Spectre Blu-ray Review - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 90Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #31 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 07:34 AM
Advanced Member
 
JamesE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 566
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 110 Post(s)
Liked: 46
I liked the movie. I put a lot of effort into setting up the sound system in my theater. The sound is one of the most important aspects of any movie for me. I was “immersed” in the movie. The video was excellent. The plot and story were good. Maybe not perfect but good. Good enough that I’m showing the movie to some of my friends next week.
JamesE is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #32 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 08:55 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: South of Heaven, East of Eden
Posts: 24
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 11 Post(s)
Liked: 6
I thought this movie was the worst Craig Bond film by far

Watched it last night, and am surprised Sony would let it out in this state. The writing was terrible; the overall plot jumbled and preposterous, and execution of the narrative had so many unbelievable elements that it took you right out of the movie. I felt like I was watching a play at times, or an old Roger Moore Bond movie. Or even a satire of a Bond movie.

Léa Seydoux is gorgeous, but a completely wooden actress. The first twenty minutes of the film are very well done, and then it seemed to just go off the rails.

I watched The Man from U.N.C.L.E. earlier in the week, and while that was not perfect, it was a lot better than SPECTRE.

I loved Casino Royale and Skyfall. Quantum of Solace I felt was just o.k.

SPECTRE should never have been made like this. Purvis, Wade and Logan were the screenplay writers from the last few films and did this as well; feels like they just didn't try, or didn't have an editor to speak of.

If I was Craig, I would want out as well.

Sorry for the rant, but I was hyped to see it and, as you can tell, completely let down.

On the plus side, the audio and video were great. Oh well.

Angling for perfection with tangential success...
Absorbed & Diffused is offline  
post #33 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 09:16 AM
Senior Member
 
Wingsbr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 200
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 86 Post(s)
Liked: 33
Did anyone find the video a bit washed out? I have a 65 HU9000 with a PS4 and Denon x4000 and I checked other movies which all looked good. Confused since others are posting great video scores.

LG OLED 65EF9500 - Denon AVR x4000 - Klipsch Reference 5.2 \/ Panasonic 55 GT31 - Denon 2112ci - Sony 2.1
Wingsbr is offline  
 
post #34 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 09:22 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Kini62's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Hawaii
Posts: 6,254
Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1748 Post(s)
Liked: 1559
This is who should have done the opening song/theme...

Maynard James Keenan

A musical genious.
Snc735 likes this.

Klipsch RF-62II, RC-500, RS-400, SVS PC12+,
Def Tech SC8000
Harman Kardon AVR 1600
PS3, Apple TV, Sharp 70" Qattron
Kini62 is offline  
post #35 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 02:17 PM
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,471
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1487 Post(s)
Liked: 701
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingsbr View Post
Did anyone find the video a bit washed out? I have a 65 HU9000 with a PS4 and Denon x4000 and I checked other movies which all looked good. Confused since others are posting great video scores.
I was wondering when someone would point this out -- we watched this last night after picking the disc up for $19 and I must say I immediately thought (as did my wife) that my rear projection display had finally died because the transfer was so yellow-pushed, contrast-blown and downright murky/soft in most places (especially the opening Mexico City scene). The transfer gets better as the film goes on as far as detail and clarity is concerned, but even the sequences involving snow looked ridiculously blown-out with regard to contrast, making the snow look "blobby" and ill-defined. The opening Mexico City sequence, on our display, boasted a ridiculously aggressive yellow/olive push to the color timing, nearly to the point my wife wanted me to stop the disc because it was really annoying her; there was inherent softness baked into the transfer that I couldn't explain either, rendering it extremely DVD-like in quality in many spots. But I do recall saying throughout the film's way-too-long running time that the contrast appeared blown-out on this disc, too much for comfortable viewing IMO. There was also the "washed out" look that Wings pointed out, which is probably what made many of the scenes appear DVD-like (this was explained on another site as a side effect of Sam Mendes shooting this on more traditional film as compared to Skyfall, which was shot in its majority on digital video).

The audio, in Master Audio 7.1, was, to my ears, average in terms of sheer sonics and impact; I can tell you that Skyfall's Master Audio track shook our walls much better in the LFE department, even causing my sub to bottom out at one point during Javier Bardem's character's "attack" on Craig's Bond beneath the subway station. While it wasn't a weak mix per se, it could have been a little better, and I keep advocating for TrueHD in these instances. In contrast, Terminator Genisys and San Andreas sounded WAY better than Spectre on Blu.

