Kenwood Sovereign System (Changer, Entre, and Receiver) Issues and Answers - Page 25 - AVS Forum
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post #721 of 6894 Old 08-02-2002, 12:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Lars...

I am sorry...But the new software allowed me to AUTO FIND many of the DVD's it could not seem to find before. Even look back a few posts where even Nick reported it found the missing DVD's he had mentioned. Harry Potter is found now without issue.

I do not know what you mean by "Auto-Lockup". I assume you mean 'Auto-Lookup'.

So I am really not sure what you are saying for everything you mentioned is does not see to be an issue for me or others. Except for the duplicate titles.

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post #722 of 6894 Old 08-02-2002, 02:27 PM
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Yes, auto-lookup was intended - typo...

When looking closer at the new "Unknown DVD" entries I can see that some of these are also available with the correct title, so it appears - atleast for me, that some of the DVD's got one or several "unknown DVD" entries as well as one or several correct entries... Before the software upgrade I did not have any Unknown DVD entries but now I have about 50+ with some duplications. Also, some of the old rental titles now showed up even though they were not there before the software upgrade, so it seems old database information re-occurred after the upgrade (including old "Unknown DVD" entries)... I will wait for the "48-hours update" (Monday?) and see if that takes care of these issues before touching the Entre again.

As far as the Harry Potter, do you also have an entry that is basically empty, i.e. no description and an incorrect category (I have "Educational" even though I would expect "Adventure" or something similar) ??

/Lars

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post #723 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 11:31 AM
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Has anyone used a 5900m with a yamaha receiver? When I pause a dvd or before the dvd starts playing I get a High pitch squeal comming out of my receiver fairly loud. If i turn off the auto detect input on the receiver this stops happening but when i play music from the entre i have to switch the receivers input mode. It seems like the receiver is detecting some sort of analog stream when the dvd player is paused....
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post #724 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 12:02 PM - Thread Starter
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Lars....In regards to Happy Potter...No...Mine is correct.

dnsenne...I am sorry. I do not.

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post #725 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 01:03 PM
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Doh! I manually selected the update of the software today (Aug 3) and got 1.1.0.7 and have the duplicate menu entry issue. I tried a number of ways to fix it and then decided to check this thread manually (although I'm subscribed I have not being getting e-mail notifications. Doh2!) I'm stupified why if they know it has this issue they are still letting it be downloaded?!? Perhaps they did actually stop the auto-download process and it would only happen if you manually did the download.

I had tried the below (disconnect) before seeing the suggestion but it didn't work for me. The message as I recall says "music" entries will be removed although I was displaying the movie guide when I powered down the DVD5900. Either way they all stayed.

Physically removed all 100ish DVDs and put only 1 back in a different slot. Menu then showed it twice (in the old slot and new slot). Put all DVDs back in and waiting for the software fix.

It absolutely is cool and useful that the Entre is software updatable BUT these bugs are a pain. No pain no gain sometimes I guess. If they can fix it promptly then there is hope. Like others, however, I'm DARN happy they are actively working on these interfaces. A sure sign they want to move this product forward. Like others, I suppose, I don't brag to my visitors how many problems this has lest I look completely stupid for buying it .

I wish they (kenwood/openglobe) would keep us informed about what is in these darn new versions on the Kenwood tips web page they provided. www.kenwoodusa.com/sovereign/latest_tips . I did notice they have a few more light product manuals/howtos now. I saw an Axcess related one there as well. Appears it's released.

Quote:
Originally posted by tm1221
For the duplicate entry problem has anyone tried turning off the DVD changer manually. The Entre will then detect that there is not a changer connected. It will give 3 options retry, ignore, and disconnect. Select disconnect and then the Entre will clear out all the titles. Once the process is complete, Turn the Entire system off. Make sure the DVD Changer main power button is pressed back to the ON position. Turn the entire system ON. The Entre will then detect that there are discs in the changer, and then enter the read process once again. Apparently the title info is stored on the Entre, for it will not need to connect to the internet to catalog the titles again. It takes a little while, but it worked for me.


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post #726 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 02:47 PM
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Hey everyone,

I've been pretty intersted in these items, the entre hub and the DV-5900M, since they first came out. I was quite suprised by the lack of buzz on them because they sounded spectacular.
I came upon these posts on the items recently and after reading through QUITE a few of the 700+ posts I've gotten kind of scared.
I think its great that Kenwood is actively taking your problems seriously and fixing them promptly...sort of.
I think now, a year after the first posts in this string, is the appropriate time to ask these questions.
I appreciate everyones assistance in this decision making process for me. You all's opinions are definitely what will be swaying me to wait or to buy.

