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post #1 of 21 Old 02-26-2012, 11:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Was reading the daily news on Dcinema Today and found this article about 3d sound and had some info on this company

Has anyone heard of this company?
http://immsound.com/technology
http://www.dcinematoday.com/dc/pr.aspx?newsID=2694

Looks like an Aura 3D thing and is only installed in European theaters

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #2 of 21 Old 02-27-2012, 12:42 AM
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IMM uses an object-based audio delivery concept that obsoletes Auro 3D before it even gets going. Several other companies (including IOSONO) are working in this same object rendering direction, and it's expected that content creation will migrate that way, as it's totally compatible with current practice.

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post #3 of 21 Old 03-13-2012, 10:19 PM
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Yes I know something about it. Did you have an application or just interested in what it is?
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post #4 of 21 Old 03-27-2012, 07:07 PM
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Was at IMMs site the other day and was impressed. Dieing to hear either there's or Auras 3D sound

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post #5 of 21 Old 03-28-2012, 03:04 PM
 
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Its like the early 90's all over again with CDS then Dolby SR-D then dts then SDDS now Barco and others want to each jump on the bandwagon with 3D sound.

But what of below beneath or underneath surround? I'd like to hear one of the competitions 3D sound not that I care for 3D image.
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post #6 of 21 Old 03-28-2012, 10:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reddig View Post

Was at IMMs site the other day and was impressed. Dieing to hear either there's or Auras 3D sound

Heard the aura set up for redtails. Was pretty neat on some scenes...but largely underwhelming. Gotta give mixers some practice time!

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #7 of 21 Old 03-29-2012, 04:21 AM
 
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Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

Heard the aura set up for redtails. Was pretty neat on some scenes...but largely underwhelming. Gotta give mixers some practice time!

I haven’t seen the film and chances are its now left UK cinemas. Not that it matters as there is no Barco 11.1 set up in the UK as of yet.

I’d say the mix is in its infancy its still early days but what bothers me is the use of old Skywalker sound effects being thrown into the mix as I have heard it in the trailer and preview clips of Skywalkers lightsaber cutting into At-At from Empire Strikes Back as well as Raiders and its getting a bit old now.

I think 3D sound is only 3D if there is an underneath below surround channel! When walking back last night from down the road I heard in the stillness of the night water running underneath the ground or drain manhole on the pavement.

My attention was drawn downwards not upwards downwards so this 3D Barco Auro 11.1 is not really going to wow me enough unless there is a below surround channel and its very difficult as it has to cover a lot of seating in cinema and less so in the home.

Plus speakers would need daily cleaning from dust and dirt!

Sound is a very complex beast. Take rain. Where does it sound when raining when in town? It sounds on the ground thou the first rain drop will sound high up on building while we hear it milliseconds later on the ground or under bus shelter or umbrella?

Rain is one sound I have yet to listen to in the film that sounds convincing enough to believe. Depending on the scene rain can come from overhead but it depends on the location and scene. Not lets just throw some rain sound effects in. Its complicated in my opinion.

It never quiet sounds right even when playing over LCR when surround it sounds like its been HF filtered down a bit. Rain when it comes down its uniform. If it came down all at once in narrow spot right over the top of you, you would be crushed by the tons of water!
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post #8 of 21 Old 03-29-2012, 11:17 AM
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^^

Luckily for movies, accuracy is not a prerequisite to creating a convincing illusion.

Nevertheless, it would be fun to pop over to BBC's North Lab near Manchester to hear what they've conjured up with High Order Ambisonics.

If the surrounds sound dull in the rain, time to get better surrounds. Lose the dipoles.

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post #9 of 21 Old 03-29-2012, 12:01 PM
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SCALING NEW HEIGHTS IN BROADCASTING USING AMBISONICS, a paper by two BBC Researchers, talks about (live) concert recording using 100+ mikes, and evaluating 3D speaker layout preferences while listening to a custom recording of a radio play with height cues in a specially designed test room...

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However, regardless of the results, this seems like a difficult speaker configuration to replicate correctly for every seat in a movie theater!

So far as I know, only NHK's 22.2 speaker configuration for SHV (with three front lower layer speakers)--and some of the (very experimental) 7.1 speaker downmix configurations derived from the full 22.2 setup--make use of any lower layer speakers . . .

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. . . and though it seems NHK has experimented with 'below eye line' microphone placement for 'enhanced sound capture' at live sporting events, it would appear--from this TVBEUROPE article--that playback of those sounds is not intended to be limited to the lower layer speakers...?!


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post #10 of 21 Old 03-29-2012, 12:24 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

^^

Luckily for movies, accuracy is not a prerequisite to creating a convincing illusion.

Nevertheless, it would be fun to pop over to BBC's North Lab near Manchester to hear what they've conjured up with High Order Ambisonics.

If the surrounds sound dull in the rain, time to get better surrounds. Lose the dipoles.

umm, yes I have seen a video of their room and discussion even mentioned about below surround has been tried by others.

First time I heard the word Ambisonics mentioned to me, was 23 years ago during my projection training.

I don't use dipoles only monopoles and their good up too 20KHz and rain effects are narrowed way, way, down. Listening to Psycho 98' (1998) where Marion Crane is driving though the rain and arrives at Bate's Motel then steps out of the car running up to the office walks around inside the rain fades out okay as it should but it would have been better if it had been panned to surrounds as the door is now behind her, you know what mean?

When walking back towards the door the rain on one of the LCR doesn't sound right a little messed up, its still a good Dolby mix and would benefit from 7.1 and use the rear stereo backs as below surround and overhead and simply re-plug those channels and put a matrix EX on the stereo sidewall surrounds to send centre phantom to the back.

