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Dolby Atmos Theatre System

137K views 1K replies 145 participants last post by  jmd1982 
#1 ·
From the press release :


>>For the first time, Dolby Atmos introduces a hybrid approach to mixing and directs sound as dynamic objects that envelop the listener, in combination with channels for playback. Dolby Atmos enables adaptive rendering to ensure that the playback experience is as close as possible to the creator's original vision in any given environment, irrespective of the specific speaker configuration in the playback environment.
 
#27 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani /forum/post/0


dtsrs

Not exciting at all...


Time to watch as dolby and dts duke it out!
 
#28 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani /forum/post/21943629


Similar, to the extent that they both use object-based mixing and rendering to a large number of speakers. But then SRS had a similar proposal, as did DTS (which just bought SRS). Looks like everyone was headed in that direction anyway.

While I have stated in the past that IMM is object based, I have recently learned that the rendering is Ambisonics based (not sure if it high order or not). In one sense that is the beauty of object-based content delivery: it can be rendered with conventional panning (the 3D version being called VBAP, or vector base amplitude panning), or WFS as in IOSONO, or Ambisonics (or HOA), all from a single soundtrack.
 
#29 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin /forum/post/21943869


When might we see the first theaters get these systems??

Ivan's favourite AMC theatre in Burbank, which includes one of those ETX auditoriums, has a bunch of extra (height?) speakers installed. According to the Mix magazine article that Marc linked to, Dolby has been working/talking with AMC about this since 2007. Maybe some test installations already exist.
 
#30 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler /forum/post/0


While I have stated in the past that IMM is object based, I have recently learned that the rendering is Ambisonics based (not sure if it high order or not). In one sense that is the beauty of object-based content delivery: it can be rendered with conventional panning (the 3D version being called VBAP, or vector base amplitude panning), or WFS as in IOSONO, or Ambisonics (or HOA), all from a single soundtrack.


Huh?
 
#31 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani /forum/post/0


Ivan's favourite AMC theatre in Burbank, which includes one of those ETX auditoriums, has a bunch of extra (height?) speakers installed. According to the Mix magazine article that Marc linked to, Dolby has been working/talking with AMC about this since 2007. Maybe some test installations already exist.

Same with the one here
 
#34 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani /forum/post/0


You know what that means: another edition of 'The Haunting'.

...........
 
#35 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer /forum/post/0



Dolby's So Cal office is in Burbank....

That brick building off the hwy??
 
#36 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin /forum/post/21943871


Not exciting at all...


Time to watch as dolby and dts duke it out!

Sorry to disappoint, but that war will not likely repeat.
DTS is no longer in the cinema hardware business, having sold it to Datasat.


What SRS is promoting is a common content creation format called MDA (multi-dimensional audio) which is an open standard format for creating object-based audio and associated metadata. This would be used at the productions stage level, and the finished MDA mix could then be encoded for any desired playback hardware, be it Atmos, Auro3D, IOSONO, IMM, or even NHK 22.2.


The main reason each of these companies currently has their own proprietary production tool is because there is no universal standard yet implemented in the DAWs and DFCs used in film production. That standard could be MDA as it is not associated with any company's cinema processor platform. Since it is unlikely that the film studios will be willing to mix their movies multiple times, the need for a universal production system is obvious.
 
#37 ·
If-and-when a theater chain upgrades a particular venue with the additional amps+speakers required to deliver Atmos playback, they will no doubt expect added value in the form of 'improved' audio performance even when not playing back a "mixed for Atmos" soundtrack--of which presumably there will be 'very few' initially! This suggests Dolby will need to provide on-the-fly 'upmix' post processing functionality for use with some|most|all of the "NOT mixed for Atmos" movie soundtracks that will also show|playback through the same speaker configuration in the theater. It might be relatively straightforward to implement some "home version" of that 'upmix' post processing technology as a 'second generation version of DPLIIz' in Home Theater, even if there is 'no easy way' to bring discrete Atmos soundtracks to HT...?!
 
#38 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by GXMnow /forum/post/21942153


Now that the system has been announced to the world, I can give a few details.

