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post #31 of 73 Old 10-21-2011, 07:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Frohlich View Post

While this is intriguing, I just can't see this format gaining any kind of acceptance in the home market. We are all junkies on this forum but who has the time, money and room to support 11.1? I know it just wouldn't be feasible in my HT room, too complicated to wire everything up for beginners.

Hi Frohlich,

I stumbled on this forum some time ago when I found out our projectors were used in the HT market. This surprised me quite a lot. Not because they are expensive, they are not , but because they are so big and noisy. But I guess when it comes to quality some people wont make compromises. I have seem much more ridiculous things happening in this HT market. Just the cable industry with its snake oil products kills me. Some will spend more on the cables than the actual gear... I do not intend to open a can of worm here. I do agree that cable quality dramatically varies and is very important. There just comes a point where you exceed in price what the real value is. I think you end-up paying for "bragging rights".

So this being said, nothing surprises me anymore. And believe me, in my old life I did have customers fortunate enough to be able to afford the room and the gear. Isnt that section titled Ulta-Hi End HT Gear (20,000+) ?

Marc Porlier

As of Jan 2012 I no longer work for Barco. So my comments do not represent the views of my former employer but only my own.

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post #32 of 73 Old 10-21-2011, 07:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mporlier View Post

Hi Frohlich,

I stumbled on this forum some time ago when I found out our projectors were used in the HT market. This surprised me quite a lot. Not because they are expensive, they are not , but because they are so big and noisy. But I guess when it comes to quality some people wont make compromises. I have seem much more ridiculous things happening in this HT market. Just the cable industry with its snake oil products kills me. Some will spend more on the cables than the actual gear... I do not intend to open a can of worm here. I do agree that cable quality dramatically varies and is very important. There just comes a point where you exceed in price what the real value is. I think you end-up paying for "bragging rights".

So this being said, nothing surprises me anymore. And believe me, in my old life I did have customers fortunate enough to be able to afford the room and the gear. Isnt that section titled Ulta-Hi End HT Gear (20,000+) ?

Marc, my apologies as my comments weren't meant as any kind of disrespect towards your company and this new sound format. This is just my initial reaction/opinion. I am not saying there wouldn't be any kind of home market acceptance but my gut would say if this ever gains acceptance in the home market, it would be the very high end. Folks with a dedicated room and passion/money to make it happen. Good luck with your new endeavour and I do wish you luck.
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post #33 of 73 Old 10-21-2011, 07:15 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frohlich View Post

Marc, my apologies as my comments weren't meant as any kind of disrespect towards your company and this new sound format. This is just my initial reaction/opinion. I am not saying there wouldn't be any kind of home market acceptance but my gut would say if this ever gains acceptance in the home market, it would be the very high end. Folks with a dedicated room and passion/money to make it happen. Good luck with your new endeavour and I do wish you luck.

Absolutely no offence taken Frohlich! The purpose of a forum is open discussion without judgement. I welcome any comments or criticism, this is what makes things better in the end!

We are not trying to push this in the HT maket, as we were not pushing our Digital Cinema projectors either. But some crazy guys, no offence Cineramark , have done really creative stuff. Although I do represent a company and I must be careful what I say, I am a technology loving guy trying to always think outside the box. Auro 3D would be a good example. This product wont be on the market until spring and if I were to put a market share estimate I would say digital cinema would get 1000 units per 1 for HT.

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post #34 of 73 Old 10-21-2011, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frohlich View Post

While this is intriguing, I just can't see this format gaining any kind of acceptance in the home market. We are all junkies on this forum but who has the time, money and room to support 11.1? I know it just wouldn't be feasible in my HT room, too complicated to wire everything up for beginners.

While Auro Technologies 'recommends' 11.1 (and even 12.1|13.1) configurations for theatrical release, they seem to focus on 9.1|10.1 for Home Theater. We'll have to wait to see whether the BD from a movie like 'Red Tails' (11.1 in theatrical release) might carry the [full] 11.1 channel Auro-3D encode from the theatrical release, or perhaps [just] a 9.1|10.1 channel 'home' remix . . . and the quality of a [post decode] channel count downmix, to some lesser HT speaker config (say 5.1_Standard+2xFrontHeight, or "better",) would seem to be an already standard function for the AVR to manage.



