Sticky: Zenith DVB318 FAQs - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 1897 Old 06-29-2004, 11:03 AM
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This depends entirely on the bandwidth of the component section of your kenwoood receiver... Most agree that 50MHz is enough. Some manufacturers do not list it though - check your owners manual. Anything lower and you *may* have issues with 1080i. Cheers,
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post #92 of 1897 Old 07-04-2004, 08:56 AM
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Anyone have issued with Burned DVD with Label attached when playing in this DVD player. After playing for awhile, the picture is freezing, then it stop.

Without the label, then it seems to be OK. Is it the weight issue?

thanks in advance. and btw, this dvd player is a piece of art. 1080 upconvert is so real.

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post #93 of 1897 Old 07-05-2004, 12:22 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by dragonbud0
I could not find the player in this site http://www.nfm.com/ , so I can send them an email to find out more.

Lenny

Hi Q, I just bought one at Nebraska Furniture Mart (www.nfm.com). I live in Omaha so I just drove down and got one. I called first to make sure. I'm sure if someone called them, they could order one to be shipped. I bought it for $187 + tax, but no shipping. Great thread. I can't wait to set it up and try it out.

EDIT: Their phone number is 402-397-6100. (I do not have any affiliation with nfm, just trying to help out)

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post #94 of 1897 Old 07-06-2004, 08:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by jbird04
This depends entirely on the bandwidth of the component section of your kenwoood receiver... Most agree that 50MHz is enough. Some manufacturers do not list it though - check your owners manual. Anything lower and you *may* have issues with 1080i. Cheers,


Well, after speaking with Kenwood Level 2 Tech Support, they informed me that the component bandwith on my VR6070 is only 10MHz

Oh well. I hooked the player directly up to my TV (via Component) and the picture looks great. No more video switching through the Receiver though.
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post #95 of 1897 Old 07-13-2004, 06:06 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by jbird04
This depends entirely on the bandwidth of the component section of your kenwoood receiver... Most agree that 50MHz is enough. Some manufacturers do not list it though - check your owners manual. Anything lower and you *may* have issues with 1080i. Cheers,


I can tell you that even my Sovereign 5900 av receiver does not have enough bandwidth to pass 1080i. As soon as I turned my rptv on, the picture would not lock into place, so it looks like I'm no longer using it for video.

Once I got it hooked up directly with the component inputs, even without recalibration (I'll get my ISF guy, Kevin Miller back in to do a recalibration since its been about 3 years since it was first done) it looks very good. And I really like the variable zoom for making 2.35:1 fill the screen decently.

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post #96 of 1897 Old 07-16-2004, 05:22 PM
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OK, I just received a new DVB318. Build date is March 2004. I got it to possibly replace my Bravo D1, which is a year old... it has been working fine and has an extremely sharp and detailed picture through the DVI on my Samsung 46" DLP. No complaints at all... just thought it might be time for something newer and supposedly better.

So, I hook up the Zenith... DVI at 720p. It looks pretty good (but not better than the Bravo, at least from first impression). I almost immediately notice the black "ghosting" latent image artifacting. WTF?

Then I discover full frame 4:3 DVD's are "stretched" and can't be displayed properly no matter what settings I select. Letterbox widescreen 4:3 DVD's can be corrected with the vertical incremental zoom, but this introduces all kinds of bizarre scaling artifacts (distorted images, smearing, yuck!).

After using this player for a few hours, I can't see how all of you have come to the conclusion that this is a better DVI enabled player than the Bravo. I know some have had their problems with the Bravo loaders and such, but this Zenith looks like crap on my DLP compared to the D1. Am I missing something? At this point, I'm sure glad I haven't sold my Bravo yet...

Also, the instructions clearly state that upscaling to 720p or 1080i through the component outs is automatically reduced to 480p when playing copy protected DVD's - regardless of what the player is set at. Hell, that's really no different than the Bravo... the D1 will also allow upscaling through it's component outs if the DVD you are playing is not copy protected (like a ripped DVD-R copy of a commercial DVD, for example). Are you all sure this machine is really upscaling copy protected DVD's? How can you be sure it's not your HDTV actually doing the upscaling from 480p?

