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post #7111 of 7336 Old 03-11-2015, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fredxr2d2 View Post
Although, as long as we're wishing, they might as well give us DTS-MA and 15Mbps 1080p.
DTS MA is not available for streaming. However DTS HD is currently being use by Cinema Now and if I'm not mistaken, similar to DD plus with a maximum bit rate at about 6 Mbps.

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post #7112 of 7336 Old 03-11-2015, 03:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
...I'll keep buying Blu-rays; my eyes and ears are too precious to me. Life's just too short to be mistreated.
Agreed. For those show I'm not terribly interested in, Netflix is a great alternative.
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post #7113 of 7336 Old 03-11-2015, 03:43 PM
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Speaking of life is short I'm sure as hell not going to wait for House of Cards to hit Blu-ray.
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post #7114 of 7336 Old 03-11-2015, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
...235 kbps is what, like 188i lines?

320x240p24. I never actually see it and most people only see it fleetingly, depending upon how well the adaptive bit rate algorithm is implemented in the device that they're playing it with.

Quote:
How much speed is required to get 15600 kbps?
I'm fairly certain that I've answered that question multiple times in this thread and during portions of the conversation that you were participating in. As a rule of thumb, you need to be able to sustain about 120% of the speed of a stream with Netflix's servers to keep a player's buffer full. 15600 Kbps video + 192 Kbps audio = 15792 Kbps * 1.2 = 18950.4 Kbps. Netflix suggests 25 Mbps service at a minimum.

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Last, how many 3D titles do you guys have over there, with Nelflix?

I have no idea. To see the list in a Netflix player browser you have to run the Netflix app in a 3D TV or in a 3D-capable BD player or something connected to a 3D TV; in other words, Netflix in a set-up which can play 3D video. (The same is true of 4K; you can only see the "Ultra HD 4K" genre in the player browser on a 4K TV or, presumably, Netflix on a 4K capable STB connected to a 4K TV). I do not now nor have I ever owned a 3D TV and have no interest in glasses-based 3D video at home or in theaters.

I had the idea that Netflix pretty much dropped development of 3D a year or two back, though they probably won't remove the existing titles. I could be wrong and they're continuing to add new 3D titles.

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post #7115 of 7336 Old 03-11-2015, 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted by metalsaber View Post
Agreed. For those show I'm not terribly interested in, Netflix is a great alternative.
...Some good documentaries from the 40s and 50s where picture quality is not a tragedy and where sound quality is not a travesty, it's ok.
/// Like from the Charlie Chaplin's era (10s, 20s, and 30s) with piano soundtracks, no dialog, and Charleston jazz music.
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post #7116 of 7336 Old 03-11-2015, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
...I'll keep buying Blu-rays; my eyes and ears are too precious to me. Life's just too short to be mistreated.

Life is way too frickin' short for me to keep hopping up changing discs. I haven't bought anything on disc other than very rarely a video game for some years now. Maybe once or twice a year I watch something that I own on disc. Otherwise I stream, download or watch/record on cable all the video and audio that I consume. I purchase almost all of the video games that I play as downloads (I've had an Xbox One for a year and a half and only recently bought a game on disc for it--Rocksmith 2014--and only because it was a tremendous deal. Being the only XB1 game disc that I own it lives in the console's drive. If the DD of it goes on a big sale I'll probably double dip and dump the disc).

I just hope that they keep making discs for you connoisseurs. BDs have never achieved the volume of sales that DVDs did; 4K discs will no doubt be less popular still as the popularity of streaming rises. Streaming video got good enough for Joe and Jane Average years ago; they rent DVDs when they rent them because Red Box is cheaper than renting streams.

Have you ever seen higher bit rate 1080p or 4K Netflix or heard its audio, NorthSky? Obviously not VUDU or any of the others in Canada. Until you actually do, don't make assumptions about PQ and AQ. Encoders are not created equal. Obviously Netflix isn't as good as some BDs (not all BDs are created equal either and I know a couple of titles with screwed up encodes on disc that Netflix's streams exceed the quality of--the final two "Dragon Tatoo" films come to mind), but I suspect that its actual quality might surprise you.

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post #7117 of 7336 Old 03-11-2015, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post
I'm fairly certain that I've answered that question multiple times in this thread and during portions of the conversation that you were participating in. As a rule of thumb, you need to be able to sustain about 120% of the speed of a stream with Netflix's servers to keep a player's buffer full. 15600 Kbps video + 192 Kbps audio = 15792 Kbps * 1.2 = 18950.4 Kbps. Netflix suggests 25 Mbps service at a minimum.
Memory's failure; truly sorry about that. Thank you for your patience and understanding and compassion and time given and all the good info.