Samsung already builds one HTIB system with four "snap together" 'Tallboy' speaker towers . . . and appears currently engaged in researching an expanded 10.2 channel configuration that includes three height channels|speakers.



LG demonstrated a similar appearance HTIB system at CES 2011 that combines corresponding Middle-Layer and (vertical firing!) Top-Layer speakers in four 'one corner of the room' units.



Plus, with the ever increasing size of direct view (i.e., NON Acoustically Transparent) displays, there is already on-going research regarding delivering [all] Lower-, Middle-, and Top-Layer Center channel playback through an array of "small" speakers located around the edge of the display (one hopes Bass Redirection is being considered carefully!)

[So I guess I see less of a problem with consumer acceptance for home Auro-3D speaker configurations than do you...?! ]

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post #35 of 73 Old 10-21-2011, 09:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mporlier View Post

Will will be showing musical event next week and it is fabulous. Once you know who is behind this product you will understand he is a no compromise person. HEre is who stated it all: Wilfried Van Baelen

Is this going to be at Showeast? I was going to go by and check out your booth till I saw the registration fee is $325. Oh well.

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post #36 of 73 Old 10-22-2011, 04:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes the demo is Tuesday morning at Show East but it's invitation only...

Marc Porlier

As of Jan 2012 I no longer work for Barco. So my comments do not represent the views of my former employer but only my own.

Sincerely
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post #37 of 73 Old 10-22-2011, 06:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post

Is this going to be at Showeast? I was going to go by and check out your booth till I saw the registration fee is $325. Oh well.

shoot me an email, I can get you in to the trade show.I think, will know when I get back from London Dual Teranex Multizone commissioning adventure,Monday.
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post #38 of 73 Old 10-23-2011, 02:37 PM
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It is still missing 11 channels, but hey the imaging is merely one quarter of SHV/UHDTV, as well, so...;-). Peter have you checked out JVC's compact Super Hi-Vision projector, yet? At IBC I was told it could become available, with the caveat that the sections are made by several parts of the JVC Kenwood conglomerate.
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post #39 of 73 Old 10-24-2011, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by donaldk View Post

It is still missing 11 channels, but hey the imaging is merely one quarter of SHV/UHDTV, as well,[. . .]

Notwithstanding the accuracy of your statement, I would still prefer to "think of the glass as 11.1 / 22.2 full, rather than as half empty"...?!

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post #40 of 73 Old 10-27-2011, 07:39 AM
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Hi Marc, I thoroughly enjoyed the presentation on Tuesday, way better sounding system (An AMC Premium Xperience venue)than the system at the RED event that officially did not happen, or at least I did not officially attend.

It is great that you guys are using the datasat platform, because that leaves the door open to the possibility of a super high end unit based on the rsi-20.








Those audio presentations were awesome, way better than the new harman sound, but of course not fair to compare as these were encoded.

Definetely worth considering an even higher end version for Bel Air type clients.
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post #41 of 73 Old 10-27-2011, 08:05 AM
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post #42 of 73 Old 10-27-2011, 08:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mporlier View Post

Will will be showing musical event next week and it is fabulous. Once you know who is behind this product you will understand he is a no compromise person. HEre is who stated it all: Wilfried Van Baelen

Clips from an Church organ and an Orchestra captured in11.1 were shown. It was unbelievable!

Marc Porlier

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post #43 of 73 Old 10-29-2011, 09:31 AM
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I am sorry I missed this. I was heading over to the show when I spilled some chemical on my jeans. I didn't have enough time to go home and come back. Oh well, thanks for the pass Peter.

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post #44 of 73 Old 10-29-2011, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mporlier View Post

Clips from an Church organ and an Orchestra captured in 11.1 were shown. It was unbelievable!

And yet I am quite willing to believe you when you say so!

Nonetheless...
For a variety of reasons--including that I have already watched|enjoyed the 1995 PBS TV movie, "The Tuskegee Airmen"--I am more motivated [to wait] to see "Red Tails" with 11.1 channel audio (rather than 5.1) . . . which begs the question of where on the west coast there might soon be an Auro-3D capable theater, other than the already announced Regal Cinemas (Los Angeles, US) location?!