My questions to you all, especially you David Bott, are these (note that I've never gotten to see either item first hand):
I understand that a year ago these items were FULL of bugs but, after all the fixes and revisions to the software for both the Entre and the DV-5900M, would you now recommend these items to someone else like me?

I've noticed that I could possibly get both units together for $2000 slightly used but in excellent condition in a recent classified I saw. Is this a good deal to you all? What do you think I should offer to buy them for? How about individually, used and new?

What about the DVD-A and Progressive Scan playback? Are they pretty high class or just so so? I know Faroudja is a good name but does it compare to a seperate Iscan Pro?

Okay and my last question. Should I wait for the next versions of these units to come out? (Does anyone know how long that could be?) I'm sure they'll have their bugs too, and a higher price tag, but they'll also have their benefits I'm sure, like faster access and stuff like that.

So okay, I'm not exactly desperate for these items. I currently have a first generation Marantz VC-8100 300 disc changer with THX ultra certification which is quite bare bones but does its job just fine. Though it only outputs 480i, which is half the reason for a possible upgrade. I'd say a bit of the other half has to do with out stupid it is. Having to put every title in by hand is really not fun and heaven forbid you move one. I have to make my own list on Excel for cripes sake!

I'm getting in on that recent Samsung 50 inch powerbuy, so I'm finally making the jump to a HD model. Just had to wait for the DVI to become affordable. So I wanted to beable to get a better picture from my DVD's.

Other than that I was wondering how will the entre interact with the rest of my system. Does it try to take over, or is it just there? I'm guessing its just there to play downloaded music and to help out the mega-changer unless you have the AV unit of course. Which I don't have. Can you get online with it through the ethernet link?


My system is this:
Integra Research RDC-7 and RDA-7
Samsung DLP 50-inch (soon)
Samsung OTA reciever with ieee-1394 (soon)
JVC HM-30000U DVHS VCR (soon)
Pioneer LD player
Monster Power center Ht-5000
Marantz VC-8100 300 disc changer (to be possibly replaced)
Tivo Series two
and some unneccesary to list speakers

Thank you all ALOT for your replies. Anything and everything is helpful, though reasonable responses are better. Just saying "the thing completely sucks, don't buy it" really isn't all that helpful.
But I will take offers to buy any units if you all are interested in selling:-)
Thanks,
Matthew
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post #727 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 05:18 PM
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Hi Matthew:

Supposedly, the problem of multichanger support is going to be solved by CEDIA. Kenwood uses this board to "leak" information which they will not confirm publicly, and that's what they've leaked.

Problem is that this system of disclosure gives Kenwood the opportunity to speak from both sides of its mouth, if it chooses. By making no public commitment to the things it leaks, it avoids the "real" responsibility associated with such pronouncements. Whether Kenwood is sincere or not remains to be seen.

That said, this is a big enough issue that I personally think anyone would be crazy to buy an Entre and a DV5900 right now, at least until there is proof that Kenwood is supporting these products, and will support these products. From my perspective, Kenwood's support has been a few bread crumbs thus far. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, and I'm sure Kenwood has had good intentions . . . (at least that's what they leak), but, despite the fact that even with its limitations it is the best changer scheme around, there is very little competition for that title, and Kenwood's track record has thus far been very poor. They're slow to acknowledge problems, they won't publicly commit to fixes or that the problems even exist, and you may be buying into a scheme which Kenwood will soon decide is not worthy of its time and money.

Kenwood is obviously a large company. But do not let that deceive you. Large corporations routinely make cost/benefit decisions on where they put their resources, and, for the near-year it's been around, all objective signs indicate that Kenwood has not been willing to devote the expense and effort to getting these problems fixed. While the benefits of the Entre and the DV5900 are significant, the problems are as well, and what I'm saying is that the track record Kenwood's shown requires you to accept on "faith" something that Kenwood has not yet demonstrated--that it will support this product.

Cedia, which is a full two months away, is when Kenwood has leaked that it will announce its multiple changer support (which was supposed to be true from the start, mind you), and I am very skeptical of that, because there is no good reason why that problem's solution has to be put so far in the future--and again, that leak came months ago. We'll see.