My wife actually fell asleep watching this last night and said she didn't care for the film at home (we saw it in theaters, as we see every Bond release when they come out in November) and went so far to say that she'd be okay never seeing it again. Here's my take: I absolutely love Craig in this role, but I understand why diehard Bond fans from older generations can't possibly envision a blonde-haired, blue-eyed guy playing this character...to many, Connery will be the ONLY Bond, and I totally respect that. I have come to enjoy these films a heck of a lot more since Craig took the role in Casino Royale, injecting a seriousness into them that was missing from the more campy and goofy Brosnan, Moore and Dalton variants...so it's safe to say I'm a "modern 007 franchise fan." Since Casino Royale, my wife and I haven't missed one follow up theatrically, catching Quantum of Solace, Skyfall and Spectre in theaters. You know what's pretty sad? Javier Bardem was, on paper, the PERFECT Bond villain given his chilling performance in No Country for Old Men -- but what Sam Mendes did to him in Skyfall, dumbing down the character to be some kind of homosexual psycho who attempts to seduce Bond (give me a break...THIS is what it has come to?), was absolutely ridiculous. That being said, Skyfall was definitely better than Spectre, and that's strange because Mendes did this new one too; what was good about Spectre was that, for the first time in the Craig franchise, Bond faces a physical adversary (Dave Bautista) that he simply can't handle (a la Bruce Wayne and Bane in Dark Knight Rises) but of course ends up getting a leg up on, which hearkened back to the older films in the series. Then there's the return of superadversary Blofeld (Christoph Waltz), which was kind of weird to thrown in at the end as the guy "behind all of Bond's pain" but who was almost as equally menacing in a psychological way as Bautista's character was physically.

The film itself was way too long and kind of came off the rails after awhile; while slick and Bond-like, the opening Mexico City sequence didn't make any sense, IMO, because at the end of Skyfall, M asks Bond if he's "ready to begin (work on a new assignment)" while presenting him a top secret folder, suggesting we're going to see James on that mission in the beginning of Spectre...instead, Bond's gone rogue to hunt down the guy Judi Dench's character asked him to in a video recording, leading him further and further to the Spectre organization...which has been behind Le Chiffre in Casino Royale, Dominic Greene in Quantum of Solace and even Javier Bardem's Silva character in Skyfall. Therein lies another problem: Are we to believe, after Bond has peeled away all these layers of the proverbial criminal onion, that the trouble ends at Spectre? There MUST be yet another group behind THAT one, and another and another....and that's where the series comes off the rails. I liked the way the series was kind of going what with Bond seeking revenge for Vesper's suicide pact in Casino Royale -- a theme that spilled into Quantum of Solace and was touched upon in Skyfall -- and the way Craig plays the emotionally ripped, rage-driven avenging Bond is absolutely spot-on in my opinion. But at this point, something has gotten lost (I said the SAME thing about Furious 7) and it seems like there needs to be a different direction.

I also didn't care for the way the film ended, and was equally confused with regard to the way professional critics said Bond "went out with a Bang" if this was to be Craig's last performance in the role, as I didn't see it that way at all. I mean, just driving off with White's daughter in the restored Aston Martin? There was also the issue of the ever-vital beginning credits sequence in Bond films, and the one here just fell flat; nothing, IMO, will compare to Madonna's "Die Another Day," which opened the Bond film of the same name, but in the Craig series of films, the best opening sequence track thus far has to be Chris Cornell's "You Know My Name" from Casino Royale. Very fitting and engaging.

At any rate, I would definitely look forward to a new 007 feature, and from what I have read several actors are being considered to take the reigns from Craig when he finally retires from the role, including Jason Statham (which would make the first bald Bond, that's for sure). In summary, Spectre had some exciting moments -- Bond seducing the utterly sexy widow of the target in Rome, who makes love to him (right after burying her husband) keeping her corset, thigh-highs, garter belt and stilettos on as well as the nail-biting hand-to-hand combat scene between Craig and Bautista -- but it fell way short of the best entry in the Craig stable, Casino Royale.
k1n3t1k likes this.

Last edited by IntelliVolume; 02-13-2016 at 02:30 PM.
IntelliVolume is offline  
post #36 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 03:20 PM
Senior Member
 
Kressilac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 267
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 81 Post(s)
Liked: 46
Am I the only one that is disappointed when a blockbuster popcorn flick doesn't feature Dolby Atmos on the disc? I can't believe it will be better when I'm paying a premium for UHD Blu-Rays that fail to deliver Atmos. So, I jump over to IMDB and the movie wasn't produced in Atmos so there's that. Lots of 6.5K and 4K sources for the video but they didn't use DTS:X or Dolby Atmos. *shrug*

Still going to watch the movie and I love Bond movies like I do Mission Impossible flicks so I am sure I will like it but serious blockbusters should use the latest tech. Spectre isn't a pre-Atmos era movie. / rant
Kressilac is offline  
post #37 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 03:42 PM
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Star of the Northern Hemisphere
Posts: 16,653
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7012 Post(s)
Liked: 3557
...And no 3D James Bond flicks...none.

* Regarding the color palette: In my opinion this is an artistic choice, and a realistic approach @ that too. Go to Mexico City and you'll see smoke, fog, sun, pollution and washed out yellows. No problemo with the colors myself, to the contrary, it brought me right back in time and in place. And same for the other scenes with different color palette.

And the audio was fine.

Technically it's top notch; film content...it's not the high standard of Casino, or Sky...but it is still very serviceable.
And you know what else...the replay value might surprise you...
NorthSky is offline  
post #38 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 04:10 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
aaranddeeman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lover's State
Posts: 3,823
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1703 Post(s)
Liked: 619
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Potts View Post
Greetings,

I didn't find that it mattered greatly as they all sounded really good. Pick one and have at it!


