The "NOT HERS" HT/Basement Build - The Suffering Begins - Page 25 - AVS Forum
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Old 08-21-2009, 09:30 PM - Thread Starter
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7/31/2009

Racking begins...

After a few days of thinking about the heat flow, weight, and ease of use.. I kind of hashed out a plan just in time for my new rack screws to arrive. After starting a thread and asking advice, this is what I went with: Click

So I spent a good 4 hours moving shelves around, installing new ones that I had scrounged over a 5 year period.

A lot of the time was spent removing and cleaning stuff from it's existing place upstairs...probably more time cleaning off the dust than actually installing stuff

This is what it looked like after my first run:


Note: You can see the bare concrete under the rack... I decided that was going to be my next step.

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Old 08-22-2009, 01:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Hmmm.... use it or chuck it?

I was rummaging through all my junk while getting ready to make another trip to Salvation Army...

I found a 6chan TAO Stero Mixer with MIC auto-override.
See Link

I was trying to think of something cool I could do with it... but not finding anything and am about to haul it off.

Thoughts?

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Old 08-22-2009, 10:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staffy View Post

QUESTION: 7.1 Speaker Placement

I have done my research, I also am aware there is a difference between Dolby and THX recommendations.. that is where my dillema comes from...

Dolby recommends:



THX and my Pioneer manual recommends:


I planned ahead for this and wired for BOTH scenarios... but I am unsure which one to go with. Is the key my Elite SC-07?

Advice needed!
(Not from Drew)

Follow the Dolby recommendations, not the Pioneer recommendations. This is especially true as you upgrade from Dolby EX to true 7.1 suround sound found on BluRay discs. EX has a mono back channel but BluRay has seperate channels so you will want to space them out to allow panning of the sound.

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Old 08-22-2009, 11:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staffy View Post

Hmmm.... use it or chuck it?

I was rummaging through all my junk while getting ready to make another trip to Salvation Army...

I found a 6chan TAO Stero Mixer with MIC auto-override.
See Link

I was trying to think of something cool I could do with it... but not finding anything and am about to haul it off.

Thoughts?

I actually have been doing some home recording for Foley and sound design in video games and could use some extra mic preamps. If you are just going to chuck it... maybe I could take it off your hands?

- Leer

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Old 08-23-2009, 11:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingLeerUK View Post

I actually have been doing some home recording for Foley and sound design in video games and could use some extra mic preamps. If you are just going to chuck it... maybe I could take it off your hands?

- Leer

Offered it to my neighbor, last night, who has a demo studio, if he has no use for it and you are local, I will let you know and you can have it (free). I do know used they go for $500+ online, so they must be decent.

And hell no I won't ship it

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Old 08-23-2009, 11:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlllava View Post

Follow the Dolby recommendations, not the Pioneer recommendations. This is especially true as you upgrade from Dolby EX to true 7.1 suround sound found on BluRay discs. EX has a mono back channel but BluRay has seperate channels so you will want to space them out to allow panning of the sound.

Well %^$^&* this is confusing...

So you are saying the current THX and Pioneed recommendations will be out of date soon (I understand).

But I thought the THX speakers and their location in the back... crap my head hurts, Ef it, I will mount it Dolby, I can patch it up later.

Plus it will keep my neighbor Mark from busting my chops about only having 5.1.

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Old 08-23-2009, 11:57 AM
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FWIW,

Staffy I have planned on the Dolby recommendations solely because they DO have separation for the rear two channels. I say throw caution to the wind and go with the Dolby recommendations and forget the THX setup. I truly don't think you can go wrong either way but I think IMHO the Dolby setup makes more sense especially when you consider the rear channels in a 7.1 setup.

Plus I don't want Mark to have any more ammo to bust your chops (as fun as that would be to see) about not having 7.1.

Regards,

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Old 08-23-2009, 12:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Gracias for all 3 of your feedback.... it calms the voices.

Yeah, don't get me started about that guy... I will rant about him when I finally get all my pics posted and updates complete.

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Old 08-23-2009, 07:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staffy View Post

Well %^$^&* this is confusing...

So you are saying the current THX and Pioneed recommendations will be out of date soon (I understand).