Bottom line is this: Entre and DV5900 have much to offer, but it also may be an endangered species, and Kenwood has done nothing to convince me that it will make the financial commitment to avoid that. Keep in mind, too, that the Faroudja processing which was supposed to be a main selling point for the DV5900 is now available all over the place, and you sure don't need to buy Sovereign to get it.

So, as I've said before, I'm looking to CEDIA, not only to see if the rumored fix for multichanger support is really made available (talk is cheap . . . especially Kenwood's method of talk), but as a barometer of whether Kenwood really has the intent to support Entre and the DVD changers.

Stay tuned.

Nick
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post #728 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 06:21 PM
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Thanks for the quick reply and viewpoint Nick. Very well thought out response. Though I don't believe I'd ever buy more than one changer I absolutely see where you are coming from. Thats completely false advertising. I look forward to hearing what happens as well.

Does anyone else have an opinion to share on whether to buy or not?
Thanks,
Matthew
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post #729 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 06:33 PM
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We purchased the Entre, DV-5900M, and VR-5700 for Christmas last year. Overall, we have been happy with the functionality but not with the bugs. The progressive scan (Faroudja) mode for DVD playback is not working on the DV-5900M. It stopped working a few months after we purchased it but never got around to doing something about it ("life changes" get in the way sometimes). After approaching it again this past weekend, lo and behold, the problem is still there. We have a Toshiba TW56x81 TheaterWide Projection TV. It should handle the progressive scan capability. When connecting the DVD player direct to the TV (bypassing the Entre) we still have the same problem. Even the splash screen is corrupted. It is almost like a colorized, solarized, filled with noise image. It is not like this when we switch back to regular mode. Has anyone else seen this? If so is it fixable locally? We purchased the DVD player from Crutchfield and they said to contact a Kenwood repair center. The local Kenwood Authorized repair center (in the Dallas area) said they would have to ship it since they don't mess with the Sovereign line due to lack of support from Kenwood (with knowlege base?). I don't want to have to ship this beast and be without a player for weeks on end. It is heavily used by our family and I have nightmares of our 3 year old stomping on and throwing our cd and dvd collection all over the house.

Second question: Does anyone have any Pronto remote files that they would be willing to share. We have the older B&W model but are looking to upgrade to the Pronto Pro in the future.

After a call to Crutchfield today I found out that they will not be carrying the Kenwood Sovereign line in the future. This is the same info I got from a local AV store called Tweeter. Just FYI.

Thank you!!!

Regards,

Jennifer Prince
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post #730 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 06:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by princer
Second question: Does anyone have any Pronto remote files that they would be willing to share. We have the older B&W model but are looking to upgrade to the Pronto Pro in the future.

I have a CCF which incorporates the DV5900 and the Entre. It is on the Remote Central site, but it is posted in the Marantz RC9200 files (Marantz's version of the Pronto Pro).

By the way, I owned the Pronto Pro, and went to the Marantz. It costs more, but (like they say on Remote Central) if you can afford a Pronto Pro, you can afford a RC9200. It is a better remote, because of the hard buttons and the built-in joystick.

Quote:
After a call to Crutchfield today I found out that they will not be carrying the Kenwood Sovereign line in the future. This is the same info I got from a local AV store called Tweeter. Just FYI.

First, check the Crutchfield warranty policy, which is on the web. It should be their problem, and they can't dodge it that easily.

As for not carrying Sovereign--Red Alert Folks--this convinces me of what I've been suspecting: Sovereign has not been a money-maker for Kenwood, and it's hard to justify financial support for an already losing venture. Crutchfield isn't going to stop selling them because they're such a hot item.

Nick
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post #731 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 06:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi Matthew:

As I mentioned before, I am very happy with my purchase. I knew when I bought it it was something that would need to be improved over time for it was software based and new. It really has changed the way I use my theater (or my entire home entertainment for that matter.)

I personally feel that Kenwood has been improving the product. Lockup's are very infrequent if any unlike when it first came out. The menu system is very, very much faster with the new software release. And even the OpenGlobe system now includes movie look-up for information for before it was only CD's. (I am referring to the OpenGlobe area.) Even the DVD look-up has improved with new "fuzzy logic". Still though, they need to improve it some more for discs that are their if you do a manual look-up are not found when it does it automatically. (This was based on 4x3 vs widescreen.) But doing the manual search I only have 4 DVD's not found.

