Denon DVD-1920 - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 01:19 PM
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[quote=cnjvh]


2. I'm not sure what the LPCM setting does. The manual states "set this to on when outputting 48KHz (or 44.1KHz)". What is the appropriate use of this setting?


/QUOTE]

i would think it's for redbook CD's. is this a different setting than PCM?

BTW listening to music is getting mighty complicated-but worth it!!!


jim

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expensive"- R. A. Janek
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post #182 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 01:45 PM
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Jennice, you have good timing...I was going to post these pictures today.

I was watching Ladder 49 last night and experienced some pretty bad MB during the opening scene in the smokey building. I have my system set up so that I can easily switch between component at 480i (all image processing occurring in TV) and HDMI at 720p (processing in the Denon by Faroudja chip). My TV is a Sharp Aquos 37" LCD (LC37g4u). The pictures attached show (part of) the same paused frame with both inputs (sorry about the size, 800x640 is the max size on avsforum and I would rather crop them than shrink them down. If you want the full size pictures, email me and I'll send them to you)

Before everyone gives up on this player, let me add these thoughts. In my experience, the Faroudja chip provides a phenomenal picture 99.5% of the time, and I still use hdmi 720p for all of my viewing--the upconverted picture is loads better than component 99.5% of the time. I still think that the Denon is an excellent player for the money, and blame a lot of this on the DVD compression on this particular movie. You can't tell from the pictures, but with the scene playing, the component feed looked like crap, too. But this was one poor-looking 5-minute scene compared to probably over 100 hours of content that looked amazing on the 1920. I just wanted to post this to let the fence-sitters know that the macroblocking issue is still a problem, but only on rare occasions.

Enjoy,

--tb
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post #183 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 01:46 PM
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I guess it lost my attachments somewhere along the way. Here are the pics

--tb
LL
LL
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post #184 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 02:02 PM
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Thanks for the reply. I've done a little more research and my current understanding is that this setting is for the coax dgital out. Apparently this output is not allowed to pass copy protected high-res material. If you want to listen to a copy protected high-res disk utililizing this output, you can engage LPCM to dumb down the signal to 44.1 and allow playback.

You're right, this is insanely complicated sometimes!!

No earth robot is going to tell ME which button to press!!
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post #185 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 02:03 PM
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hey great job tyler!! to me it looks like the MB is SLIGHTLY worse in the HDMI image(staircase frame & post) but its a subtle difference. and you reminded of something i should have mentioned in my post to Jennice-MB can vary in severity overall AND some DVD's are worse for MB than others-tho a first rate player can minimize it. i'm lucky cuz my RP82 seems to have little or no sign of MB issues-even TRUE LIES doesn't look to bad.

jim

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post #186 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cnjvh View Post

Thanks for the reply. I've done a little more research and my current understanding is that this setting is for the coax dgital out. Apparently this output is not allowed to pass copy protected high-res material. If you want to listen to a copy protected high-res disk utililizing this output, you can engage LPCM to dumb down the signal to 44.1 and allow playback.

You're right, this is insanely complicated sometimes!!

hmm-i didn't even think about copy-protection. now we have THAT to deal with for music? there are times i almost miss my old(REALLY old actually) dorm-room stereo with it's manual Technics turntable-just put the tonearm down & rock on!!! LOL!!!!

jim

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post #187 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 04:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerb2002 View Post

But this was one poor-looking 5-minute scene compared to probably over 100 hours of content that looked amazing on the 1920. I just wanted to post this to let the fence-sitters know that the macroblocking issue is still a problem, but only on rare occasions.

I think this is a very good point, to rule out a player that looks amazing 99% percent of the time for a flaw that may only effect certain movies at certian senes is just not fair IMO.
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post #188 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 05:45 PM
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I must agree with the concept that accuracy will reveal bad things and my past insistence that a 'good DVD player' must make everything look perfect is delusional at best. Some DVDs out there are simply LQ and as a friend of mine said, You can't polish a turd.

This unit continues to impress and please methe charm is not wearing off.

Panasonic Tau 34" Widescreen HDTV (CT-34WX15)
Pioneer Elite VSX-53XT, Denon DVD-1920
PSB Image 5.1 with Velodyne DPS-10 Subwoofer
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post #189 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 06:06 PM
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I've been comparing the 1920 with the Oppo DV971H over the past few days, and the Denon has consistently displayed the superior image. The Oppo puts out a very nice image at 720p, but not so special at 1080i. Many are having sync or flicker issues with it at that setting. The Denon, however, matches the Oppo at 720p and blows it away at 1080i. On a direct view CRT (Sony KD-34XBR960), the Denon at 1080i is surprisingly close to matching the pq on my JVC HM-DH5U D-VHS, which is legit 1080i @ 28.2Mbps for D-Theatre movies.