Perhaps I am doing something wrong - ? Or is my assesment about right?
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post #97 of 1897 Old 07-16-2004, 05:34 PM
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Maybe it has to do with the fact that the Zentih doesn't have custom resolution settings like the Bravo. I have the D2 and the 318 and I am liking both for PQ, but I am slightly on the side of the 318 for most DVDs, but sometimes films look beter on the D2. The DLP supports 720 and the 318 looks best at 1080i as noted by most reviews.
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post #98 of 1897 Old 07-16-2004, 05:43 PM
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Like I said, the Zenith looks OK at 720p playing back anamorphic widescreen DVD's (except for the black "ghosting" thing). It's all the other issues I mentioned that are a disappointing surprise.
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post #99 of 1897 Old 07-16-2004, 06:15 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by gshelley61
Also, the instructions clearly state that upscaling to 720p or 1080i through the component outs is automatically reduced to 480p when playing copy protected DVD's - regardless of what the player is set at. Hell, that's really no different than the Bravo... the D1 will also allow upscaling through it's component outs if the DVD you are playing is not copy protected (like a ripped DVD-R copy of a commercial DVD, for example). Are you all sure this machine is really upscaling copy protected DVD's? How can you be sure it's not your HDTV actually doing the upscaling from 480p?

I think those instructions are ********. I'm getting 1080i from 480p through component no problem. I tried upscaling from 480p to 1080i just using my projector before I hooked up the Zenith and the results were pretty bad - for one thing, the proportions were all off and I got a big blue band at the bottom of the screen ...
With the Zenith, everything looks great at 1080i. I know it is putting out a 1080i signal rather than reverting back to a 480p signal, because if I tell it to upconvert to 1080i, then select 480p on my projector, the image is all screwed up, wrong proportions, etc. But if I select 1080i on the projector, I'm good to go ...
From reading your post it sounds like you are only using DVI? The consensus on this DVD player is that 1080i upconversion through component is the way to go, not DVI.
I will say that the picture offers a nice improvement, but not THAT much better than 480p. It's not like going from VHS to DVD, for instance. And it very much depends on the picture quality of the individual DVD ... on some it may even make things look worse, if they look bad to begin with.

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post #100 of 1897 Old 07-16-2004, 06:26 PM
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Thanks for the clarification, Gray. It sounds like the Zenith does what it says it does. I guess my problem is I've been watching crystal clear images from that Bravo D1 with the DVI out for over a year... I mean I know how good an upscaled DVD can look on a nice display like the Samsung DLP. So the Zenith is turning out to be a bit of a letdown in my case. I'll hook it up using the component outs and see how it looks.

Thanks again for the comments... I appreciate it.
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post #101 of 1897 Old 07-16-2004, 10:00 PM
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Just got new Z1 and DVB318. I had to change the service menu setting#326 in the Z1 to 26 to solve right side banding. When I switched to my other HD cable source there was no change. looks great.
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post #102 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 04:10 AM
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Well, after five or six hours of testing last night, and unfortunately for the Zenith DVB318, there is simply no doubt that my Bravo D1 has a much clearer, more detailed and less artifact-ridden picture. I tried the Zenith at 720p (native screen resolution of may Samsung DLP) and at 1080i using the component outputs. It did look better than using the Zenith's DVI out (which I find really odd... DVI is supposed to bypass all the analog processing and therefore be a higher quality, more accurate signal).

But no matter... there is still the black smearing/ghosting problem (although it was less noticeable) and what I can only describe as very slight image "wandering"... it appeared to move around a bit (not a rock solid, stable playback). And, of course, there is the annoying fact that the Zenith stretches 4:3 DVD content (with kid's stuff, older movies, etc. this is a real pain in the a**). You have to reset the TV from "wide" to "normal" for the aspect ratio to be correct. And if the DVD is a widescreen letterbox (non-anamorphic) 4:3, the zoom function on the Zenith introduces some very weird scaling artifacts when you zoom vertically with the incremental adjustment to correct the aspect ratio. Also, it appears the Zenith overscans (crops) the borders of the image too much... you definitely can't see the entire frame.

