Sony DVP-NS975V FAQ / Brain dump - Page 16 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #451 of 1495 Old 01-19-2005, 07:03 AM
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Hi David:

I have the 46" 520 and the 975 ( currently being replaced because the HDMI output wasn't working) and noted that many of the SM items were different than the 500/510, so I've been reluctant to perform any tweaks. Have you found a SM tweak to push the green depression up? I'm considering calling Sony to see if they'll walk me through the tweak on the phone.
Also, the reds looked spot on in the DVE DVD, we're yours?
Of course all my observations are from component inputs on the 520.

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post #452 of 1495 Old 01-19-2005, 08:16 AM
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Sony will NOT give out the SM codes over the phone. Also, if you push the green up to compensate, it will affect all the other inputs as this would be a global adjustment. Your best bet would be to use the HDMI output on the player to 480P and have the TV upscale for you. Unless Sony does some kind of firmware fix (not very likely) for everyone.

If it's not a BIG screen, it's not a theater...
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post #453 of 1495 Old 01-19-2005, 09:17 AM
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So if I've got to run at 480p through HDMI to keep the colors right...

what's the advantage of this player over the 775, for example?

does running through HDMI w/out upconverting offer that much benefit over running 480p through component on the 775?
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post #454 of 1495 Old 01-19-2005, 09:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Depends upon the display. If the display will allow for using the SD color matrix at 720p/1080i then there should be no color matrix conflict problem. Check through the display's owners manual and read carefully. Many manuals are downloadable .pdf files from the manufacturer.

Paul
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post #455 of 1495 Old 01-19-2005, 12:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jon S
Your best bet would be to use the HDMI output on the player to 480P and have the TV upscale for you. Unless Sony does some kind of firmware fix (not very likely) for everyone. [/b]
Thanks 6foot6 for your suggestion.

Is there any reason to think the upscaler in the TV (46/520) is any better or worse than the on in the player (975)?

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post #456 of 1495 Old 01-19-2005, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Repdetect
Thanks 6foot6 for your suggestion.

Is there any reason to think the upscaler in the TV (46/520) is any better or worse than the on in the player (975)?
Sorry, thanks to JonS for the suggestion.

Mitsubishi WD73-742, Oppo BDP-103, Gallo Classico CL-4/Classico CL-C Center/ CL-10 Sub/ Adiva-ti surrounds, Emotiva UMC-200/ XPA-5/ XPA-3, Toshiba HD-A3. Roku XS  "All rooms, speakers and ears are different, trust your own ears."
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post #457 of 1495 Old 01-19-2005, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
I have the 46" 520 and the 975 ( currently being replaced because the HDMI output wasn't working) and noted that many of the SM items were different than the 500/510, so I've been reluctant to perform any tweaks. Have you found a SM tweak to push the green depression up? I'm considering calling Sony to see if they'll walk me through the tweak on the phone.
The only tweak I did to color was change AXIS to 1 (was to 0). This actually helped red push.

So, now, all of my colors are within 5-8% of each other according to the Avia Color Decoder Check. Green is slightly depressed compared to blue and red. However, this isn't really an issue. I keep green at about zero, which puts red at around +5 and blue is at around +8 to + 10. Prior to this change, the gaps were closer to 20%.

Quote:
I don't know about Kris at secrets, but HDMI vs Component in my case seems to give a much better PQ via HDMI with the sound split off via Optical Digital cable directly into my Onkyo receiver. I am running this player into a Sony GWIV 55WF655 HDMI to HDMI vs HDMI to DVI. Maybe that's the difference. Who knows, but I am very happy with the results.
Yup.

That's exactly how I am running it; HDMI to HDMI. I am using the 975 via HDMI 480p with digital optical going to my Yamaha receiver.

Picture quality-wise, I find HDMI gives more detail than component. I've verified this on Avia's test patterns. On some of the patterns where all you see are straight white lines with component, those same lines with HDMI start exhibiting fine detail and structure with more "feathering." Some of the finer black lines become "tighter" looking with HDMI where as with component they look softer (sharpness control playing no factor in this).

Also, with HDMI, there are fewer digital artifacts. The picture is more clean.
I just got my set ISF'd and overscan reduced, so this is even more noticable now.