Quick easy and simple or maybe Dolby should have given encoding flags for the stereo rear back so some films will format them to ether rear stereo back or mono below surround and mono overhead at least the channels would be discrete.

As for the video link I've watched it some 3 to 4 times now over the last couple of years and its still interesting. watching it on in living room on AUX mode from the pc to AVR in format 60, Dolby Pro-logic.
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post #11 of 21 Old 03-29-2012, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cat-222ASR View Post

I don't use dipoles only monopoles and their good up too 20KHz and rain effects are narrowed way, way, down. Listening to Psycho 98' (1998) where Marion Crane is driving though the rain and arrives at Bate's Motel then steps out of the car running up to the office walks around inside the rain fades out okay as it should but it would have been better if it had been panned to surrounds as the door is now behind her, you know what mean?

Oh. We cannot expect our speakers to make up for a mix.

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post #12 of 21 Old 03-29-2012, 01:13 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler View Post

Oh. We cannot expect our speakers to make up for a mix.

Hi
I have good selection of mono films. I've got Futureworld (1976) on now I can watch it multiple times in one evening music mix is good Foley and effects as well as dialogue mix sound loud and clear to tell the story. Dolby Stereo would have been good at the time and use it creatively pan human dialogue across the LCR.

I read somewhere years ago that it costs more to make mono mix than Dolby Stereo mix, is there any truth to that?
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post #13 of 21 Old 04-07-2012, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

Heard the aura set up for redtails. Was pretty neat on some scenes...but largely underwhelming. Gotta give mixers some practice time!

That was my thought too . . . plus it's probably safer at this point in the product life cycle to add height cues 'with a lighter touch'...?!

As I am NOT in the movie business, I found this "product promotional video" about the Auro-3D Workflow process very interesting. (I guess that competing 3D sound mix products have all developed 'comparable but different' solutions to deliver their own final products...?!)


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post #14 of 21 Old 04-07-2012, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundChex View Post

I found this "product promotional video" about the Auro-3D Workflow process very interesting. (I guess that competing 3D sound mix products have all developed 'comparable but different' solutions to deliver their own final products...?!)

Thanks for that. Nice info.

Yes, there are several such systems being proposed (NHK 22.2, Auro3D, DTS, Dolby, IMM), but even though they all have their own production tools and playback hardware, we will see a convergence onto a single production solution within the confines of the dubbing stage. Studios will support playback on any of these systems as long as they do not have to make a half dozen versions of their soundtrack mix.

Turns out it is rather straightforward to feed all of these systems from a single 3D object-based mix, so I would not expect any delay of industry adoption as we tend to find in consumer format wars. Much the same idea as when 35mm digital audio was adopted. Any of the formats, Dolby, DTS, SDDS, could deliver exactly the same 5.1 mix even though the codecs and playback hardware were all proprietary.

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post #15 of 21 Old 04-08-2012, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roger dressler View Post

yes, there are several such systems being proposed (nhk 22.2, auro3d, dts, dolby, imm), but even though they all have their own production tools and playback hardware, we will see a convergence onto a single production solution within the confines of the dubbing stage. studios will support playback on any of these systems as long as they do not have to make a half dozen versions of their soundtrack mix.

Turns out it is rather straightforward to feed all of these systems from a single 3d object-based mix, so i would not expect any delay of industry adoption as we tend to find in consumer format wars. Much the same idea as when 35mm digital audio was adopted. Any of the formats, dolby, dts, sdds, could deliver exactly the same 5.1 mix even though the codecs and playback hardware were all proprietary.

+1
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post #16 of 21 Old 04-08-2012, 09:59 PM - Thread Starter
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Any of you guys see red tails in the auro set up? What did you guys think?

No subwoofer I've heard has been able to produce the bass I've experienced in the Corps!

Must..stop...buying...every bluray release...
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post #17 of 21 Old 04-09-2012, 06:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

Heard the aura set up for redtails. Was pretty neat on some scenes...but largely underwhelming. Gotta give mixers some practice time!

Nice ya no doubt.

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post #18 of 21 Old 06-16-2013, 11:08 AM
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Can anyone tell me if it's possible/logical to combine the following:

Immsound '3D sound system' consisting of up to 24 separate channels of sound from speakers located behind the screen and around the cinema and 5 individual channels in the ceiling,

and a Dolby Cinema Processor CP750, which is designed for the 7.1 set-up, with a main eight-channel audio output.


Is it still possible to get the best out of the 3D system or would it effectively become a 7.1?
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post #19 of 21 Old 06-16-2013, 12:33 PM
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The two could coexist in one system. Only one or the other would be used at a time. It's a moot point, now, since Dolby acquired immSound. They will define the merged scenario, whatever that may be.
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post #20 of 21 Old 06-16-2013, 08:19 PM
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In 1996 when the first Meridian 861 came out, there was a Part Numbered label set that came with it. The labels for 16 channel ambisoinics compatible speaker array included floor channels.


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post #21 of 21 Old 06-17-2013, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CINERAMAX View Post

In 1996 when the first Meridian 861 came out, there was a Part Numbered label set that came with it. The labels for 16 channel ambisoinics compatible speaker array included floor channels.

Now that you mention floor channels, I recall that the imm sound 23.1 configuration to which Tindra alluded (link) did in fact also contain a Bottom Front Left|Right (BtFL|BtFR) speaker pair.



Interestingly, I see no sign of similarly placed speakers in the Dolby Atmos configuration that (presumably) benefits from Dolby's acquisition of imm sound...?! cool.gif
_

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