The Dolby Atmos paper mentions room equalization (band based?) and (surround) bass management. Can you provide more detailed info?
 
#39 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler /forum/post/21942849


Exactly right. And delivering object-based audio means more information comes to the playback system, thus allowing improved rendering even with existing speaker configurations.

Two potential problems: "beds" and monitoring in real spaces like a dubbing stage. But I guess that's the price we have to pay for backwards compatibility with existing (re-)production techniques.


By the way, do you have more detailed info on the format of Dolby Atmos audio files? Dolby states there are up to 128 simultaneous and lossless audio streams.
 
#40 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler /forum/post/21941911


Read between the lines: >>Launching in the cinema, Dolby Atmos...
 
#41 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundChex /forum/post/21944002

If-and-when a theater chain upgrades a particular venue with the additional amps+speakers required to deliver Atmos playback, they will no doubt expect added value in the form of 'improved' audio performance even when not playing back a "mixed for Atmos" soundtrack--of which presumably there will be 'very few' initially! This suggests Dolby will need to provide on-the-fly 'upmix' post processing functionality for use with some|most|all of the "NOT mixed for Atmos" movie soundtracks that will also show|playback through the same speaker configuration in the theater.

If you read the white papers, one of the things mentioned in a very brief way, is how Dolby has been looking at changes in how we have thought about our standards and re-evaluating them.


SMPTE has convened a working group that is also looking to redefine cinema playback systems, standards and, etc...


I suspect we will see more fundamental changes in the quality of even standard 5.1 cinema systems...


I don't think Dolby wants to get into the business of real time up mixing in the cinemas.... obviously any Atmos theater will be able to play back 5.1 and 7.1 films as intended..


As I alluded to earlier, they are implementing a business model that should see a fairly rapid (in respect to other technology upgrades before it) rate of installations..


There has recently been a bit of chatter among my colleagues about AMC's ETX system up mix and it has started the discussion about what is and isn't acceptable to content makers in regards to their original delivered soundtracks.


In the end, I wholeheartedly agree that we should see an improvement in the overall quality of sound in the cinemas.
 
#43 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Dressler /forum/post/21943912


Sorry to disappoint, but that war will not likely repeat.
DTS is no longer in the cinema hardware business, having sold it to Datasat.

Purely speculation on my part, but I think the merger, on the surface, gives DTS access to a couple of areas that they haven't cracked which could be very lucrative, and with which SRS has been wildly successful.


Broadcast and display sound systems (i.e. tv speaker systems.).
 
#45 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmMixer /forum/post/0



If you read the white papers, one of the things mentioned in a very brief way, is how Dolby has been looking at changes in how we have thought about our standards and re-evaluating them.


SMPTE has convened a working group that is also looking to redefine cinema playback systems, standards and, etc...


I suspect we will see more fundamental changes in the quality of even standard 5.1 cinema systems...


I don't think Dolby wants to get into the business of real time up mixing in the cinemas.... obviously any Atmos theater will be able to play back 5.1 and 7.1 films as intended..


As I alluded to earlier, they are implementing a business model that should see a fairly rapid (in respect to other technology upgrades before it) rate of installations..


There has recently been a bit of chatter among my colleagues about AMC's ETX system up mix and it has started the discussion about what is and isn't acceptable to content makers in regards to their original delivered soundtracks.


In the end, I wholeheartedly agree that we should see an improvement in the overall quality of sound in the cinemas.

How do you feel about the etx system?
 
#47 ·
The eq system is very interesting. All 64 feeds have Dolby LAKE processing for the filtering. The room config file with the type and location of each speaker needs to be entered first, then the tuning can begin. Here is a very simplified explanation of the procedure. We setup an array of mics in the room and they are all digitized in real time along with the source test signal. Each channel is played and sampled then the system calculates the correction filters. Then we can play with the applied eq and check the results. Eq can be manually adjusted as well using tools that can act like a parametric, graphic, or Mesa eq. Filters are never addedor stacked, you just are altering the settings of the lake filter.