The changer has not has any updates as of yet itself. But the Entre code is still being improved.

The biggest sticker for Nick, and some others here, is the 3 changer support. (I only have 267 DVD's loaded..but still want the feature.) The units themselves can already do this and always have been able to, but the Entre using them is the issue. Other than that...What else is left? I ask this because the other issues mentioned in regards to the Entre really now seems to be non-issues. Internet Radio works great, MP3 works very well, and the changer interface work well (thought with only one changer at this time.) They are fixing and improving the Entre software...it always has been on going. Look at the version numbers. So, I guess I see it different on the lack of support. If their were no on going support for the units...why would we keep getting new software and not just fixes, but also additions?

Some things I am still waiting for are... 1) The three second layer change on the changer. (fixable) 2) Maybe the Info Button giving you info (right now it does nothing.) 3) Multi Changer support via Entre. Other than those three...I find the system works well and I think other would also agree.

I still have hopes they will show something at CEDIA to show progress on the multi changer, as it was mentioned they should be. I have not heard anything on any new units at all and I do not use progressive scan for I use a Fru 2200 in my theater.

So with all the software updates made that both bug fix and add options...how can one say their is no continuing support for the platform?

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post #732 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 07:01 PM
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I'll be sure to check out the Marantz and compare it with the Pronto. Also, thank you for sharing the file information. I'm on my way to Remote Central......
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post #733 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 07:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Jennifer...

I do not usually use the progressive mode in my setup...But when I did try it to see it...I had no issue like reported at all. Not surprised at all when you said you tried it months later and it was still their. It is a player issue and thus would not be affected by any Entre software updates I am sorry to say.

From what I know about repair centers...they are not just Kenwood repair centers. The Sovereign line is a totally different and thus not surprised that they would not have the info on the units and they have to go to Kenwood directly for repair. I also have run into this with some other manufacture in the past. Some other repair centers may have the info needed...they are not all alike.

I was going to suggest checking your cables...but you said when you go back to non-progessinve you are fine. Pondering.

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post #734 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 07:12 PM
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Quote:
The biggest sticker for Nick, and some others here, is the 3 changer support. (I only have 267 DVD's loaded..but still want the feature.) The units themselves can already do this and always have been able to, but the Entre using them is the issue.



David is correct, although I am not too happy with the recent Entre addition of discs. But I see this as a very significant issue in its own right, that if they don't come through, they owe me money back. It's that simple.

By the way, Audio Advisor is an authorized outlet for Sovereign, and continues to tout Entre's ability to control three changers. Check out the most recent issue of Audio Advisor's catalogue, which I received last week.

Quote:
I'll be sure to check out the Marantz and compare it with the Pronto. Also, thank you for sharing the file information. I'm on my way to Remote Central......



It's called "The Marilyn Remote." There's a picture of her plastered on each screen (you can remove the pictures if you like . . .) You will have to download the Marantz RC9200 Touchscreen Program (almost exactly like Pronto Pro Edit), so you can open it on the Emulator and see how it looks. I think I've got all the functions there, so it's fairly complete. Also, there are "jumps" from the Entre screen to the DV5900 screen, since you really need to have both remotes to control anything.

Nick
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post #735 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 07:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi Nick...

What do you mean by... "...although I am not too happy with the recent Entre addition of discs." ?

Do you mean the duplicate name issue in the guide? Or are you saying you are not happy that more titles are able now to be found with the "Fuzzy Logic"? If you ment the duplicate issue...it should not be an issue for long as reported.

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post #736 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by David Bott
Hi Nick...

Do you mean the duplicate name issue in the guide? Or are you saying you are not happy that more titles are able now to be found with the "Fuzzy Logic"? If you ment the duplicate issue...it should not be an issue for long as reported.

It is the duplication issue. Of course I'm happy that more discs are available . . . (though I'd really like to see DVD-Audio added . . . but they never said that was part of the package, although it's logical that it should be added)

As for how long it will be an issue . . . well, I remember our discussions back in October, David, when the 3 changers were going to be resolved in 90 days. Remember that from Kenwood?

However . . . the duplication issue is not really a functional problem. Even though I've got four Gosford Parks, I just choose one of them to watch, and it plays. I'm not holding them to the forty eight hours they said.