Regards,
That's what they call being, "politically correct" !
aaranddeeman is offline  
post #39 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 04:30 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
tenthplanet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: North of Mexico, South of Oregon, West of desert
Posts: 3,291
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1005 Post(s)
Liked: 1021
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wingsbr View Post
Did anyone find the video a bit washed out? I have a 65 HU9000 with a PS4 and Denon x4000 and I checked other movies which all looked good. Confused since others are posting great video scores.
The film looked washed out a bit in the theater also, it's just the way it looks. Doesn't detract from the story.

"Ich spreche Klingon und du?"/ "Ich spreche auch Klingon"/ "Und sie ?"/ "Wir sprechen Klingon! "
tenthplanet is offline  
post #40 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 05:03 PM
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,471
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1487 Post(s)
Liked: 701
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kressilac View Post
Am I the only one that is disappointed when a blockbuster popcorn flick doesn't feature Dolby Atmos on the disc? I can't believe it will be better when I'm paying a premium for UHD Blu-Rays that fail to deliver Atmos. So, I jump over to IMDB and the movie wasn't produced in Atmos so there's that. Lots of 6.5K and 4K sources for the video but they didn't use DTS:X or Dolby Atmos. *shrug*

Still going to watch the movie and I love Bond movies like I do Mission Impossible flicks so I am sure I will like it but serious blockbusters should use the latest tech. Spectre isn't a pre-Atmos era movie. / rant

I would have taken an Atmos track JUST for its core TrueHD mix -- would have sounded tremendously better than what we got here.
IntelliVolume is offline  
post #41 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 05:47 PM
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,471
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1487 Post(s)
Liked: 701
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
...And no 3D James Bond flicks...none.
...for non-3D buffs, this is a non-issue...

Quote:
* Regarding the color palette: In my opinion this is an artistic choice, and a realistic approach @ that too. Go to Mexico City and you'll see smoke, fog, sun, pollution and washed out yellows. No problemo with the colors myself, to the contrary, it brought me right back in time and in place. And same for the other scenes with different color palette.
Normally, I'd agree with you regarding the wildly aggressive sepia tone lathered on that opening sequence -- that is, being in Mexico City and experiencing the fog, smoke, heavy sun-drenched hues, etc. -- but I found it really excessive to the point that it rendered some of the shots way too soft. Again, though, we are dealing with a nearly eight-year-old 1080p rear projection HDTV which has been developing what seems like an infamous (for this model Sony) optical block problem, manifesting as a yellow-ish spot in the center of the screen...so my feedback and interpretation of the color MAY be compromised.

Quote:
And the audio was fine.
I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree a BIT in this case; while no means a bomb like Age of Ultron was, the audio here I felt could have been a tad better -- was there aggressive surround usage and wild effects panning when called upon? Sure. Was there LFE wallop? Yes. But nothing like the wall-rattling wallop delivered by Skyfall's Master Audio track...I will even go so far to say that the Casino Royale Collector's Edition Blu-ray and its TrueHD mix was much louder, in-your-face and engaging than any track given to any of the Craig 007 films thus far by MGM/Fox.

Quote:
Technically it's top notch; film content...it's not the high standard of Casino, or Sky...but it is still very serviceable.
And you know what else...the replay value might surprise you...
It's been overwhelmingly agreed upon by many Bond/007/Fleming fans that Spectre is sort of the weakest entry of this Craig series; what was once reserved for Marc Forester's Quantum of Solace (which I didn't care for in theaters but came to enjoy at home) has now been bestowed upon Sam Mendes' latest attempt. It's a shame, because Craig is really good in the role, but the problem here was more the writing, pacing and the way in which the plot just became so thick at certain points it began to collapse on itself (what I mean by this is the way Mendes seemed to want to stuff too much into this...the Bautista adversary, Blofeld, White, White's sexy daughter...it felt a bit too "rushed" towards the end torture sequence in North Africa). However, that being said, there were indeed interesting, action-packed moments like the fight with Bautista and the "standoff" with Bond and Blofeld before he's tortured with the "brain needles"...but at the end of the day, this was definitely NO Casino Royale (which brought us all back to some of the classic Bond flicks in history what with its classy style and throwback spy-esque overtones) or even Skyfall. Speaking of Skyfall, this could have been a truly great action/Bond flick if it wasn't for what Mendes did to Bardem's character, turning him unnecessarily gay with a "thing" for Bond...I mean, come on...what is that?

Last edited by IntelliVolume; 02-13-2016 at 05:52 PM.
IntelliVolume is offline  
post #42 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 07:58 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
curlyjive's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Abington, PA
Posts: 1,907
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 538 Post(s)
Liked: 247
Am I the only one seeing noticeable flicker/flashing in many dark scenes? It's not there in the digital copy vudu version. Two scenes in particular are the scene with bond and Mr white in the lake house and the room with the meteorite.

It's really bad. I can slow motion fast forward through the scene and see the flashes occur as well.
curlyjive is offline  
post #43 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 09:26 PM
Senior Member
 
Tiki Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Rodney Ontario Canada
Posts: 300
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 105 Post(s)
Liked: 88
Just curious how many have read the Ian Feming Bond books and what you think of the movie character verses the literary character, and the stories.
I grew up with the "original Bonds" and really liked those movies.
Then when Craig started playing Bond I was less than thrilled with him and his portrayal of Bond.
Then I read the books and was surprised to find the books and Bond were nothing like the original movies.
And felt that Craig really was much more like the books character than anyone else had done so far.