But I thought the THX speakers and their location in the back... crap my head hurts, Ef it, I will mount it Dolby, I can patch it up later.

Plus it will keep my neighbor Mark from busting my chops about only having 5.1.

The THX and Pioneer recommendations are for Dolby EX which has a mono rear channel. Actually, it works just like the front channel in Dolby Pro Logic by steering sound from the side surrounds to the rear when the surrounds are in phase. Since the two EX channels are really the same (mono), it makes some sense to put them next to each other. (Or you could save money and just buy one speaker.)

With BluRay, take advantage of the discrete channels by spacing them per Dolby specs.

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Old 08-24-2009, 12:22 PM
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I'd too go with the dolby setup. Here is what DTS recomends for a 7.1 system.

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Old 08-24-2009, 09:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks gurus!! You made life easier, now I can finalize my 7.1 setup!

Very much appreciate the assistance.

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Old 08-24-2009, 10:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Any objections to this speakerwire?

12 ga speaker wire for rewire

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Old 08-25-2009, 05:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staffy View Post

Any objections to this speakerwire?

12 ga speaker wire for rewire

Monoprice speaker wire has been used by numerous people here at AVS without any major issues. I myself have my house wired with it and it's the best bang for your buck that you're going to find. Just search in the Theater or Home A/V Distribution and Networking forums for more information.

In most cases 14 gauge wire is fine for wiring speakers depending upon the wattage of your amplifier and distance to the speaker. Make sure your speakers can accept a 12 gauge wire. It's better to overestimate the gauge of wire needed than to underestimate it.
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Old 08-25-2009, 06:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staffy View Post

Any objections to this speakerwire?

12 ga speaker wire for rewire

It has been a long time since I bought speaker wire but isn't is supposed to state that it is "in-wall rated"?

Like this.

Man, that took longer than I thought it would...

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Old 08-25-2009, 06:58 AM
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As drew states it should have a CL2 or CL3 rating for in wall installation and typically it would not have a clear jacket. In the event of a fire, it burns differently and creates less lethal fumes.
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Old 08-25-2009, 07:13 AM
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Yes if it is in the walls it should be in wall rated.

I used the 10g Blue Jean Cable wire

If I had it to do all over again, I'd still hit that shot.
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Old 08-25-2009, 09:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Why inwall rating if I have conduit everywhere? I am confused...

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Old 08-25-2009, 09:34 AM
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Because your conduit is in-wall and to meet code, everything located within walls needs to be CL2/CL3 rated.

It has to do with burn rating...

John
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Old 08-25-2009, 02:49 PM
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I should mention, i went with the THX setup, just given my room design...
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Old 08-25-2009, 04:17 PM
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Yup,

It is confusing, but I to believe that all the inwall stuff needs to be rated for in wall use regardless of the use of conduit. Sorry to burst you bubble. Plus you would not want Mark to bust your chops for using just plain ole speaker wire. You'd never hear the end of it!

Regards,

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Now a Certified Carpet Counselor and Plumbing Counselor (Self given titles - pay no attention).
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Old 08-25-2009, 07:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smakovits View Post

I should mention, i went with the THX setup, just given my room design...

Everyone knows the THX setup sucks.... that is why all along I planned to do Dolby. Your post just validated I made the correct decision.

Leave me alone and go fix your trim...





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Old 08-25-2009, 07:56 PM - Thread Starter
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21 cents vs 62 cents for CL rated... eff me.

You guys just want to put a delay on my PJ purchase...


I still don't understand the burn rate thing... I mean I understand the jacket will burn at a certain rate vs the CL rated stuff, but at that point if the place is on fire, why would I care?

Or are you saying the non-inwall rated speaker wire could potentially cause a fire? Heck I could just use Romex then could I not? It is all inwall rated... and only 30 cents a foot..


Hmm what about this then? CL2 Rated (28 cents/ft)

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Old 08-25-2009, 08:08 PM
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That is the one I had in the link of my first post. Note though that both the 250' and 500' rolls are on back order...

Man, that took longer than I thought it would...

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Old 08-25-2009, 09:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staffy View Post

21 cents vs 62 cents for CL rated... eff me.