If you are looking for an upscaling player, but unsure which resolution you will be running to your display, the Denon delivers the goods at either 720p or 1080i. Which means that if you should upgrade to a new display after you get the 1920, there will be no nasty surprises.
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post #190 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 09:56 PM
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how is the layer switch on this unit?

sorry for the "banal" question but all else sounds to work well so was curious how this unit handles this.

while I'm at it how id th FF and Rew? multiple speeds?

Rolando
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post #191 of 787 Old 09-01-2005, 10:51 PM
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I have a Mitsu WD-52527 LCD, and I actually prefer the 480p image via HDMI over 720p.
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post #192 of 787 Old 09-02-2005, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_Smi View Post

I think this is a very good point, to rule out a player that looks amazing 99% percent of the time for a flaw that may only effect certain movies at certian senes is just not fair IMO.

couldn't agree more. this player is looking better & better(especially for the price.)

jim

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expensive"- R. A. Janek
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post #193 of 787 Old 09-03-2005, 05:09 AM
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TylerB2002,

Thanks for posting the pics. However, I don't know if I got wiser or if I'm just in over my head!
I can't see the problem, but I don't know what to look for - or expect - either. The good side is that I think this player should be fine for me. The downside is that I don't know whether to laugh or cry for feeling kinda' dumb not to see any problem.

Anyway... my "reference" (the only player I've had so far) is one of these cheap Denver DVD players that cost next-to-nothing in the local supermarket. I suppose anything will be an improvement, although this player is too "stupid" to care about region codes or anything else. It just plays what you feed it. *L*

It is (as will the new player be) connected to a TV and a Sanyo PLV-Z2 projector. The projector is reached via 18 meters (which converts to about 54 feet I think) of coax cable, being fed a composite (not component) signal. Ordinary antenna cable was the best signal cable I could get, after comparisons with a commercial S-video cable. The S-video cable made two ghost images slightly off-set from the original, while the antenna cable had no ghost images (cable reflections to blame, I think) at all. I know it's not the best conditions imaginable, but it'll have to do for now. The Z-2 projector has a DVI input, but the standard doesn't support that long digital cables, and as I understand it'll only be 8-bit anyway. Would component be possible at these distances, and would it be a major improvement? (the cheap player I have now doesn't have component out.)

Oh, boy... The more I dig, the more lost I feel. Sorry if I'm drifting slightly off-topic, but I'm just feeling so confused now...

Hoping for patience -
Jennice
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post #194 of 787 Old 09-03-2005, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolando A View Post

how is the layer switch on this unit?

sorry for the "banal" question but all else sounds to work well so was curious how this unit handles this.

while I'm at it how id th FF and Rew? multiple speeds?

Your answers are in my review post:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&&#post6013206
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post #195 of 787 Old 09-03-2005, 02:32 PM
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I am still waiting if this player does Pal to Ntsc? and can be made Region Free?

as European version, does and also plays DIVX?
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post #196 of 787 Old 09-03-2005, 03:07 PM
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I just purchased the Denon 1920 DVD player to replace my old Sony DVD player and I found a really weird problem with it. I don't know if any of you ever heard or experienced this before, but when I connected the Denon 1920 to my Onkyo receiver through a coax cable I can hear a local sports radio station out of my surround speakers at high volumes. I didn't realize this until I was playing a movie at a descent volume and when a quiet scene arrived I heard voices from my surround speakers. I stood up and listen to the sound closer and it was a radio station. I stopped the movie and when there was no sound I turned the volume up and I can hear the radio station sound coming out of my surround speakers (not the center or the main speakers, just the back ones). I immediately switch DVD players and connected my old Sony player again and the voices were gone. I thought it was my receiver but my old DVD player is not showing the problem. Apparently it has something to do with the Denon 1920. Can you guys guide me the right direction on what to do?

I think it is pretty weird since my old Sony plays fine and the Denon produces the the noise. It makes no sense to me...
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post #197 of 787 Old 09-03-2005, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoro View Post

I am still waiting if this player does Pal to Ntsc? and can be made Region Free?

as European version, does and also plays DIVX?

No PAL playback (or conversion) on the US model, and no DivX. I'm sure region-free is possible, but without PAL playback, there's not much point to having it.

Denon obviously left some features out of the 1920 to entice people who need PAL-to-NTSC to their 2910 and 3910 models. And, Denon is one of the manufacturers who regard DivX as a European phenonema, along with Panasonic, Onkyo and Sony. Onkyo, for example, has disabled DivX capability on their DV-SP502 player, which behind the Onkyo casing is really a DivX-friendly Pioneer DV-588A.
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post #198 of 787 Old 09-03-2005, 05:35 PM
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AlieniceT,
I've enjoyed all your posts in this thread, thanks & hope your happy.
I did see you mention SA-CD playback (twice), how about CD & DVD-A?