Quote:
I have no idea. To see the list in a Netflix player browser you have to run the Netflix app in a 3D TV or in a 3D-capable BD player or something connected to a 3D TV; in other words, Netflix in a set-up which can play 3D video. (The same is true of 4K; you can only see the "Ultra HD 4K" genre in the player browser on a 4K TV or, presumably, Netflix on a 4K capable STB connected to a 4K TV). I do not now nor have I ever owned a 3D TV and have no interest in glasses-based 3D video at home or in theaters.

I had the idea that Netflix pretty much dropped development of 3D a year or two back, though they probably won't remove the existing titles. I could be wrong and they're continuing to add new 3D titles.
I asked because I think in Canada we have zero. ...You guys are on a different Netflix than Canadians; yours is more advanced with more and better TV watching selections.
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post #7118 of 7336 Old 03-11-2015, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post
Life is way too frickin' short for me to keep hopping up changing discs. I haven't bought anything on disc other than very rarely a video game for some years now. Maybe once or twice a year I watch something that I own on disc. Otherwise I stream, download or watch/record on cable all the video and audio that I consume. I purchase almost all of the video games that I play as downloads (I've had an Xbox One for a year and a half and only recently bought a game on disc for it--Rocksmith 2014--and only because it was a tremendous deal. Being the only XB1 game disc that I own it lives in the console's drive. If the DD of it goes on a big sale I'll probably double dip and dump the disc).

I just hope that they keep making discs for you connoisseurs. BDs have never achieved the volume of sales that DVDs did; 4K discs will no doubt be less popular still as the popularity of streaming rises. Streaming video got good enough for Joe and Jane Average years ago; they rent DVDs when they rent them because Red Box is cheaper than renting streams.

Have you ever seen higher bit rate 1080p or 4K Netflix or heard its audio, NorthSky? Obviously not VUDU or any of the others in Canada. Until you actually do, don't make assumptions about PQ and AQ. Encoders are not created equal. Obviously Netflix isn't as good as some BDs (not all BDs are created equal either and I know a couple of titles with screwed up encodes on disc that Netflix's streams exceed the quality of--the final two "Dragon Tatoo" films come to mind), but I suspect that its actual quality might surprise you.
Do you have your own private chauffeur and grocery shopper like I do?
Do you take walks up the mountains and around the lakes with your dogs?
Do you go fishing with your canoe on the ocean?

I don't know about you but Blu-ray movies in 3D and DTS-HD 7.1 sound and look pretty pretty good to me. ...Multichannel discrete hi-res audio man.
...Need to get one of those.

May I ask you; what makes you assume that I was assuming, because I am simply asking and discovering as we all go along in this life together for a better healthier and cleaner planet. This is in all honesty. Many people they don't like my Blu-rays; they say it's to expensive it's a waste of time and effort. Plus it creates future plastic garbage, which they are 100% right, and they make me reflect deep into myself and in the way I watched my movies @ home.
In that sense you are way ahead, and doing good for the planet and all the people around you; and that, I am fully aware of, chapeau!
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post #7119 of 7336 Old 03-11-2015, 07:54 PM
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I too prefer streaming over disc's but I always go back to disc's when the streaming services pull the crap of expiring getting rid of content. This happens mostly with movies though.

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post #7120 of 7336 Old 03-11-2015, 09:00 PM
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Despite the fact that streaming continues to improve in terms of PQ and AQ, in most cases it still doesn't compete with Blu-Ray. I happen to enjoy both and the fact that I can watch an HD quality movie, anytime I want on-line, is a big plus.

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post #7121 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 05:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mailiang View Post
Despite the fact that streaming continues to improve in terms of PQ and AQ, in most cases it still doesn't compete with Blu-Ray. I happen to enjoy both and the fact that I can watch an HD quality movie, anytime I want on-line, is a big plus.

Ian
I could live with existing PQ from 1080p streams as they are pretty good. The biggest complain I have is the AQ. The AQ from Netflix and the like can't even come close to a BD.
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post #7122 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by metalsaber View Post
I could live with existing PQ from 1080p streams as they are pretty good. The biggest complain I have is the AQ. The AQ from Netflix and the like can't even come close to a BD.
If you have a quality system that can take advantage of lossless audio's higher bandwidth, for many titles, especially those with a lot of action content, there is no contest.

Ian
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post #7123 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post
The audio bit rate is also trivial; 192 Kbps for 5.1 sound, 96 Kbps for stereo (embedded; 64 Kbps for stereo sound in the PC players). The crappiest video bitrate is 235 Kbps, the best being 5800 Kbps (8000- to 15600 Kbps for 4K).
Plus the encoding gets inconsistent as to volume. Usually with Netflix on my AVR a -19.0 DB works for most titles (keep in mine that number is relative to my Yamaha receiver and another number relevant on my old Pioneer). Dolby did create a way to keep consistency between titles but as far as I know it was just a feature for TV broadcast encoders and at that many engineers (or operators since TV doesn't even use licensed engineers anymore) didn't even know it was available.