For me Spectre was the closest to the book Bond and this movie was the best yet, it was just great entertainment.

Samsung 60" F8500
Samsung BD-F7500
Pioneer 1024K
PSB Image 8C,5T,2B,Alpha
Polk PSW10 (x 2)
Monster HTS5100mkII
Tiki Steve is offline  
post #44 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 09:34 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Mr.SoftDome's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,319
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 499 Post(s)
Liked: 400
I thought it was pretty good. I have really grown to see Daniel Craig in this role but have a feeling this was it. Too bad.

The Day of the Dead fastivities in Mexico were frigging awesome and checking that out was almost better than the movie.

Too bad I wouldn't feel safe as I would love to check that out some day..

Rick
Mr.SoftDome is online now  
post #45 of 242 Old 02-13-2016, 09:53 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
JeffR1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Canada
Posts: 1,228
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 748 Post(s)
Liked: 264
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pagey123 View Post
I am a huge Daniel Craig fan. I wanted to like Spectre. I wanted all the negative reviews to be wrong. But, in this case, they were simply spot on. This feels so...forced. The lines felt cheesy and forced. The "Bond Girls" were not captivating at all (I killed your husband, let's get it on; we just survived an attack by a huge, nearly unstoppable assassin, let's have sex; I don't really like you, but now that you are being tortured, I love you and can't live w/out you). The car chase was boring. Christoph's talents (see Inglourious Basterds) were wasted. Maybe I am just older and more cynical, but this was, unfortunately, a HUGE letdown for me.
I was never really a big James Bond fan from the get go. The early ones were very corny _ all Hell would break loose and he always came out with out a scratch on him or a hair out place.
At least the recent ones are more realistic in that sense.

I found this almost a "Spoof" on all the Bonds, sort of predictable, but still fun to watch, even complete with the white cat and the "Good By Mr. Bond" at the end.

I went into it not expecting much so I wouldn't be disappointed, but I was still entertained none the less.

And of course, the villain is kept alive in the end to continue things.
IntelliVolume likes this.
JeffR1 is online now  
post #46 of 242 Old 02-14-2016, 12:24 AM
Member
 
Yosemite Dan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 163
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 38 Post(s)
Liked: 40
Just watched it and where do I start. Well it got off to a bad start because the Sam Smith song was awful.

Now the movie itself. Quite disappointed with how the story felt forced and predictable. Not sure why they needed to tie in every aspect of the 1st 3 movies. Almost felt like those sitcoms where they show highlights of past shows just to waste an episode. Didn't really understand the motivations of Blofeld, the romance felt forced to try and create false tension, and everything felt shoehorned just to go from one action set piece to the next which made the plot feel disjointed. And Bond seemed to have an escape vehicle at every moment of peril. I counted a plane, helicopter and a boat that seemed to come out of nowhere. Not to mention the heroine seemed to have alot of nice clothes to wear considering she was initially kidnapped and wouldn't have had time to pack. I guess her and Bond did some shopping between explosions because he had a custom made tuxedo just for the dinner on the train. I don't normally nitpick those kinds of things but that seemed glaring to me.

Very sloppy writing and hard to believe that Mendes was the same guy who directed Skyfall. It was really lacking any visual style which Skyfall had in spades. I heard Sam Mendes had to be talked into making this and it showed. I'm sure it didn't help that he had a different cinematographer but even then there was no imagination to the directing. I barely rate this above Quantum which I thought was pretty weak. The only person who didn't appear to be mailing it in was Craig.

Waltz wasn't particularly effective as Blofeld. I don't think he was the right choice as it just seemed he was channeling his Inglorious Basterds character and looked bored most of the time. He was more menacing as the villain in the Green Hornet. Bautista was cartooney and a poor man's Jaws. I'm a fan of Ralph Fiennes but his portrayal of M is the same scowl and indicates a guy who feels really constipated.

Now on to the video and audio. For the first 2 hours the picture was soft, the colors muted and it was drab despite some exotic locales. It was so soft and muted that I thought it was purposely done just to emulate the 60's style softness and color palette of Bond movies because they were introducing Spectre and were getting retro. But then around the 2 hour mark when the movie returned to London, the image became much sharper and detailed and colors more vibrant despite it all taking place at night. The difference is jarring and I'm surprised no one else noticed this. Either someone screwed up the BR transfer or they decided to change the visual style of the last 30 minutes which makes no sense since these were night scenes and it would have made more sense to take advantage of the outdoor scenes of the first 2 hours. Or as someone mentioned perhaps they shot the last 30 minutes digitally.

And I wasn't particularly impressed with the sound either. It had shortcomings like the picture in the first 2 hours. The bass felt muddy and the dynamic range could have been better but then it seemed to open up for the last 30 minutes as well. The bass felt cleaner and the highs more distinct. So for both the video and audio to upgrade at the same 2 hour mark can only mean that they screwed up the transfer.