"I wonder if any of the releases had slipcovers though."
"Are these comfirmed to have slipcovers?"
"They look nice in those slips."
"This slipcover looks too good to pass up."
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post #199 of 787 Old 09-03-2005, 07:29 PM
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Terricola,

Try a different connection method for the player. Sounds like you are picking up stray radio signals via your wiring, I doubt its the player itself, just co-incidence that the player is creating just the right antenna loop.

I assume you mean coax for digital audio, if so, try an optical out.

Its not just a hobby, its a 401K reduction plan.
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post #200 of 787 Old 09-03-2005, 07:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmcdayton View Post

Terricola,

Try a different connection method for the player. Sounds like you are picking up stray radio signals via your wiring, I doubt its the player itself, just co-incidence that the player is creating just the right antenna loop.

I assume you mean coax for digital audio, if so, try an optical out.


dmcdayton,

I was thinking about that while I sit here at work and think about what the problem could be. I will try using an optical cable when I get home to see if it corrects the problem. The only thing I'm thinking is having to spend more money to purchase an additional optical cable if that's the case. That will put the coax output on the Denon 1920 useless on my setup

I'll let you know what happens when I test the connection with the optical cable instead of a coax.

Thanks for your help
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post #201 of 787 Old 09-04-2005, 09:18 AM
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Hmm... Didn't you guys talk about the Denon 1920 as having BB 179x D/A chips?
The Danish dealer states: Audio D/A-dekodere: 24-bit/192kHz (Burr-Brown PCM1738).

I'm starting to wonder what's going on here?!

Jennice
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post #202 of 787 Old 09-04-2005, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlieniceT View Post

No PAL playback (or conversion) on the US model, and no DivX. I'm sure region-free is possible, but without PAL playback, there's not much point to having it.

Denon obviously left some features out of the 1920 to entice people who need PAL-to-NTSC to their 2910 and 3910 models. And, Denon is one of the manufacturers who regard DivX as a European phenonema, along with Panasonic, Onkyo and Sony. Onkyo, for example, has disabled DivX capability on their DV-SP502 player, which behind the Onkyo casing is really a DivX-friendly Pioneer DV-588A.

Have you personally tried it? or Just by the specs?
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post #203 of 787 Old 09-04-2005, 12:53 PM
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There are different specs for D/A floating around. Right now Denon USA and Denon Germany both spec the 1920 with Burr Brown DSD-1608. At the same time a lot of resellers have them spec'd with Burr Brown PCM1738.
Can someone please confirm the final spec?

DSD1608 (info from TI)
---------------------------
Analog Performance
* Dynamic Range: 108 dB, Typical
* SNR: 108 dB, Typical
* THD+N: 0.0012%, Typical

PCM1738 (info from TI)
--------------------------
Analog Performance
Dynamic Range: 117dB typ
SNR: 117dB typ
THD+N: 0.0004% typ

/Jimmy
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post #204 of 787 Old 09-04-2005, 01:54 PM
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dmcdayton,

I switch the coax digital output to the optical and the problem was gone for about five minutes until it returned. Now it comes and goes as opposed to being there all that time like it does with the coax cable. I'm lost, I looked at everything I could imagine and nothing seems to get rid of the noise. When I unplug the optical and connect the coax cable the radio station automatically starts but when I switch the coax to the optical it comes and goes. So weird!!

Any other suggestions?

If I can't figure anything out its going to leave me no choice but to take the player back
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post #205 of 787 Old 09-04-2005, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG ED View Post

AlieniceT,
I've enjoyed all your posts in this thread, thanks & hope your happy.
I did see you mention SA-CD playback (twice), how about CD & DVD-A?

BIG ED,
Thanks for the feedback. The SACD playback on the 1920 is its' strength, in my opinion. Very detailed, open soundstage, articulate bass reproduction. It compares favorably with my Pioneer 59AVi and a Sony 975 I owned previously. The Pioneer sound with SACD is very warm, which is often a good quality, but not in all cases. The Denon sound is more neutral, which is to say it seems more faithful to the source material. The Denon should work well with most set-ups, provided that it is not paired with a receiver or speakers that are overly bright. In that case, a Pioneer or Marantz universal would make a better choice. The Marantz DV-6600 due out this fall looks to be a clone of the 1920, but with Marantz audio tweaks. The remote is virtually identical to the 1920 remote.
http://www.marantz.com/pdfs/e_dv6600.pdf


DVD-A on the Denon 1920 is also very good, again presenting good imaging and detail, but with not quite as wide of a soundstage as with SACD. Redbook CD is good, but about what you would expect for this price range. I have much better D/A conversion for Redbook in my processor, so I use the coax out on the 1920 for CD's. It's similar to my 59AVi with Redbook, in that both reproduce low bass instruments with a lack of precision - my processor keeps bass under control and better defined compared to these players.