As far as I know there is no plan to artificially up mix 5.1 or 7.1 tracks. But there will still be a good benefit. With only a single driver on each amp channel the speaker control will be improved vs the series/parallel arrays of past. Each speaker independently balanced and equalized should have better more even sound. The arrays will be the ideal located speakers in the room. True full frequency range will be available with less distortio due the the use of individual amps and bass managed surround and rear sub woofers.
 
#48 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by GXMnow /forum/post/21945938


The eq system is very interesting. All 64 feeds have Dolby LAKE processing for the filtering. The room config file with the type and location of each speaker needs to be entered first, then the tuning can begin. Here is a very simplified explanation of the procedure. We setup an array of mics in the room and they are all digitized in real time along with the source test signal. Each channel is played and sampled then the system calculates the correction filters. Then we can play with the applied eq and check the results. Eq can be manually adjusted as well using tools that can act like a parametric, graphic, or Mesa eq. Filters are never addedor stacked, you just are altering the settings of the lake filter.


As far as I know there is no plan to artificially up mix 5.1 or 7.1 tracks. But there will still be a good benefit. With only a single driver on each amp channel the speaker control will be improved vs the series/parallel arrays of past. Each speaker independently balanced and equalized should have better more even sound. The arrays will be the ideal located speakers in the room. True full frequency range will be available with less distortio due the the use of individual amps and bass managed surround and rear sub woofers.

Thanks GXMnow.


Are the fronts now bass managed too? How are the mics set up for room EQ (location and number)?
 
#49 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundChex /forum/post/21944055


The first stumbling block to Home Theater discrete 3D audio would seem to be the almost complete absence of movies mixed with 3D audio . . . and with few theaters equipped for 3D audio playback until recently, there has been little incentive for studios to mix audio in 3D. Hopefully the studios will quickly find a way to mix soundtracks 'once' for playback in both Auro-3D and Dolby Atmos capable theaters--even if doing so does not initially make best|full use of either sound system. The more theaters that can play 3D soundtracks of all systems, the sooner the studios will exploit the 3D audio format . . . and we might expect to see (hear!) the start of discrete 3D audio for Home Theater!

Quite right. The chicken and egg problem can be a real stumbling block. In this case, movie mixing as been evolving to being more and more "in the box" (using a DAW) increasing flexibility and efficiency, and narrowing the gap to object-based audio. A Pro Tools session is, in essence, an object based mix. The only problem to date is that it stayed inside the box. Exporting objects and metadata is the new feature, and that's more a matter of plumbing rather than a paradigm shift in workflow. Of course the addition of speakers and 3D adds new challenges for our friend FilmMixer
, but the artistic rewards will help offset the effort.
 
#50 ·
Sorry I can't figure out how to quote o. My iPhone.


All of the tests I have info on have not used screen channel bass management. It simply is not needed with 4 x 15 inch woofers and 1200+ watts feeding them on each screen channel. That said, the config file will allow the installer to make any full range channel bass manage at any frequency into one of up to 3 sub woofer outputs. Most see them being assigned as front LFE sub , left back sub , right back sub.


The mic number and placement is not defined and multiple passes can be used to get more measured positions we have done as many as 16 locations in the main seating area, sampling 6 at a time. The "sweet spot" mic stays in the ref position. 2/3 back just off center. The other 5 moved and were sampled 2 more times.


As you might imagine, manually Eq'ing 50 channels would take a fair bit of time. Even with this semi auto setup it is taking a out 2 hours to do a full tune. I am sure we Wil cut that a bit as we refine the process though. The software is still maturing as well.


I am still waiting to hear all the feed back from Vegas.
 
#51 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by GXMnow /forum/post/21946519


...the config file will allow the installer to make any full range channel bass manage at any frequency into one of up to 3 sub woofer outputs.


As you might imagine, manually Eq'ing 50 channels would take a fair bit of time. Even with this semi auto setup it is taking a out 2 hours to do a full tune.

So is bass management and automated room correction ("semi auto setup") that we consumers take for granted on our home systems finally coming to commercial cinema?
 
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