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post #737 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 07:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Yes....I remember hearing that from Kenwood support also. Thus I see your point now.

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post #738 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 07:36 PM
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There's a large section on eBay devoted to selling DVDs. I know, for when it was my goal to keep all of my discs on my Entre screen, I'd sell off a bunch (purge, really), and my second changer remained in hibernation.

As an incentive to Kenwood, we should take our Entre Menus literally. Thus, my Entre Screen says I have 4 Gosford Park DVDs, well, that means I've got three to sell!!!

So, for each duplicate, we should put them up on eBay, and, after the bids are in, and we get the money for the extra discs we had, it's Kenwood's responsibility to provide those discs to the buyers, because, after all, it was Kenwood that created the extra discs in the first place!!!

Think Kenwood will go for it? If they do, I want more duplicates now!!!


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post #739 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 07:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Now Nick...that was a totally useless post even for you.

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post #740 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 11:29 PM
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48 hours has come and gone, maybe they meant 48 business hours, which is really scary since Kenwood's definition of 90 days is about seven to twelve months, which means 48 hours could be several months by Kenwood's reckoning. I do like the fact that I have over 650 DVD's in a 400 DVD changer, boy did I get my monies worth. What I don't understand is why with all the out of work computer geeks, hackers and programmers, why hasn't anyone hacked the entre, rewrote the programming and developed hardware to do what we all want - 3 changer control, look-up that works, menu's that only show 1 disc per slot, 3 second layer change delay eliminated and all those other problems reported in the last 700 posts. Speaking of lockups, mine just locked up after attempting to manually input the names of the "unknown DVD's".
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post #741 of 6894 Old 08-03-2002, 11:31 PM
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Oh by the way, would I buy these puppies again, maybe...Since if I had bought stock with the money, it would be worthless now, at least the Kenwood's make great boat anchors (ok maybe not that bad).
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post #742 of 6894 Old 08-04-2002, 12:14 AM
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I suspect that the Kenwood Entre will soon be gone, because its just too easy to provide a command set and a computer control program to duplicate much of the functionality. Some of this has been done via scripts and DVDLobby.

They may actually become coveted collector items because they are programmable (although the serial codes are not well-documented.)

Ken Elliott
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post #743 of 6894 Old 08-04-2002, 04:54 AM - Thread Starter
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zinja...

You may be able to rewrite the code for the Entre...however you surely can not do anything with the eprom in the changer which would need to be done for the 3 second layer and the 3 changer via Entre.

Boat anchor? Come on. BTW...you are using it right? At this point it has been improved and is continuing to do so right? (you you have dups...it will be fixed, this I know.) And yes...I would guess business hours.

Ken...

I do not seeing it going away because of what you mention. In order to do what you are referring to, requires a person to want to use a computer to do it and take the time to set it all up. The nice thing about the Entre is the integration to the system. Lets see computers can also play back DVD's and in a lot of cases, better than most DVD players...but yet you do not see those stopping to be made. The Entre is a convenience piece and I for one believe a very nice one. I would not change at this point back to a normal changer or even consider a PC.



I say again that I find nothing at this point to me that makes the system not usable and we do see it still being developed and thus supported. What is missing at this point? 3 second layer change and the three changer support are the only once that seem to be mentioned now.

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post #744 of 6894 Old 08-04-2002, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by David Bott
Ken...

I do not seeing it going away because of what you mention. In order to do what you are referring to, requires a person to want to use a computer to do it and take the time to set it all up. The nice thing about the Entre is the integration to the system. Lets see computers can also play back DVD's and in a lot of cases, better than most DVD players...but yet you do not see those stopping to be made. The Entre is a convenience piece and I for one believe a very nice one. I would not change at this point back to a normal changer or even consider a PC.

I wasn't very clear.
My point was that the product line is due for an upgrade and that times have changed since the Entre was introduced. If Crutchfield drops Kenwood Sovereign, that's a bad sign for the line. I've seen indications that Good Guys is phasing it out also.

I'm hoping that they don't phase it out, (I just bought a 5050M) but really won't believe that they won't phase it out until I see some new fall models. But, what if they do and what if they don't phase out the line?

If they do, its time to get some equipment from eBay.

If they don't, the 5900M and 5050M will likely be updated to be tolerant of more formats and with a new interface. The Entre is a convenience piece but is probably expensive to develop and maintain. It might be time for Entre2, if it exists. Alternatively, I could see them improving the interface of the 5900M to decrease the need for the Entre and doing away with the Entre and replacing it with a software suite.