I hooked my Bravo back up to the DVI and left the Zenith connected to the component ins to do an A/B... there is no comparison. At least with the Samsung DLP rear projection display, the picture quality of the Bravo is much more detailed, clear, stable, and has no scaling problems or other artifacts (unless they are on the DVD itself - i.e. compression grain, blocks, color banding, etc.)

I have to conclude that the Zenith DVB318 does have a pretty impressive picture over the analog component outputs. If you do not have a DVI input on your HDTV or it is a more forgiving display type than DLP (like direct view CRT, plasma, etc.), then the Zenith should be fine, as long as the 4:3 stretch thing doesn't bother you.

As for me, I will stick with my D1 for now. I haven't had any loading problems or other issues with mine and it is over a year old now. Maybe I'll have a look at the D2...

FWIW, IMHO, YMMV
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post #103 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 03:09 PM
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wow! thats one person out of how many I have heard having problems with the D1. good for you! If I was confident I would have got a good one like you I would have tried the D1.

I think your the only one with a good D1.
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post #104 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 03:41 PM
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Yeah, I understand the D1's haven't been all that reliable for some folks. Mine has worked like a champ for well over a year, and my family uses it probably 3 or 4 times every day (we have small children... lots of family/educational DVD's). I suggested a D1 a few months ago to a friend of mine who also bought a Samsung DLP, and his works OK, too.

One thing about my setup is when we shut down our system, AC power is cut to the Bravo and several other components... so it does not have a continuous source of electricity. Perhaps this causes my Bravo to reset itself over and over and that's why I haven't run into loading problems, etc. Just a possibility.

The build quality of the Bravo D1 is pretty cheesy and the remote sucks, but the picture quality, sharpness and detail using the DVI is really hard to beat. The superbit Fifth Element looks stunning on the DLP using the Bravo at 720p. Lord of the Rings... awesome! The only drawback is when you encounter badly encoded DVD's (there are more than a few out there). You really notice if there are compression artifacts (blockiness, color banding, mosquito noise, etc.) - the combination of the Bravo D1 and the Samsung DLP is not very forgiving if the source is mediocre or poor.
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post #105 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 03:54 PM
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makes you think. maybe your right about resetting all the time.
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post #106 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 04:02 PM
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Well, either way, I am considering myself lucky...

And no hard feelings about the Zenith.
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post #107 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 05:53 PM
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gshelley61 - did you compare bravo to the zenith with both using component? Can the bravo upconvert through component?
My LCD Z1 doesn't have DVI, so component is my best option. If the Bravo picture through component beats Zenith through component I might be tempted to switch ...

People of California! The moment will soon be here when you will ALL be sorry for what you have done to me! Your time of reckoning is growing near. Your cities will lie in smoldering ruins, your women will be ravished. Your men will cry bitter tears. You will ALL feel my wrath.
Yeah, that's...
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post #108 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 05:59 PM
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some of you guys should read the manual and 2 inserts the Zenith came with. it clearly states in the manual and on 2 Attention slips(one yellow and one white) that this player does 1080i on both DVI and Component outs.

I don't know why some people are saying the things they are saying but Zenith has made it very clear what it does over component and yes that includes 1080i and 720p.

my instruction's don't say anywhere that it is reduced to 480p if 720p or 1080i is selected. it says just the opposite.

also anyone can tell just by looking at the picture and selecting through the settings what 480p and 1080i looks like. there is no mistake.
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post #109 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 07:29 PM
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hdtv
You said "Anyone have issued with Burned DVD with Label attached when playing in this DVD player. After playing for awhile, the picture is freezing, then it stop.

Without the label, then it seems to be OK. Is it the weight issue?

