PM
 
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Can you put a picture?
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post #12 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:34 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nidi View Post

do you know that right guy?

Michael

Yes, just got mine calibrated by a technician at Pioneer Portugal.
They have the service manual of the unit. Fantastic job!
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post #13 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MV_Cinema View Post

Yes, just got mine calibrated by a technician at Pioneer Portugal.
They have the service manual of the unit. Fantastic job!


cool, and in Europe too! are you from Portugal?

Pioneer Europe in Belgium couldn't repair mine 3 years ago.
it had to be shipped back to Japan to be repaired.
I do have the service manual as well

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post #14 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 05:42 PM
 
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Michael when you need help with your X0 let me know, Portugal is very near.
The guy is spectacular and treats the equipment with lots of care.

Yes, i live in Portugal.
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post #15 of 34 Old 12-12-2011, 06:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Speaking of the Entech SVSI-1, anyone want to sell one? So rare unfortunately. I haven't even seen one sell on ebay yet.
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post #16 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 05:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by astro1 View Post

Speaking of the Entech SVSI-1, anyone want to sell one? So rare unfortunately. I haven't even seen one sell on ebay yet.

You don't want one. I tested one once and it was crap:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1276726

What you want is a DVD/VHS recorder with a good comb filter in it. The RCA DRC8335 is one (probably of many) that works well.

TLK
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post #17 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 05:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MV_Cinema View Post

Michael when you need help with your X0 let me know, Portugal is very near.
The guy is spectacular and treats the equipment with lots of care.

Yes, i live in Portugal.

And you sold your X0 recently, apparently.

TLK
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post #18 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 05:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nidi View Post

Why do you US guys always mistake Switzerland with Sweden ????

the videogon player is sold by a very good friend of mine


Michael

Oops.

Why do you European guys always assume that if someone posts something incredibly stupid that he's automatically an American?

TLK
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post #19 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lizard King View Post

Oops.

Why do you European guys always assume that if someone posts something incredibly stupid that he's automatically an American?

TLK


oops, s o r r y , but I always hear that when I'm in the States.

why's Sweden better known in the States than Switzerland?

I thought we flooded the States with Lindt chocolates and Emmi cheeses

Michael
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post #20 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 08:53 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lizard King View Post

Oops.

Why do you European guys always assume that if someone posts something incredibly stupid that he's automatically an American?

TLK

LOOOOOOOL...
Because most of times, it happens...sorry couldn't resist
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post #21 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 08:54 AM
 
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Yes recently i sold an X0 that i had like new.
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post #22 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 02:43 PM - Thread Starter
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And another thing, what is it with the XO leaving a 2 pixel black line on the bottom right of the frame?? The engineers couldn't extend the image to the end? See pic below. Nidi tells me this is commonplace, I don't believe it. I haven't seen any other laserdisc player do this. Can it be adjusted so it doesn't happen?

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post #23 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by astro1 View Post

And another thing, what is it with the XO leaving a 2 pixel black line on the bottom right of the frame?? The engineers couldn't extend the image to the end? See pic below. Nidi tells me this is commonplace, I don't believe it. I haven't seen any other laserdisc player do this. Can it be adjusted so it doesn't happen?


My LD-S2 does that, too. It doesn't bother me, since overscan removes it from the visible frame.

TLK
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post #24 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 06:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Is the X9 the same?
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post #25 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 08:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by astro1 View Post

Is the X9 the same?

Since the HLD-X9 is based upon the same pick up as the LD-S9/CLD-99/CLD-79/CLD-D704, and my CLD-79 does NOT have those missing couple of lines of video, I'm guessing that the X9 won't either.

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post #26 of 34 Old 12-13-2011, 11:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Can someone post a full frame screen grab from an X9 to confirm that?
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post #27 of 34 Old 12-14-2011, 04:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by astro1 View Post

Can someone post a full frame screen grab from an X9 to confirm that?

If it doesn't, would you consider trading your X0 for an X9?

TLK
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post #28 of 34 Old 12-14-2011, 02:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lizard King View Post

Since the HLD-X9 is based upon the same pick up as the LD-S9/CLD-99/CLD-79/CLD-D704, and my CLD-79 does NOT have those missing couple of lines of video, I'm guessing that the X9 won't either.

TLK

The X9 has the same mechanical assembly but the pickup is a red laser and the electronics board is completely different. The other machines you mention S9/99/79 all have the very same boards with just differences in the Y/C output filtering board. The 704 uses the same parts as the S9/79/99 but arranges the boards a little different to get the video board on top to fit the adaptive filter.
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post #29 of 34 Old 12-14-2011, 03:48 PM - Thread Starter
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A full frame screen grab from an X9, if someone would be so kind to post a pic. Thanks.
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post #30 of 34 Old 12-15-2011, 03:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by astro1 View Post

Sorry, a small correction, the other player is the CLD-D925. I used the BNC composite output. Also, one thing I found annoying, the black line on the bottom from the middle to the right. Apparently I'm led to believe, that's how the XO outputs. The last line is outputted halfway?


from this site:

http://www.infocellar.com/television/scanning.htm




half lines - 1st field ends scanning in the middle, 2nd field begins scanning in the middle


actual full lines, or cycles per field - where Field 1 is 262 5/12, and Field 2 is 262 7/12 full lines


two closed captioning lines - they occur immediately after the vertical retrace lines


the first line of each field is a vertical retrace line - begins at the bottom - not at the top


cropped lines are included - the number of cropped lines may vary




Each Field is comprised of 262.5 horizontal lines which are scanned onto the screen, left to right, each line is scanned below the previous line


There is one odd Field (Field 1) and one even Field (Field 2)


The odd field scans lines 1, 3, 5, etc and the even field scans lines 0, 2, 4, etc - hence the term interlaced


The two field's interlaced lines mesh perfectly to create one full frame of lines 1,2,3,4, etc


There are 525 horizontal lines total in each frame, 262.5 lines per field - but only 91% of them are visible



so , half lines (black lines are normal



Michael
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