The only thing that bugs me a little bit about this player is the picture is off-centered. On 2:35 movies, this isn't as much of an issue. However, on 1:85 I keep thinking I am missing a little something, but I am probably just being anal about it. :)

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post #458 of 1495 Old 01-19-2005, 11:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jon S
Your best bet would be to use the HDMI output on the player to 480P and have the TV upscale for you. Unless Sony does some kind of firmware fix (not very likely) for everyone.
I have a Sony GWIV 55WF which the 975V is connected to via HDMI. It may sound odd but the best PQ I get is setting the 975V to 10801 out. 480P and 720P both look great, but 1080I looks the best. Go figure.
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post #459 of 1495 Old 01-20-2005, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Paul Bigelow
Depends upon the display. If the display will allow for using the SD color matrix at 720p/1080i then there should be no color matrix conflict problem.
Since the consensus is that this is a mistake or defect if you will, has anyone tried contacting Sony to see if it is possible to address this through firmware or will it require some type of hardware to correct? While some FP's may allow adjusting the color space used I would think that most RP's do not have such an adjustment and most likely would expect a HD color space at higher resolutions using the HDMI input.
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post #460 of 1495 Old 01-21-2005, 04:22 AM
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Paul,

Will you ever be adding pics from this player like you did with the Panny? It would be nice to see the comparison. Also, did you ever test either of these at 720p over HDMI? Finally, thanks for the time and effort you put into the reviews.:)
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post #461 of 1495 Old 01-21-2005, 06:05 AM
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Hello

I'm new to this forum. A co-worker turned me onto this site and I can't believe the wealth of knowledge that is being exchanged here....!

Hopefully someone can help me out.

I have a Sony 30" XBR Widescreen CRT I bought in May. This is last years model which does not have the HDMI input. My set has the DVI input.

I just bought the 975 from Tweeter yesterday but they had to have it shipped from one of their other stores. I will be picking it up Monday.

I am ordering a DVI-HDMI cable from bettercables.com today. Unfortunatley I have to purchase the 9footer because they are out of stock on the shorter length cables. Not that big of a deal.

After reading many pages of this thread I am bit confused.

Besides the tray locking problem which seems to be hit or miss, Will I have any problems running this player on my TV with DVI-HMDI cable?

Thanks in advance for any help or advice you can give me.

George
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post #462 of 1495 Old 01-21-2005, 10:20 AM
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Heads up, all. I just received a phone call from Sony, Texas, telling me that they won't be able to fix my player for a long time (more than a month at least; they've already had it for two weeks). The recommendation was that I take my money back and get something else. I tried to grill this guy about how likely I was to experience the same problems with another 975V. He did the customary song and dance when I explained that these players were dropping like flies, mainly for the same reasons (tray lock, refusal to read/play disks). The long and short of it is that I decided to take my money and try one more 975V, only because I have already invested heavily around it in cables, a DVI switch, and bunch of SACDs. It makes more sense for me at this point to stay with the Sony rather than migrate to a DVD-A Panasonic or Denon with HDMI and eat my SACDs. The Samsungs are simply not an option because of their PQ. I loved how the Sony performed on all fronts until it went South (pun intended); its apparent flaws with DVI were more acceptable to me than macroblocking or black crush with another player would be. So, it's buyer beware. Sony will maintain a stone silence on the severity of the issue, but my experience suggests that those of you in this game hope for the best but prepare for the worst. The store where I ordered the second one was fairly candid about the percentage of players that had come back. I can't read anything into what they told me. Good luck, and I will certainly post any further developments.

Ed
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post #463 of 1495 Old 01-21-2005, 10:25 AM
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Ed!! I will recommend Samsung HD 941 if u can find one!!
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post #464 of 1495 Old 01-21-2005, 10:32 AM
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Zoro, I thought that it hadn't cured the black/white crush of its predecessors with DVI. No? If the old problems are solved, then the Samsung will be my backup if the new Sony fails.

Ed
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post #465 of 1495 Old 01-21-2005, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by liberatusvirus
Heads up, all. I just received a phone call from Sony, Texas, telling me that they won't be able to fix my player for a long time (more than a month at least; they've already had it for two weeks). The recommendation was that I take my money back and get something else. I tried to grill this guy about how likely I was to experience the same problems with another 975V. He did the customary song and dance when I explained that these players were dropping like flies, mainly for the same reasons (tray lock, refusal to read/play disks). The long and short of it is that I decided to take my money and try one more 975V, only because I have already invested heavily around it in cables, a DVI switch, and bunch of SACDs. It makes more sense for me at this point to stay with the Sony rather than migrate to a DVD-A Panasonic or Denon with HDMI and eat my SACDs. The Samsungs are simply not an option because of their PQ. I loved how the Sony performed on all fronts until it went South (pun intended); its apparent flaws with DVI were more acceptable to me than macroblocking or black crush with another player would be. So, it's buyer beware. Sony will maintain a stone silence on the severity of the issue, but my experience suggests that those of you in this game hope for the best but prepare for the worst. The store where I ordered the second one was fairly candid about the percentage of players that had come back. I can't read anything into what they told me. Good luck, and I will certainly post any further developments.