Overall it was a forgettable movie despite having all the ingredients to be so much better. Out of all the Craig movies, this one was the least grounded in reality and had a fair amount of cheese which I hope they are not returning to because I have a lactose intolerance for those type of movies. I hope Craig returns for another because it looked like he was the only one who cared in making it.

Last edited by Yosemite Dan; 02-14-2016 at 01:09 AM.
Yosemite Dan is offline  
post #47 of 242 Old 02-14-2016, 04:53 AM
Senior Member
 
wkingincharge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Maryland Area
Posts: 306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 28
I will start by saying that this can't be Daniel Craig's final Bond appearance just in the fact it was not the proper send off. Casino Royale had such a edgy feel to it and watching bond carry these dark issues throughout the other films was great until this film.The storyline tried so hard to connect everything (not necessary ) ,This bond girl not interesting or even close to the Vespa character, some of the action scenes lacked impact with exception to the train scene,More gadgets please!!

The audio/video presentation was also not as impressive or even in the same arena as Skyfall. The images just seemed soft at times but not the worst I have ever seen. The audio had some moments in the beginning but for the most part very boring. I guess my taste in soundtracks for movies like this tend to favor more of say Ghost Protocol . I will take some time and revisit this one down the road and maybe my opinion changes a little so for now my rankings are.

Casino Royale
Skyfall
Quantum of Solice - The audio/video sounded better (my opinion)
Spectre
IntelliVolume likes this.

Last edited by wkingincharge; 02-14-2016 at 05:10 AM.
wkingincharge is offline  
post #48 of 242 Old 02-14-2016, 01:32 PM
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,471
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1487 Post(s)
Liked: 701
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosemite Dan View Post
Just watched it and where do I start. Well it got off to a bad start because the Sam Smith song was awful.

Now the movie itself. Quite disappointed with how the story felt forced and predictable. Not sure why they needed to tie in every aspect of the 1st 3 movies. Almost felt like those sitcoms where they show highlights of past shows just to waste an episode. Didn't really understand the motivations of Blofeld, the romance felt forced to try and create false tension, and everything felt shoehorned just to go from one action set piece to the next which made the plot feel disjointed. And Bond seemed to have an escape vehicle at every moment of peril. I counted a plane, helicopter and a boat that seemed to come out of nowhere. Not to mention the heroine seemed to have alot of nice clothes to wear considering she was initially kidnapped and wouldn't have had time to pack. I guess her and Bond did some shopping between explosions because he had a custom made tuxedo just for the dinner on the train. I don't normally nitpick those kinds of things but that seemed glaring to me.

Very sloppy writing and hard to believe that Mendes was the same guy who directed Skyfall. It was really lacking any visual style which Skyfall had in spades. I heard Sam Mendes had to be talked into making this and it showed. I'm sure it didn't help that he had a different cinematographer but even then there was no imagination to the directing. I barely rate this above Quantum which I thought was pretty weak. The only person who didn't appear to be mailing it in was Craig.

Waltz wasn't particularly effective as Blofeld. I don't think he was the right choice as it just seemed he was channeling his Inglorious Basterds character and looked bored most of the time. He was more menacing as the villain in the Green Hornet. Bautista was cartooney and a poor man's Jaws. I'm a fan of Ralph Fiennes but his portrayal of M is the same scowl and indicates a guy who feels really constipated.

Now on to the video and audio. For the first 2 hours the picture was soft, the colors muted and it was drab despite some exotic locales. It was so soft and muted that I thought it was purposely done just to emulate the 60's style softness and color palette of Bond movies because they were introducing Spectre and were getting retro. But then around the 2 hour mark when the movie returned to London, the image became much sharper and detailed and colors more vibrant despite it all taking place at night. The difference is jarring and I'm surprised no one else noticed this. Either someone screwed up the BR transfer or they decided to change the visual style of the last 30 minutes which makes no sense since these were night scenes and it would have made more sense to take advantage of the outdoor scenes of the first 2 hours. Or as someone mentioned perhaps they shot the last 30 minutes digitally.

And I wasn't particularly impressed with the sound either. It had shortcomings like the picture in the first 2 hours. The bass felt muddy and the dynamic range could have been better but then it seemed to open up for the last 30 minutes as well. The bass felt cleaner and the highs more distinct. So for both the video and audio to upgrade at the same 2 hour mark can only mean that they screwed up the transfer.

Overall it was a forgettable movie despite having all the ingredients to be so much better. Out of all the Craig movies, this one was the least grounded in reality and had a fair amount of cheese which I hope they are not returning to because I have a lactose intolerance for those type of movies. I hope Craig returns for another because it looked like he was the only one who cared in making it.

Couldn't agree more with just about EVERYTHING you said here, right down to the audio and video quality analysis. My wife went so far to say she doesn't ever have to take it off the shelf to watch again, and that she "really couldn't stand it" at home for some reason (as compared to when we saw it theatrically); as for the reference to "shooting it digitally," I am not sure if this was in reference to the observation I made in my last post, but from what I understand Skyfall was shot (perhaps entirely) on digital video whereas with Spectre, Mendes went with a film approach. This could explain Skyfall's nearly reference-grade video, especially in that opening Istanbul sequence which boasts jaw-dropping detail elements including asphalt, facial complexions, saturated colors, depth of field and much more. Spectre didn't exhibit any of this until the middle of the film, where Bond is attempting to save Madeline from Mr. Hinx's clutches by flying the twin-engine plane into the snowy banks; this sequence began the improvement portion of Spectre, to my eyes, with regard to the video quality, but even here the snow looked so blown-out so far as contrast levels are concerned that it ended up looking like white blobs with no definition.