And somewhat more related to HT: After reading some of the strange beliefs "average" consumers reveal after they buy a 3D [video] Blu-ray Disk, I can't help wondering if unsophisticated consumers who watch|hear "Red Tails" in an Auro-3D capable movie theater might not develop 'unrealistic expectations' for the audio experience they will get from the (announced for 2012) 20th Century Fox BD release?!

Which in turn raises the issue of if|when we are likely to see Auro-3D encoded BDs released . . . and the matching hardware|software decoders too, of course!

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post #45 of 73 Old 10-29-2011, 12:17 PM - Thread Starter
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I will try and keep track of the installed theatres. I will probably post a link.

Marc Porlier

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post #46 of 73 Old 10-31-2011, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by mporlier View Post

I will try and keep track of the installed theatres. I will probably post a link.

Thanks Marc! Info on the location of Auro-3D capable theaters will be much appreciated.

I wonder if you might know . . . and are permitted to say?!

Based on the Barco+Auro Technologies literature asserting 'easy integration with existing hardware', I'm assuming that a likely 'Auro-3D upgrade' for a theater with an existing 7.1 channel configuration would be to install additional amps|speakers sufficient to playback either six new height channels--giving the theater an Auro-3D 12(7).1 configuration--or seven new height channels--giving the theater an Auro-3D 13(7).1 configuration. [Hope I got the nomenclature correct! ]

If a movie that carries an Auro-3D 11.1 channel soundtrack (e.g., "Red Tails") plays in a 12(6|7).1 or 13(6|7).1 capable theater, does the Auromatic Upmixer 'fill in' the extra 2 or 3 audio channels after the 11.1 soundtrack is decoded? And if so, can the theater then advertise the movie as having a 13.1 channel soundtrack?

[This would appear to be relevant to both the theatrical and HT presentation of movies: It seems possible that a movie like "The Bridges Of Madison County" (which contains little or no air-to-air combat scenes!) might play 'better' without 3D audio upmixing . . . but continue to benefit from leaving intact any 6.1|7.1 configuration of the theater 'in place before the Auro-3D upgrade'...?! ]

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post #47 of 73 Old 10-31-2011, 08:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundChex View Post

Based on the Barco+Auro Technologies literature asserting 'easy integration with existing hardware', I'm assuming that a likely 'Auro-3D upgrade' for a theater with an existing 7.1 channel configuration would be to install additional amps|speakers sufficient to playback either six new height channels--giving the theater an Auro-3D 12(7).1 configuration--or seven new height channels--giving the theater an Auro-3D 13(7).1 configuration. [Hope I got the nomenclature correct! ]

You are technicaly correct on all points. The audio processor does not require changes to existing setup (unless ther realy are crappy).

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundChex View Post

If a movie that carries an Auro-3D 11.1 channel soundtrack (e.g., "Red Tails") plays in a 12(6|7).1 or 13(6|7).1 capable theater, does the Auromatic Upmixer 'fill in' the extra 2 or 3 audio channels after the 11.1 soundtrack is decoded? And if so, can the theater then advertise the movie as having a 13.1 channel soundtrack?

Yes, the upmixer will make good use of the extra channels available. The theatre owners will most certainly advertise their screens as "equiped with 11.1 Auro 3D" but they will not advertise the movies as such.

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post #48 of 73 Old 10-31-2011, 08:52 PM
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Marc,
Did you find out which theater in Miami has the Auro?

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post #49 of 73 Old 10-31-2011, 08:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post

Marc,
Did you find out which theater in Miami has the Auro?

AMC Aventura screen 17.

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post #50 of 73 Old 10-31-2011, 08:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mporlier View Post


AMC Aventura screen 17.

But the projector is NOT a Barco!!! The image was... Well I can't say it. It would not be professional of me.

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post #51 of 73 Old 10-31-2011, 09:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mporlier View Post

But the projector is NOT a Barco!!! The image was... Well I can't say it. It would not be professional of me.

I am guessing that is the ETX screen. It isn't my favorite theater, but I will give it a try as it is close by.

If that is the IMAX screen, then I was unimpressed when I saw Star Trek on it.