Ed
Mine arrived in Laredo on Monday 1/17. I haven't heard from them or called them on it yet. I'll probably do that next week since the repair website message to expect 10 days. I'll also let this thread know how it goes.

I watched a DVD on an XBOX last night. The PQ and sound was terrible compared to the 975, but at least it would play one.
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post #466 of 1495 Old 01-21-2005, 11:27 AM
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My point is with these HDMI players HDMI to HDMI connection is optimum thing to do! and this player works like dream in such way!! All HDMI players have problems when u use HDMI to DVI conversion in one way or the other!
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post #467 of 1495 Old 01-21-2005, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by zoro
My point is with these HDMI players HDMI to HDMI connection is optimum thing to do! and this player works like dream in such way!! All HDMI players have problems when u use HDMI to DVI conversion in one way or the other!
Agree and disagree. HDMI to HDMI is always going to be a better bet, but there are some combinations where you can convert back to DVI. (And, EVERY attempt to do so won't fail). Zoro is overstepping his knowledge by making the generalization that HDMI will never work with ANY DVI input.

There are many threads on this issue and they even explain the reason(s) for the problem. Bottom line is that most of the information necessary to predict the chance of HDMI=>DVI conversion is not readily provided in specifications. An example of an HDMI player that works correctly input to DVI is the Pioneer Elite 59AVi. (Since I don't need DVI, I'm not sure about some of the other options -- though I thought the Panasonic S97 faired pretty well in this department).

There have been reports that the 975 will alway create black crush when fed into DVI. But, it's also said it will do this via HDMI. But, a slight adjustment will alleviate the HDMI issue. I have not heard if it solves the DVI issue as well.

Global, unsupported statements (like the last sentence of the quote above) often lead to confusion about what will/won't work. And, that's one reason it's often hard to find the correct answer in here.

gp
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post #468 of 1495 Old 01-21-2005, 11:53 AM
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Right. I could live with the Sony's faults over DVI, but not with the Samsung's, I don't think. It's a brave new world we inhabit now. In a year, all of these wrinkles will be gone, but woe to the early adopter, the guinea pigs of the electronics manufacturers. Just wait until hi def DVD rolls out.
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post #469 of 1495 Old 01-21-2005, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by tblankenship
This is how my problems started. Within 2 weeks, I could no longer play any disc. I'll be shipping mine to Sony today for exchange.
You were so right, 10 days later it has cratered. So sad as PQ on Sammy 4674 was outstanding HDMI-HDMI. I'm on phone to Sony tomorrow, but after all I have read here, not expecting too much. How really, really sad. Shame on Sony.
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post #470 of 1495 Old 01-22-2005, 08:38 AM
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I just looked at Sony's repair site, after calling them a few days ago and not getting a response back. The message has changed from "being looked at by a tech, and should be finshed within 10 days". To "now being repaired and should be finshed in 5 days". I hope they get it fixed, because after switching back to my old Sony 755v and running interlaced into my projector, it looks like crap. If I change it to progressive, I do not like where it places the image on the screen. If they do not get if fixed, I guess I'll try the panny s97, but with all the issues it seems to have, It will proably not be any better. Hurry up HD-DVD/Blu-ray universal player.
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post #471 of 1495 Old 01-22-2005, 11:13 AM
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Tblanken - I too am using my XBOX as a DVD player in lieu of the empty space where my two Sony 975s used to be. And yes, PQ is horrid compared to the Sony, but at least it works! :)

I think I'll hold out for the new Panasonic upconverter thats coming out in March...

any other thoughts on a replacement, anyone? I'd like to try the Momitsu 880 Deluxe, but I see its not being sold anymore....
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post #472 of 1495 Old 01-22-2005, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
If they do not get if fixed, I guess I'll try the panny s97, but with all the issues it seems to have, It will proably not be any better.
Reportedly, there is now a firmware available in Canada for the s97. Forunately, no problems yet on my 975 ---- but if something does arise, I am thinking the s97 with a firmware upgrade might be the answer. However, I want more verification that the firmware upgrade on the panny does in fact completely fix the known issues with macroblocking and noise.

It's ashame there aren't more quality options for players in this price range.