I don't think the DTS-HD MA track on Spectre was terrible, by any stretch, but I came away thinking this could have been somewhat "better." Skyfall, as I pointed out a couple of times now, boasted a quite rambunctious Master Audio mix that included a pretty "masked" LFE track, making itself known out of nowhere to rock the walls such as during the sequence when Silva (Bardem) unleashes the explosive under the subway station as Bond chases him....when the train breaks through the concrete and heads right for Bond, the LFE in this sequence actually bottomed out my sub when I initially had the volume up too high.
Yosemite Dan likes this.
IntelliVolume is offline  
post #49 of 242 Old 02-14-2016, 01:42 PM
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,471
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1487 Post(s)
Liked: 701
Quote:
Originally Posted by wkingincharge View Post
I will start by saying that this can't be Daniel Craig's final Bond appearance just in the fact it was not the proper send off. Casino Royale had such a edgy feel to it and watching bond carry these dark issues throughout the other films was great until this film.The storyline tried so hard to connect everything (not necessary ) ,This bond girl not interesting or even close to the Vespa character, some of the action scenes lacked impact with exception to the train scene,More gadgets please!!

The audio/video presentation was also not as impressive or even in the same arena as Skyfall. The images just seemed soft at times but not the worst I have ever seen. The audio had some moments in the beginning but for the most part very boring. I guess my taste in soundtracks for movies like this tend to favor more of say Ghost Protocol . I will take some time and revisit this one down the road and maybe my opinion changes a little so for now my rankings are.

Casino Royale
Skyfall
Quantum of Solice - The audio/video sounded better (my opinion)
Spectre

As with the member who posted before you, I agree with just about everything you say here; I love the way Craig took the "almost unstoppable MI6 agent hell-bent on revenge for the death of the one woman he gave his heart to" aspect of the character through all the films up until Skyfall too, and though much of that bitterness and darkness was still within the character in this latest film, something didn't feel right. I agree the "Bond Girls" were a bit of a letdown here, but the "sexy older widow" hookup seemed age appropriate (believe it or not) for Craig's Bond at this point, even though the SETUP was ridiculous (I just buried my husband...come **** me while I keep my sultry, seductive undergarments on because you're a stranger I don't even know) and we have to admit White's daughter Madeline looked awfully delicious in that gown she wears on the train (and then later when she's decked out in the black and white dress and heels Blofeld leaves for her to wear at his compound). Still, these elements could not -- as you point out -- compare with the intrigue of Eva Green's Lynd character and her connection to 007.

I think I would rate all the Craig series Bonds the way you did as well, though I still, to this day, feel like Quantum of Solace didn't have that great of a DTS-HD MA mix; it is remotely possible Spectre boasts a better sound mix as compared to Quantum. But still nothing bests the Casino Royale: Collector's Edition Blu-ray's wildly aggressive and pounding Dolby TrueHD track IMO.
IntelliVolume is offline  
post #50 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 08:19 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Emaych's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,259
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 478 Post(s)
Liked: 229
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
I think I would rate all the Craig series Bonds the way you did as well, though I still, to this day, feel like Quantum of Solace didn't have that great of a DTS-HD MA mix; it is remotely possible Spectre boasts a better sound mix as compared to Quantum. But still nothing bests the Casino Royale: Collector's Edition Blu-ray's wildly aggressive and pounding Dolby TrueHD track IMO.
You seem to be highlighting a possible difference in the audio presentation of the original release of CASINO ROYALE on blu-ray versus a presumably later "Collector's Edition" -- was there any difference? What would that be?
Emaych is offline  
post #51 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 09:18 AM
Advanced Member
 
JediFonger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 728
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 69 Post(s)
Liked: 19
Rogue Nation did it better with the same plot. It's all about execution imho.

Meanwhile... casino royale was a response to BOurne films. In some ways, I still feel like Bond franchise is still playing catchup. Hell even Kingsman is outdoing Bond itself... (in spite of the nature of Kingsman film). It's just sad when so many other subsequent spy films that have been inspired by Bond franchises are outdoing it on so many levels.

to the edge of eternity and depth of infinity, stupidity knows no bound.
JediFonger is online now  
post #52 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 01:39 PM
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,471
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1487 Post(s)
Liked: 701
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emaych View Post
You seem to be highlighting a possible difference in the audio presentation of the original release of CASINO ROYALE on blu-ray versus a presumably later "Collector's Edition" -- was there any difference? What would that be?

There's nothing "presumptuous" about it; there was in fact a "Collector's Edition" variant of Casino Royale that came out after Sony's original Blu-ray release, which added special features such as a BD Live protocol as well as a quite rousing, near-reference grade Dolby TrueHD track which replaced the original Blu-ray's uncompressed PCM mix. In my opinion, there was nothing special about the PCM track on the original release, and I will even say that the DVD release of Casino Royale, with its Dolby Digital 5.1 mix, was more aggressive and immersive than the first BD's PCM audio (I know, because I have owned every version of this film including the DVD and the two BD releases).