This might not be good for the convenience of the consumer, but would be driven by cost issues that Kenwood is facing. Such is the nature of the consumer electronics industry.

I admit much of this speculative, but its brought on by the reduced visibility of changers in the marketplace.

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post #745 of 6894 Old 08-04-2002, 10:56 AM - Thread Starter
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I have not seen or heard anything on any new line from Kenwood to would replace the units. Software changes and updates yes...but no new hardware at all have I seen or heard about.

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post #746 of 6894 Old 08-04-2002, 01:04 PM
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Originally posted by kelliot


I wasn't very clear.
My point was that the product line is due for an upgrade and that times have changed since the Entre was introduced. If Crutchfield drops Kenwood Sovereign, that's a bad sign for the line. I've seen indications that Good Guys is phasing it out also.

Agreed. I'd like to get something more definitive than a few rumors on this point, however. Then, I'd like to hear the precise reasons they are being dropped. Then we would have the information sufficient to make anything more than a guess.

Quote:
If they don't, the 5900M and 5050M will likely be updated to be tolerant of more formats and with a new interface. The Entre is a convenience piece but is probably expensive to develop and maintain. It might be time for Entre2, if it exists. Alternatively, I could see them improving the interface of the 5900M to decrease the need for the Entre and doing away with the Entre and replacing it with a software suite.

Disagreed. What more "formats" are you referring to? It does everything except play SACD, (the DV-5900 that is . . .. I know the 5050 won't play DVD-A, but that's a deliberate set-apart from the big brother) and lots of manufacturers are staking positions in the alleged "format wars" by declaring support for either DVD-A or SACD, and not including the other. Only Pioneer, to my knowledge, has a player that does all . . . but the hardware is so cheap in either format that you can, for $200 or $300, purchase a separate DVD-A or multichannel SACD unit, and have peace in your home theater . . . no format wars. Think Swiss.

Quote:
I admit much of this speculative, but its brought on by the reduced visibility of changers in the marketplace.

No speculation, no AVS Forum. But this is a troubling phenomenon to me, too. The problem is that Kenwood, for all its faults, has upped the ante so significantly for what we look for in a changer, that it's going to take something Kenwood-like to get me excited. The Entre is really a seriously cool product--although it could well be discontinued in months, based on my "speculation"--and the addition of internet connectivity into your theater is something you will miss far more when it's gone. I just don't "see" anyone else entering the breach, which is why I don't want it to happen.

Look at it like this: I've got an Entre, a DV5900, and a DV5050M (and I would have had a second by now, if the multichanger support were there). How excited do you think I get when I hear that Sony is about to introduce a "new" progressive scan changer, which is only going to be their same old model, with a progressive scan chip. I don't even use the progressive scan chip on either player.

If Entre and Sovereign hang around, one thing that they must do by way of upgrade (in conjunction with OpenGlobe, I guess) is make DVD-A cover art and information readable and available. I see the day when my DV5900 will only have DVD-A discs in it, and my DVDs will be in the pair of 5050s. Even if this wasn't specifically "promised" when it came out, there is a realistic expectation by the consumer that whatever disc the DV5900 would play, the Entre would download information and art. This can't be a hard thing to add, and, given the relatively minimal number of DVD-A discs available, KENWOOD COULD CONVINCE A LOT OF US THAT IT WILL SUPPORT SOVEREIGN BY ADDING DVD-A INFO AND COVER ART AS THINGS THAT ENTRE WILL IDENTIFY (hint, Kenwood, hint).

CEDIA is the date the coach turns into a pumpkin. If multichanger support is not available by then, well, Kenwood should address a compensation program for all who purchased one of the changers, or the Entre, because they marketed it on expansion capabilities that were supposed to be there, and what you paid for. Even if you only bought one changer, you were buying an "option" on future expansion which never got delivered.

On the other hand, if Kenwood is true to its word, I will be the first to defend it on every front, for what is still a forward-looking, innovative product, that, quite frankly, no one else delivered.

Nick
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post #747 of 6894 Old 08-04-2002, 01:31 PM
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What would you all think about making a purchase on some or all of the Sovereign line now? I've been toying with the idea of selling some of my current stuff, and getting the VR-5900 and Entre, to go along with my 5050M.