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post #473 of 1495 Old 01-22-2005, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Paul Bigelow

BTB and crushing: Passes BTB. BUT only with: CINEMA1, CINEMA2, or MANUAL: PICTURE -2, BRIGHTNESS -2. Basically one has to reduce player Picture/Brightness to get BTB to appear

WTW and crushing: The picture modes will crush white. Set MANUAL to above settings to avoid white crushing.

Color accuracy via 720p/1080i (green depression):
1080i: Depends on display. If the display allows for SD/HD matrix selection then choose SD and it's OK. If the HD matrix is fixed at HD for 720p and 1080i then significant green depression -20% on Avia decoder check. Some green shades noted in near black areas. Might be material dependent. It is noted that if one sets the player's "TINT" to -3 and reduce the "COLOR" to -2, the most apparent visual affects of the HD/SD color conversion issue can be reduced somewhat.


The above quote from the original post suggests using the SD color matrix if available. I have an Sony VPL HS20. In the Set Menu it allows selection of the color system. It is currently set to Auto, but it also has NTSC3.58 and NTSC4.43 (as well as some PAL and SECAM settings). Are the two different NTSC settings the SD/HD color matrix settings? If so, which is which? If I leave it set in Auto, will it automatically select the correct one?

I tried the suggested adjustments to Tint, (Hue), and Color. I also set the Picture and Brightness as suggested to allow the player to pass BTB and reduce white crushing. I actually prefer the Cinema1 setting as it seems to improve shadow detail without washing out the picture.

Thanks,

Craig

Lombardi said it:
Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."

My System

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post #474 of 1495 Old 01-22-2005, 06:36 PM
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Thanks a bunch for all the info guys it has been a long read but I decided to go and try to get the 975. I just purchased it from Crutchfield and I even decided to get the 3 year service plan, just in case I get a bogus player. Plus it was only $30 for the plan and crutchfield is a lot easier to work with than Sony. I love Crutchfield. :cool:

Anyway thanks for the info that everyone has laid out especially to Paul.
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post #475 of 1495 Old 01-22-2005, 07:53 PM
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Hey Paul,

Could firmware correct the picture off-centering?

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post #476 of 1495 Old 01-22-2005, 08:53 PM - Thread Starter
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David,

I don't know for certain. My *guess* is that it could. If Sony could lower the picture about 1/4" I would think that would about right.

Paul
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post #477 of 1495 Old 01-23-2005, 07:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by kdog044
Paul,

Will you ever be adding pics from this player like you did with the Panny? It would be nice to see the comparison. Also, did you ever test either of these at 720p over HDMI? Finally, thanks for the time and effort you put into the reviews.:)
Paul, can you respond to my question if you get a chance? Thanks.
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post #478 of 1495 Old 01-23-2005, 05:44 PM
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Is everyone using the auto HDMI option on the Sony or just setting it to 1080 or 720 manually?
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post #479 of 1495 Old 01-23-2005, 08:18 PM - Thread Starter
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kdog044,

My apologies, probably no pictures -- at least in the near future. It's extremely time consuming. I have no TV that has an HDMI input at 720p only 1080i. I have tried 720p via HDMI->DVI to a plasma. It wasn't a thorough examination but mostly to verify that there was no "black crush" going from the HDMI->DVI. A quick view of some other patterns didn't show any major problems that I recall.

SCDaly2000,

I did try the auto and it seemed to work fine. It automatically set for 1080i HDMI (the only HD resolution available via the HDMI.

Paul
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post #480 of 1495 Old 01-23-2005, 08:26 PM
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picked up a 975 last week and i have been very pleasantly surprised.

i was originally going to use this as a backup to my bravo d2 as far as video is concerned, and use the 975 primarily for SACD, but after long hours of comparing the 975 and the D2, the 975 just has a much better picture than the Bravo d2.....the picture is slightly more detailed and 3 dimensional (i am using a hdmi-dvi cord).

its only shortcomings that i can find so far is that over the hdmi output, nonanamorphic widescreen dvd's are not scaled properly (4:3 material is presented with black bars on the side, or FULL so my projector can format it) but none of the zoom modes on my projector properly scale nonanamorphic widescreen properly with the 975 and the player isn't sclaing the flagged non-16:9 discs....also there is very little picture control (just Black Level, which doesn't seem to do anything over HDMI...i've tried both settings).

SACD sounds great....i set all the speakers to small in the SACD menu, this was the only way to get the bass pumping with SACD....but now it sounds great.

very happy so far
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