You should never attach a label to a DVD, it's not like a CD, they are far more sensitive for the amount of data they contain.
Look at page 5, 2nd paragraph of your operators manual. It states, "Do not attach any seal or label to either side (the labeled side or recorded side) of a disc.

You can remove the labels from the DVD by soaking in warm water then peeling it off. If you have any glue residue you can remove it with Goo Gone available at Home Depot. Then buy yourself a sharpie pen and you can write on it without any problems. Unlike a CD the DVD is layered and the data is sandwiched in between the layers, therefore the pen has no adverse effects on the disk. With a label attached your talking about potential weight imbalance, which has the capability to ruin your player.

Make a nice cover instead of using the labels, you can download em free at
http://www.cdcovers.cc/covers.php
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post #110 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 07:43 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Gray Davis
gshelley61 - did you compare bravo to the zenith with both using component? Can the bravo upconvert through component?
My LCD Z1 doesn't have DVI, so component is my best option. If the Bravo picture through component beats Zenith through component I might be tempted to switch ...

The analog (component out) section of the Bravo D1 is not very good quality, and definitely can't compete with the Zenith DVB318 in that area. I believe the new D2 addresses this and has much improved component video output, though I personally have not seen a D2 in action. My D1 will pass upscaled signals (720p, 1080i) through it's component outputs if the DVD it is playing is not copy protected (for example, a ripped DVD-R backup)... I've tried it and it does work. It doesn't come at all close to the DVI signal, though.

If you don't have a DVI input, the Zenith (for the money) is probably the best bet at this point since it will pass through upscaled signals whether the DVD is copy protected or not. Plus, the picture quality is pretty impressive, for sure. Just not as good as the D1 using DVI. IMHO
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post #111 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 07:56 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by bruman
some of you guys should read the manual and 2 inserts the Zenith came with. it clearly states in the manual and on 2 Attention slips(one yellow and one white) that this player does 1080i on both DVI and Component outs.

I don't know why some people are saying the things they are saying but Zenith has made it very clear what it does over component and yes that includes 1080i and 720p.

my instruction's don't say anywhere that it is reduced to 480p if 720p or 1080i is selected. it says just the opposite.

also anyone can tell just by looking at the picture and selecting through the settings what 480p and 1080i looks like. there is no mistake.

Page 10 of the instructions, lower right hand corner box titled "Notes for DVI and Component video output". Fourth bullet point says "The selected resolution and output resolution may be different during playing back a DVD which copy protection signals are recorded. e.g., The output resolution is changed to 480p automatically even though the selected resolution is 1080i"

That's where I got that idea from. The two inserts regarding upscaled output connections contradict that, and of course actual use does, too. I don't know why that is in the instructions, but it is in there.
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post #112 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 08:19 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by tiptaz
Just got new Z1 and DVB318. I had to change the service menu setting#326 in the Z1 to 26 to solve right side banding. When I switched to my other HD cable source there was no change. looks great.

tiptaz,

I've been trying to do the same on my Z1 but I'm new at this and can't seem to get into the service menu. I've tried holding down the menu and input buttons on the projector - but to no avail. Am I doing something wrong?

thanks
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post #113 of 1897 Old 07-17-2004, 08:44 PM
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I've been meaning to mention this - but I don't think changing that service menu value is a good idea at all. I tried it and you AREN'T getting back the mixing pixels - you're just stretching the image to take up the slack. Which means you're also stretching the proportions out of whack. Try it with the image of a circle and you'll see what I mean ...

People of California! The moment will soon be here when you will ALL be sorry for what you have done to me! Your time of reckoning is growing near. Your cities will lie in smoldering ruins, your women will be ravished. Your men will cry bitter tears. You will ALL feel my wrath.
Yeah, that's...
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post #114 of 1897 Old 07-18-2004, 08:27 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Gray Davis
I've been meaning to mention this - but I don't think changing that service menu value is a good idea at all. I tried it and you AREN'T getting back the mixing pixels - you're just stretching the image to take up the slack. Which means you're also stretching the proportions out of whack. Try it with the image of a circle and you'll see what I mean ...