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post #52 of 73 Old 10-31-2011, 09:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Ericglo View Post


I am guessing that is the ETX screen. It isn't my favorite theater, but I will give it a try as it is close by.

If that is the IMAX screen, then I was unimpressed when I saw Star Trek on it.

It is not the IMAX screen.

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post #53 of 73 Old 10-31-2011, 09:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mporlier View Post

It is not the IMAX screen.

It looks like the ETX screen is not the IMAX screen. I am not that interested in In Time, but I may go check it out for this.

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post #54 of 73 Old 11-04-2011, 09:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Initial Auro 3D installations can be found here:


Miami AMC theaters Aventura 24
Regal Edwards Stadium cinemas Calabasas, CA
Cinemark Plano North, (Dallas, TX)

Non USA

Kinepolis Antwerp, Belgium
Jam Hall Cinemas, St Petersburg Russia
Wangfujing Cinemas, Chengdu, China


More to come!

Marc

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post #55 of 73 Old 12-05-2011, 05:15 PM
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This article looks to be a reprint of a BARCO and|or Doremi press release. It says:
Quote:


"Leading exhibitors on three continents have already successfully installed Auro-3D®, bringing the Auro-3D® install base into the double digits."



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post #56 of 73 Old 12-09-2011, 08:05 AM
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(Link to an) Auro-3D "explanation and demonstration" video (6 minutes) from BARCO|Auro Technologies. This looks to be intended to run in Auro-3D 11.1 channel audio equipped movie theaters before the feature film.

Edit: Here it is on YouTube:



Background material:
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The Cinema Technology Magazine December 2011 issue includes a fairly comprehensive survey|summary article ('promo') Auro-3D, A new dimension in cinema sound (magazine pages 26-31, pdf pages 17-22), with some reference to possible future home BD products.

A Dolby authored article that 'follows' (magazine page 32, pdf page 23) makes several points about the difficulties of including height channels|speakers in a theatrical environment . . . some of which might be less important in a home theater environment.


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post #57 of 73 Old 12-10-2011, 09:30 PM
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interesting...hopefully they dont charge extra for those theaters

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #58 of 73 Old 12-11-2011, 05:44 PM
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Kinepolis Antwerp has it on Screen 11, but doesn't expect any features mixed in 11.1 till into the next year possibly even as late as February, at least that's what they told some-one over at the Dutch forum, when he contacted them.
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post #59 of 73 Old 01-27-2012, 10:07 PM
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To give some background, I work in the movie industry and first heard 10.2 audio at Tom Holman's USC lab some time around 1997, so I was pretty excited about hearing an 11.1 mix.

Anyway last Sunday I watched Red Tails in Auro 3D 11.1 at the Edwards movie theater in Calabasas CA (USA).

First off there is zero advertising of the Auro sound system anywhere in the theater, I asked the ticket checker and he said that they have had new speakers installed, which was encouraging. Inside the auditorium the new speakers are obvious with additional height surround speakers and ceiling speakers.

So the trailers start and the sound is extremely good with impressive LFE especially the Battleship trailer.

No Auro 3D 11.1 trailer played before the feature, so the average movie goer has no idea about the sound system.

Now the sad part, Red Tails starts and around 30s in the sound mutes and when it comes back there is no deep bass or LFE that I can hear. Could someone who has seen Red Tails in a conventional movie theater comment about the quality of the audio.

Yes I heard some height info but I am not sure what I heard after the mute so want to reserve judgment.

AMC ETX
On a related note the AMC ETX screens (4K Digital) have a 13 channel QSC audio system installed, no height channel on the surrounds but there are ceiling speakers. Audio quality is extremely high, better than the Auro 3D screen I heard (before the sub cut out).
You pay extra for the ETX screen so you darned well know it's "special" and they play an ETX trailer with a mixing console adjusting the audio channels on an Indiana Jones "style" movie.

I will give the Auro 3D fitted Edwards another chance.
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post #60 of 73 Old 01-31-2012, 10:36 AM
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Thanks for the feedback, Safari. I wanted to go see REd Tails at the Avenura theater, but haven't had a chance. I may be to late and you are correct that there is hardly any advertising of the special sound system.

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