Here's what the original release looked like:



The Collector's Edition looked like this:


IntelliVolume is offline  
post #53 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 02:10 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
blastermaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Sunny Okanagan
Posts: 1,912
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 502 Post(s)
Liked: 634
[QUOTE=IntelliVolume;41593129]There's nothing "presumptuous" about it; there was in fact a "Collector's Edition" variant of Casino Royale that came out after Sony's original Blu-ray release, which added special features such as a BD Live protocol as well as a quite rousing, near-reference grade Dolby TrueHD track which replaced the original Blu-ray's uncompressed PCM mix. In my opinion, there was nothing special about the PCM track on the original release, and I will even say that the DVD release of Casino Royale, with its Dolby Digital 5.1 mix, was more aggressive and immersive than the first BD's PCM audio (I know, because I have owned every version of this film including the DVD and the two BD releases).

I haven't got the collector's edition, but here's one reviewer's take on it:

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/1693...royale_ce.html

I haven't got any problems with my pcm version. I think I'll wait for 4k Casino Royale. It's gonna happen.
blastermaster is offline  
post #54 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 02:26 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Emaych's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,259
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 478 Post(s)
Liked: 229
^^^The presumption was on my part, lacking specific knowledge as to whether both releases might have been simultaneous, or one the antecedent of the other, but in any event, such presumption does not lend itself to the apparently inferred differentiated connotation of "presumptuousness." That issue aside, I was motivated after posting to consult both Blu-ray.com:

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Casino...-Blu-ray/1150/

...and highdefdigest.com:

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/1693...royale_ce.html

...both of whom addressed the issue of the audio of the Dolby TrueHD versus PCM tracks. The former seems to have thought as you do, IntelliVolume, that the later variant bested the first, the latter source concluded any distinctions were negligible.

I just rewatched SKYFALL last night, and would obtain CR Collector's Ed. to replace my original edition CR if I thought I might be treated to more of that SKYFALL sweetness, but not sure I'm convinced. What I will do just now is revisit my PCM CR, see what I think. Thanks for your impressions.

Have not seen this latest one, but sounds as if folks are not blown away.....

Last edited by Emaych; 02-15-2016 at 02:30 PM.
Emaych is offline  
post #55 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 03:02 PM
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,471
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1487 Post(s)
Liked: 701
[quote=blastermaster;41594153]
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
There's nothing "presumptuous" about it; there was in fact a "Collector's Edition" variant of Casino Royale that came out after Sony's original Blu-ray release, which added special features such as a BD Live protocol as well as a quite rousing, near-reference grade Dolby TrueHD track which replaced the original Blu-ray's uncompressed PCM mix. In my opinion, there was nothing special about the PCM track on the original release, and I will even say that the DVD release of Casino Royale, with its Dolby Digital 5.1 mix, was more aggressive and immersive than the first BD's PCM audio (I know, because I have owned every version of this film including the DVD and the two BD releases).

I haven't got the collector's edition, but here's one reviewer's take on it:

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/1693...royale_ce.html

I haven't got any problems with my pcm version. I think I'll wait for 4k Casino Royale. It's gonna happen.

To my ears, there was surely nothing special about the PCM track on that first BD release; I even thought the DVD's Dolby Digital track was superior in a myriad of areas.


Funny you mentioned a 4K Casino Royale; was thinking I'd probably sell my Blu-rays if they come out with a Daniel Craig 007 collection on UltraHD...
IntelliVolume is offline  
post #56 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 03:05 PM
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,471
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1487 Post(s)
Liked: 701
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emaych View Post
^^^The presumption was on my part, lacking specific knowledge as to whether both releases might have been simultaneous, or one the antecedent of the other, but in any event, such presumption does not lend itself to the apparently inferred differentiated connotation of "presumptuousness." That issue aside, I was motivated after posting to consult both Blu-ray.com:

http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Casino...-Blu-ray/1150/

...and highdefdigest.com:

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/1693...royale_ce.html

...both of whom addressed the issue of the audio of the Dolby TrueHD versus PCM tracks. The former seems to have thought as you do, IntelliVolume, that the later variant bested the first, the latter source concluded any distinctions were negligible.

I just rewatched SKYFALL last night, and would obtain CR Collector's Ed. to replace my original edition CR if I thought I might be treated to more of that SKYFALL sweetness, but not sure I'm convinced. What I will do just now is revisit my PCM CR, see what I think. Thanks for your impressions.

Have not seen this latest one, but sounds as if folks are not blown away.....

Well, all I can report on is what I experienced; to ME, personally, a double dip on Casino Royale on Blu was justified after I had read data on the improvements the TrueHD track made on the PCM mix...and I found that to be accurate. Actually, in my case, it was a triple dip because I had the film on DVD first...