If that's true, then I am going to say that I am really not impressed with the 318 and it's marriage with the Z1. I have done side by side comparisons between it (1080i over component) and my old Toshiba (not progressive scan) and I honestly can't tell much difference. The only thing I got with the Zenith was an additional black band on the right side and remote that just flat out won't work. I'm more of an audiophile myself and am not much on being able to discern picture quality but haven't really noticed much improvement. It certainly doesn't compare to the HD signal that I know the Z1 is capable of producing. Anyway, I'll chock this one up to falling for the hype. I really thought the Faroudja in the Zenith was going to outshine what is in the Z1 - technically, perhaps it does but on the final eyeball analysis, I still see the same traces of screendoor that I saw before. Looks okay, but not what I expected.
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post #115 of 1897 Old 07-18-2004, 08:36 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by gshelley61
Page 10 of the instructions, lower right hand corner box titled "Notes for DVI and Component video output". Fourth bullet point says "The selected resolution and output resolution may be different during playing back a DVD which copy protection signals are recorded. e.g., The output resolution is changed to 480p automatically even though the selected resolution is 1080i"

That's where I got that idea from. The two inserts regarding upscaled output connections contradict that, and of course actual use does, too. I don't know why that is in the instructions, but it is in there.

It's there in order to meet the obligations of the DVD "industry" and allows them to meet Rule X -- the CYA rule.

...BK
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post #116 of 1897 Old 07-18-2004, 09:02 AM
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they are just covering but cause the manual says it does both over component and also 2 inserts say it too.

its just a butt cover.
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post #117 of 1897 Old 07-18-2004, 09:07 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by mbaker12
If that's true, then I am going to say that I am really not impressed with the 318 and it's marriage with the Z1. I have done side by side comparisons between it (1080i over component) and my old Toshiba (not progressive scan) and I honestly can't tell much difference. The only thing I got with the Zenith was an additional black band on the right side and remote that just flat out won't work. I'm more of an audiophile myself and am not much on being able to discern picture quality but haven't really noticed much improvement. It certainly doesn't compare to the HD signal that I know the Z1 is capable of producing. Anyway, I'll chock this one up to falling for the hype. I really thought the Faroudja in the Zenith was going to outshine what is in the Z1 - technically, perhaps it does but on the final eyeball analysis, I still see the same traces of screendoor that I saw before. Looks okay, but not what I expected.

If the Z1 already has a decent scaler built-in, perhaps feeding it an upscaled analog DVD image over the component inputs is not going to matter that much. My Samsung DLP has an excellent Faroudja scaler already, so I see almost no difference when I send a 480p, 720p or 1080i upscaled signal. HD format signals (1920x1080i or 1280x720p to start with) of course look much better than upscaled DVD's.
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post #118 of 1897 Old 07-18-2004, 09:13 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by bruman
they are just covering but cause the manual says it does both over component and also 2 inserts say it too.

its just a butt cover.

I think the operative word in that little blurb is "may". It "may" change resolution. It doesn't say it will for sure... like you said, it's apparently a CYA to appease the DVD consortium.
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post #119 of 1897 Old 07-18-2004, 10:19 AM
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Gshelley.Of course it looks like crap using dvi.The dvi on the Zenith has some problems.White crush is the worst.This is thru the dvi connection only.Also the player has problems with y/c delay over all resolutions but 1080i thru component is the best.The Zenith also has minor pixel cropping and hot video levels but these are minor problems.
I read that michael tlv is testing some firmware to fix the dvi white crush problem.If you have to have a dvi player try the momitsu ,outstanding picture thru dvi.
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post #120 of 1897 Old 07-18-2004, 10:31 AM
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I will say with 99% certainty that zenith/lg is NOT going to disable upconversion over component. Reasoning is this... If everyone is keeping up with the monster thread, you've heard that there is a firmware update in beta - and that they are testing all modes of operation! So why would zenith/lg waste the time and energy (= MONEY) to test all outputs and resolutions just to disable the component connection??? IMHO.
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