I've also seen a reference to an free encoder plugin for podcasts that does the same thing as those can have varying levels too. Then we have YouTube whose engineers really need to implement something like that.
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post #7124 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 01:10 PM
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I have been following this thread for the most part and sorry if I missed it. I routinely streamed Example short 23.976 to check my system and now I cannot find it in Netflix anymore. Did they rename it or remove it temporarily? If anyone here knows please let me know. Thanks
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post #7125 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 01:23 PM
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I have been following this thread for the most part and sorry if I missed it. I routinely streamed Example short 23.976 to check my system and now I cannot find it in Netflix anymore. Did they rename it or remove it temporarily? If anyone here knows please let me know. Thanks
Still there in the US at least, 33 different versions in fact. Just search "Example Short".
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post #7126 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 01:27 PM
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Hi mdavej, Thanks for that. I did that yesterday and I came up empty. As soon as I was at 'exam..' it said no matches. The last time I remember there were a lot of files with varying times. I checked the US Netflix. Something must be odd in my system and I don't know what. I checked using my panasonic bdt220 and PS3. Will try again today.
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post #7127 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 01:38 PM
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Try it from InstantWatcher.com. You can search and add to your queue from there.
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post #7128 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 01:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vishwa Somayaji View Post
I have been following this thread for the most part and sorry if I missed it. I routinely streamed Example short 23.976 to check my system and now I cannot find it in Netflix anymore. Did they rename it or remove it temporarily? If anyone here knows please let me know. Thanks

http://www.netflix.com/WiPlayer?movieid=70136810 ; still works fine for me. These days I mostly use "El Fuente: 60 MP10", a colorful travelog of Mexico with similar bit rate/resolution information printed on its constituent video encodes; "El Fuente" includes 4K encodes which "Example Short" does not.

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post #7129 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 01:43 PM
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Try it from InstantWatcher.com. You can search and add to your queue from there.
Thanks. I will try it tonight.
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post #7130 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Vishwa Somayaji View Post
Hi mdavej, Thanks for that. I did that yesterday and I came up empty. As soon as I was at 'exam..' it said no matches. The last time I remember there were a lot of files with varying times. I checked the US Netflix. Something must be odd in my system and I don't know what. I checked using my panasonic bdt220 and PS3. Will try again today.
http://www.netflix.com/search/example

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post #7131 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 01:45 PM
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Thanks, Michael. Every other month I usually run it to know how things are--how quickly it ramps up and whether it stays at 5800Kbps, etc. I think I ran it a month ago but last two days it just doesn't show up. Thanks for the other tip on the Mexico travelog.
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post #7132 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 01:46 PM
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Thanks. Will do tonight.
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post #7133 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 02:49 PM
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Quote:
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I have been following this thread for the most part and sorry if I missed it. I routinely streamed Example short 23.976 to check my system and now I cannot find it in Netflix anymore. Did they rename it or remove it temporarily? If anyone here knows please let me know. Thanks

This is my go to: Test Pattern: Downscaling 2997fps 10Min

Rob

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post #7134 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 02:51 PM
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This is my go to: Test Pattern: Downscaling 2997fps 10Min

Rob

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I have never tried that but will give it a try tonight. My go to so far has been the example short 23.976--there are several and I choose the shortest one.
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post #7135 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 03:07 PM
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I have never tried that but will give it a try tonight. My go to so far has been the example short 23.976--there are several and I choose the shortest one.
You may like the simplicity and features of Test Pattern: Downscaling 2997fps 10Min it is now the only one I use since I found it. I believe all my Roku 2XS is capable of streaming is 30fps.

Rob

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post #7136 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 03:09 PM
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Must be a hidden treasure--at least hidden from me.
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post #7137 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 04:27 PM
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Must be a hidden treasure--at least hidden from me.
Just copy Test Pattern: Downscaling 2997fps 10Min then paste it in the Netflix search.

Rob

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post #7138 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 05:21 PM
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Just copy Test Pattern: Downscaling 2997fps 10Min then paste it in the Netflix search.

Rob

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Hi Rob,
The test pattern you suggested is way better than the example short I was using. Many thanks to you. This will be my go to pattern from now on.
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post #7139 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 08:09 PM
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What is it that you guys prefer about that to the video tests? I always found it to be too annoying to use.

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post #7140 of 7336 Old 03-12-2015, 08:57 PM
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What is it that you guys prefer about that to the video tests? I always found it to be too annoying to use.
The audio and flashing reminds me of an emergency test signal.

This is a test of the Netflix emergency network. If this was a real emergency, you would be asked to switch from streaming to your local TV broadcast channel.


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