Is Kenwood likely to announce a new receiver at CEDIA? And how does the VR-5900 perform? I currently have a Lexicon MC-1 and Rotel RB985 amp, previously I used a B&K AVR-202. Obviously I dont want to go down in quality, but I think from reading the 38+ pages on this thread that most of you are happy with the VR-5900? Also, to get full functionality out of the Entre, is the VR-59000 needed? Or should I just get the Entre and add it to my Lexicon or even B&K?

Thanks for any suggestions, as after reading this whole thread 2 times, I am even more unsure of what I should do!

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post #748 of 6894 Old 08-04-2002, 01:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Nick...Just one point to clarify...

"KENWOOD COULD CONVINCE A LOT OF US THAT IT WILL SUPPORT SOVEREIGN BY ADDING DVD-A INFO AND COVER ART AS THINGS THAT ENTRE WILL IDENTIFY (hint, Kenwood, hint). "

This would not be a Kenwood issue, but an OpenGlode issue. OpenGlode is the partner that does the databases. It also does it for Escent and I do not think Escent even has the option for the data is not their. So, Kenwood can not give what it does not own or control. OpenGlode is the content provider. If their data is their, which I do not think it is, then it comes down to the contract between the two. All in all it would come down to cost either way, but it would fall on OpenGlobe to provide the data.

My thought on it.

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post #749 of 6894 Old 08-04-2002, 01:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Kirby...

You can always add the VR-59000 later if yuo want. I have it and it of course works very when then Entre controls it. But you surely do not need it. I went from a Lex MC-1, to a Denon 5800, to the VR-5900. I am happy with the performance in my dedicated theater.

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post #750 of 6894 Old 08-04-2002, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by David Bott
Nick...Just one point to clarify...

"KENWOOD COULD CONVINCE A LOT OF US THAT IT WILL SUPPORT SOVEREIGN BY ADDING DVD-A INFO AND COVER ART AS THINGS THAT ENTRE WILL IDENTIFY (hint, Kenwood, hint). "

This would not be a Kenwood issue, but an OpenGlobe issue. OpenGlode is the partner that does the databases. It also does it for Escent and I do not think Escent even has the option for the data is not their. So, Kenwood can not give what it does not own or control. OpenGlobe is the content provider. If their data is their, which I do not think it is, then it comes down to the contract between the two. All in all it would come down to cost either way, but it would fall on OpenGlobe to provide the data.

My thought on it.

Well, sort of . . . go to the OpenGlobe website and you'll see a list of its "Partners" (Escient, Kenwood, etc.). While OpenGlobe is certainly the content provider, Kenwood can and should do all it can to encourage OpenGlobe to provide this information, in the same way that it would encourage OpenGlobe to stay current with DVD releases.

I spoke with OpenGlobe once on this issue, and the fellow that I talked to made it out as if it were no big deal, and that's possible . . . but that no real thought had been given to it. You could tell he was putting it in a sort of mental suggestion box, but Heaven knows whether it got written down.

My point is that Kenwood can and should be an advocate for this, particularly since it's selling the DV5900 which it markets as being DVD-A capable, and to be controlled by Entre, and supplemented by Entre. It's true, nowhere in the Kenwood literature does it say "cover art for DVD-A discs will be included," but nowhere does it say, "by the way, in case you plan on using this as a changer primarily for DVD-A discs, you won't get cover art."

In the short time I've been collecting DVD-A discs, I've accumulated 40. That's 10% of the DV5900, and that number will probably one day approach 100%.

Are we Kenwood's customers? Is OpenGlobe and Entre supposed to be interactive and upgradeable? This is not an unreasonable expectation under the circumstances, and I would be extremely disappointed if Kenwood's response were that, sorry, that's OpenGlobe's problem, and if you don't like it, tough. My response back would be: Why didn't you tell me that even though the Entre controlled the DV5900, it didn't do for DVD-A discs what it does for DVD discs?

I'm not accusing Kenwood of being duplicitous, but I for one was surprised after I bought the Entre and the DV5900 that the information on DVD-A discs was not available. Hell, I get all kinds of information from CDDJ on cd discs--cover art, lyrics, disc tracks--for use with a Nirvis controller of my Sony CD changers, and it doesn't cost a thing. I'm betting that with little investment, or little prodding of OpenGlobe, some information can be provided that some people really did expect when they bought Entre.

Nick
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