Sony 4k wins this one. - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 09:21 AM - Thread Starter
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AMC opens it first all digital multiplex, no DLPs.
Click here to see what $13 buys you.
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post #2 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 09:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Gouger View Post

AMC opens it first all digital multiplex, no DLPs.
Click here to see what $13 buys you.

From the article:

"So why would someone choose to go to AMC Yonge & Dundas instead of the Paramount? we asked DiOrio. He rhymed off the digital projection, the six-dollar morning movies, and the cheaper concessions. This last point is true. It is possible to purchase, in small quantities, popcorn, drinks, and candies for $3 each, or three for $7.50. It's not a lot of food at all, but for people for whom popcorn is part of the ritual, rather than simply an oily substitute for a real meal, it might be a dealbreaker."


We were in Toronto in 2000 and went to the Paramount. Really nice theater!!!@@@


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post #3 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 09:45 AM
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Well, the fact that the Sony was chosen says something. I wonder if they felt that the this left them aittle more future proof or what ? The reviewer seemed rather negative about the whole project in this article.

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post #4 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post

The reviewer seemed rather negative about the whole project in this article.

Art

Wow! I'll say he was down right miserable I thought. Sounds and looks like a nice theater from the pic shown.

Cheers
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post #5 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 09:59 AM
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I heard that AMC had a huge credit with Sony over the SDDS disaster. They are getting these 4k projectors for free plus Sony is using marketing dollars to brand these sites almost like Sony stores with the Sony name plastered everywhere.
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post #6 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 10:20 AM
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My only experience with the Sony 4K was at CEDIA. There, it was sharp but had horrendous uniformity issues and in motion the image seemed to have trouble catching up to itself.

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post #7 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin Bright View Post

I heard that AMC had a huge credit with Sony over the SDDS disaster. They are getting these 4k projectors for free plus Sony is using marketing dollars to brand these sites almost like Sony stores with the Sony name plastered everywhere.

thats the way sony did at the moment to BUY the market but even with that it will be hard for sony to get build market share.

sad as i already post because ti will not go sonn to 4k and not spend
much money to research and development because they save this cost because there is no need.
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post #8 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 11:11 AM
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Wolfgang,
Has it been your experience that the issues I saw regarding the Sony 4K unit have been solved ?

Art

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post #9 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 12:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post

Wolfgang,
Has it been your experience that the issues I saw regarding the Sony 4K unit have been solved ?

Art

art
yes i guess most of them.
they have now convergence shift.
i dont know about shading that is may still a issue.

the new 18000 lumen 220 is very very new so no one at the moment knows
how this pr. will perform in 6 months from now or in 3 years when use them 8 hours a day and cinemas
like a pr. that runns some years without any problem.

with all the bad experience from early 105 and 110 units it is no
surprise that cinema owners not take the risk when you have
a dlp system that have prove to be reliable.

the tread shoud be.

sony 4k BUY this one
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post #10 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 12:43 PM
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'Very Very New';-). It was scheduled for availability late 2005, then finally shown at Showest late 2006, so very very new;-).

The DLP guys have also been in the habit of buying their way into theaters, and various key demoprojects (UK Film Council for instance) for a number of years, with loaners, demomachines, barters, crossmarketing and little margin seeding quantities. Compare the listprice for the HD8K 65K euro plus lens, plus VAT, that used to buy people a Christie D-Cinema projector at twice (or more?) the lumens.
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post #11 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 02:04 PM
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I am looking forward to the first true 4k movie shown in 4k. Will there be a 4k movie in 2008? The writer of the article must be an ex film projectionist.

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post #12 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohlson View Post

Will there be a 4k movie in 2008?

may one or two but question is where
japan ?
us ?
europe ?
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post #13 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 02:34 PM
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How do you feel about higher fps and digital cinema. In the DCI specs as they stand I think 24p and 48fp is allowed for.

With real 4k@48-60fps there will be a difference in 4k. The faster exposure times will allow for better use of the resolution potential.

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post #14 of 97 Old 03-30-2008, 03:58 PM
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i like to have more than 24 frame a secound.
48 should be nice but 60 should be the target.
till 48 all todays cinema dlps can do "cinema prozessing" over that they can do
just the normally prozessing.

there will be some new hd consumer video camera that will record
with 60 frames a secound.
may the first will be there by end 08.

good thing is that most 1920x1080 pr. can take and display such signal.
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post #15 of 97 Old 04-04-2008, 09:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohlson View Post

I am looking forward to the first true 4k movie shown in 4k. Will there be a 4k movie in 2008? The writer of the article must be an ex film projectionist.

The D-cinema spec is at 2K, but a lot of post work is being done at 4K now to be ready for HD presentation, and has been for several years on major productions, from what I've been told. No worries, though. Let's hope these hold up reasonably well under extended use.

Oh, yeah, the D-cinema spec is available online without too much of a hassle if anyone cares to read it.

http://www.dcimovies.com/specification/index.tt2

...like the author of the article Alan referenced.

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post #16 of 97 Old 04-21-2008, 03:58 PM
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Would a 4K PJ have and advantage in playback over a 2K projector with a 1080P24 source???