You guys just want to put a delay on my PJ purchase...


I still don't understand the burn rate thing... I mean I understand the jacket will burn at a certain rate vs the CL rated stuff, but at that point if the place is on fire, why would I care?

Or are you saying the non-inwall rated speaker wire could potentially cause a fire? Heck I could just use Romex then could I not? It is all inwall rated... and only 30 cents a foot..


Hmm what about this then? CL2 Rated (28 cents/ft)

You could open up a can of worms or is it Whoop A$$ with that statement over on the speaker forum. There have been "scientific" tests comparing lamp wire with 500 dollar speaker wire to "see" if there is any audible difference.

Just stop wining, buy the right stuff and get over it you pansy! Or am I going to have to get Mark involved?

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Old 08-25-2009, 10:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staffy View Post

Everyone knows the THX setup sucks.... that is why all along I planned to do Dolby. Your post just validated I made the correct decision.

Leave me alone and go fix your trim...





I hate you...


Once upon a time I thought THX was the tell all be all. I actually wired for both myself, but since I want to put a pub table in my one back corner I have to change the design and go THX setup. I think ultimately they are both good, arent they?
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Old 08-26-2009, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staffy View Post

21 cents vs 62 cents for CL rated... eff me.

You guys just want to put a delay on my PJ purchase...


I still don't understand the burn rate thing... I mean I understand the jacket will burn at a certain rate vs the CL rated stuff, but at that point if the place is on fire, why would I care?

Or are you saying the non-inwall rated speaker wire could potentially cause a fire? Heck I could just use Romex then could I not? It is all inwall rated... and only 30 cents a foot..


Hmm what about this then? CL2 Rated (28 cents/ft)

That's the stuff you want.

In my understanding as I stated above it is the fumes that are caused by that jacket burning. Also it is more if it is a slow smoldering fire inside your walls that you may not be aware of right away. CL2 rating will not have any insurance implications.
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Old 08-26-2009, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staffy View Post


I still don't understand the burn rate thing... I mean I understand the jacket will burn at a certain rate vs the CL rated stuff, but at that point if the place is on fire, why would I care?

My understanding is it will burn and can start to burn in the burning room and get into the wall cavities which just sounds bad. Hence a one room fire becomes a big ole 3 alarm fire.

If I had it to do all over again, I'd still hit that shot.
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Old 08-26-2009, 09:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smakovits View Post

I hate you...


Once upon a time I thought THX was the tell all be all. I actually wired for both myself, but since I want to put a pub table in my one back corner I have to change the design and go THX setup. I think ultimately they are both good, arent they?


Hell no, THX is so 2008 dude. You effed up. I bet you used 4" screws to mount the speakers too..


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Old 08-26-2009, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Staffy View Post

Hell no, THX is so 2008 dude. You effed up. I bet you used 4" screws to mount the speakers too..



Actually, where I messed up is buying Klipsch RF-62 tower speakers for my surrounds. There was a sick deal I couldnt pass up that had them $50 less than the actual wall surrounds, so I have 4 RF-62's for my surrounds and and RF-82 for my front L/R and then a RC-62 center, I almost got a RF-82 for there too, but held back...

Soo yeah, because I cant mount towers on the wall, it is either no pub table, or THX. I have some space to separate them, but they are still behind me, I can get like 2 feet between them. Ugh, certain design flaws, what are you going to do. It still sounds really good, I mean do the two really sounds that different? I dont know, I am kind of asking here.

And given that I bought all the equipment in 2008 and 2007, I cant complain too much, but like I said, I am wired for both if i want...

Im over it. Unless I get convinced otherwise that dolby is WAY better than the THX setup. I will plan for the pub table when I get some more cash, but if I need to go dolby, I will scrap the pub table and do it.
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Old 08-26-2009, 09:14 PM
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Staffy, you didn't specify the speaker wire was going in the wall when I posted. Yes, everyone here is correct that if it is going in the wall you need to use the wall rated wire. Monoprice is still going to be your best bet.

As for the 12 gauge issue are you sure you need it? I don't remember what speakers you picked out or the power rating for them. 14 gauge works in most cases and could save you some money. Just a thought.
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