The audio performance for the hi-rez formats with the Denon 1920 is the best I have heard in a player at this price. Denon obviously made this a priority over Redbook quality. It is not anywhere near the performance of the high end universals like the Onkyo SP1000 or the Denon 5910. Nor should it be for $350.00. And, it is only one link in the audio chain. Without good amplification and speakers, they all sound like crap.
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post #206 of 787 Old 09-04-2005, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zoro View Post

Have you personally tried it? or Just by the specs?

zoro,
I've tried both DivX and PAL discs in the 1920 and get a 'disc error' message with each media format. The PAL disc I tried said 'incorrect region', which is strange as it was a region 0 disc. It should have said 'unable to play this type of disc', which is basically what it said with the DivX disc. I think the 1920 recognizes PAL DVD's, so it should be able to play them. It may not convert them, but it probably can output a PAL signal. Why Denon has made this player NTSC-only is beyond me.
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post #207 of 787 Old 09-04-2005, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlieniceT View Post

zoro,
Why Denon has made this player NTSC-only is beyond me.

probably to save $$$'s. i've seen some lower-priced A/V receivers that have component switching but not S-Video!!!! again i'm guessing to save money. and let's face it a $350 universal player with very good sound & good video is going to SELL!!!
BTW AlieniceT thanks for the expanded opinion on the 1920's multi-channel playback. IF i go with this player it should sound fantastic thru my 1st gen. Boston Acoustics CRs(i.e. CR9's, CR6's et. al.). think i'll keep my RP82 tho.


jim

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post #208 of 787 Old 09-04-2005, 04:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terricola View Post

If I can't figure anything out its going to leave me no choice but to take the player back

Perhaps you should consider taking the Onkyo receiver back. After all, the receiver is the unit that has an FM tuner in it, and not the DVD player. Why the Denon caused the receiver to misbehave, that I do not know!
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post #209 of 787 Old 09-05-2005, 12:06 AM
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I'm wondering...
You all have nice things to say about the 1920, but the CD playback quality seem to be it's worst side (or least good, as overall everyone has said good things about this unit).
Would I be (much?) better off, buying a dedicated CD player like Cambridge Audio Azur 540C or 640C, or Denon DCD-685 or NAD 521 (I've heard the NAD with their top-of-line integrated amp, and several speakers, and wasn't impressed, but I don't know if it was the amp to blame). Can someone please advise?

Jennice
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post #210 of 787 Old 09-05-2005, 01:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jennice View Post

I'm wondering...
You all have nice things to say about the 1920, but the CD playback quality seem to be it's worst side (or least good, as overall everyone has said good things about this unit).
Would I be (much?) better off, buying a dedicated CD player like Cambridge Audio Azur 540C or 640C, or Denon DCD-685 or NAD 521 (I've heard the NAD with their top-of-line integrated amp, and several speakers, and wasn't impressed, but I don't know if it was the amp to blame). Can someone please advise?

Jennice

Denon obviously focused on the SACD sound quality with the 1920, as SACD can only be played back through the multi-channel analog outs (no i.link, Denon Link 3, or HDMI 1.2 for a digital output). For quality Redbook CD performance (and better quality DVD-A than the 1920 provides), you need to feed a digital signal from the 1920 to a quality pre-pro or receiver with better D/A conversion than the DVD player provides. That is the compromise that comes with a $350.00 universal player. With a "high-end" set-up featuring a player feeding a digital signal via i.link connection to a pre-pro or receiver, one wire is all that is required and the end result is nearly always superior to what can be achieved within the DVD player using its' analog outs (Onkyo SP1000 and Denon 5910 are notable exceptions).

Remember that the 1920 is capable of passing multi-channel DVD-A as well as CD audio in digital form over the HDMI connection. The best set-up for anyone using the Denon 1920 is to send CD and DVD-A over HDMI to an HDMI 1.1 receiver or processor (these are now available), while feeding SACD signals to the receiver or pre-pro through the multi-channel analog interconnects. The next best configuration would be sending CD audio over coaxial or optical output to your pre-pro or receiver, and SACD and DVD-A over the analog outs.

Getting a stand-alone player for two-channel CD playback is always an option, and a good route to go with if you listen to music more often than view movies. You also extend the life of your players by splitting the workload between two machines.
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