When PJs went from 720P to 1080P, the 480i DVD picture improved.

Yes? No?

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post #17 of 97 Old 04-21-2008, 04:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

Would a 4K PJ have and advantage in playback over a 2K projector with a 1080P24 source???

When PJs went from 720P to 1080P, the 480i DVD picture improved.

Yes? No?

Yes, all else being equal along with great scaling of HDto 4K. All assumptions that are yet to be answered.

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post #18 of 97 Old 04-24-2008, 11:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

Would a 4K PJ have and advantage in playback over a 2K projector with a 1080P24 source???

When PJs went from 720P to 1080P, the 480i DVD picture improved.

Yes? No?

Yes. It improved for the sets with larger screens but probably not for 20" sets. Same will apply to 2K -> 4K transition. The smaller displays may not gain much. For this case, "smaller" could be large. I am not sure what would be the break point in inches.

There is a limit to the screen size of home theaters typically restricted by the real estate dimensions. Therefore, the gain from 2K to 4K could be marginal even for a large screen that would fit a typical suburban house.
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post #19 of 97 Old 04-25-2008, 12:09 AM
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it depends what we are talking about. a 4k that is of good quality vs a 2k that is a true DCI machine... i will take the 2 k thanks.

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post #20 of 97 Old 04-25-2008, 05:20 AM
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I'm going to assume that some of the 4K issues have been or are going to be ironed out,eg uniformity,panel alignment, poor ANSI etc.

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post #21 of 97 Old 04-25-2008, 08:16 AM
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those are merely implementation/product issues. all will be resolved over time.

Point being made is that scaling was a huge difference in the NTSC realm. the advantages get less with higher sources. and most importantly, we are not even CLOSE to seeing what 2k can be. so in 10 years time or so, once we are getting all we can out of the sources, and projectors are able to really take advantage of it all, then the scaling may have also advanced to a point where we will consistently realize a big advantage.

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post #22 of 97 Old 04-25-2008, 09:12 AM
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Goood enough, though, is never good enough... particularly at this place.

My Home Theater of the Month- Le Petit Trianon

There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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post #23 of 97 Old 04-25-2008, 09:34 AM
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I saw the Red camera demo at NAB last week which had 4k native from the Red One camera being projected by a Sony 4k projector onto a ~15' Stewart screen sitting about 12' away. It looked amazing. Overkill for home theater? Unless you've got a really big room, probably. Then they showed clips from Soderbergh's 'Guerilla' about Che Guevera where he used a Red, but was taking an 2.4:1 extract from the center of the sensor, not using the entire 4k. Still looked amazing.

I admit this was a best case scenario 'show off' situation, but the capability is there. The implimentation...???
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post #24 of 97 Old 04-25-2008, 09:47 AM
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4K is the next evolution for enthusiasts no doubt.

My Home Theater of the Month- Le Petit Trianon

There are more than a handful of [op amps] that sound so good that most designers want to be using them as opposed to discreet transistors. Dave Reich, Theta 2009
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There is a limit to the advantage of increasing the resolution for home theaters as well as commercial theaters. Of course the numbers would be different since screen sizes are different. Interesting to find out these limits. Large corporations such as Sony must have done human factors research on this.
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post #26 of 97 Old 04-26-2008, 07:17 AM
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Well ,no doubt 4K allows closer seating but , after that SXRD has little over DLP and a few shortcomings in fact.

All things being equal,as I said, I'd take 4K. Has there been any talk of the scalers taking HD up to 4K ?

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post #27 of 97 Old 04-26-2008, 07:42 AM - Thread Starter
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I read somewhere the "Vantage" offered an output mode for 4k which caught my eye so I started reading on it and found it could not output 24 from 1080i until a few months ago. That lost all interest for me.
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post #28 of 97 Old 05-01-2008, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Art Sonneborn View Post

Yes, all else being equal along with great scaling of HDto 4K. All assumptions that are yet to be answered.

Art

And they will be, sooner than later

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post #29 of 97 Old 05-02-2008, 06:00 AM
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James Cameron spoke enthusiastically about 48fps in 3D which he had experimented with. Then probably at 2k I guess.

Are Sony 4k projectors now capable of 48-60fps. I could live with that since I am skeptical of 3D presentations. I am not sure I want 3D for every movie.

Call me old fashioned but 4k@60fps would do me just fine. Over at the film-tech forum it is said Sony is persuing 8k and beyond so I guess enthusiast can make do with just 4k at home in the future.

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post #30 of 97 Old 05-02-2008, 06:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohlson View Post

James Cameron spoke enthusiastically about 48fps in 3D which he had experimented with. Then probably at 2k I guess.

Are Sony 4k projectors now capable of 48-60fps. I could live with that since I am skeptical of 3D presentations. I am not sure I want 3D for every movie.

Call me old fashioned but 4k@60fps would do me just fine. Over at the film-tech forum it is said Sony is persuing 8k and beyond so I guess enthusiast can make do with just 4k at home in the future.

Yep - start saving your pennies now

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