Here's just one example of the differences I experienced between the two: During that opening chase sequence in Madagascar, the tactile "heft" and LFE pounding as Craig is chasing the bomb maker through the jungles on the Collector's Edition was simply in another league compared to the original PCM variant, which to my ears didn't make much impact; when Bond breaks through the stack of construction pipes when the bomb maker thinks he's lost him in the big truck, a WALLOP of wall-rattling LFE shakes my room to the point it seems like everything is going to come down. Of course, this is just one example -- but there are plenty more, with the biggest difference between the two releases being the overall aggressiveness of the TrueHD mix and its superior in-your-face mastering volume IMO.


But, you're welcome with regard to my thoughts; if you do swap your original Casino Royale for the Collector's Edition, it would be interesting to know what you thought of the audio differences.

Last edited by IntelliVolume; 02-15-2016 at 03:10 PM.
IntelliVolume is offline  
post #57 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 03:13 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
blastermaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Sunny Okanagan
Posts: 1,912
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 502 Post(s)
Liked: 634
If I can find it on the cheap, I may go for it. It is, after all, my favourite Bond movie if not my favourite movie in my collection.
blastermaster is offline  
post #58 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 03:16 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Emaych's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,259
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 478 Post(s)
Liked: 229
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
Well, all I can report on is what I experienced; to ME, personally, a double dip on Casino Royale on Blu was justified after I had read data on the improvements the TrueHD track made on the PCM mix...and I found that to be accurate. Actually, in my case, it was a triple dip because I had the film on DVD first...


Here's just one example of the differences I experienced between the two: During that opening chase sequence in Madagascar, the tactile "heft" and LFE pounding as Craig is chasing the bomb maker through the jungles on the Collector's Edition was simply in another league compared to the original PCM variant, which to my ears didn't make much impact; when Bond breaks through the stack of construction pipes when the bomb maker thinks he's lost him in the big truck, a WALLOP of wall-rattling LFE shakes my room to the point it seems like everything is going to come down. Of course, this is just one example -- but there are plenty more, with the biggest difference between the two releases being the overall aggressiveness of the TrueHD mix and its superior in-your-face mastering volume IMO.


But, you're welcome with regard to my thoughts; if you do swap your original Casino Royale for the Collector's Edition, it would be interesting to know what you thought of the audio differences.
Yeah, I think that pretty much matches the review I read, and that kind of difference is highly meaningful to me...but Idunno -- the Collector's edition is like $24 presently, so I think I would have to be pretty sold on the concept of VERY significant differences -- actually, I will go so far as to say I'm not paying that, but almost certainly will go for the other version at some point -- maybe when everyone is selling their Collector's to pick up the 4K!
Emaych is offline  
post #59 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 03:16 PM
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Star of the Northern Hemisphere
Posts: 16,653
Mentioned: 26 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7012 Post(s)
Liked: 3557
The DTS-HD Master Audio 7.1 soundtrack is impeccable here, right from the very opening scene with the drums in Mexico City.
Just too bad that it wasn't encoded in DTS:X

___________

As for 'Casino Royale' audio on Blu, from Ralph's own perspective; Dolby TrueHD vs PCM:

"Casino Royale received a lossless Dolby TrueHD audio encoding for this Collectors’ Edition release versus the uncompressed PCM audio included on the original. Comparing the two I noticed the TrueHD soundtrack seemed as though it had been mixed a bit hotter. The same sequences watched via the PCM track were noticeably lower at the same volume setting. Matching the levels I didn’t find an appreciable difference in dynamics, clarity or low frequency detail. The same attributes existed in both. This came in the form of high level detail, defining clarity, and rich, room filling surround sound that didn’t disappoint. This is sophisticated sound design that incorporates a vast number of sound effects that are intricately mixed to engage the listening position. Bass is substantive and can sometimes be vigorous in depth but never rises inappropriately in prominence within the soundfield. The delicate blend of music, discrete/ambient sounds, dialogue and bass is supremely enriching as it weaves an aurally stimulating pattern across the entire surround platform."

___________

I too own both versions, plus the DVD dual-disc set, and the best audio is from the original Blu-ray...PCM 5.1 ... I think, I'm not 100% sure, I could be wrong, or I could be right too, it's hard to tell when you cannot do a 0.001dB level match between the two in a blind listening test. ...But as best as I tried to concentrate, from my less than effective set of ears and level matching and memory; it appeared to me that the PCM had a very very slight edge...like perhaps maybe not sure not absolutely with determined/total certainty, 1.5% overall superiority in sound quality. But this is all thin air with a grain of salt to be taken from.

'Spectre' sounded awesome on Blu-ray.
NorthSky is offline  
post #60 of 242 Old 02-15-2016, 03:25 PM
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,471
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1487 Post(s)
Liked: 701
Quote:
Originally Posted by Emaych View Post
Yeah, I think that pretty much matches the review I read, and that kind of difference is highly meaningful to me...but Idunno -- the Collector's edition is like $24 presently, so I think I would have to be pretty sold on the concept of VERY significant differences -- actually, I will go so far as to say I'm not paying that, but almost certainly will go for the other version at some point -- maybe when everyone is selling their Collector's to pick up the 4K!

Agreed.
IntelliVolume is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Official AVS Forum® Blu-ray Disc Reviews

Tags
dts-hd 7.1

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off